Elon Musk thread

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Woodpecker
Orthodox
I am merely an inquirer and I do wish to overstep any boundaries.

I (privately) reached out to @MichaelWitcoff some time ago having questions about the second coming of Jesus Christ. In response he sent me a link [0] to a reading from St. Paisios the Athonite on the topic titled "On Our Times". In listening to the reading I heard that "That’s why Holy Scripture says that even the chosen will be deceived", at 9:51 in the video.

Who are "the chosen" that St. Paisios was referring to if not faithful Christians?
This requires a subtler explanation.

 
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Akaky Akakievitch

Kingfisher
Orthodox
I am not well-read on this, but from what I have read it seems that it would be quite easy to spot the anti-Christ, as he will bring material comforts, rather than spiritual. My intuition is that it will play out that material comforts will successively be taken away, and we will be told we will get it back if only we do X. This process leads to worsening conditions until we are offered a choice - Christ of the last comfort.

I have found that the vast majority of people are oblivious to material vs. non-material arguments. It's like talking to them about COVID being a scam. They just don't respond. All people understand is - is health care getting better, are my wages going up ... are they or their bedfellows getting a good material deal. That is almost the entirety of modern debate.

We will know him by his fruits, yes. If a new global world leader promises a worldly kingdom and material riches in exchange for absolute allegiance (not to mention the fact he will be Jewish), then we should know that something is very wrong.

But my point was more to do with the general appearance/countenance of the antichrist, as many tacitly assume he will manifest as the typical red-horned devil, but from what I understand, to the world he will appear beautiful, radiant, and angelic (at least for a time), which will be the most difficult dilemma for any discerning Christian in those final days.

I get the impression that he will have an irresistible charisma, so that even if we might suspect something of this strange otherworldly man, that his words could win us over if we're not careful.

I've even heard some saints say quite sternly, that when he arrives, no one should even dare to look at the antichrist's face, fearing that one may be tempted by only a simple glance. This is identical advice towards how we deal with the passions, especially lust, that when we find ourselves tempted or feel passions rising within us, instead of deal with them directly, we should run like a small child to Christ, for our protection, as we cannot do it on our own.

So it will be like dealing with the most beautiful person we have ever seen, a completely irresistible personality and someone with the most magnetic charisma -- the charm of the devil, no less. That's why his sudden appearance from complete obscurity will make it all the more dramatic and attractive for people, so it won't be baby X. But the 'spirit of antichrist' has been working tirelessly ever since the martyrdom of Tsar Nicholas II over a hundred years ago, and numerous 'types' have arisen since then, from Stalin all the way down to Musk, so these figures are warning signs at the least and a reminder to stay vigilant.
 

Shadowman

Chicken
Orthodox Inquirer
This needs subtle explanation. People understand the word 'faithful' differently. Would you call Bartholomew faithful? He is elect but is he faithful?


It was said by the fathers that faithful Christians will have no problem with discerning who the antiChrist is.
Thank you for the reply.

I watched the entire video twice.

I used the word "faithful" because you used it in your original comment to which I replied.

Fr. Spyridon then used the word "elect" in the video that you linked. However, to me, it seems like he uses that word as something akin to what St. Paisios said. ("chosen", and I may be wrong here).

Right at the beginning of the video (0:11) Fr. Spyridon says: "In both the Holy Scriptures and in the writings of the Church Fathers we read that, in the end times, there will be a universal apostasy. There will be a deception that fills the earth. A deception that is so subtle that even the elect may be deceived."

In case I missed it (which very well might have happened), could you please provide the timestamp where Fr. Spyridon (as that is the source that you linked as an answer to my question) says that "faithful Christians will have no problem with discerning who the Antichrist is"? Or a link to what was said by the Church Fathers as was said in your original comment to which I replied?

To boil it down my questions here relate to what the Orthodox teaching is on the Antichrist. Will it be "no problem" for the Orthodox to discern who the Antichrist is or not?

Thank you and God bless you.
 

Akaky Akakievitch

Kingfisher
Orthodox
You have no way to rule that out, just because it's known doesn't mean it's not in the spotlight, Elon is. Jesus was also known to some before His ministry, in the village, in the Synagogue...

Personally I just don't think that the owner of Tesla and Twitter, and known to possibly billions worldwide, is someone who could possibly have their child be "nurtured in secret". I appreciate his mega-riches may give him a degree of privacy, but by also naming the boy "X" etc... it seems too farfetched (but interesting too how "X" is the first letter of Christ in Greek, they must have acknowledged this). It's obvious that this is a warning of some kind, I'm not ignoring that, but I suspect he will be a fairly regular Jewish boy to begin with, exceptionally intelligent and talented, but no more than others before him. Then later on the devil will possess him to carry out his will. I derive some of this from what St Lawrence of Chernigov states in one of his prophecies:


"The Antichrist will be born from a Jewish harlot [other saints say specifically he will come from the tribe of Dan]. From a young age he will be very gifted and intelligent. Especially from the time when he will be an adolescent of twelve years old, he will be walking with his mother in the park and he will meet Satan, who will come out of the darkness and enter inside of him. The boy will shudder from fear, but Satan will say to him "Do not fear. I will help you". And inside this child the Antichrist will take on a human form [the devil will not incarnate as a human but he will essentially "possess" someone and use them as his avatar to carry out his will]."

I'll concede that it is impossible to say how, when or where this will happen, we can only share our conjectures and the prophecies or writings of the saints.

I must say that in this past half a year or so, this subject has greatly interested me, largely because the signs from the world seem to be pointing towards his imminent arrival. It's possible this "X" app could catch on, and help create the one world system which will be used by antichrist (of course, he would be the author of it all along) so it's something to keep tabs on.
 
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Острог

Woodpecker
Orthodox
Thank you for the reply.

I watched the entire video twice.

I used the word "faithful" because you used it in your original comment to which I replied.

Fr. Spyridon then used the word "elect" in the video that you linked. However, to me, it seems like he uses that word as something akin to what St. Paisios said. ("chosen", and I may be wrong here).

Right at the beginning of the video (0:11) Fr. Spyridon says: "In both the Holy Scriptures and in the writings of the Church Fathers we read that, in the end times, there will be a universal apostasy. There will be a deception that fills the earth. A deception that is so subtle that even the elect may be deceived."

In case I missed it (which very well might have happened), could you please provide the timestamp where Fr. Spyridon (as that is the source that you linked as an answer to my question) says that "faithful Christians will have no problem with discerning who the Antichrist is"? Or a link to what was said by the Church Fathers as was said in your original comment to which I replied?

To boil it down my questions here relate to what the Orthodox teaching is on the Antichrist. Will it be "no problem" for the Orthodox to discern who the Antichrist is or not?

Thank you and God bless you.
Maybe I'm not the best person to explain this. Let's not get bogged down with semantics here like a protestant would. The simple and universal answer to this is that with real faith comes God's grace. Those who receive it will see the antiChrist for who he is. Remember that there are bishops today who betray their flock. What do you think they will do once the man of sin is here?

I believe it was some Georgian father who also said that you shouldn't worry about your flight during antiChrist's reign, God will clear your mind and you'll know what to do.

Are you getting my point?
 

budoslavic

Eagle
Orthodox
Gold Member
Tweeting factual crime statistics? Twitter will ban you.

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It_is_my_time

Crow
Protestant
I was listening to a great podcast and they mentioned that some leftists (probably sponsored by some branch of our govt.) were following Elon's son around and making threatening statements. Since this time Elon has rolled back a little in this "free speech" idea. Elon didn't know what he was up against and now he is being warned. I don't know how men can be that intelligent and that well connected and still think they can get away with challenging the system without some sort of reaction from it.
 

It_is_my_time

Crow
Protestant
As rich and powerful and meme-y as Elon is, on a lot of days he really comes across as your classic out of touch boomer.
He reminds me of a typical 50 something X'er. He thinks sexual jokes are still edgy and funny, and he thinks the "extremes of both sides" are equally bad. He is very out of touch with where society is today. But he is closer to the truth than many others in his position, so it is nice to see him take some kind of X'er stand.
 

DanielH

Hummingbird
Moderator
Orthodox
Wow, how very disappointing. Elon's Twitter may not be a blatantly leftist as old Twitter but it's still a cesspool.
It seems exactly as leftist in practice, just less openly. They basically set the clock back two years in terms of censorship. They might do the same four years from now. I was always surprised Steve Sailer was allowed on Twitter despite never, and still not, violating twitter rules.
 

It_is_my_time

Crow
Protestant
It seems exactly as leftist in practice, just less openly. They basically set the clock back two years in terms of censorship. They might do the same four years from now. I was always surprised Steve Sailer was allowed on Twitter despite never, and still not, violating twitter rules.
Some of the guys I listen to are told they are never allowed back on Twitter, no matter what they do. One of them never broke any rules, he simply asked liberals questions that caused them to think and then break and combined with using his real name = permanent ban under Elon Musk.
 

Uzisuicide

Kingfisher
Protestant
Gold Member
I'm sure it's going to take a long time to straighten Twitter out. There are always going to be some bans and things that make people think nothing has changed. But in the end, I think free speech on Twitter is going to be better off under Musk. It's a big place though. Musk can't be aware of every account but so far I think Musk's attempt to change the culture at twitter has gone as well an can be expected.

I guess he's learning that it doesn't take long for people to start hating you once you make a stand for what's right, despite how reasonable it is.
 
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