Financial crash thread (2022-2024)

paternos

Kingfisher
Catholic
Partly true....it gets more complicated when banks figured out they can take your money, loan other banks that money and then the other banks do the same thereby creating a large pyramid of manufactured debt from a very small amount of cash.
That's what it is.

Banks take about 10% as fractional reserve. So you deposit 1000, then Bank A reserves a 100 and can lend lend 900. Bank B take a loan for 900 and lends 810. Adding this all up, this flow of money, your deposit of a 1000 can create up to 10 times the volume in money.

Most banks are now fully stacked with long term, e.g. 20 year mortgage loans against crazy low rates, e.g. 2 percent. A lot of money outstanding, incredibly low return on capital. They need deposits on the other side. When you walk away, they need to acquire money against a high price today.

When that balance sheet is mortgages.houses, and those prices go down, banks have a problem, if those were bonds, banks had a problems as bonds went down in price a lot. Banks are in the end highly leveraged. It's like 10x crypto trading for those that did it. And there are many regulations, like the bonds. (depends per country)

If houses go down, through high interest rates, if bond portfolio go down through high interest rates, if people take their money. They are in deep problems.

Most likely is that the FED will stop going higher in interest rates and maybe even lower soon, otherwise banks will go down. Bonds and houses will decrease in price with higher interest rates. And a bank run like this has everyone on their edge.
 

Thomas More

Crow
Protestant
I see posts about various famous rich people who had their money in SVB and have now lost it. I know the FDIC only covers up to $250,000, but has the bank actually lost all its money? I was under the impression they were shut down as soon as the bank started being upside down, and maybe 10% of deposits can't be covered by assets. I expect a bailout will be arranged with some other bank taking over SVB and making good all the deposits.

Is there any indication that depositors will actually lose everything over $250,000?
 

Cynllo

Ostrich
Orthodox Inquirer
Inevitable these things will happen in a fundamentally usurious system. Further convinces me to up my shovelling of centralised digits in unverifiable ledgers onto decentralised digits in verifiable ledgers.

I was thinking of buying some sort of property, but I don't see that point when crypto is obviously in bear lows and will go much higher into 2025.

I have a home for sale in the UK at the moment. Issue is it's in the top 15% of the market. Smaller homes sell quite quickly as there are a lot of people who want them. Larger homes seem to be coming with a considerable sq. ft. reduction. Simply as so few people can afford them. The house has been reduced 15%. A few days ago there was a record of 4,100 home prices reduced in a day. Average for a few years ago was about 1,000. Also very few new homes being listed. This market is obviously tipping over more. I'll be putting all the proceeds into crypto.

Crypto prices have taken a big hit due to this. Dip bought. Particularly USDC has been hit, which holds about 9% of it's assets with SVB. So their stable coin is now trading at about 91 cents. A lot of people are taking the trade that it will go up after a bail out and not much reason for it to go down more.

Also shows the fragility of the usurious system. People can make their criticisms of crypto. But the total (at occurrence) losses of centralised usury-based crypto entities is in the tens of billions. In the wild west of sometimes anonymously operated decentralised platforms, I can't think of any large losses.
 

rainy

Pelican
Other Christian
If interest rates start going down, that’s at least a positive for many.

Doesn’t answer to the issue of where to put any good size sum of money if you’re fortunate enough to have it. Even sizable 401k’s…..

My understanding as well is the FDIC despite insuring up to 250k, does not in actuality have the ability to cover any large scale national bank runs. If that’s your retirement fund as an example 250k is not much if you’re approaching that age.
 

Crazy88

Robin
Other Christian
It looks like the woke virus is spreading everywhere, be it every corner of the federal government, schools and universities, the sports and entertainment complex, airlines and the rest of our transportation network, and of course corporate America. How much longer can we count in living in a stable, well-functioning society where meritocracy is dead and your only qualifications are which gender and race box you check?

This SVB failure may have hit Silicon Valley and a great portion of the tech start-up scene and we can say good riddance to the undoubtedly liberal and woke crowd impacted by it. But if there’s a contagion effect and an eventual economic collapse, the rest of us will suffer and maybe that’s the ultimate goal.

 

Blade Runner

Crow
Orthodox
It looks like the woke virus is spreading everywhere, be it every corner of the federal government, schools and universities, the sports and entertainment complex, airlines and the rest of our transportation network, and of course corporate America. How much longer can we count in living in a stable, well-functioning society where meritocracy is dead and your only qualifications are which gender and race box you check?

This SVB failure may have hit Silicon Valley and a great portion of the tech start-up scene and we can say good riddance to the undoubtedly liberal and woke crowd impacted by it. But if there’s a contagion effect and an eventual economic collapse, the rest of us will suffer and maybe that’s the ultimate goal.

It is. The "be careful what you wish for" is something that I can understand, but when you realize all of this only stops when the funding runs out, why should we worry about the bad that comes, when we're already being tortured with nonsense in clown world?
 

Eusebius Erasmus

Ostrich
Orthodox

Jewish Press reports 500 Israeli firms are exposed to the SVB collapse. Some were recent depositors, moving funds from Israeli banks to SVB as some form of protest.

Very interesting.

Tom Luongo thinks that the Federal Reserve, under Powell, is engaging in a war against the World Economic Forum. According to this theory, the Fed is raising interest rates rapidly so that all of the 'bad actors' in the economy are eradicated.

I don't know if Tom is correct, but the collapse of SVB suggests he is onto something.
 

paternos

Kingfisher
Catholic
Inevitable these things will happen in a fundamentally usurious system. Further convinces me to up my shovelling of centralised digits in unverifiable ledgers onto decentralised digits in verifiable ledgers.

I was thinking of buying some sort of property, but I don't see that point when crypto is obviously in bear lows and will go much higher into 2025.

I have a home for sale in the UK at the moment. Issue is it's in the top 15% of the market. Smaller homes sell quite quickly as there are a lot of people who want them. Larger homes seem to be coming with a considerable sq. ft. reduction. Simply as so few people can afford them. The house has been reduced 15%. A few days ago there was a record of 4,100 home prices reduced in a day. Average for a few years ago was about 1,000. Also very few new homes being listed. This market is obviously tipping over more. I'll be putting all the proceeds into crypto.

Crypto prices have taken a big hit due to this. Dip bought. Particularly USDC has been hit, which holds about 9% of it's assets with SVB. So their stable coin is now trading at about 91 cents. A lot of people are taking the trade that it will go up after a bail out and not much reason for it to go down more.

Also shows the fragility of the usurious system. People can make their criticisms of crypto. But the total (at occurrence) losses of centralised usury-based crypto entities is in the tens of billions. In the wild west of sometimes anonymously operated decentralised platforms, I can't think of any large losses.
I can think of a few reasons:

- Crypto doesn't generate revenue (If you invest in a gold miner or farmer, they mine gold or crops for you)
- Governments don't like crypto (crackdowns will happen)
- Cryptos are easily made (there are 10.000s with similar capabilities and switching is simple, all depends on popularity)
- Little practical usage at the moment and high transaction costs
- Criminality (funky exchanges, no judicial way to get anything back after theft)

Anyhow I would suggest you not to gamble your whole house in this. Please think in probabilities, not certainties. Invest some, but not all.

Compare not only to money, but also dividend stocks, cyclicals, bonds, stocks in southern america / china / Russia or real estate. There are ton of ways to park your funds.
 

Eusebius Erasmus

Ostrich
Orthodox
I can think of a few reasons:

- Crypto doesn't generate revenue (If you invest in a gold miner or farmer, they mine gold or crops for you)
- Governments don't like crypto (crackdowns will happen)
- Cryptos are easily made (there are 10.000s with similar capabilities and switching is simple, all depends on popularity)
- Little practical usage at the moment and high transaction costs
- Criminality (funky exchanges, no judicial way to get anything back after theft)

Anyhow I would suggest you not to gamble your whole house in this. Please think in probabilities, not certainties. Invest some, but not all.

Compare not only to money, but also dividend stocks, cyclicals, bonds, stocks in southern america / china / Russia or real estate. There are ton of ways to park your funds.

Correct.

Also, the overall crypto market cap is low. This means that crypto makets are easily manipulated by someone with a few million bucks who can corner the market.
 

paternos

Kingfisher
Catholic
I think this podcast is a great outline on SVB and what's to come.



Of a guy that works with businesses banking at SVB..

I don't agree with with his moral sense, but observations are spot on.

- There were large investors like Peter Thiel asking all their start ups to pull the money out.
- The speed is unheard off with online banking.
- Goverment will guarantee the depositors are safe.
- Probably a "Salomon" will buy up SVB for pennies. Making a deal with the government on the depositors.
 

Cynllo

Ostrich
Orthodox Inquirer
Also, the overall crypto market cap is low. This means that crypto makets are easily manipulated by someone with a few million bucks who can corner the market.

Guilty as charged. But the crypto markets are still more based in some sort of reality and price discovery than stocks, which are juiced with easy money and propping up. Crypto is the only market that's allowed to put in bottoms. Also isn't broadly the case. More BTC addresses with a more distributed supply is the trend.

I can think of a few reasons:

- Crypto doesn't generate revenue (If you invest in a gold miner or farmer, they mine gold or crops for you)
- Governments don't like crypto (crackdowns will happen)
- Cryptos are easily made (there are 10.000s with similar capabilities and switching is simple, all depends on popularity)
- Little practical usage at the moment and high transaction costs
- Criminality (funky exchanges, no judicial way to get anything back after theft)

Anyhow I would suggest you not to gamble your whole house in this. Please think in probabilities, not certainties. Invest some, but not all.

Compare not only to money, but also dividend stocks, cyclicals, bonds, stocks in southern america / china / Russia or real estate. There are ton of ways to park your funds.

I first bought BTC 2-3 months shy of ten years ago. The only advice I needed to hear during all that time was to completely ignore all the Peter Schiffs and those trying to outpace inflation with artificially propped up stocks (hence why I am not buying), who have cut my gains. Currently short 3X the Russel 2000. Gains should push well into the 30s% as SVB unfolds tomorrow.

Stocks in the US are considerably inflated and propped up on top of the usury system.

image_proxy


Especially considering the economy has not being doing well over the last twenty years, this is well overvalued, and it's going down ~80% as soon as it isn't be propped up more. That's the only time I'll be buying.

Then look at Euro stocks. When inflation is factored in, many have lost value, if not most.

I'm generally only going to buy something if it's undervalued. And stocks are overvalued. They were going to pop in '18, '20 and maybe need another shot of fiat tomorrow. If I buy stocks now I think the most likely scenario is I will be underwater for years.

Crypto I have a very good handle on. I posted here the exact day BTC began it's ~50% rally:


Had picked up a big chunk, more two days ago when it hit sub-$20K again. Picking up more.

It's a very predictable market, particularly in it's lows. To any small extent it's manipulated by private actors, it's demonstrably less than how stocks are held up. Stocks are not so predictable, as over the last 15 years they have been considerably detached from price discovery. Right now crypto is around it's very predictable bottom. The only thing that has held me back from buying more is the growing possibility of a recession, at which point I would expect maybe $10K BTC.

***

I think that crypto doesn't generate revenue is a good argument, and it's yet to be seen why some of these token have value. There is a number of ways this could go. But I only see crypto gaining more momentum, whether it be a Bitcoin standard, ETH, or something else. Ultimately most will die. But I there is too much traction here. People have been saying BTC will die from $5-69,000. Crypto is a bet outside of the inherent usury system, it's a bet on new technology that is growing through trial and error.

I ultimately don't care if governments don't like cryptos, as they are hostile enemy forces, which would prefer if we all just died, and in the meantime would prefer to see us reduced to a UBI-based permanent wanker on our way to an early grave. Crackdowns will obviously effect the price, but this ecosystem is ultimately out of their control. I'd rather live there than being a peon of a usury-based monetary system, which won't let the market correct to allow a reasonable entry point; and will no doubt begin confiscating fiat and stocks at some point in the next two decades.

Many cryptos. Yes. Not sure how it will end up, but to someone who is savvy it's quite obvious as to which the better ones are, as it was obvious which stocks would have performed better after 2008. Safe bet is BTC. Switching is not simple, if wanting to maintain purchasing power, as the bar to becoming a top coin is extremely high. Ultimately there is only a need for one coin and a derivative stable coin. It could be BTC + Stacks, or ETH + L2, or maybe something else. The individual project tokens - it's not so clear why they would need to exist long-term. But a lot of useful software has been written, and can be used with whatever token.

I agree on little practical usage, and this was always one of my biggest criticisms, but this is changing by the month. There are probably 10s of millions of people using a crypto project on a monthly basis, and all of this activity requires a base asset to operate. Now this is mostly ETH + BTC. There's billions of growing transactions occurring on crypto, happening outside of sanctions or in low trust/unstable jurisdictions. Last year was the biggest year, in a 80-99% bear market (deepening on asset). I think it will be around 2030 before we really see things take off, like decentralised could computing, messaging etc.

Transaction fees are small, and in the process of being made irrelevant. Standard BTC and TXs are already 90% or so cheaper than international transfers.

Criminality. As mentioned in this thread or another. The criminality has happened on centralised usury-based systems. I believe BTC is less used by criminals than the dollar.

What does it do within 3 years?

See the chart I linked to -

photo_2023-01-12_21-48-33-jpg.53317


This is the last model left standing, which fits BTC's price moves over 10+ years. It will put BTC around $200,000 by the end of 2025, or a 10X from now.

Last bull market I bet on ETH, seeing that it was seeing a lot of growth of projects, which were gaining more adoption, and needed ETH to operate. ETH did 50X over BTC's 20X. Harder to say how it will go now. There could be traction from Stacks, which builds smart contracts/apps on top of BTC. That's been popular in this 2023 spring. There are a lot of assets being ported onto ETH L2s, but I don't see any move to be made to profit from this. The only other chain that's really been left standing is BNB, but it's just a budget chain. All the other chains have been hit hard.

I'm working on scheming out a portfolio balance into 2025. So far it's 25% ETH (staked, earning about 5%/year), 16% BTC, 10% Gala, 5% ENS. I have some others, but not sure of the exact quantities. My main play is to pick one very good performer looking at 30-100X. Gala and ENS are my favourites. Gala has been one of the coins that's shown it's potential already, with a 4X since Nov, before pulling back. To be sold Nov-Dec 2025.

I think asset seizures are what take BTC to $1M, 2030 onwards. Maybe 2033. At that point it's gold and crypto in your possession. What are the latest projections for that time period?
 
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paternos

Kingfisher
Catholic
I think this podcast is a great outline on SVB and what's to come.



Of a guy that works with businesses banking at SVB..

I don't agree with with his moral sense, but observations are spot on.

- There were large investors like Peter Thiel asking all their start ups to pull the money out.
- The speed is unheard off with online banking.
- Goverment will guarantee the depositors are safe.
- Probably a "Salomon" will buy up SVB for pennies. Making a deal with the government on the depositors.

Solomon is in the auction:


This shows how rigged the system is, underhand huge companies are sold, in the name of protecting the population.
If you're a minor shareholder, you have no vote, they just do what they want.

Wild theory
First they blow up the worldwide debt in Corona in the fastest pace ever, then they increase interest rates in an uncontrolled way to let the system go to halt.

FesQW0FUcAA0fWq.jpeg
Maybe they are trying to end capitalism and property here. Give it a death blow. It's all just so wild and destructive.

I just don't belief this steep increase of interest rates on megadebt is to "fight inflation".
 
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