Floyd "Money" Mayweather VS Robert "The Ghost" Guerrero

[thegmanifesto]

I think you are off a little here.

Hatton (slightly past his peak, coming up in weight)

Hatton was undefeated. Coming off a huge win over Jose Luis Castillo.

Perfect time to fight him.

Marquez (ditto)

Was the #3 Pound for pound in the world at the time. One of the greatest fighters of his time. And obviously he still has gas in the tank.

He just came of the huge Juan Diaz win.

Perfect time to fight him.

Cotto (past his peak; Mayweather avoided him in his prime)

Possibly, but he was coming off the biggest win of his career.

Great time to fight him.

Guerrero (coming up TWO weight classes -- the guy fought at 135 pounds three fights ago!)

Again, coming off the biggest win of his career.

Perfect time to fight him.

He ducked the hell out of Pacquiao in prime (maybe he'll fight him now that he's spent!).

I think the "ducking" (if you want to call it that, I just call it "the business of boxing") was on both sides, but then again, maybe you were in the negotiating room. I wasn't.

Ditto for Antonio Margarito - ducked him for a decade!

Was he supposed to fight Margarito or De La Hoya?

Which made more sense?

Victor Ortiz - coming up in weight.

No he wasn't. He was already a welter.

Shane Mosely - past his prime (ducked him,

Never ducked Shane.

Shane ducked him early on. May fought him after a huge win (Margarito) and when he had his career back on track.

Perfect time to fight him.

Winky Wright, and Vernon Forest, and Felix Trinidad, in their primes...heck he never fought the last three guys AT ALL!).

When was he supposed to fight them?

In 2002 when he was a lightweight and they were welters? I think you are mixing your eras up.

He can't fight more than one person at a time.

I just wish Mayweather wasn't so greedy, because had he fought everyone he should have, he may not be undefeated right now.

Like who?

But I can't hate, he's a great business man. But think about it, Ali had been defeated at 36. Ain't no way Mayweather is as good of a boxer as Ali was. Defensively though, he is one of the greatest of all time.

Impossible to compare the two eras.

Ali fought quite possibly during the most competitive era of Heavyweight boxing.

Floyd's era was tough, but maybe not as tough as welter of the 90's and certainly not as tough as welter-middle in the 80's.

Could have been tougher, but the 80's babies have been unable to unseat the 70's babies (in Life) and in boxing.

Therefore, the 70's babies have been able to dominate from the 1990's till today.

Hell, my man Bernard Hopkins is a 60's baby and still going strong.

 

[Dexter Morgan]

Props to Floyd - he's one of the best defensive fighters ever. I bought the fight on PPV just to watch him slip punches.

I don't know if you would be interested in streaming it for free next time, maybe you prefer the quality of PPV, but you can stream every fight for free on www.firstrowsports.eu. That's what I use for all my sports and it almost always works. You can just hook the computer up to the TV instead of paying for it, but if you prefer the quality, PPV is definitely better, but still not bad on firstrowsports.

Prefer HD.

 

[InternationPlayboy]

I just wish Mayweather wasn't so greedy, because had he fought everyone he should have, he may not be undefeated right now.

Like who?

But I can't hate, he's a great business man. But think about it, Ali had been defeated at 36. Ain't no way Mayweather is as good of a boxer as Ali was. Defensively though, he is one of the greatest of all time.

Impossible to compare the two eras.

Ali fought quite possibly during the most competitive era of Heavyweight boxing.

Floyd's era was tough, but maybe not as tough as welter of the 90's and certainly not as tough as welter-middle in the 80's.

Could have been tougher, but the 80's babies have been unable to unseat the 70's babies (in Life) and in boxing.

Therefore, the 70's babies have been able to dominate from the 1990's till today.

Hell, my man Bernard Hopkins is a 60's baby and still going strong.

I mean the obvious answer to the first question is Pacquiao. I'm not saying Pacquiao would have won for sure, I'm just saying it would have been one of the biggest fights of his career, and Pacquiao had a chance. I think Pacquiao is falling off though. If they were to fight today, I would put money on Mayweather for sure. They should have fought a couple years ago when they were both more in their prime. It would have been a lot better of a fight. Mayweather is in better condition now, maybe having to do with his, the less you get hit the longer you can box motto. He simply just doesn't get rocked as much as most boxers do.

The second response, you're absolutely right.

 

[Dexter Morgan]

I think you are off a little here.

Hatton (slightly past his peak, coming up in weight)

Hatton was undefeated. Coming off a huge win over Jose Luis Castillo.

Perfect time to fight him.

Marquez (ditto)

Was the #3 Pound for pound in the world at the time. One of the greatest fighters of his time. And obviously he still has gas in the tank.

He just came of the huge Juan Diaz win.

Perfect time to fight him.

Cotto (past his peak; Mayweather avoided him in his prime)

Possibly, but he was coming off the biggest win of his career.

Great time to fight him.

Guerrero (coming up TWO weight classes -- the guy fought at 135 pounds three fights ago!)

Again, coming off the biggest win of his career.

Perfect time to fight him.

He ducked the hell out of Pacquiao in prime (maybe he'll fight him now that he's spent!).

I think the ducking was on both sides, but then again, maybe you were in the negotiating room. I wasn't.

Ditto for Antonio Margarito - ducked him for a decade!

Was he supposed to fight Margarito or De La Hoya?

Which made more sense?

Victor Ortiz - coming up in weight.

No he wasn't. He was already a welter.

Shane Mosely - past his prime (ducked him,

Never ducked Shane.

Shane ducked him early on. May fought him after a huge win (Margarito) and when he had his career back on track.

Perfect time to fight him.

Winky Wright, and Vernon Forest, and Felix Trinidad, in their primes...heck he never fought the last three guys AT ALL!).

I think you are mixing your eras up.

He can't fight more than one person at a time.

I just wish Mayweather wasn't so greedy, because had he fought everyone he should have, he may not be undefeated right now.

Like who?

But I can't hate, he's a great business man. But think about it, Ali had been defeated at 36. Ain't no way Mayweather is as good of a boxer as Ali was. Defensively though, he is one of the greatest of all time.

Impossible to compare the two eras.

Ali fought quite possibly during the most competitive era of Heavyweight boxing.

Floyd's era was tough, but maybe not as tough as welter of the 90's and certainly not as tough as welter-middle in the 80's.

Could have been tougher, but the 80's babies have been unable to unseat the 70's babies (in Life) and in boxing.

Hatton moved up in weight and was out of his depth. And he was GROSSLY over-rated because of his skin color. Lost three of his last five fights at that point in his career, retired, and went into rehab.

Marquez was 36, and just fought at 130 pounds the year before!! Moved up to 147 overnight, had no time to prepare (or to juice up, as he did against Pacquiao...as Mexican great Erik Morales said after the Marquez - Pacquiao fight, "The Mexican pharmacy beat the Phillipines pharmacy tonight".

Cotto was coming off the greatest win of his career when he fought Mayweather?? After Pacquiao knocked Margarito's eye socket to pieces and Mosely beat him down?? THAT was his biggest win and the right time to fight him?? How about after Cotto beat Mosely in 2007, when Cotto was 26 and in his prime...that MAYBE might've been a better time to fight him!

Guerrero was a "perfect time to fight him" because he was coming off the biggest win of his career?? How about...not fighting him at all! How about fighting someone who had been at 147 pounds for a couple of years?

As for Pacman, you said: "I think the ducking was on both sides, but then again, maybe you were in the negotiating room. I wasn't."

And you didn't need to be. Pacquiao said publicly "We'll do the fight at 50-50 purse with no other conditions". Mayweather wanted most of the purse, Olympic drug testing, can't fight if there's a full moon that month, blah blah blah. I asked Marlon Starling, former Welterweight champion, why the fight didn't get made and he didn't skip a beat: He told me "Mayweather don't want that fight".

"Victor Ortiz - coming up in weight.

No he wasn't. He was already a welter."

For about ten minutes...fought at 140 or below for 95% of his fights before Mayweather.

"Winky Wright, and Vernon Forest, and Felix Trinidad, in their primes...heck he never fought the last three guys AT ALL!).

I think you are mixing your eras up."

Why? Those guys fought at 154 or 160 when Floyd was at 147/154..why couldn't he go up and challenge them, as 147 pound Ray Leonard went up to fight 160 pound Marvin Hagler in 1987? Why is that only Floyd's challengers have to have a weight disadvantage, if he's such a great fighter?

I'm where I was at the start of this thread (and, incidentally, where Dan Rafael, Kevin Iole and most boxing writers are): Floyd is a great talent, one of the best defensive fighters ever, but he ducked people in their prime to preserve his "zero" and he increased his odds in other fights by fighting guys past their prime and when he had a weight advantage. Maybe, he'll break this pattern with Canelo, who has called him out. But I wouldn't hold my breath.

And when Floyd retires at 48-0, people won't lump him in with Ray Leonard, Marvin Hagler, Thomas Hearns, Roberto Duran etc - all of whom fought each other, in their primes, and ducked NO ONE. They'll simply say he was a talented fighter who COULD HAVE BEEN one of the all-time greats, had he fought the best of his era.

 

[InternationPlayboy]

I have to agree with Dexter Morgan. I'm not gonna sit here and say Mayweather isn't great, and neither did he, but I will agree that he did duck quite a few fights to keep his 0, and most everyone seems to agree.

 

[Dexter Morgan]

I have to agree with Dexter Morgan. I'm not gonna sit here and say Mayweather isn't great, and neither did he, but I will agree that he did duck quite a few fights to keep his 0, and most everyone seems to agree.

He's totally great...still time to atone for all the ducking...he can fight Canelo, Martinez, Pacman and move up to fight Geale and Golovkin in his last 5 fights.

It's one thing to navigate your career with caution...it's another thing to do it with the biggest mouth in boxing, insulting everybody you fight. If you do that, you can't be a woman about it - you've gotta wear your big girl panties and suck it up when people point out you haven't fought the strongest competition. Only way to silence the critics is to beat Canelo and the others.

 

[thegmanifesto]

You are all over the map.

Hatton moved up in weight and was out of his depth. And he was GROSSLY over-rated because of his skin color. Lost three of his last five fights at that point in his career, retired, and went into rehab.

"At that point in his career"? You mean "after that point in his career".

Big difference.

So you are blaming Floyd for beating an undefeated fighter?

Who then went on to lose to the second best fighter in the sport?

Makes sense.

Marquez was 36, and just fought at 130 pounds the year before!!

Yeah, and he beat PacMan 3 years later.

What a bum that guy is.

Cotto was coming off the greatest win of his career when he fought Mayweather?? After Pacquiao knocked Margarito's eye socket to pieces and Mosely beat him down?? THAT was his biggest win and the right time to fight him??

I am referring to a three fight win streak, Foreman, Mayorga and culminating with Margarito. You might remember he had a tough time with Margarito in the first fight.

Get it?

Guerrero was a "perfect time to fight him" because he was coming off the biggest win of his career?? How about...not fighting him at all! How about fighting someone who had been at 147 pounds for a couple of years?

Who?

As for Pacman, you said: "I think the ducking was on both sides, but then again, maybe you were in the negotiating room. I wasn't."

And you didn't need to be. Pacquiao said publicly "We'll do the fight at 50-50 purse with no other conditions". Mayweather wanted most of the purse, Olympic drug testing, can't fight if there's a full moon that month, blah blah blah. I asked Marlon Starling, former Welterweight champion, why the fight didn't get made and he didn't skip a beat: He told me "Mayweather don't want that fight".

Right.

Like I said, "the business of boxing". And everyone has an opinion.

Funny you are going off of what "Pacquiao said publicly" though.

I mean, real funny.

"Victor Ortiz - coming up in weight.

No he wasn't. He was already a welter."

For about ten minutes...fought at 140 or below for 95% of his fights before Mayweather.

Or three fights.

But if you feel better about making stuff up, have at it.

"Winky Wright, and Vernon Forest, and Felix Trinidad, in their primes...heck he never fought the last three guys AT ALL!).

I think you are mixing your eras up."

Why? Those guys fought at 154 or 160 when Floyd was at 147/154..why couldn't he go up and challenge them

Wrong again.

Winky Wright and Felix Trinidad were at 160 when Floyd was at 140.

And when should have he fought Forrest?

Again, you can't fight everyone.

None of these fights you are proposing make any sense.

You might as well be asking "Why didn't Floyd fight Sugar Ray Robinson? He didn't because he is ducking him!!!!!"

Why is that only Floyd's challengers have to have a weight disadvantage, if he's such a great fighter?

Three words:

De La Hoya.

Wrong again.

Maybe, he'll break this pattern with Canelo, who has called him out.

Who hasn't called him out?

And when Floyd retires at 48-0, people won't lump him in with Ray Leonard, Marvin Hagler, Thomas Hearns, Roberto Duran etc - all of whom fought each other, in their primes, and ducked NO ONE. They'll simply say he was a talented fighter who COULD HAVE BEEN one of the all-time greats, had he fought the best of his era.

I think they will.

Different eras though. Impossible to compare.

I have to agree with Dexter Morgan. I'm not gonna sit here and say Mayweather isn't great, and neither did he, but I will agree that he did duck quite a few fights to keep his 0, and most everyone seems to agree.

Who?

Pacman?

Who else is he "ducking"?

Most people now think Pacman was ducking Mayweather.

Again, I don't know, I wasn't in the negotiating rooms like you guys were.

And who is to say they still won't fight?

I don't know that.

Again, you guys probably have Arum's and Oscar's ears. I don't.

 

[Dexter Morgan]

"So you are blaming Floyd for beating an undefeated fighter?" Yes, actually - anyone connected to boxing thinks Hatton was an over-rated chump. Freddie Roach said so. Still, you know better...

Re: Marquez: "Yeah, and he beat PacMan 3 years later." See Erik Morales' comment above. You only need to look at the difference in Marquez body on both fights to see the difference. Did you see both fights?

Re: Ortiz. You said he fought at Welter for "three fights...But if you feel better about making stuff up, have at it.". No, he fought Lamont Peterson and Andre Berto at Welter. Two fights. His last fight before that was Vivian Harris at 140. So, let's review: 35 fights up to that point, 33 of them below 147 = 94.29% of his fights below welter.

"Different eras though. Impossible to compare." Uh...why, exactly? This isn't like comparing Babe Ruth to Barry bonds; Duran and Hearns and Leonard et al fought 20 years ago!! I was alive 20 years ago, and if I remember correctly, 147 pounds then = 147 pounds now. Fights were 12 rounds, gloves were generally 8 ounces, ring sizes generally 16 to 20 feet, rounds were 3 minutes...what was so different. Oooh - I know!! Those guys from 20 years ago didn't duck the best fighters of their era like Floyd!! You were right - it really was different!

"Again, I don't know, I wasn't in the negotiating rooms like you guys were. "

Chuckle chuckle snort snort. And NO ONE will notice this is a complete misdirection, that you don't need to be in the room to notice they NEVER ACTUALLY FOUGHT. Nope. You've fooled 'em!

But as with a lot of good snarkery, there is a bit of projection in what you say: I DO think many of us are closer to boxing, and more knowledgable about it, than you are. The two most prominent boxing-only journalists of the era seem to think Floyd was ducking Pacman; see links below. Who do you prefer to read on boxing?

http://sports.yahoo.com/box/news?slug=ki-floydducking072710

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...-floyd-ducking-fight-that-would-cement-legacy

 

[Dexter Morgan]

By the way: The real story of last nights fight wasn't that Floyd beat this blown-up 140 pounder who lacked a punch. The real story was that, at an age where many "skill" athletes start to decline, after a year of inactivity, two of which were spent in jail...he actually looked better/quicker than his last fight. So far, the one opponent Floyd hasn't ducked, his most impressive victory to date, is against father time...

 

[thegmanifesto]

"So you are blaming Floyd for beating an undefeated fighter?" Yes, actually - anyone connected to boxing thinks Hatton was an over-rated chump. Freddie Roach said so. Still, you know better...

Yeah, a guy who beat Kostya Tszyu is a chump.

Ok champ.

Re: Marquez: "Yeah, and he beat PacMan 3 years later." See Erik Morales' comment above. You only need to look at the difference in Marquez body on both fights to see the difference. Did you see both fights?

Ok.

So Marquez was a chump too.

Mayweather is a chump too.

Everyone sucks.

Got it.

Re: Ortiz. You said he fought at Welter for "three fights...But if you feel better about making stuff up, have at it.". No, he fought Lamont Peterson and Andre Berto at Welter. Two fights. His last fight before that was Vivian Harris at 140. So, let's review: 35 fights up to that point, 33 of them below 147 = 94.29% of his fights below welter.

Three including Floyd.

Now he is a welter. He was then.

I am sure he weighed less when he was a newborn.

What's your point?

Fights were 12 rounds,

They were also 15 round fights back then.

Anyone who knows that era knows that.

Like I said, different era.

Chuckle chuckle snort snort.

What?

You should kill that.

I don't read yahoo sport or bleacher.

The real story was that, at an age where many "skill" athletes start to decline, after a year of inactivity, two of which were spent in jail...he actually looked better/quicker than his last fight. So far, the one opponent Floyd hasn't ducked, his most impressive victory to date, is against father time...

Agreed.

 

[Four]

Didn't want Mayweather to win, but it happened. I saw a special on Robert Guerrero and his wife was diagnosed with cancer, pretty sad stuff.

 

[Dexter Morgan]

"They were also 15 round fights back then.

Anyone who knows that era knows that.

Like I said, different era."

Only very briefly. Ray Mancini knocked out Duk Koo Kim dead on a Saturday afternoon in Las Vegas in '81 or '82, and that was the end of that. Only ONE fight between those four guys went 15 rounds - the first Duran - Leonard fight.

Not that a couple of scheduled extra rounds makes that much difference - most of their fights against each other didn't go the difference, anyway, so what does a few extra scheduled rounds make? Not much.

 

[Dexter Morgan]

"I don't read yahoo sport or bleacher".

What about ESPN? Dan Raphael is their boxing-only analyst and, at this time, probably the most well regarded boxing writer out there. And he says your boy is a chicken who ducks fights.

Lemme guess: YOU only read Stephen A. Smith. It's OK to admit that. Lots of hood rats get their politically-inspired sports views from him...

 

[thegmanifesto]

"They were also 15 round fights back then.

Anyone who knows that era knows that.

Like I said, different era."

Only very briefly. Ray Mancini knocked out Duk Koo Kim dead on a Saturday afternoon in Las Vegas in '81 or '82, and that was the end of that. Only ONE fight between those four guys went 15 rounds - the first Duran - Leonard fight.

Wrong again. (For the 32nd time).

Hagler beat Duran in a 15 round decision.



I am not sure I have ever had a boxing conversation with anyone so consistently inaccurate as you.

It is almost incredible how inaccurate you are. Amazing even.

Congratulations.

Not that a couple of scheduled extra rounds makes that much difference -

Someone who has never boxed, if that wasn't obvious earlier.

This comment tells everyone all you need to know about this guy.

This is the problem with "fans" who have never boxed themselves; they don't know anything about the sport.

This guy is a great example of this.

"I don't read yahoo sport or bleacher".

What about ESPN? Dan Raphael is their boxing-only analyst and, at this time, probably the most well regarded boxing writer out there. And he says your boy is a chicken who ducks fights.

Lemme guess: YOU only read Stephen A. Smith. It's OK to admit that. Lots of hood rats get their politically-inspired sports views from him...

Who?

You are increasingly getting emotional and insulting in this conversation.

I don't mind of course, but that is what people typically do when they lose every point of an argument time and time again.

 

[Teedub]

I don't know if you would be interested in streaming it for free next time, maybe you prefer the quality of PPV, but you can stream every fight for free on www.firstrowsports.eu. That's what I use for all my sports and it almost always works. You can just hook the computer up to the TV instead of paying for it, but if you prefer the quality, PPV is definitely better, but still not bad on firstrowsports.

Yeah firstrow is good, but for boxing, check out: http://boxingguru.eu/ I wasn't sure to post it as wasn't sure if you guys could access a ".eu" site, but if you can get on firstrow then all good!

And when Floyd retires at 48-0, people won't lump him in with Ray Leonard, Marvin Hagler, Thomas Hearns, Roberto Duran etc - all of whom fought each other, in their primes, and ducked NO ONE. They'll simply say he was a talented fighter who COULD HAVE BEEN one of the all-time greats, had he fought the best of his era.

People will lump him in with those guys because he's better than those guys. Statistically speaking anyway. Check this out: http://espn.go.com/boxing/story/_/id/7780088/floyd-mayweather-jr-measures-boxing-greats

In those terms, he's head and shoulders above Ali, and like it says, only Joe Louis comes close.

Sure, the Pac fight would have been amazing in '09 or even '10, but now I'm not bothered and I'm confident May would have beaten Pac. That said, I believe Pac would have had a chance at winning. I actually do think it was Mayweather ducking Pacquiao, but I'm not sure of the reasons. 50 gives it his best shot here, go to 03:50:



TL/DW - Basically, he says Floyd isn't scared of fighting anyone, it all comes down to money. He's basically greedy and thinks he should be paid far more than his opponents. He also does cherry pick to an extent, but for financial reasons rather than fear.

 

[AlbertoDelMuerto]

I don't think Pacquiao has what it takes to beat Mayweather, at least not any more.

 

[InternationPlayboy]

I don't think Pacquiao has what it takes to beat Mayweather, at least not any more.

Exactly, not anymore. Mayweather wouldn't fight him when he possibly had what it takes. Now he'll probably end up fighting him in the next year or two because mayweather knows he's falling off.

 

[Timoteo]

Mayweather started as a junior lightweight I believe. People keep saying he ducked this guy and that, but many of those fighters were at their peaks before Floyd would have been ready to fight them. It took Floyd quite a while to reach his current stature. Now, some of the up-and-comers people are accusing him of ducking are probably being kept away from HIM, because THEY aren't ready.

No one was saying Mosley was washed up when he knocked Margarito out. No one was questioning Margarito when he beat up Cotto. De La Hoya was old when he fought Floyd, but Oscar gets lots of credit for fighting everyone out there. That was a bad match-up for him, but some fights get made because of the money they'll generate. Like Floyd does now, Oscar controlled a great many of his fights from the business side, and made the lion's share of the money. His opponents, unlike Pacquiao, didn't have an issue with it because it was still the biggest payday of their careers. When Cotto put hands on Floyd more than anyone else had, the talk was that Floyd was slipping. Now it's that Cotto is on the downside of his career (that's true, but he had Floyd bleeding). Floyd stood in and actually fought Cotto's fight for stretches (he didn't run, like so many erroneously accuse him of). When Guerrero was bullying Berto, no one was saying he wasn't big enough to fight welterweights. Berto isn't as skilled as Floyd, but he IS a true welterweight, and a banger. Guerrero moved up in weight, and bullied him. Now that Floyd slapped him up, the reason is because he isn't a true welter? Guerrero has been calling out Floyd for a couple of years. He got the fight, and realized after all the talk that it ain't as easy at it supposedly looked to him. His punch output against previous opponents was much higher, but when you're in there with Floyd and learn quickly that every time you lift your gloves to punch, you'll get slapped before you can get off, and if you DO get off, you'll miss and get slapped anyway. Hatton wasn't a true welter - he's natural at 140. But his people got him the fight and the payday. I didn't feel that Hatton did anything to warrant the shot, but he was sold as an exciting brawler that would make for an entertaining fight. He actually acquitted himself well - as good as could be expected. He tried to bully Floyd the way he did guys across the pond at 140, and got dropped. But he got paid like he hadn't in all his previous fights.

Pacquiao couldn't get a clean win against Marquez, then ended up getting starched by him. Floyd toyed with that same fighter, but again, the excuse is that he beat him because he was going up in weight. I don't get the reluctance to acknowledge his greatness. Sure, we can always look back at other eras and acknowledge that more great fighters fought each other. But at the same time, the fight game has changed a lot since the 80s and earlier. There are more alphabet belts to be had, and these organizations don't want to see belts unified. There's another title to be had every 5 to 7 pounds, so the multiple belts at multiple weights accomplishment is somewhat diminished. While Floyd has greater control than most fighters have over his career, the same can't be said about his opponents, so that still makes getting great match-ups difficult. I don't blame him for not making match-ups that don't benefit him financially, because he's doing the promoting, taking the risks, paying his opponent, etc. etc. I get why people don't like him as a man, but it truly clouds people's thinking and results in tons of revisionism regarding his career.

 

[thegmanifesto]

Timoteo -

Great comment as always.

It is usually the same guy who says X Opponent is going to beat Floyd, then after the fight discredits that same fighter with some excuse about how they were moving up in weight.

Oscar in retrospect was a few years off his best performance. But he had only lost to Trinidad (arguable), Mosley (close twice, but had his number, and the perfect style to beat Oscar) and Hopkins (outsized and over matched).

It wasn't like people thought Oscar was shot when he fought Floyd. On the contrary, most people picked him. He was the favorite. People were saying the old adage, "A Good big guy beats a good small guy" and all that. Hell, I think Angelo Dundee said that before the fight. (I of course went against popular opinion and correctly picked Floyd to win: Cinco de Mayweather: De La Hoya VS Mayweather , but that is neither here nor there).

And in retrospect, Hatton was over matched. Still he beat (and retired) Kostya Tszyu who was a super human beast.



And hell, the Hatton fight was one of Floyds most entertaining fights of this career.

Great match up. So how can anyone hate on that fight? That fight was worth every penny.

Again, I keep on saying it, but Marquez was the #3 fighter in the world when Floyd fought him. What is Floyd supposed to do? Conjure up opponents that are bigger and younger than him that don't exist? He can only fight one guy at at time, and the guys that are out there.

When Guerrero was bullying Berto, no one was saying he wasn't big enough to fight welterweights. Berto isn't as skilled as Floyd, but he IS a true welterweight, and a banger. Guerrero moved up in weight, and bullied him. Now that Floyd slapped him up, the reason is because he isn't a true welter?

Great point. My thoughts exactly.

Bottom line, it is easy to discredit Floyd (or any boxer) in retrospect.

But you have to know your history, like you do, to know the context of when these fights happen.

People don't realize, that it wasn't till 2007 when he beat Oscar that he became this big crossover star. Hell, the fight before that was with Carlos Baldomir. Before Oscar, he was just another star within the world of boxing.

Hell, I am not even a huge Floyd fan.

I do however love the way he boxes. It is near perfect. He is the guy I would want to be in the ring.

I just give respect and credit where credit is due. Some people let his on screen persona get in the way of that, which is too bad for them.

Guys are emotional these days though, as we can see earlier in the thread.

 

[Giovonny]

It helps my game to see these guys fight.

Floyd is 36. Hopkins is 46. Martinez is 38.

They are killing guys who are half their age.

What dedication! What spirit! What athletes.

Floyds defense is maybe the best defeneve if all time.

I don't know, I never saw Willie Pep fight..?

Did you guys see Rigondeaux beat Donaire?

That Cuban boy is a beautiful boxer. Pure old school. Pure class.