Government shutdown
- Thread starter Tex Pro
- Start date
It isn't a Fox News talking point, it is just a fact. If you are a man under 35 your insurance costs will sky rocket. Women it will go up a little for under 35, for men it will sky rocket.
The govt. shutting down isn't nearly as big of a deal as you are making it out to be. It has happened before and it will probably happen again.
Let's talk math.
With ObamaCare the AVERAGE family was going to save around $2,500 a year; now it's been established it's going to cost them an ADDITIONAL $7,000+ a year.
Math doesn't lie and anyone who thinks ObamaCare is good for America (not to mention it's completely unconstitutional), needs their head examined.
Much love to all my RVF brethen but it is what it is.
With ObamaCare the AVERAGE family was going to save around $2,500 a year; now it's been established it's going to cost them an ADDITIONAL $7,000+ a year.
Math doesn't lie and anyone who thinks ObamaCare is good for America (not to mention it's completely unconstitutional), needs their head examined.
Much love to all my RVF brethen but it is what it is.
K Galt
Woodpecker
This is all political theater designed to get the masses to accept radical changes to the Governmental and economic involvement in the Healthcare Industry.
For those in this thread arguing partisan politics...please. Just stop.
Republicons want More guns, less butter.
Demorats want more butter, less guns.
Neither address the problem that whether we're spending on guns or butter or both, we are "spending" money we don't have.
That's what the national debt means.
We're like an unemployed family living on welfare in a section-8 housing ghetto, arguing about buying a car or a boat on our maxed out credit cards. When someone says "hey, how can we afford either, when our credit cards are almost maxed out and we have no money or jobs? Oh, don't worry about that...they're going to increase our credit limit. They always do!"
Spending money we don't have on shit we don't need is the name of the Game, regardless of whether or not it's a Pachyderm or a Jackass in the Oval office, or which party supposedly "controls" congress.
Finally, the time to truly worry will be when civil society starts breaking down in the advent of a true "shutdown" aka what we saw in Greece last year. The American version of "Austerity measures." But it will be far more violent and destructive than what we saw in Greece.
When the social security checks, Government pension checks, medicare and medicaid reimbursement checks, WIC, SNAP and EBT benefits are no longer disbursed, we are going to have an awful lot of the citizenry who depend on those entitlement programs to keep a roof over their heads, clothes on their backs, food in their bellies and their daily dose of prescription meds from Big Pharma that so many folks cannot live without.
Once those things are no longer being paid for, in about 2-3 weeks we're gonna find out that the "Zombie Apocalypse" scenario is not just syfy fictional fantasy...but hordes of starving, homeless, in the throes of withdrawals from going cold turkey on all of Big Pharma's anti-depressants and pain killers they've been taking daily for months/years, are going to fill the streets with desperate, hungry and violent masses demanding their entitlements.
THAT'S when martial law by executive order goes into effect...then we'll all get to go camping!
For those in this thread arguing partisan politics...please. Just stop.
Republicons want More guns, less butter.
Demorats want more butter, less guns.
Neither address the problem that whether we're spending on guns or butter or both, we are "spending" money we don't have.
That's what the national debt means.
We're like an unemployed family living on welfare in a section-8 housing ghetto, arguing about buying a car or a boat on our maxed out credit cards. When someone says "hey, how can we afford either, when our credit cards are almost maxed out and we have no money or jobs? Oh, don't worry about that...they're going to increase our credit limit. They always do!"
Spending money we don't have on shit we don't need is the name of the Game, regardless of whether or not it's a Pachyderm or a Jackass in the Oval office, or which party supposedly "controls" congress.
Finally, the time to truly worry will be when civil society starts breaking down in the advent of a true "shutdown" aka what we saw in Greece last year. The American version of "Austerity measures." But it will be far more violent and destructive than what we saw in Greece.
When the social security checks, Government pension checks, medicare and medicaid reimbursement checks, WIC, SNAP and EBT benefits are no longer disbursed, we are going to have an awful lot of the citizenry who depend on those entitlement programs to keep a roof over their heads, clothes on their backs, food in their bellies and their daily dose of prescription meds from Big Pharma that so many folks cannot live without.
Once those things are no longer being paid for, in about 2-3 weeks we're gonna find out that the "Zombie Apocalypse" scenario is not just syfy fictional fantasy...but hordes of starving, homeless, in the throes of withdrawals from going cold turkey on all of Big Pharma's anti-depressants and pain killers they've been taking daily for months/years, are going to fill the streets with desperate, hungry and violent masses demanding their entitlements.
THAT'S when martial law by executive order goes into effect...then we'll all get to go camping!
Easy E said:
I've heard it before, recently, and I believe it was from the CBO.
Aliblahba said:
Ali: are you a defense contractor?
I kind of agree with CR, but ultimately it is my hunch that all federal govt workers are going to get paid after this all passes - everyone gets back pay for their furlough.. that is my hunch.. but what do I know? I am just going based on the shutdown/furlough that took place in 1996.
Easy E said:
Yep, the CBO...
http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapot...pending-by-7450-for-a-typical-family-of-four/
Contractors fuel the government manpower. Do you guys really think actual gov't employees do anything? Contractors saved the taxpayer a fortune overseas, and countless lives of the warfighter. We work to keep our jobs and for the companies to continue contracts. Gov't employees can't get fired for shit, and don't really care.
Easy E said:
Looks like forbes had an article about it last week.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapot...pending-by-7450-for-a-typical-family-of-four/
I am taking a more 'wait and see approach" as to whether the ACA will sink the economy or not.
Why is American healthcare so expensive compared to the rest of the world?
Is there anyway you can make it cheaper?
Is there anyway you can make it cheaper?
McQueen said:
McQ: You are mixing both data and opinion here.
The data that you provided does not make it a fact, but it could be persuasive one way or the other to some people. I don't have a problem with different opinions, but sometimes people make the statement of an opinion as if it is the only sane conclusion, which really is not fair.
We are still learning various facts and implementation issues about this fairly humongous legislation so it is going to play out differently for people in different circumstances.. we are not averages, but sometimes we may discover that something initially we thought was good to be bad or something that we initially thought was bad to be good.
Don't get me wrong, I am not exactly excited about this obamacare legislation, but likely it is gonna help some people. However, is it going to negatively impact others to such an extent that overall it is a negative rather than a positive, based on what i know so far is that I believe it is a net positive for the country and the American people. And, I am not going to get my head examined, yet. maybe later...
It_is_my_time said:
Did you read the article? It is not by the CBO. It is by Forbes. The author is constantly updating it due having several other critics point out the flaws in the calculation and methodology.
We really won't know how much more it will cost per family until the ACA has been in effect for a while. This is especially due to the fact that a lot of families (up to 400% of the poverty level) will get subsidies to help cover the cost of healthcare.
Aliblahba said:
Ali:
You are doing a salesmanship on govt contractors, and if it is based on your personal circumstances, I don't want you to take my comments personally or to insult you.
I think that people's opinions about government contractors is going to vary, and all that you said is not necessarily true - though some of what you said may be true in some circumstances.
As you know there is a lot of controversy surrounding the topic of government contractors, and in various ways government contracting has become problematic and corrupted b/c of how much money is going into it and some of the auditing difficulties.
There are some trade offs too, and some things that you mentioned as positives can be construed as negatives. Probably it is no not necessary to get into these kinds of discussions about pros and cons of govt contracting.
Generally, I have no problems with individuals making money however they can within a system (and contracting is one of those systems), but i may not agree with several aspects of the system.
Let me just leave my comment information that government contracting, especially in various military jobs, has greatly increased in the last 10 years (and we could gather various data points to show this considerable increase of contractors), and my opinion that it has increased much more than it is justified and ultimately cost the american people more than it is worth and also I become bothered by too much quasi privatization of traditionally public services. that does not make me anti-american, anti-capitalist, socialist or communist.. he he he ..
In these regards opinions can vary, and it could be a long discussion to say why one comes down one way or another (to flesh out the pros and the cons) on the topic of federal govt contractor proliferations (like rabbits in australia).
Well, that's just swell. I had to file an extension on filing my taxes. I received the W-2 I needed a few weeks ago but my dumb ass waited until last night to e-file. They keep rejecting my return for some nonsense about my SSN but I can't call them because their offices are shut down. The extended deadline to file is October 15th. Fuck my life.
K Galt said:
K Galt: Certainly you are entitled to your opinion and even speculation about the direction that this matter is going to go. And you make several good points.
Nonetheless, I find your comparison of government budget like a family budget to be lacking. the government's budget is not the same as a family's budget - especially the US government. There are at least a couple of ways that the govt budget is different.
First some things are neither profitable or agreed by everyone, but are legislated as must do this service and with some complicated funding scheme... including wars, policing social services.
second the US can make almost as much money as it wants b/c the US dollar happens to be the international standard (we shouldn't wanna screw up that cush deal)
third - sometimes its gonna make economic sense to over leverage a govt's budget, and it would be unwise to live within the budget when you should be leveraging in order to stimulate the economy or maybe for some other reason.
This example of comparing households to the govt is frequently used in mainstream media.. in order to get people to relate and to agree... and there is definitely faulty logic in that kind of comparison for the purpose of persuading us to engage in austerity, belt tightening, living within our means or whatever you wanna call it.