Home Security?

Engineer

Kingfisher
Gold Member
Orion said:
jessup25 said:
^ :laugh: I think that's the best suggestion so far.

Not really. Intruders will poison them with ease, i know from experience. And then you will have two puppies dead for no good reason, or sick.

snip

Agreed, poison is easy for a scumbag thief. Forgot about that. Big dogs would just deter an opportunistic scumbag, not a prepared professional.

Not sure if runsonmagic is looking to turn his crib into fort knox or just deter the occasional druggie thief. Seems like best to combine dogs/safe/sirens/cctv at the level appropriate for what he's trying to protect.

Sorry to hear about your dogs Orion.
 

HawkWrites

Woodpecker
Gold Member
objectivist tree said:
Just so you guys are aware: it is illegal to set traps that would kill burglars. I am not saying that anyone is suggesting that but just be aware that it is against the law to set traps that kill people, even if they are breaking into your house.

Case in point: one of my buddies from years ago set up his garage so a couple of live wires connected to his motorcycle. If anyone touched the bike, the electricity would flow.

Well, he fried some asshole with it and is in prison with a life sentence.
 

Engineer

Kingfisher
Gold Member
HawkWrites said:
objectivist tree said:
Just so you guys are aware: it is illegal to set traps that would kill burglars. I am not saying that anyone is suggesting that but just be aware that it is against the law to set traps that kill people, even if they are breaking into your house.

Case in point: one of my buddies from years ago set up his garage so a couple of live wires connected to his motorcycle. If anyone touched the bike, the electricity would flow.

Well, he fried some asshole with it and is in prison with a life sentence.

What about stepping up the voltage and making the current too small to kill? Any high-voltage experts on here?
 

HawkWrites

Woodpecker
Gold Member
Engineer said:
HawkWrites said:
objectivist tree said:
Just so you guys are aware: it is illegal to set traps that would kill burglars. I am not saying that anyone is suggesting that but just be aware that it is against the law to set traps that kill people, even if they are breaking into your house.

Case in point: one of my buddies from years ago set up his garage so a couple of live wires connected to his motorcycle. If anyone touched the bike, the electricity would flow.

Well, he fried some asshole with it and is in prison with a life sentence.

What about stepping up the voltage and making the current too small to kill? Any high-voltage experts on here?

If you could lower to the current to something similar to what stun guns use, you might be onto something there. The current is what kills you, not the voltage, so it's something to think about. Sending 900,000 volts through someone will certainly ruin their day and make them think twice (once they regain the ability to think after the initial shock of course).
 

Onto

Ostrich
Gold Member
Get a motion detection camera setup that emails a picture to your phone. You'll know right away someone is in your place and you just dial the cops and have them go over.
 

DarkTriad

Ostrich
Gold Member
Engineer said:
Orion said:
jessup25 said:
^ :laugh: I think that's the best suggestion so far.

Not really. Intruders will poison them with ease, i know from experience. And then you will have two puppies dead for no good reason, or sick.

snip

Agreed, poison is easy for a scumbag thief. Forgot about that. Big dogs would just deter an opportunistic scumbag, not a prepared professional.

Not sure if runsonmagic is looking to turn his crib into fort knox or just deter the occasional druggie thief. Seems like best to combine dogs/safe/sirens/cctv at the level appropriate for what he's trying to protect.

Sorry to hear about your dogs Orion.

That's OK, Orion was the guy that poisoned the dogs while he was robbing the house.
 

Feyoder

Pelican
Case in point: one of my buddies from years ago set up his garage so a couple of live wires connected to his motorcycle. If anyone touched the bike, the electricity would flow.

Well, he fried some asshole with it and is in prison with a life sentence.

WTF??!?! Which state is this?
 

paninaro

Pelican
Does anyone have any experience they can lend in terms of safes? Such as which is the best type of safe? And other observations relating to its security.

Get 2 safes. One is your decoy safe. Criminals assume if they see a safe (let's say it's a serviceperson working in your house), that you have something valuable in it. Now you're a target. Put some minor items in your decoy safe, so if your house is broken into or it's a home invasion, they'll focus on that and not think to look further.

One friend has the real safe mounted behind the decoy safe. This way, if the HVAC technician told his buddies, the safe is in the wall above the fireplace, they will go there and fine a safe.. but it will be the decoy safe and they won't think to look behind it for the real one. Of course, the complication here is wall depth, but another way is to mount it below the decoy safe but much more hidden.

With the price of electronics so low compared to 20 years ago, burglary generally doesn't pay (no one wants your $50 DVD player), unless you keep a lot of cash or jewelry at home, which most people don't. When someone knows a home has a safe, they know there's something valuable in there.
 

Jacob Robinson

Woodpecker
Catholic
Does anyone have any experience they can lend in terms of safes? Such as which is the best type of safe? And other observations relating to its security.
The most secure safe is one bolted to the floor, or one cast into the floor. Few criminals know how to open safes quickly, but they will haul it off and beat it with sledge hammers until it opens. So unless it is too heavy to move, bolt it down or surround it with concrete.

The better safes are UL rated for fire and burglar protection. If you want one that can not readily be opened by a burglar, look for a TL rating by the Underwriters Laboratory. TL-15 means a semi-skilled burglar with tools will likely take 15 minutes to get into it, etc. TL-15 and TL-30 safes would typically be for jewelry and may be required to get insurance coverage of high-value collections. Run-of-the mill safes will not be UL rated at all.

A safe should be the last layer of security. No high security facility depends only on a safe, it is layer after layer to deter, detect, and delay.

Keep the safe a secret and give no one a reason to think there is a high value item in the house. Have motion lights, cut back shrubbery, etc. Interior lights on timers. Reinforce door jams. Make sure all windows lock securely. Upgrade locks--have a locksmith add mushroom and anti-bump pins to lock cylinders, have them go with maximum MACS (a locksmith will know what that means) for the pinning, and go with an odd-ball 6-pin keyway if possible--that will thwart most picking and almost all bumping attacks. A less common Sargent, Corbin-Russwin, Yale, etc., keyway can be substituted for the ubiquitous Schlage SC1 and Kwikset KW1 keyways in some deadbolts and some key-in-knob lockets. Go with a "paracentric" (i.e., wiggly) keyway. Or go with a better lock (Schlage Primus, etc.) There is an exploitable flaw with the Kwikset "Smart Key" locks and I would personally stay away from them. And go with grade 1 or grade 2 lock hardware. Make sure dead bolts extend all they way into door frames--they do not really lock until the bolt fully extends. Door knobs that lock need to have their strike plates adjusted right so the dead lock feature works so the can not be carded open. For doors that open outwards, there are ways to secure them so hinges can not be removed. For sliding doors, do not have them, but if you are stuck with one, put large-headed screws in above the sliding door so it can not be lifted up out of the track. And add an auxiliary lock to it. Personally, I would remove any garage door emergency release cords.

Have a video system pushing notifications when motion is triggered, and have the DVR in a hidden area. Get a big dog. Have a security system. There are still some you can install yourself. Should have a sensor on every door and window and a glass-break detector on any large areas of glass. Go with cellular communications back to the monitoring company. If you go the do-it-yourself route you can get monitoring for around $10 a month.

If they get past all that, then for a safe, again, bolt it down. Hide it best you can. In one house we had, the safe was in a nook in the basement behind a stack of moving boxes. Beyond that, may want to secure any tools in your workshop that could be used to breach it (drills, angle grinders, cutting torches, etc.) Given a choice, put the safe in a corner where the door opens adjacent to a wall -- harder to use pry bars on it that way. For a better safe, get one that has thick hard plate and multiple relockers. Hardplate tears up drill bits and relockers will fire when a safe is messed with, and then it takes a safe tech, a pile of drills, and a lot of swearing to ever get the thing open again. When people go to the big box store to buy a safe they might be impressed by a lot of large diameter locking bolts. Those are not the issue. You need to take the back panel off the door and see what is going on under the hood. There needs to be a lot of hard plate to protect the lock. Thick steel is not really the issue--with the right drill bit you can go through steel like butter. Hardplate is what is needed. Hardplate destroys drill bits.

I would prefer a good quality mechanical combination over an electronic one. Nearly all electronic locks can be opened quickly by safe techs with certain tools. Those tools are only sold within the industry, and I have heard no reports of criminals getting them, but it could happen. A quality combination lock has no quick way to unlock it without the combination. Safe cracking in movies, where they dial in the combination by feel, is nonsense. Mechanical locks can be manipulated open, but it is not a quick process--it usually takes hours. If one is really worried about it, get an S&G 8410 -- rated for 20 hours of manipulation effort. Or get a Kaba-Mas X-10 lock, although it is electronic, there is no known method of getting past it other than destructive means. But unless you have something incredibly valuable those two locks would be expensive overkill.
 
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