How to be a better sibling?

[Engineer]

Not neccessarily. Try and impart a punishment on both. My grandpa did this to my brother and me when we were kids. Younger brother provoked me and I smacked him. Grandpa ended up yelling at us both but kept my younger brother in time out longer. He told him to not start fights.

Sometimes punishing the "victim" with little kids is an effective way to keep the younger one from being passively manipulative and the older one subordinate without dominating the younger. You can punish the older one's behavior without killing his spirit, something that will lead to resentment and problems down the road.

Does that make sense?

Yes, I agree. You punish both because you assume both were misbehaving, and try to adjust the punishment to fit the crime and to achieve the goals you stated. I tried this for a while myself, but just ended up punishing them both constantly. Eventually I said don't even come to me crying, because if I didn't see it I'm not taking action on it. There is no perfect/fair solution.

 

[Dr. Howard]

Also, what is with the child support advice? That seems like something from a 'take time to be a father' PSA ad. So the Dad should be giving money to mom and cross his fingers that she will spend it appropriately to solve the problem? I think Dad should be aware of the problem and them make up his own mind as to whether its a solution that requires money or not; If he thinks it warrants money then he should pay for the activity directly or give the money to Fortis and hold him accountable.

A friend of mine (a woman) had some good advice in this department, it was, "help out your kids but never give the mom money that you don't have to. Buy them diapers, buy them clothes, buy them school supplies or a bike. It keeps the woman honest and the man involved"

Doc, I really respect some of your excellent posts in other areas. On this one, your approach is very different than mine, and could have negative impacts on OPs family for many years.

1) Cross your fingers and hope the woman spends the money appropriately? Yeah I never said that. Woman/logic/money never go together, you can't be seriously thinking that is what I was advising.
2) The OP already indicated the father was not involved time-wise, so I suggested the next best thing from him to help the issue, money. To the mother/kids/OP directly, it doesn't really matter, because of #3 below:
3) Your female friend's advice might sound good on the surface but is actually COMPLETELY wrong. I understand the underlying point about men getting divorce raped and having to give money over to a crazy ex. Not fun. However, if the man buys the diapers or whatnot, then that's money the woman doesn't have to spend on diapers and can buy shoes or whatever it is she wastes money on. Money is completely fungible. Your woman friend sounds crafty - be careful around her and her "good advice"

Here's where I think you're right:

Beatdown is the fastest path to humility - yes, that will resolve the situation very quickly. But with what unintended consequence? The OP is not around to police the situation 24/7 and the 10 year old will likely suffer if the lesson taught to the 14 year old doesn't take. At some point, the 14 year old may lash out at his mother, when he's big enough. Then the OP will get pissed and put the him in the hospital. Then etc.etc.etc. Violence breeds violence.

I guess I'm in the minority opinion here, and most everyone agrees to slap some sense into the 14 year old. I'm not saying it won't work, but it should be a final trump card because after that you have no good options left. Good luck, whatever you decide.

True enough, I overlooked that the OP doesn't live in the house/isn't around.

 

[Engineer]

Try taking your brothers on a camping trip or going kayaking. Do some kind of activity together.

Great idea. What about turning it into a contest? "Two of us are going to (whatever they like best) next weekend. Me and the one of you who behaves best between now and then by not picking on the other and stressing mom out"

You go with one of them and it's a real treat for him to hang out with big brother. If the three of you go you risk them competing for your attention and it's 100x more work for you. The loser is punished by staying home with mom, hahaha. Tell the loser "I wanted to take you, but you let me down. Can you do better for next month and we'll (something even better). Or if a miracle happens and they're both angels for the week, you say I'm proud of you both, you're both going.

 

[jmourinho]

Simple solution: Just give him a good slap
A bitch slap for a bitch, Ari Gold style

 

[Fortis]

Well wait a second, hold on.

Why is the 14 year old picking on the younger one? Are you sure it is actually him just picking on him for the sake of picking on him?

When I was a kid, my younger brother would provoke me all of the time. Then of course i'd smack the f*cker and he'd start crying to get my parents involved. Of course I would get in trouble.

Get both sides of the story. If the 10 year old is in fact instigating it, then he deserves whatever he gets. Ask both of them what caused them leading up to it.

Of course the little one sometimes pick with his older brother, but the 14 year old has a way of taking shit too far. My younger brother was trying to find a hiking stick one day and he finds a stick that suits his height, so his older brother comes over, breaks the stick in half and throws it back into the woods for no reason.

The older kid will also just try to control the little kid all the time. They'll play PS3 together and if the younger kid no longer wants to play, his brother will force him to sit and play a game with him just so he can beat him. If he loses to the younger kid then he just trash talks the entire time. A bit of heckling is healthy for kids, but I think it's a bit much when you're constantly verbally abusing your little brother.

I think this has all has been exacerbated by the summer vacation: the older kid works some days, but not enough to always be out of the house. The younger kid goes to camp some days, but neither situation is full-time. Strangely, neither of them seem to want to spend much time with their friends, but I imagine that scheduling playdates is quite an ordeal in today's helicopter parent climate.

my mother spends much of the day out of the house working leaving the two with my grandmother. Sweet lady, but she (rightfully) doesn't have the energy to hover over a pair of kids all day.

They can't just have a friendly competition unless I'm there policing the situation. It's a bit ridiculous.

I was never like this with either of them, so I'm baffled as to why he's a jerk.

I won't pretend to be some saint or anything, but I imagine that I can help before my mom has to start calling the cops on this kid, or before I have to get violent, which is really not my thing, Especially on a kid 11 years my junior.

 

[J DOE]

If the 14 year old is really being that antagonistic to his little brother unprovoked then I would do everything in my power to stop it. The most beta person that I knew growing up had a badass alpha father but he had 2 older brothers who were huge assholes to him and would beat his ass all the time unprovoked.

The oldest brother is a pretty normal guy, but the younger two are completely fucked in the head. The middle one is on a ton of antidepressants and the youngest one learned to be too accommodating and completely lacks the ability to assert himself. He constantly gets walked all over by people.

 

[Fortis]

Update: I had to put the 14 year old in a sleeper hold because he got way out of line.

gist of the situation: He started acting rude, so I asked him to quit it. he wouldn't stop, so I asked him to leave the room. He wouldn't leave the room while I was playing COD with the 10 year old, so I ignore him. he snatches the control from my hand and curls up on the floor. Initiate sleeper hold on him. He cried and calls mommy. Lol.

I let him shrug out of it and hit me a few times, without flinching to let him know I can devour him if he contines to act out of line with me.


He got angry and cracked my laptop screen, so I am taking the money out of his next paycheck.

Problem solved? No, but at least he understands the differences in raw strength that we have. he also understands accountability and how he can't treat me like his mother and get away with it.

 

[weambulance]

Update: I had to put the 14 year old in a sleeper hold because he got way out of line.

gist of the situation: He started acting rude, so I asked him to quit it. he wouldn't stop, so I asked him to leave the room. He wouldn't leave the room while I was playing COD with the 10 year old, so I ignore him. he snatches the control from my hand and curls up on the floor. Initiate sleeper hold on him. He cried and calls mommy. Lol.

I let him shrug out of it and hit me a few times, without flinching to let him know I can devour him if he contines to act out of line with me.


He got angry and cracked my laptop screen, so I am taking the money out of his next paycheck.

Problem solved? No, but at least he understands the differences in raw strength that we have. he also understands accountability and how he can't treat me like his mother and get away with it.

:dodgy:

I'd go Major Payne on his ass and parade him outside wearing a damn dress if my younger brother damaged my computer. You have far more restraint than I, sir.

 

[Fortis]

I didn't see the need to do anything more. He did It when I wasn't looking and that just shoes his weakness. he felt defeated and needed to get petty vengeance. If he continues to act this way I will actually begin striking him. I hate to do it, but this kid's and asshole and need to understand that stronger people will not tolerate his sarcasm and irreverence.