Is homeopathy real?

Captain Gh

Ostrich
Atheist
Gold Member
It might be quakery... for us not in the "real know"! Both Obama & the Queen Elizabeth have 2 Full Time Homeopaths & Astronomists on Deck... let that sink in for a minute! It's energetic Healing! However... for the healing to take place FOR REAL... there might be "something else" goin on... only privy to Society Members! Even for a Mystery Religion fanatic like me... it's a door that I'm a bit scared to open! I'd try the intravenous vitamin C treatment recommended by Simeon first... and if that doesn't work... I'd try very light dosage of Anabolic Steroids afterwards!

Anyway good luck! As long as it ain't Street Drugs... try it! You're already way beyond anything Big Pharma would recommend to get you back in shape... and 98% of the World Population would already consider you crazy for not sticking to the "experts"... so go all out my friend!!
 

BasilSeal

Kingfisher
Catholic
Gold Member
At this point in my life, I now always consider treating an acute health condition in the following order, until things improve.

1. Eat better, hydrate, exercise, get rest
2. Push fluids, fasting, more rest
3. Careful supplementation if dietary sources seem insufficient
4. Homeopathy

In other threads, I've mentioned my health issues, incl. high cholesterol, gout, weight gain, heart palpitations, and a family history of Alzheimer's and rheumatoid arthritis that I'm watchful for.

Part of my personal path to health included homeopathy. My own experience says that, yes it can work. I certainly do not feel it is at all simply a placebo effect, and if you read any of my other medical posts, you can see the degree of diligence I've put into monitoring my health.

Even if homeopathic treatments are simply a placebo effect, if the result is improved health and wellbeing, that was my objective. The debate is interesting to me, but I don't need to be a doctor or a biochemist to know if I am feeling better, and I am content with that. Similarly, I can't explain the light wave / particle duality let alone other known quantum effects, but I'm still quite okay with physics.

I have so much skepticism of the current medical and especially pharmaceutical establishment, that I would at this point in my life be very VERY reluctant to take any drug, over the counter or otherwise. Whoever posted elsewhere a meme that one should 'judge doctors by how hard they work to get you OFF medication' nailed it in my view.

So, even with homeopathic remedies, I also approach with caution and careful study for matching and observing symptoms. Important also are dosages, potencies, frequency of dose.

Now as an aside (from the topic of homeopathy) try this. Every time you hear a commercial for a drug on TV that mentions death as a potential side effect (many do, have a listen), replace the word death in your head with "spontaneous bleeding from the eyes". I find the imagery of randomly bleeding from the eyes so much more vivid than some vague reference to death (which we all know is inevitable). It's terrifying, but yet in terms of health, one should prefer it to death of course. Others that say "suicidal thoughts" can occur. When I reword that one, I call it "a medication that will have you longing for death". Sign. Me. Up.

If a commercial told you that some medication carried random eye bleeding or longing for death as a side effect, would you still so willingly take it? I wonder.
 
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OrthodoxLaity

 
Banned
Orthodox
I am dealing with some health issues, and I recently had a consultation over Skype with a doctor from my country in South America who prescribed me homeopathic medication.

By definition, what doctors are doing when they prescribe medicine is homeopathy.

The way homeopathy works is to dilute medicine down to a small quantity and mix it with water when you take the drug.

When you take oral medicine, you take a small dose, usually in the micrograms or milligrams range and swallow it with water.

When you take a dissolvable tablet, it is also a small dose in the micrograms or milligrams range and it is dissolved in the water to reduce the concentration of the drug.

When you take an injectable form of the medicine, it is also a small dose diluted in water.

In fact, you can even buy medical nitroglycerin which is dissolved in water to produce a very low concentration solution of the drug.
 

BasilSeal

Kingfisher
Catholic
Gold Member
Well, this is not traditional homeopathy, neither by definition or in the practice you described above.

Although it can be much more complex, a homeopathic remedy would never have a dose measured in milligrams, micrograms, as a very simple way to differentiate.
 
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bucky

Hummingbird
Other Christian
My wife used to see a homeopathic practitioner in her country who misdiagnosed her as pregnant. Twice. I didn't know much about homeopathy before that, but I'm obviously pretty skeptical now.

That said, there's a homeopathic cold remedy for kids that they sell at Walgreens here in the States that seems to work for my kids, so who knows.
 

BasilSeal

Kingfisher
Catholic
Gold Member
My limited experience with homeopathy relates only to treatment of acute injuries and a very little bit on chronic illnesses, and specifically as it relates to my own health.

I do have a massive book on "homeopathic surgery" that I've never even opened. I have no idea what I even expect to find inside it. Which is the primary reason I bought it. I have no idea how homeopaths would diagnose or mis-diagnose pregnancy.

But, sounds like you built a family without them!
 

OrthodoxLaity

 
Banned
Orthodox
My limited experience with homeopathy relates only to treatment of acute injuries and a very little bit on chronic illnesses, and specifically as it relates to my own health.

I do have a massive book on "homeopathic surgery" that I've never even opened. I have no idea what I even expect to find inside it. Which is the primary reason I bought it. I have no idea how homeopaths would diagnose or mis-diagnose pregnancy.

But, sounds like you built a family without them!

The other claim that homeopathic practitioners make is that a substance that can cause disease in healthy people can cure the disease in sick people.

This is demonstrably false because the consumption of that substance may very well be what caused the illness in the 1st place.

For example, a homeopath would treat a person with atherosclerosis by telling him to smoke cigarettes.

But that would make the condition worse because cigarette smoking is the leading cause of atherosclerosis.
 

Jive Turkey

Kingfisher
Orthodox Catechumen
My only anecdote is this:

A couple years ago I had a wart on my finger and an old lady invited me to go on a walk with her. She found a plant and broke it in half and told me to press the liquid from the stem onto the wart for ten minutes and within a few days the wart was gone never to return.

This wart had been there for years and I had it frozen a few times and it always came back.

So obviously some remedies work. It makes sense that God would put plants with healing properties in nature!
 

BasilSeal

Kingfisher
Catholic
Gold Member
The other claim that homeopathic practitioners make is that a substance that can cause disease in healthy people can cure the disease in sick people.

This is demonstrably false because the consumption of that substance may very well be what caused the illness in the 1st place.

For example, a homeopath would treat a person with atherosclerosis by telling him to smoke cigarettes.

But that would make the condition worse because cigarette smoking is the leading cause of atherosclerosis.

That does not sound like anything a homeopath would do. If it helps to reframe the discussion, a homeopath treats patients with energy signatures derived from the dillution and agitation of a carefully selected substance to the point where it can no longer be found even at a molecular level in the remedy.

I don't see the relation to smoking cigarettes. There are many good books on the theory of homeopathy.
 
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BasilSeal

Kingfisher
Catholic
Gold Member
A homeopathic remedy in a moderate dose of 30c has a dilution of 1 part per 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000. Or, 10^60.

At that dilution, Avogadro would tell you that there is nothing is left of the original ingredient.
 

Hypno

Crow
That said, there's a homeopathic cold remedy for kids that they sell at Walgreens here in the States that seems to work for my kids, so who knows.

You go to the doc and he either does nothing or tells you to take an antibiotic which kills half of your gut biome.

Instead, megadose Vitamins C and D, gargle with saltwater, and use a saline spray on your nostrils. This will be more effective. Is that homeopathy?
 

BasilSeal

Kingfisher
Catholic
Gold Member
It is not. While homeopathic remedies are all natural, not all natural remedies are homeopathic in the way that the question was asked (Is homeopathy real?).

The topic was not on natural remedies, but on the use of specific homeopathic remedies, as prescribed by a homeopath in the model of James Tyler Kent, for example. These would have had the characteristic dilution as described above.

That is what generally makes people vacillate between either disbelief that they can possibly do anything at all (it's a placebo) or incredulity that anyone would put known poisons into their body (belladonna, arsenic, hemlock and more are all about $9 for 80 pellets on Amazon).

FWIW, I think natural remedies are great, including yours.
 
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WatchingWatchmen

Pigeon
Other Christian
I'm appalled seeing people recommending homeopathy on this supposedly Christian forum. - that's my Christian concern and as a seeker of the truth, I'm appalled by the complete lack of information between discussers on what exactly is homeopathy.

It's not only about dilution (to ridiculous levels), but also about inputting energy during the gradual solution by slamming the vials onto the elastic surface - they just talk about shaking so it doesn't sound so crazy (they call it succussion - from horse's mouth http://www.homeoint.org/morrell/articles/pm_succu.htm ).
And it has definitely occult roots, Hahnemann - founder of modern homeopathy was a freemason who took inspiration from alchemical writings. And when homeopathy dwindled in the UK after WW2 it was revived by "Arch-Druid Thomas Maughan". Speaks for itself, doesn't it?

Also, even if it worked, so what? God forbade witchcraft even though he never said it doesn't work.


btw, document on Orthodoxy and homeopathy:
A belief in homeopathy is often demonstrated by Orthodox Christians who are fascinated by the idea of conspiracies, particularly those of an eschatological nature. Homeopathy is seen as an alternative to using medicines developed by pharmaceutical companies, which are, apparently, part of an international anti-Christian conspiracy. There is no doubt that the pharmaceutical industry has been deeply involved in some huge financial and ethical scandals, but is pagan holistic medicine the answer?
 

BasilSeal

Kingfisher
Catholic
Gold Member
Here is a video that illustrates the manufacturing process for Boiron remedies:



I personally do not entertain the thought that there is anything occult about modern homeopathy, as an alternative to allopathic treatment and prescription drugs. But, I am also not boldly recommending homeopathy either, only stating that I've seen it work (and that it could be a placebo effect). I definitely would recommend avoiding prescription drugs whenever practicable. One of these two treatment philosophies is responsible for the injury and death of countless people.

For good health, as stated, I recommend eating healthy and unprocessed foods, hydration, exercise, rest, fasting, and vitamins if it is not possible to get certain vitamins and minerals from your diet. But, no one is immune to illness and we will all die. I have a book with a number of beautiful and wonderful prayers that I turn to during times of illness. Perhaps I will share some, but not in this thread.

It certainly makes sense to me to seek your guidance from your religious leaders, or to simply avoid if there is any doubt. I have no doubt this is a Christian forum.
 
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Enhanced Eddie

Pelican
Orthodox Inquirer
Gold Member
I was healed from very severe hay fevers and allergies by homeopathy, when all else had failed.

Much like anything that is vilified by big pharma and the institutions, in my experience it seems to be helpful.

I believe it is important to find a good practitioner, but if you do then it seems to help.
 

BasilSeal

Kingfisher
Catholic
Gold Member
In a lot of ways, I wish this thread were in the "Deep" (forum). There are some really interesting topics around homeopathy that would be a lot of fun to discuss. There are a few remaining things I think I'd like to share on this thread, and then I'm happy enough to let my contributions ride.

The first is, I think the video I posted is an interesting and stark contrast to @Roosh 's video on canola oil. So, on the surface, I see nothing nefarious about how homeopathic medicines are produced, regardless of the strange words that they used in the early days of homeopathy (likely to help distinguish from simple allopathic concepts). This includes "secussion" as well as "miasm" and there are plenty more. I am happy to use the term "shake", and you can see the process in the video. They are shaking a vial. Call it what you like, it is no more complex than that.

The second is that what we see, but do not understand, should not automatically assume some occult or demonic involvement. In my original(?) post on this topic I briefly touched on the duality of light as a particle or as a wave. And this, along with many other topics in the realm of quantum physics, are highly demonstrable, but not well understood. That does NOT make them demonic, or occult. Neither does the fact that such inexplicable phenomenon (by classical physics or other scientific inquiry) are noted first by those who have an association with the occult, with freemasons, with certain religions, etc... make them so.

Today, we can all agree that quantum physics is a real and demonstrable scientific reality. Quantum computers demonstrate that such things can exist, and a whole history of science shows that there are countless examples of physical objects and properties that are only explicable in terms of quantum theory. This includes the wave/particle duality, but also radioactive decay. Everyone who watched Breaking Bad knows the name Heisenberg. Not as many know what his uncertainty principle is, or why it is meaningful.

The thought that any substance can be diluted to the point where no single molecule (see again, Avogadro) should present within it should confound reason. It should confound science. It should make people question the minds of those who even suggest that a modality of health drawn upon such shaky ground could ever, really, be "a thing". Yet. People really say it works.

As often as we talk about quantum physics, the reality is that we speak mostly about physical objects, of light, of electrons, and atomic particles of matter, and we observe in a lab how they work, what they do, and what effect our mere observation has on their outcome (a lot). All of these effects have a great deal to do with "energy", and not at a molecular level, but at the most basic level of human understanding, of quarks, qubits, and such. These crazy things have non-local physical properties and "spooky actions at a distance".

Yet, we too are, part of, this same thing. Our physical bodies have these same properties and are likewise subject to the same kinds of influences that our lab observed material is influenced, at the quantum physical level. But nobody talks about "quantum biology" or "quantum chemistry". We do not take those same principles and turn those same ideas inward, to consider what is the nature of our physical bodies. At least, not often. Schrodinger DID do this, in a 1944 paper called What is Life?. It is easy to find (somewhat easy to read) and about 30 pages in length.

We are okay with certain inexplicable things because we have to be, because they are in our face, and because of the "scale" of our involvement. But not because they're in any way fully understood. This includes the flow of electrons, of gravity, of magnetism. All of the forces that work within our universe that we see. But we can't unify them, or get them all to make sense together, even before introducing nuclear and subatmomic or quantum forces into the discussion. Truly this is a wonderful, wonderful world.

The point that I'm making, I hope, is that just because something is not fully understood, does not make it anti-Christian, any more than quantum physics. It is an area exploration for science, and it is at the heart of our physical reality. In my mind (as an intellectual person), I find all of this fascinating, and I consider myself and open-minded skeptic on all of it. But, my interest is pure in intention, and truth is my objective, in all things. I cannot make the occult leap here, and I hope that we reach a point of understanding on such topics that, rather than casting ethical doubt on the process, we understand it well enough to marvel at yet another facet of God's wonderful design.
 
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Tardynox

Sparrow
Orthodox Inquirer
I was healed from very severe hay fevers and allergies by homeopathy, when all else had failed.

Much like anything that is vilified by big pharma and the institutions, in my experience it seems to be helpful.

I believe it is important to find a good practitioner, but if you do then it seems to help.
Made me curious since I have had to suffer through relatively rough hay fever symptoms in the past, what did you use?
 

Philip Dru

Sparrow
Trad Catholic
When I was litte I often would become sick on long car drives. Eventually my mother gave me homeopathic pills and I never had to puke again. But I didn`t knew they were homeopathic. Then in eight grade I did a presentation about homeopathy and came to the conclusion that it is bullshit and the placebo effect did work for me. Still I heard it does work on farm animals.

I am now more open to alternative medicine than my eight grade "enlightened" self, but I still do not trust it. The logic behind it seems faulty. Say you want something against vomiting. You take a plant that make you vomit and dilute it with water. Sometimes to such a degree that nothing is left. Why would that work?

In Germany homeopathy is big and in my opinion just a way to extract money from gullible people.

I also was given homeopathy at a young age and later believed it was bunk.

HOWEVER. watch this documentary on Nobel Laureate Luc Montagnier's study on the memory of water. Water can retain frequencies, which may be why life depends on it. The fascinating work he is doing suggests to me that Homeopathy is likely legitimate.

It is the most compelling documentary I've seen in the last 5 years, and it gives me a better appreciation for the mysteries of baptism. I believe he uses this ability of water to re-assemble molocules from the composite particles. Praise God for this intriguing universe.

 

Sherman

Ostrich
Orthodox Inquirer
I have been taking peptones for several months prescribed by a Homeopathic doctor in Mexico. It is suppose to help for enlarged prostate problems. The only solution of Western medical science is surgery that burns, cuts and destroys tissue creating more problems than it solves.
 

Australia Sucks

Kingfisher
Other Christian
Why do people bother with quackery like homeopathy when legitimate alternative medicines exist?

You can visit a qualified Dr. of Naturopathy who will give you various herbal supplements or recommend dietary or lifestyle changes, etc that have proven efficacy.

Even a traditional village herbal medicine man who has good knowledge of plants can be highly effective. Homeopathy on the hand is just quackery.
 
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