It Is Time To Leave The West

xmdr

Pigeon
Orthodox
A really nice article, providing comprehensive view on the situation in Russia:

 

Parmesan

Kingfisher
Other Christian
Florida or Texas...are you crazy? There are only a few places worse than those in the USA I can think of (california). Texas is hot, dry, and flooded with illegals, florida loosely the same. The only places you should be considering is the countryside in the mid west, alaska, or the mountains (but the mountains are getting flooded by californians)
Mountains in the lower 48 are very questionable, as most accessible mountain towns (not tainted by mining toxins) have been taken over by, or have a large presence of Hiking Boot liberals (the dude in Montana that confronted Tucker Carlson, perfect example of one). Even red states like Montana have a strong university system in their ski towns which of course brings the usual politics. Rural mountain real estate is generally expensive and likely overpriced, you are probably at least 10 years too late, more like 20. What’s left of middle class mountain range towns are usually that way for a reason: decline of mining or other local industry and no nearby ski resorts or outdoorsy icons. I suspect even these places will gentrify soon as the boom in remote work obviously enables people to live closer to the recreation and scenery they fantasize about.
 

oldfaith

 
Banned
Orthodox
A really nice article, providing comprehensive view on the situation in Russia:


Right on. I keep updating Russia thread as insanity unravels.
I have a feeling QR code system is being pre-tested in some countries before they move on with more expansive versions.
There's a reason China suggested global QR code system, that's where it's going.
Various tests are being run in different countries, as different people have different mentalities.
They back off sometimes, like in the city of Moscow, but they're just re-grouping.
They want to unroll global passport without riots.
Back in 2020, when Russia had e-passes to travel or leave the house and QR codes were tested, people were saying the right thing: they're not going through all this trouble and effot for nothing. They'll deploy that stuff in full to control everyone's movement eventually.
 

Blade Runner

Hummingbird
Orthodox
I had that theory about a year ago: China set off an arms race of: "Look at what they're doing! We have to catch up and get that same type of control over our people! Otherwise, we won't be able to compete with them."

Bizarre, yes, but that's what the prince of this world has gotten these people to do - forget their humanity, their past, all manner of virtue and constantly look for ways to establish positioning that they think will put them on top for a long time.
 

Don Quixote

Ostrich
Orthodox Inquirer
Florida or Texas...are you crazy? There are only a few places worse than those in the USA I can think of (california). Texas is hot, dry, and flooded with illegals, florida loosely the same. The only places you should be considering is the countryside in the mid west, alaska, or the mountains (but the mountains are getting flooded by californians)
Huh? Florida is awesome. At least momentarily. Probably it won't last long, as I feel it's all because De Santis is gearing up for a Presidential run. If you want to go somewhere that is really anti-vax, your best bet would be Wyoming, Alabama, Mississippi, and Tennessee.
 

canuckj

Woodpecker
Other Christian
Huh? Florida is awesome. At least momentarily. Probably it won't last long, as I feel it's all because De Santis is gearing up for a Presidential run. If you want to go somewhere that is really anti-vax, your best bet would be Wyoming, Alabama, Mississippi, and Tennessee.
There are tons of options in the USA. That is something we don't have in Canada. I think we all read to pray for Governor Rick De Santis. People who are fighting evil become targets.
 

Don Quixote

Ostrich
Orthodox Inquirer
There are tons of options in the USA. That is something we don't have in Canada. I think we all read to pray for Governor Rick De Santis. People who are fighting evil become targets.
Yea Canada seems completely done for. I would do all I could within my power to escape it, if I were you. They are trying to find other methods of inducing collapse in America, such as the new food shortage thing. If they can't get this country through one method they will just institute harsher methods. It's like going through various circles of hell. So maybe you are not missing out on that much.
 

oldfaith

 
Banned
Orthodox
Huh? Florida is awesome. At least momentarily. Probably it won't last long, as I feel it's all because De Santis is gearing up for a Presidential run. If you want to go somewhere that is really anti-vax, your best bet would be Wyoming, Alabama, Mississippi, and Tennessee.
Alabama - their governor already publicly blamed the unvaccinated. What else to add.
If one wants to protect their job including remote I'd go to a state with strong legal protection such as TX, FL, I also heard they fear to mandate Montana residents.
A remote employee creates a nexus in the state for the company, and if VA company mandates TX-resident remote worker, they violate TX law and can be fined.
 

CaliforniaBased

Woodpecker
Catholic
good news from Poland :
"The E.U. accuses Poland of undermining the entire 27-nation union by asserting that its domestic laws take precedence over shared European law. Poland is the first member state to do so, and E.U. leaders say the move threatens the very foundations of the bloc.

More than 100,000 people across Poland took to the streets in protest in response to a ruling from the country’s top court, which declared that judges can ignore certain European Union laws and rulings. Many fear this is an initial step toward “Polexit,” or Poland’s leaving the bloc like Britain did with “Brexit.” "
 
I understand where this thread and video is coming from. I do. But evil is found everywhere and we know that evil will take over the world or close to it before the return of Christ.

Christ never ran from his obstacles he tackled and confronted them as they came. He could have ran off but never did. Where can I go where degeneracy will not reach? It’s inevitable. I rather stay where I was born and raised and fight the religious and whatever other battle that may come.

Look at all the “refugees” fleeing their nations only to go to other nations and turn it into a shit hole. Even if there is some based Christian only utopia, do you think “they” will let it stand and let it take its course? No.

You could go off grid a bit. Be self sustaining and prep food and such. I think that’s a bit more doable and realistic. We need to stand and defend what’s ours like our ancestors did even if it means death.
 

Solitarius

 
Banned
Catholic
I wanted to mention Mennonites. Yes, and there're also some communities/villages of German immigrants but I don't think one has to be ethnic German to buy land in them. It's easier to live in a community there, I think, especially if one isn't good with Spanish. My understanding is that Paraguay has real gun rights. I can't figure out where their restrictions are going - right now they're heading into summer, so of course that's most relaxed time in any country. Comes winter not sure what it's going to be there if they don't get their vaccination rate high they might be told by NWO to lock down and mandate, like what just happened to Russia.
Paraguay is an interesting country, one of their dictators Alfredo Stroessner was half German & half native. As for language I read that the aboriginal idiom Guarani is widely spoken in Paraguay, so much so that in some of the more rural areas they don't understand Spanish. I looked it up out of curiosity & from the little bit I read about the grammar it is fiendishly difficult to learn.
 

Liviu

Robin
Orthodox
Did Father Seraphim Rose in his great wisdom not also say "I should state an elementary truth: modern science, when it deals with scientific facts, does indeed usually know more than the holy Fathers, and the holy Fathers can easily make mistakes of scientific facts; it is not scientific facts which we look for in the holy Fathers, but true theology and the true philosophy which is based on theology."

And if the holy Fathers could easily make mistakes of scientific facts because they do not have the full knowledge of science, would the same not also apply to politics, and even more to later theologians, indeed to Father Seraphim Rose himself? And to the Meotropolitan Neophitos of Morphou indeed as well?

We should certainly respect their great wisdom on theology and the true philosophy based on theology. However, when it comes to matters of science or politics, we need to be mindful that they may not have the full spectrum of facts and therefore can be wrong on such matters.

If you decide to leave your own country it should be done only if you yourself have all the facts, and are certain that to leave is the right thing to do. Not because a Metropolitan makes statements about politics, or because Gonzalo Liro does. You yourself must be certain.
I see you quote from father Seraphim Rose despite you are not orthodox. I think you confuse things a bit. The western reasoning, meaning logic , which damages the faith (according to Saint Paisios) is visible in your statement. You quote yourself from Father Seraphim but, no disrespect, twist a little the meaning. Scientific facts are one , and political facts, which relate at nations` and ultimately people`s life is a total different thing. Scientific things were seen and described by the fathers of Church with humanly eyes in opposition with people`s destiny where mainly they were enlighted by God.
Saint Paisios the Athonite said with years before that Soviet Union will get dismantled. Even professors at the University said he`s wrong. Eventually they phoned him to apologize. The metropolit Neophytos of Morphou took information from at least one hesychast if not more. I think he or a bishop from Greece takes information from more than one person with holy life in order to be sure about what information lets out. Also, there are other similar propheties, related to what I quoted, from people with holy life from Russia or Greece. I know, psychological some things are harder to accept. But , as we see, in that matter, people of holy life from different ethnicities and different parts of the world have the same enlighted perspective.
I didn`t advised anyone to leave his own country, just that I would welcome anyone in my country.Is a personal or familial decision for everyone. Darius, the initiator of this forum, being in Europe, felt is guided to go back in his homeland. Eventually, we all will have to take a stand for outh faith and maybe to understand earlier that we have a bigger role in our Christian community.
 
I see you quote from father Seraphim Rose despite you are not orthodox. I think you confuse things a bit. The western reasoning, meaning logic , which damages the faith (according to Saint Paisios) is visible in your statement. You quote yourself from Father Seraphim but, no disrespect, twist a little the meaning. Scientific facts are one , and political facts, which relate at nations` and ultimately people`s life is a total different thing. Scientific things were seen and described by the fathers of Church with humanly eyes in opposition with people`s destiny where mainly they were enlighted by God.
Saint Paisios the Athonite said with years before that Soviet Union will get dismantled. Even professors at the University said he`s wrong. Eventually they phoned him to apologize. The metropolit Neophytos of Morphou took information from at least one hesychast if not more. I think he or a bishop from Greece takes information from more than one person with holy life in order to be sure about what information lets out. Also, there are other similar propheties, related to what I quoted, from people with holy life from Russia or Greece. I know, psychological some things are harder to accept. But , as we see, in that matter, people of holy life from different ethnicities and different parts of the world have the same enlighted perspective.
I didn`t advised anyone to leave his own country, just that I would welcome anyone in my country.Is a personal or familial decision for everyone. Darius, the initiator of this forum, being in Europe, felt is guided to go back in his homeland. Eventually, we all will have to take a stand for outh faith and maybe to understand earlier that we have a bigger role in our Christian community.

No, I don't think I "confuse" things, and I certainly do not twist the meaning of the quote, it is very clear. What Father Seraphim Rose said about the possibility of the holy Fathers easily being capable of making mistakes as to science was based on the premise, as he said himself, that they would not have the full scientific facts at times. The essence of the very wise statement by Father Seraphim Rose is that you need to have the full facts to make a correct analysis. As he correctly pointed out, this can not always be the case with science, and equally it can not always be the case with politics, where the full facts would also not always be known to later theologians.

That is not to say that theologians can not be right about science or politics, of course they can. Many have made correct predictions as you rightly said. And indeed, it is correct that there is a difference between science and politics. However the same principle outlined by Father Seraphim Rose applies, you need to have the full facts in both arenas to make a correct analysis, and in science as in politics, theologians may not have them at all times and can be wrong in their analysis.

Past performance is no guarantee of future outcome, and just because some predictions have turned out to be correct in the past does not mean that all predictions on politics made by theologians will be correct. If they have the full facts they might be. But they can easily be wrong. So if anyone decides to leave their own country it better be because they made the decision based on their own circumstances, not because anyone predicts this or that political outcome unless such prediction is made in full knowledge of all facts.
 

Liviu

Robin
Orthodox
No, I don't think I "confuse" things, and I certainly do not twist the meaning of the quote, it is very clear. What Father Seraphim Rose said about the possibility of the holy Fathers easily being capable of making mistakes as to science was based on the premise, as he said himself, that they would not have the full scientific facts at times.

The more we discuss , the more visibile depth between western rationalism and Christian-orthodox perspective.I thought I was quite clear. Is not about `analysis` of the holy fathers or about `prediction` , is about what God revealed or reveals to them. In science is a total different thing, they used mainly their mind.
However the same principle outlined by Father Seraphim Rose applies, you need to have the full facts in both arenas to make a correct analysis, and in science as in politics, theologians may not have them at all times and can be wrong in their analysis.
Again, `principle`, `full facts`, `analysis`. No difference in the view of aproaching science and people`s destiny. Is God discovery, not analysis in some things.

And I give you this, despite I thing is futile, hope I am wrong:

Saint John Chrysostom : `Where is the wisdom of God is no need of wisdom of men`
 

oldfaith

 
Banned
Orthodox
Paraguay is an interesting country, one of their dictators Alfredo Stroessner was half German & half native. As for language I read that the aboriginal idiom Guarani is widely spoken in Paraguay, so much so that in some of the more rural areas they don't understand Spanish. I looked it up out of curiosity & from the little bit I read about the grammar it is fiendishly difficult to learn.
Yes, I heard that about Guarani being dominant language in places. In my experience in a dual-language country like that someone not knowing Spanish well might feel more at ease. Less "otherness". Just a guess, but personally I always feel as less of an outsider in dual-language places.
 

Sword

Sparrow
Catholic
Mountains in the lower 48 are very questionable, as most accessible mountain towns (not tainted by mining toxins) have been taken over by, or have a large presence of Hiking Boot liberals (the dude in Montana that confronted Tucker Carlson, perfect example of one). Even red states like Montana have a strong university system in their ski towns which of course brings the usual politics. Rural mountain real estate is generally expensive and likely overpriced, you are probably at least 10 years too late, more like 20. What’s left of middle class mountain range towns are usually that way for a reason: decline of mining or other local industry and no nearby ski resorts or outdoorsy icons. I suspect even these places will gentrify soon as the boom in remote work obviously enables people to live closer to the recreation and scenery they fantasize about.
Great point, even if its against mine. To be clear, I am talking about the area purely from a survival point of view. I am unfortunately very well aware of politics and economics. Montana/idaho was to be my 'retreat' area, so it was with great displeasure seeing the hippsters flood out from california with their wfh jobs and literally drive up the price 3x in the scope of less than a year. So, there is a pain in my heart seeing quaint houses and towns that could be bought for less than 200k in 2019 pushing 600,000$ easy in 2021.

All this being said, the areas I still consider now are midwest states, or alaska. What are your thoughts? I would miss the mountains so much, even if they are tainted by this swine.
 

Geo Martin

Woodpecker
Catholic
Maybe the only safe haven left will be something like the favelas in Brazil, they're armed to the teeth and the police won't even dare go in there.
But then how a gringo like most of us will handle the drug trafficking gang members with tear tattoos and gold teeth is another story. Time to work on those tans, black hair dyes and perms lads...
 
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