Nowhere did I say it was easy. I just said the intentions are clear. No one joins the FFL in order to “defend freedom” or “protect their country.”
Joining the U.S. Military in 2020?
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CamelJockey
Pigeon
Can you explain what "pozzed" means? All I can find is it refers to gays being HIV positive. So when you say "the military is pozzed", what exactly does that mean?
- Obedience to God. The Bible says that God’s servants would “beat their swords into plowshares” and not “learn war anymore.”—Isaiah 2:4.
- Obedience to Jesus. The apostle Peter was told by Jesus: “Return your sword to its place, for all those who take the sword will perish by the sword.” (Matthew 26:52) Jesus thus showed that his followers would not take up weapons of warfare.
Jesus’ disciples obey his command to be “no part of the world” by remaining strictly neutral in political matters. (John 17:16) They do not protest against military actions or interfere with those who choose to serve in the armed forces. - Love for others. Jesus commanded his disciples to “love one another.” (John 13:34, 35) They would thus form an international brotherhood in which no one would ever wage war against his brother or sister.—1 John 3:10-12.
- The example of early Christians. The Encyclopedia of Religion and War states: “The earliest followers of Jesus rejected war and military service,” recognizing those practices as “incompatible with the love ethic of Jesus and the injunction to love one’s enemies.” Likewise, German theologian Peter Meinhold said of those early disciples of Jesus: “Being a Christian and a soldier was considered irreconcilable.”
I'm downvoting especially because of point 4 which is an insult to Christians who fought and died to protect their countries. If Christians followed this pacifist ideology there would have never been a single Christian country in history. Also the idea that there could be a world without war is just lunacy. This is a fallen world.
If someone breaks into your church and starts breaking things, a peacemaker would ask them to leave, and then physically remove them if needed. Christ used a whip and overthrew tables to defend His temple. If someone attacks my family I will take up weapons to stop that.
Violence should be a last resort, definitely, but it has a place and time.
I would posit that the rejection of military service by the early Christians had more to do with the fact that enlisting would require them to fight for an empire that sacrificed to idols, and enlisting could involve participating in worship and sacrifice with pagans in opposition to Christianity. How that is glanced over by your encyclopedia, I don't know, maybe it is addressed elsewhere.
Very selective use of Bible verses as well. Could bring up examples of the Apostles being ordered to buy a sword and the Israelites to kill all of the Canaanites, implying there is a time for war.
Jesus mentioned that “My Kingdom is no part of this world.” (John 18:36) Certainly God has the ability to ensure that true worship would continue irrespective of the political or ideological climate in the nations from century to century. This is evident today considering that the Bible is the most reproduced book in history and translated in hundreds of languages. God does not need any particular 'Christian' nation to fulfill his purpose, therefore why would we be called to defend them? The war we are supposed to fight is a spiritual war, and not for the 'ruler of this world' (Satan). Satan has cleverly convinced many to fight for Nations and in doing so, many so called Christian have fought and killed many other Christians.
This particular instance of Jesus in the Temple was regarding true worship in the temple among people who professed to share the same religion. Basically a dispute between family members (people of the same faith).
Faithful worshippers of God throughout history have been victims of violent crime. (Genesis 4:8; Job 1:14, 15, 17) If a person is confronted by an armed robber, what should he do? Jesus instructed: “Do not resist him that is wicked.” (Matthew 5:39) He also said: “From him that takes away your outer garment, do not withhold even the undergarment.” (Luke 6:29) Jesus did not condone use of physical weapons to defend material possessions. If confronted by an armed robber, a wise person will not resist giving up his valuables. Surely, life is far more precious than belongings!
On the other hand, what if a person’s life is threatened by an assailant? A law that God gave to ancient Israel sheds light on this. If a thief was caught in the daytime and was killed, the assailant would be charged with murder. This was evidently because thievery did not carry the death penalty and the thief could have been identified and brought to justice. However, if an intruder was fatally struck at night, the householder could be exonerated because it would be difficult for him to see what the intruder was doing and to ascertain the intentions of the intruder. The householder could reasonably conclude that his family was under threat of harm and take defensive action.—Exodus 22:2, 3.
The Bible thus indicates that a person may defend himself or his family if physically assaulted. He may ward off blows, restrain the attacker, or even strike a blow to stun or incapacitate him. The intention would be to neutralize the aggression or stop the attack. This being the case, if the aggressor was seriously harmed or killed in such a situation, his death would be accidental and not deliberate.
The distinction here is very different than going off to war in Military service for the nations.
Indeed Jesus requested that the disciples buy swords, but when they were used during the time that Jesus was confronted by soldiers, he told them immediately to put them away. He also had the ability to instantly heal any flesh wound, which he did (Matt. 26:52, 53). We do not have this ability, or the same authority as Jesus. The lesson he wanted to show was very clear, live by the sword, die by the sword.
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There is a time for war and a time for pacifism. I would have thought the time for pacifism would have been America from 1900-present. But our rulers had other plans
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“St. Cyril continued: “Christ our God commands us to pray to God for those who persecute us and even do good to them, but He also said to us, ‘Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends’ (John 15:13). That is why we bear the insults that our enemies cast at us individually and why we pray to God for them. However, as a society, we defend one another and lay down our lives, so that the enemy would not enslave our brethren, would not enslave their souls with their bodies, and would not destroy them in both body and soul.” (From the Prologue of Ochrid)”
Soldiers asked John the Forerunner what they should do, he responded thusly: “he said to them, “Rob no one by violence or by false accusation, and be content with your wages.” (Luke 3:14). He didn't say “quit the army it violates the rules of pacifism.”
[Rulers in authority are] God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain; he is the servant of God to execute his wrath on the wrongdoer. Therefore one must be subject, not only to avoid God’s wrath but also for the sake of conscience. (Rom. 13:4-5)
Pacifism on the part of the individual is different than looking after your brothers and sisters.
Good post and I'd add that the very first Gentile to convert to Christianity was a Roman centurion.
Jünger
Ostrich
Clown World Chronicles: What is 'Pozzed'?
Of the variety of insults and jibes in the vocabulary of Clown World, many of them relate to sexual conduct. This is true of all times and places in human history, but Clown World slang has moved past calling people 'fags' and 'wankers'. In Clown World culture there's an entirely new vocabulary...
vjmpublishing.nz
Your post is the biggest problem with modern Christians today.
I mean this as respectfully as possible. This false idea is rooted in good intentions but completely misses the historical, cultural, and theological context of Jesus' sermon on the mount.
Full Stop
Jesus' words in Matthew 5:39 and Luke 6:29 were in relation to a concept that is foreign to westerners. Face and honor.
"Turning the cheek" after being slapped with the left hand means they now have to slap you with their right hand. To the 1st century Jew, doing this was a huge insult. A big no-no. It's a clever inversion of a common insult.
He's telling you to let the easy stuff go. If someone slights your honor, who cares? Life goes on. Take a wild guess where this type of lesson has failed to take route: you're right, in places like the Middle East and China. It's an insufferable s**thole of having to deal with fragile egos.
Consequently, Jesus' sole law he gave us that supersedes old testament law is quite clear: loves others as you love yourself and to love God with all your heart.
I love my family a lot and something that I love deserves to not be hurt. If someone hurts something that I love, it is OK and holy for me to defend them because clearly if the assailant loved themselves, they wouldn't treat others that way.
@DanielH is right, we live in a fallen world and need to be active defenders of those we love. Not doormats.
The lie that Christians have to be passive wimps and doormats is an inversion by certain (((people))) to weaken Christians and their nations.
Another note: why are you going back to the old testament to try to figure out if something fits with God's law or not? Do you go back to an expired apartment lease contract to decide if it's OK for you to own a dog in your new apartment?
No! You go to the current one, which is the New Testament for what fits with God's law.
The only purpose the old testament has is to prove that God fulfilled the promises that happened in the New Testament. Only Jews concern themselves with the laws of the old testament.
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This is risible.
Were this the case Christianity would've been a footnote, & what became Christendom just a western outpost of the Caliphate.
Actually quite insulting to the countless men who've given their lives defending their Christian lands against Islamic invasion over the years.
Just trying to provide some insight for the OP's original question "How does God feel about man and military service?".
I am aware that war can always be justified outside of the scriptures, but for Christians there is no scriptural justification for it. In Jesus day, Israel was under the yoke of the Romans. Jesus had the power and authority to conquer any nation on earth, yet he never picked up arms or enticed his followers to do so outside of one demonstration to teach them that they are not fighting a physical battle. Although he was in a war, it was spiritual warfare.
In many conflicts, religious leaders on both sides have claimed that God is on their side. “Religion has always played a part in every war that was ever fought,” says the book The Causes of War.
Instead of sending his followers to war, Jesus told them: “Continue to love your enemies and to pray for those who persecute you, so that you may prove yourselves sons of your Father who is in the heavens.” (Matthew 5:44, 45) Even when the nation in which they live goes to war, Christians should remain neutral, “no part of the world.” (John 15:19) If God wants his worshippers in all nations to love their enemies and to remain separate from the world, how could he support either side of a violent conflict today?
Christians need to avoid association with those who promote or perpetrate violence, and what is more violent that warfare? Clearly, God hates those who promote violence. The Bible states: “Jehovah himself examines the righteous one as well as the wicked one, and anyone loving violence His soul certainly hates.” (Psalm 11:5) Christians are admonished to avoid all forms of uncontrolled anger, even verbal violence.—Galatians 5:19-21; Ephesians 4:31.
Again, as I mentioned above you CAN and should defend your family and loved ones from physical attack. The distinction here is very different than going off to war in Military service for the nations.
I am aware that war can always be justified outside of the scriptures, but for Christians there is no scriptural justification for it. In Jesus day, Israel was under the yoke of the Romans. Jesus had the power and authority to conquer any nation on earth, yet he never picked up arms or enticed his followers to do so outside of one demonstration to teach them that they are not fighting a physical battle. Although he was in a war, it was spiritual warfare.
In many conflicts, religious leaders on both sides have claimed that God is on their side. “Religion has always played a part in every war that was ever fought,” says the book The Causes of War.
WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS
Christians are not authorized to fight against their enemies. The apostle Paul wrote to fellow Christians: “If possible, as far as it depends on you, be peaceable with all men. Do not avenge yourselves.”—Romans 12:18, 19.Instead of sending his followers to war, Jesus told them: “Continue to love your enemies and to pray for those who persecute you, so that you may prove yourselves sons of your Father who is in the heavens.” (Matthew 5:44, 45) Even when the nation in which they live goes to war, Christians should remain neutral, “no part of the world.” (John 15:19) If God wants his worshippers in all nations to love their enemies and to remain separate from the world, how could he support either side of a violent conflict today?
Christians need to avoid association with those who promote or perpetrate violence, and what is more violent that warfare? Clearly, God hates those who promote violence. The Bible states: “Jehovah himself examines the righteous one as well as the wicked one, and anyone loving violence His soul certainly hates.” (Psalm 11:5) Christians are admonished to avoid all forms of uncontrolled anger, even verbal violence.—Galatians 5:19-21; Ephesians 4:31.
Again, as I mentioned above you CAN and should defend your family and loved ones from physical attack. The distinction here is very different than going off to war in Military service for the nations.
A nation is just an extended family. Should Armenia just have surrendered to Azerbaijan and let their entire country be partitioned by Turkey and Azerbaijan? Is that what God wants, for us all to live under the yoke of muslims and atheists? To have no public worship, so that only a very small amount of people can even worship with others and for all of our literature to be burned by invaders?
Should Jesus, who was an Israelite, part of the covenant people at that time, just allow the Romans to continue to conquer Israel and later in 70C.E totally decimate it killing most of the population? Remember the scripture “My Kingdom is no part of this world.” (John 18:36). If you fight for the nations who are you actually fighting for?
Jesus Christ himself spoke of the Devil as “the ruler of the world,” as recorded at John 14:30, and said that this ruler had no hold on him. If Satan currently rules the world, who rules the nations that you would fight and kill for in military service?
“Be watchful! Your adversary, the Devil, walks about like a roaring lion, seeking to devour someone.”—1 PET. 5:8.
Jesus Christ himself spoke of the Devil as “the ruler of the world,” as recorded at John 14:30, and said that this ruler had no hold on him. If Satan currently rules the world, who rules the nations that you would fight and kill for in military service?
“Be watchful! Your adversary, the Devil, walks about like a roaring lion, seeking to devour someone.”—1 PET. 5:8.
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As someone who strongly considered military service when I was in my early twenties, I would say no. Main reason being that you're supporting a Godless and immoral state by doing so. You're not fighting for "freedom" or "democracy" (as if anyone would want to fight for that anyways), you're fighting for the geo-political and economic interests of a ruthless international oligarchical class. The same class of people that are currently forcing their own citizen into humiliation rituals under the guise of "covid", openly talking about depopulating the planet and are hellbent on creating their godless kingdom of man (the Brave New World technocratic slave state). Is this the ideology and state you honestly wish to spread to the rest of the globe? Personally, I could not justify it. If we were a Christian society, and the state still saw itself as a defender of the faith, that would be a different story. But I see us now in a situation more along the lines of early Christians in Rome, with the pagan society around us being completely antithetical and outright hostile to us.
If masculinity is what you're after, don't fall for the lie that only those who become pawns of these "people", is the way to do it. There are plenty of trades which contain not only masculine men, but healthy men. Men with wives and families and practical life experience. You will find more role models as plumbers, roofers, mechanics etc., than you will getting drunk with other kids your age. Heck, you'll find more genuine masculinity in Church, than you will in deployment. Protecting and providing for a family, becoming self-sustainable and overcoming your base self is true masculinity.
Besides, your true enemy is the state that rules over you, not some cave dwellers half a world away. Cave dwellers that are funded equipped and trained by the very state you are considering fighting FOR. Find a noble trade, join and become a pillar in a parish community (I personally would recommend the Orthodox Church) and look for a wife to marry. This would be my advice, brother.
God bless.
If masculinity is what you're after, don't fall for the lie that only those who become pawns of these "people", is the way to do it. There are plenty of trades which contain not only masculine men, but healthy men. Men with wives and families and practical life experience. You will find more role models as plumbers, roofers, mechanics etc., than you will getting drunk with other kids your age. Heck, you'll find more genuine masculinity in Church, than you will in deployment. Protecting and providing for a family, becoming self-sustainable and overcoming your base self is true masculinity.
Besides, your true enemy is the state that rules over you, not some cave dwellers half a world away. Cave dwellers that are funded equipped and trained by the very state you are considering fighting FOR. Find a noble trade, join and become a pillar in a parish community (I personally would recommend the Orthodox Church) and look for a wife to marry. This would be my advice, brother.
God bless.
EPIC!
Yes valid points, but let me offer an alternate view to play devil's advocate
....if you are looking for an adventure, life experience, travel and some of the greatest friends you've ever made, there is no substitute.
My mil experience in my 20s as a Marine Artillery Officer set me up with insight, financial stability above most of my peers, and a true appreciation for the freedoms we still have in America. I would not trade it for all the money in the world. I had to walk that path to get to where I am now.
People who haven't done it won't get it at all. You don't chose where you go, you volunteer hoping that your country and it'd people don't squander your service fighting a somali warlord or some bullshit like that. You can acknowledge that you're a foot soldier for wallstreet/((())) but it's a reality that our empire needs troops. You can rationalize or justify or not however you chose...
When you see a war torn country where the men blow up their own wives/kids as suicide vests and tribal warfare ect, you really understand good and evil as it manifests WAY better than you could ever do watching a movie or reading about it in a book. It makes you realize how precious the little things every one of the fat nasty american people take for granted while they are panic buying TP during the WuFlu.... It makes you confident that your ability to weather the storm will overcome any challenges of a 1st world regime ect...
But everyone's experience is different.
My point is that for some people who are being called, there is no solution other than service. And for good or bad, it is something some men just need to experience so they can fully reach actualization and a life without regret of inaction.
Tercio VII
Pigeon
I’ve been considering joining the military for some time, at least the ones that accept foreigners if I can’t join my country’s own. Things will get increasingly worse and at least I want to be prepared for things to come and offer some safety to my family first, then my community. It won’t be my top priority but I’ll work to join before I’m past the age limit.
Outside of anglo countries and Germany, I wonder how other armies are faring with progressive crap.
Outside of anglo countries and Germany, I wonder how other armies are faring with progressive crap.