Ladies commentaries on pre and post-university transformations of women

Starlight

Kingfisher
Woman
Protestant
The whole “conservative female gun culture” is really fascinating to me and I agree it probably has roots from Pioneer/Homesteading America. I actually have never shot a gun, let alone touched one. When BLM was having its Peaceful Summer of Love, I asked my husband if he would teach me how to use a gun and he literally said, “Absolutely not. That’s a horrible idea.” :laughter:
 

Luna Novem

Kingfisher
Woman
Catholic
The whole “conservative female gun culture” is really fascinating to me and I agree it probably has roots from Pioneer/Homesteading America. I actually have never shot a gun, let alone touched one. When BLM was having its Peaceful Summer of Love, I asked my husband if he would teach me how to use a gun and he literally said, “Absolutely not. That’s a horrible idea.” :laughter:
Why, though? I genuinely don't understand.
 

Maddox

Woodpecker
Protestant
screen-shot-2021-08-18-at-4-10-11-pm-png.32961

The guy in this pic is teaching her how to defend the homestead when he's away. Or maybe how to put down a horse with a broken leg.

But I'll bet he didn't go into town later on and tell the men in the saloon he has a new shooting buddy.
 

Luna Novem

Kingfisher
Woman
Catholic
The guy in this pic is teaching her how to defend the homestead when he's away. Or maybe how to put down a horse with a broken leg.

But I'll bet he didn't go into town later on and tell the men in the saloon he has a new shooting buddy.
As the mom of a son, I am 100% for all-boy endeavors (baseball team; Scouts if they weren't corrupt; etc.) And I certainly believe in husbands having guy hunting/fishing/poker night, what have you. But I can't find anything wrong with an individual man choosing to take his own wife out shooting.
 

PVW

Sparrow
Woman
Protestant
I'm appreciating these turns to history that show us things weren't always like they are today.

I think in those earlier generations, ie., high school girls with rifles in the 1940s-1960s or the pioneer women of the 19th century shooting rifles, women shooting was a matter-of-fact activity, nothing that needed a feminist statement to go with it. It wasn't even a matter of compromising their femininity. Women took care of the home and needed to protect if if the men were away.

And isn't a lot of modern gun culture--for men and women--about being "badass" as compared to a matter-of-fact self defense matter? And isn't so much of that glorified in popular media?
 
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PVW

Sparrow
Woman
Protestant
United States. From about 1940s to 1960s, there were high school rifle/gun clubs across the United States.
Good point: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_school_gun_clubs_and_teams_in_the_United_States:

As of 2018, there are reportedly more than 2,000 high-school rifle programs across the United States.[1] In 2015, 9,245 students in 317 schools across three states participated in the USA High School Clay Target League. In 2018, participation had increased 138% with 21,917 students from 804 teams in 20 states.[2]

Supported by organizations like the Civilian Marksmanship Program, school-based gun education was routine for much of the 20th century. It was common for high school teams to compete with .22 caliber rifles. In recent years, air rifles have gained in popularity as a more affordable and safer alternative to .22 rifles.[1]

According to John Lott:[3]

Until 1969 virtually every public high school—even in New York City—had a shooting club. High school students in New York City carried their guns to school on the subways in the morning, turned them over to their homeroom teacher or the gym coach during the day, and retrieved them after school for target practice. Club members were given their rifles and ammunition by the federal government. Students regularly competed in citywide shooting contests for university scholarships.
 

infowarrior1

Crow
Protestant
I'm appreciating these turns to history that show us things weren't always like they are today.

I think in those earlier generations, ie., high school girls with rifles in the 1940s-1960s or the pioneer women of the 19th century shooting rifles, women shooting was a matter-of-fact activity, nothing that needed a feminist statement to go with it. It wasn't even a matter of compromising their femininity. Women took care of the home and needed to protect if if the men were away.

And isn't a lot of modern gun culture--for men and women--about being "badass" as compared to a matter-of-fact self defense matter? And isn't so much of that glorified in popular media?

It does look like the result of individualism that made roles more interchangable.

Families in homesteads that are far apart would need to do this.

But as we see the spiritual enemy eventually found a way to take advantage and caused evil to manifest in a unique way.
 

Lamkins

Woodpecker
Woman
Protestant
Hubby and I (we too are extremely introverted) enjoy going to the gun range together. I’m not into the culture at all nor do I want to browse the gun department like he does. It’s just fun to target practice.

The university transformations are tragic. I think I’d leave rather than change to that extent due to peer pressure. Perhaps it was within them all along? Edited to say is it perhaps our culture? I grew up in the 80s when individualsm and materialism were society’s religion. These days it seems to be more ”we are a tribe” false sense of unity. I’m not explaining my idea well. Let me think.
 

Kitty Tantrum

Kingfisher
Woman
Catholic
I can actually see these "university transformations" becoming fairly rare -- on account of the fact that it's becoming pretty rare for girls to make it out of high school... or middle school... or elementary school... without already being ruined.

SAD.

Girls should not go to school of any sort. Unless they REALLY REALLY WANT TO. And then you know there's something wrong with them anyway ;) so it's no biggie if they come out the other side all chewed up.

How many babies could I have had if I had never learned how to friggin' READ????

Ugh.
 

infowarrior1

Crow
Protestant
I can actually see these "university transformations" becoming fairly rare -- on account of the fact that it's becoming pretty rare for girls to make it out of high school... or middle school... or elementary school... without already being ruined.

SAD.

Girls should not go to school of any sort. Unless they REALLY REALLY WANT TO. And then you know there's something wrong with them anyway ;) so it's no biggie if they come out the other side all chewed up.

How many babies could I have had if I had never learned how to friggin' READ????

Ugh.

Puts a new light on the enthusiasm for girls education in the 3rd world by global NGOs doesn't it?(Could be found by quick search engine inquiry)

Capture the means of education and indoctrination takes its place.

Hence the rise of groups like Boko Haram (Education forbidden) in Africa because their strategists realized this is how their culture would get subverted through that vector of infection.
 

Starlight

Kingfisher
Woman
Protestant
Why, though? I genuinely don't understand.
To be honest, I’m a bit of a “girly girl” and, I’ll admit, naive in some ways and so my husband’s response to *me* was appropriate lol. My husband grew up with guns since he was a small child and did lots of those overnight, weekend, safety/training courses but I have absolutely zero experience. I’m pretty sure he thinks that if he said “ok” then I’d be taking our youngest for a stroller walk down the street dressed like Emiliano Zapata while waving to our neighbors :laughter:
 

Elspeth

Sparrow
Woman
Protestant
Back to the other topic on hand. What other observations do you see of women going and coming from university transformed?
My suggestion would be to ask the very women that you're curious about rather than most of us who have either a) never gone to university or had limited experience with it, and/or b) aren't liberal. However, regarding my own personal experience, I went to a public university, and I'm still involved in academia. I'm in STEM, however, so I haven't been around much of the Humanities where some subjects can be up to the political/sociological interpretation of their instructors. I did live in an all-women boarding house, and all of my housemates were either liberal, or leftist, so I have some experience with that idealogical end. Despite our differences that we all still maintain, I can say with absolute certainty that it was one of the best experiences of my life, short of getting married to my husband.

Long story short, what you see on the outside isn't always representative on the inside. (Obviously, this can easily apply to anything, not just how someone chooses to dress.) When kids go to college, more often than not, it's their first time away from their parents. This new-found freedom may just have been the opportunity some kids had been waiting for to fully express what may have already been there to begin with, or maybe as you suggested, they simply adapted to the progressive culture of higher education. More often than not, the kids that do the latter never really had any substantial beliefs of their own to begin with (after all, life experience in general, or the trying of one's character, begets a better understanding of self). If someone enters college (or any social environment) with a firm grasp of who they are according to their experiences, they may be less likely to adopt the beliefs/attitudes of their peers. Same goes with the military, which I also have experience with; typically these same kinds of kids were the most "boot" out of us all. Bottom line, if kids don't have much opportunity to find out what they're made of until later into their young adult lives, they tend to fall towards extremes for whatever reason. This is just my observation, though. I think there's a lot of studies out there that explore these topics that would answer these questions better than I could.
 

Starlight

Kingfisher
Woman
Protestant
I
My suggestion would be to ask the very women that you're curious about rather than most of us who have either a) never gone to university or had limited experience with it, and/or b) aren't liberal. However, regarding my own personal experience, I went to a public university, and I'm still involved in academia. I'm in STEM, however, so I haven't been around much of the Humanities where some subjects can be up to the political/sociological interpretation of their instructors. I did live in an all-women boarding house, and all of my housemates were either liberal, or leftist, so I have some experience with that idealogical end. Despite our differences that we all still maintain, I can say with absolute certainty that it was one of the best experiences of my life, short of getting married to my husband.

Long story short, what you see on the outside isn't always representative on the inside. (Obviously, this can easily apply to anything, not just how someone chooses to dress.) When kids go to college, more often than not, it's their first time away from their parents. This new-found freedom may just have been the opportunity some kids had been waiting for to fully express what may have already there to begin with, or maybe as you suggested, they simply adapted to the progressive culture of higher education. More often than not, the kids that do the latter never really had any substantial beliefs of their own to begin with (after all, life experience in general, or the trying of one's character, begets a better understanding of self). If someone enters college (or any social environment) with a firm grasp of who they are according to their experiences, they may be less likely to adopt the beliefs/attitudes of their peers. Same goes with the military, which I also have experience with; typically these same kinds of kids were the most "boot" out of us all. Bottom line, if kids don't have much opportunity to find out what they're made of until later into their young adult lives, they tend to fall towards extremes for whatever reason. This is just my observation, though. I think there's a lot of studies out there that explore these topics that would answer these questions better than I could.
Welcome back Elspeth :)
 

Starlight

Kingfisher
Woman
Protestant
I can actually see these "university transformations" becoming fairly rare -- on account of the fact that it's becoming pretty rare for girls to make it out of high school... or middle school... or elementary school... without already being ruined.

SAD.

Girls should not go to school of any sort. Unless they REALLY REALLY WANT TO. And then you know there's something wrong with them anyway ;) so it's no biggie if they come out the other side all chewed up.

How many babies could I have had if I had never learned how to friggin' READ????

Ugh.
How are you supposed to teach your children anything if you never learned to read? That’s ridiculous.
 

Max Roscoe

Ostrich
Orthodox Inquirer
I was asked yesterday in a older men's discussion group (I am probably 25 years younger than anyone else) what do I and my generation most fear about the future?

I thought for a moment and answered, the social opportunities that every generation before me had, when marriage was a virtue, the family was the fabric of society, and finding a good partner was a goal any decent man would have no problem with.

For all the economic success America has, we are lacking the basic familial opportunities that so many poor countries I have visited achieve easily. So many of my friends are in the same boat as me, and I assume the vast majority of the users here: Never married, and somewhat terrified of the world we would be raising a family in, if we ever made it that far.

But these women are taking that opportunity and throwing it straight in the garbage.

While there is always the possibility of redemption, the reality is the women who damage themselves as in the video, distorting their bodies and harming their souls at peak fertility, are ruining their chances of ever having the opportunity for family life. It's incredibly sad, and I wonder if they will ever realize, one day, that their Public Relations Degree or their cubicle accounting job really isn't fulfilling them.

They probably won't understand the lost opportunity of motherhood since many of them will never experience it, but it's a travesty that the grown men and women running our society allow and encourage this. I see it as a vicious cycle which will only accelerate, as these damaged souls grow up and become the teachers of tomorrow's children.
 

messaggera

Pelican
Woman
Other Christian
Back to the other topic on hand. What other observations do you see of women going and coming from university transformed?

The United States' higher education system is going through a curriculum reform, and rebranding phase; given the pandemic.
It may be too early to say but Kitty Tantrum may be on to something:

I can actually see these "university transformations" becoming fairly rare -- on account of the fact that it's becoming pretty rare for girls to make it out of high school... or middle school... or elementary school... without already being ruined.

Prior to COVID state institutions were already loco parentis to the extreme of becoming secondary high schools. Remedial courses cost the institutions money; and most incoming students are not prepared for college entry education.

With state funding being reduced we are going to see institutions switching to new decentralized budget models - budget models where revenue generated stays within those academic units.

How does student services bring in revenue? Typically the units do not in order to sustain staff. The student services units, within an institution, are responsible for shaping the campus culture based on the types of events, seminars, activites, etc. targeted to students.

Elspeth did a good job summing up the incoming student's milstone:

When kids go to college, more often than not, it's their first time away from their parents. This new-found freedom may just have been the opportunity some kids had been waiting for to fully express what may have already been there to begin with, or maybe as you suggested, they simply adapted to the progressive culture of higher education. More often than not, the kids that do the latter never really had any substantial beliefs of their own to begin with (after all, life experience in general, or the trying of one's character, begets a better understanding of self). If someone enters college (or any social environment) with a firm grasp of who they are according to their experiences, they may be less likely to adopt the beliefs/attitudes of their peers.
 

PVW

Sparrow
Woman
Protestant
Hubby and I (we too are extremely introverted) enjoy going to the gun range together. I’m not into the culture at all nor do I want to browse the gun department like he does. It’s just fun to target practice.

The university transformations are tragic. I think I’d leave rather than change to that extent due to peer pressure. Perhaps it was within them all along? Edited to say is it perhaps our culture? I grew up in the 80s when individualsm and materialism were society’s religion. These days it seems to be more ”we are a tribe” false sense of unity. I’m not explaining my idea well. Let me think.
Your comment gets at something I could have stated better. Other aspects of modern gun culture forget the other side of gun ownership, that it might not just be about self defense. Some people just like target practice. That is what those high school rifle clubs were about 80 or so years ago, girls and boys who liked target practice.

As for the modern college students, I've worked in college and university settings. College students have been doing this for decades now, ever since the late 1960s at least, when universities no longer operated in loco parentis (as de fact parents) and college students demanded more and more freedom to become more and more and more liberal. There were plenty of 1960s coeds who arrived on campus around 1964/1965 looking prim and conservative looking, only to emerge as feminist hippy types by 1968/1969.

But not all did of course, and over all those years since then. It comes down to the individual students how they experience the college environment and whether it changes them drastically. It might not even change them much.

It's only because these students are rebelling in so obvious ways that it's noticeable. Or perhaps because their hippy grandparents (1960s college students) and parents (1980s college students) have been respectable bourgeois types for a long time now. Smile. The stakes have become higher when everything is already more liberal. They have to become more radical. If anying, the basic college liberals of 30-50 years ago were so tame compared to today's world, they would be seen as hopelessly conservative in the eyes of these radical types.

I wouldn't be surprised if in ten to twenty years some those women with short hair, piercings and tattoos are married and raising kids. That is what a number of their predecessors (who are in their 30s and 40s today) are doing now.

Everclear had the perfect song for it, Volvo Driving Soccer Moms.
 
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infowarrior1

Crow
Protestant
Your comment gets at something I could have stated better. Other aspects of modern gun culture forget the other side of gun ownership, that it might not just be about self defense. Some people just like target practice. That is what those high school rifle clubs were about 80 or so years ago, girls and boys who liked target practice.

As for the modern college students, I've worked in college and university settings. College students have been doing this for decades now, ever since the late 1960s at least, when universities no longer operated in loco parentis (as de fact parents) and college students demanded more and more freedom to become more and more and more liberal. There were plenty of 1960s coeds who arrived on campus around 1964/1965 looking prim and conservative looking, only to emerge as feminist hippy types by 1968/1969.

But not all did of course, and over all those years since then. It comes down to the individual students how they experience the college environment and whether it changes them drastically. It might not even change them much.

It's only because these students are rebelling in so obvious ways that it's noticeable. Or perhaps because their hippy grandparents (1960s college students) and parents (1980s college students) have been respectable bourgeois types for a long time now. Smile. The stakes have become higher when everything is already more liberal. They have to become more radical. If anying, the basic college liberals of 30-50 years ago were so tame compared to today's world, they would be seen as hopelessly conservative in the eyes of these radical types.

I wouldn't be surprised if in ten to twenty years some those women with short hair, piercings and tattoos are married and raising kids. That is what a number of their predecessors (who are in their 30s and 40s today) are doing now.

Everclear had the perfect song for it, Volvo Driving Soccer Moms.
By the time many of them felt ready by 30. Most of their eggs are gone.

So there is definitely a hit to family size and mutation load. That risk multiplies every generation when repeated. And even if their children or grandchildren marry younger the damage is done.

Likewise as the cultural drift continues. This trend will increase and get even worse.

The victory will increasingly belong to women who get going on husband hunting straight out of high school sans college. Who are home schooled and resistant to the the programming.

Because I see less Men being tolerant of women who already gave their best years to other Men before them.

Expect more of this:
 
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