Lawful gun owner Ryan Whitaker killed by cops

Robert High Hawk

Kingfisher
Yeah, his immediately walking out showed aggression.
Yeah, concealing it was a big mistake. He could've even shot behind his back the officer who shot him.
You see guys, when they wrote the constition, they meant that the second amendment is more of a permission to just collect guns and occasionally hunt. That's all.

Unless you follow protocol exactly, and I do mean EXACTLY, when you decide to defend your property, the police are allowed to shoot you, even if there was no real reason whatsoever for their presence to begin with.
 

renotime

Ostrich
Gold Member
As much as the cops have been militarized - it was certainly a bit trigger-happy. However he did 2 massive errors.

He opened the door with the gun in his hand, then even walked out. He reacted a bit late by trying to de-escalate the situation, but even that he did the wrong way. Instead of openly putting down the gun slowly, so that they can see it he stupidly tried to hide the weapon behind him.

If you watch the footage at lower speed you can easily see that he walks out like Brad Pitt in the movie California where he plays a low-class serial killer. He has the same walk, going out in some kind of combat stance in his underwear while holding his gun on the side. Seriously - his very stance and behavior is by default menacing even if the cops over-reacted. He went into a completely different pose and stupidly tried to put the gun down to the back of him.

Self-defense is all good and well, but who did he expect would knock that way at night loudly and call themselves loudly 'Phoenix Police'? Chances are that he was a bit drunk or on drugs and did not hear who they were. He should have shouted out who they are first, before walking out with a drawn gun. Who else would it be who would knock at night? Antifa, BLM rioters? They would attack everyone. If he expected some criminal, then he absolutely should first check to not confuse that criminal with 2 cops who are already standing there and expecting the worst.

But the point of the thread remains - if that guy was black, then this would be center news and riots would erupt in Phoenix by now. And this again is no clear-cut case of police brutality given his initial unfortunate behavior. There are times when walking out in such a way will protect you from Antifa or BLM rioters, but doing it with cops is not advisable.
They were hiding away from the peep hole. And they were responding to a noise violation, so he probably didn't hear them.

And how does one openly put a gun down?

He held his left hand up and didn't make any sudden movements. There was more than one cop there and the other guys didn't shoot. By the time the cop shot the guy he hit him in the back because the dude was well into the process of putting the gun down. It was just a poor response.
 

LeoniusD

Kingfisher
Actually if you watch it you see his first reaction attempting to hide the gun. It was an unfortunate reaction and the cop being a bit too trigger-happy, but I wouldn't call it an example of police brutality. It is what is to be expected when cops are raised on playstation shooters, then some even are retired veterans. While computer games are fun, they are co-designed by the military and were promoted by them. The rest is done by the rampant violence in society. Also - according to studies whites get shot more often for the same transgressions, so this confirms it once again.

Again - the guy reacted badly, came out aggressively, had a split second the wrong reaction trying to hide the gun before slowly attempting to lower it in the back. My point remains - if you have a gun, then your chance of survival is better if you show it openly instead of having it at his back. It is what it is - it's more an accident since the cop likely didn't want to shoot the poor bastard either. At least I hope he didn't.
 
Yeah, I agree on both counts with most people. Firstly on the militarization of police and mainly on the effect movies and video games have in impressionable people. Never forget your common sense.

Ironically guys like this (as well as criminals, don't know if this guy was one) only reinforce the loop of police paranoia.
 
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renotime

Ostrich
Gold Member
Actually if you watch it you see his first reaction attempting to hide the gun. It was an unfortunate reaction and the cop being a bit too trigger-happy, but I wouldn't call it an example of police brutality. It is what is to be expected when cops are raised on playstation shooters, then some even are retired veterans. While computer games are fun, they are co-designed by the military and were promoted by them. The rest is done by the rampant violence in society. Also - according to studies whites get shot more often for the same transgressions, so this confirms it once again.

Again - the guy reacted badly, came out aggressively, had a split second the wrong reaction trying to hide the gun before slowly attempting to lower it in the back. My point remains - if you have a gun, then your chance of survival is better if you show it openly instead of having it at his back. It is what it is - it's more an accident since the cop likely didn't want to shoot the poor bastard either. At least I hope he didn't.
How do you hide a gun after it's obviously been seen? He goes from offensive to submissive in a split second. He gets to his knees and puts his open left hand up. He does all of this before a cop can even draw down on him. He gets shot as he's trying to put the gun on the ground. He had the gun pointed at the ground the whole time.

To me this is police incompetence. These cops' reaction time was terrible.

Also, are you and Geremia the same person?
 
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