That's not true. The Libertarian PARTY wants open borders. And Gary Johnson, sadly, likes open borders, too. Their philosophy being that if we had a true Laisse faire free market with no handouts, then we wouldn't have a flood of moochers. And I agree with that part to some point, but that's not what we have. We have a socialist/crony capitalist government system of benefits to moochers and looters. Be it corporations that loot from their crony politicians or from constituent voters that just want free shit.SamuelBRoberts said:I'll restate what I said in the other thread.
Libertarians are patsies. If a libertarian government was every elected to the US, it would be elected for one term.
Its open borders policies would flood the country with people from countries far to the left of the US on the political spectrum. They would vote the libertarians out of power, and the libertarians would never be able to win another election.
It doesn't matter if you, personally, aren't for open borders. The libertarian party has always been for open borders, far, far more so than even the democrats. You can go on their website, and read about their policies.
Here's the relevant section from their website: "Economic freedom demands the unrestricted movement of human as well as financial capital across national borders."
Unrestricted. That means no restrictions, whatsoever. Under the libertarian party platform, the entire population of South America could move here, and vote for whatever policies they want. You would be completely unable to stop them.
Libertarians are patsies and fools.
No, voting for a failed system is not my only choice. I don't have to do what you say. You continually vote for a failed two-party system, yet an educated, intelligent man will tell you that there were once whigs and torries, and we don't have those anymore. How did those parties go away if there were no other options?SamuelBRoberts said:In a two-party system, the libertarian party's only function is to divert votes from the Republican party and make the democratic party stronger, leading to bigger government. If you actually want to make a different, voting republican is your only choice.
Because I've discovered that usually the first ones to hurl epithets are the first snowflakes to get their feelings hurt. So, if you got hurt that I said these things after you said I was a retard, then sorry, not sorry.SamuelBRoberts said:"If it offends you that I said the voters were stupid, then touche. You disparaged my intelligence first."
Not to derail the discussion, but why do you feel this would offend me?
I'm really confused by that.
It's sales 101. Match and mirror. He's applying sales methodology to the largest demographic. It's the pyramid of intelligence: If you cannot explain your area of expertise to someone with no knowledge of the topic, you are not wise. You're well read, but you are not wise. Trump is taking complex issues, and delivering answers in a small concise message that everyone understands.weambulance said:Bro, I've described myself as a small-l libertarian for years. I have major, major issues with the Libertarian Party because it's fucking ridiculous, will never have any power, and just siphons votes off to make shit easier for the Democrats.
We probably agree quite a lot on political philosophy.
But where you're going off the rails here is in not understanding why Donald Trump is presenting the image he has chosen to present. Donald Trump is not stupid. He is not a buffoon. He is using rhetoric, and speaking to the common man. He plays the media like a fiddle. Do you honestly believe that's all by accident?
If you expect him to speak to you in a way you would prefer, using only logic and facts and details, you're going to be disappointed because that doesn't work on about 95% of the population. He will lose if he does that.
I have to ask, do you have experience as a speaker? I'm curious because as someone who is a pretty solid public speaker and teacher, I can see Mr. Trump doing exactly the things he needs to to get his message across: he's tailoring his presentation to his audience, telling them why they should care about what he's saying, and keeping them engaged by being entertaining, reacting to the crowd, and not rigidly following written speeches. It doesn't look like the typical politician, so people often conclude that he's an idiot when he is in fact being quite shrewd.
I don't agree with everything Mr. Trump says, but I do agree with a solid chunk of it, and it's obvious that Hillary will be an absolute disaster. I'm not voting for the lesser of two evils at all. Donald Trump is only the second political candidate I've ever wanted to vote for; in every other election I was voting against someone. Donald Trump is offering to take the first serious steps to fixing this country in decades. It would be insane to walk away from that over purity concerns (like most libertarians), or because you simply don't understand the way he communicates because you're in the 5% of people who respond to logic and facts.
And that attitude will get you the same two party system. If you're not willing to change the system with your votes or your money, then whose fault is the two party system? If you continue to support the same assholes, then is it the assholes' fault for doing the same trickery to get your vote? Or is it your fault for falling for it?weambulance said:There's no fucking way any of them are going to rise to prominence, if only because nearly the entire voting population knows not to take them seriously.