birthday cat said:
Onto said:
Birthday Cat: if you can explain what the wisdom is, in detail with concrete examples, I would be interested in hearing it.
At 8:11 Jandai gives an example of how people cannot achieve happiness and fulfillment through buying material items. "The most expensive pair of pants cannot change my life." There is wisdom in understanding that happiness cannot be purchased in this manner especially since advertising for consumer products frequently uses psychological manipulation to make people feel inadequate so they will make a purchase. (Something that is outside the scope of this thread but may be interesting to forum members is a documentary titled Consumed where an evolutionary psychologist discusses how the psychology of sex/mating is the primary tool of advertising for consumer products.)
Advertising's magic is not in making people feel inadequate. Everyone already does. A well advertised product gives the viewer an answer to what is already missing. A well crafted or needed product needs little advertising. And of course sex sells. Anything that symbolizes the infinite is going to sell, it's what everyone is seeking.
I don't buy expensive clothes, vinyl records, guitars, or other things because I think they will change my life. I spend more on a particular thing because I appreciate the quality of it.
For example: There is a very real difference between a $300 tightly knit cashmere hat from Jay Kos and a $5 NYC hat from the street vendor. My $300 hat lasted me over 10 years and because I'm bald the feel and how well it works is important.
Vinyl Records: There is a very big difference between a 1st pressing of "Kind of Blue" and a 1980s re-pressing. Like night and day.
Guitars: Well-built guitars allow you to play to your full potential and their sound is significant. Granted some people pay $250 for a pair of jeans that are ripped and looked like mine did after years of wear. But is that because they feel it will make them happy?
I don't think it's the case. I think they buy those jeans and "fashionable" stuff because of what it symbolizes. It speaks to them in some way so they buy it. Much like when someone buys a DVD of a favorite movie they won't watch often. The movie resonates with them so they buy it and keep it on display with the rest of their collection.
birthday cat said:
At 9:55 Jandai suggests that sickness should indicate to people that they have done something wrong in their life. Obviously this doesn't apply to all sicknesses but it applies to some. There is wisdom in understanding this concept since the popular thing to do in current western culture is for people to rationalize why their problems aren't their fault. Example - obesity is typically a result of poor eating habits and other lifestyle factors not a result of genetics.
Like what? A hangover.
I don't think anyone blames their fatness on genes and nothing else and it is true that people's bodies differ along with it's ability to metabolize. There are a lot of sickness and injury that occur from genetics, environment, occupation, and plain bad luck.
birthday cat said:
At 10:22 Jandai talks about how relying on oneself for the basic necessities in life reduces fear and increases freedom. There is wisdom in understanding how relying on others, such as government or corporations, is a problem and there is wisdom in understanding the relationship between fear and freedom.
Doesn't a farmer rely on the weather? Isn't Mother Nature kinda whimsical?
I don't think workers are relying on corporations. People are free to develop a skill set and offer it in the market for compensation. This a simple barter system. Whether its for eggs or money.
If there were no corporations, people would build a business of their own, that if successful gets so big it becomes a corporation. Where do you think these corporations come from?
Granted there are a lot of people on welfare relying on the gov to pay for everything, and I do agree that welfare, when abused, dulls the human spirit.
birthday cat said:
At 14:03 Jandai talks about how he lives his life in a way that is logical to him although it may not be how most people in society live their lives. He says "People can think whatever they want. I cannot manage anything outside myself. What I can do is manage mind." There is wisdom is avoiding social conditioning, seeking the truth, and doing what is best for yourself even if you don't have the approval of mainstream society. Obviously this relates to all of us on the forum that don't accept what society has told us about masculinity, relationships between men and women, etc.
Sounds like something a woman would say. "Whatever, haters, I just do what I want"
birthday cat said:
Most importantly, at 3:58 Jandai says that when people have time to be with themselves and understand themselves then they can see what they want in their lives. This is where I have a different interpretation from the other commenters in this thread about Jandai's message. I don't think he is suggesting laziness or endless joy. I think he is suggesting that people need to think critically about their lives. I think he is suggesting that some people, especially in hectic cities like Bangkok or NYC, rush through life and need some time away from the daily grind so they can get their mind into a state where they can have a deeper level of introspection.
Time to be with yourself? You're with yourself every moment of the day. You don't need to go to the woods for that. While a change of jobs, city, etc. can be good for a person, there's truth in the saying, "Wherever you go you take yourself with you."
Many people are quite at home in NYC and Bangkok, much more than they would be in the country or as a farmer. There are so many different occupations and lifestyles the Self has developed. Do you really think it doesn't know what it's doing?
Of course people need a break. Remember that catchy song from the hit TV show Cheers? Probably the most successful them song in history. Geez, I wonder why?
Because the promise of freedom from one's finitude SELLS. Always has and always will. Have a listen. You can almost hear Pun-Pun in the chorus.
birthday cat said:
Some people might not need to do anything to get their mind in the right place, others might need relaxation, and others might need intense physical exercise. I've done meditation and I've done mental toughness training with military special operations guys pushing me to my limits with fun tasks like push-ups face down in the cold water of a creek at 2am. Both can work and neither are lazy. In my opinion, pushing your mind to relax in order to sharpen your thinking is the opposite of laziness just as push-ups in the cold water at 2am.
Agreed, "Different Strokes for Different Folks." So thank you Pun-Pun for sharing your story of success, but I have my own and it just happens that it's different from being a sustainable, organic, fair-trade, cage-free farmer.
Granted it's not the easy life, but I've learned a lot from it.
I'm starting to think instead of paying $6,000/plate to listen to Pun-Pun talk one could just listen to 80's TV theme songs.
birthday cat said:
Onto said:
It's not to say that Thai guy shouldn't be doing what he's doing, but he's not addressing what's most important, which is engaging the questions of
"Why am I doing what I'm doing?"
"Why do I still feel unfulfilled?"
"What would I need to finally feel fulfilled?"
"If I could achieve that, would I then feel fulfilled forever?"
"If no, then why not?"
I agree with this list and I'm glad Onto gave us these questions. What I disagree with is that Jandai is ignoring these questions just because he doesn't address them specifically in the video. I think Jandai is trying to help people get to a place where they can answer these questions hence
"when they understand themself they can see what they want in their life".
If you're not addressing them specifically, it doesn't count. He has it backwards anyways. It's when you try to see your life (the wants, the regrets, what's great, what's missing) you begin to understand yourself. It's what's referred to as self-reflection.
