Low risk investments like CDs

Oberrheiner

Pelican
See the detailed economic and theological analysis by Anthony Santelli Ph. D. in the Culture Wars issue of July/August 2013.
To summarize it very briefly, usury is an act of war cf. Deuteronomy 23:19-20. Christians are allowed to practice it defensively if economic war is waged on them ; if they practice it at the legal rate, they are simply getting back the money that's been stolen from them by usury.

It would be better to not practice usury at all, sure, but one must realize in a world of state-sponsored usury, any group who abstains from usury in any way will get totally destitute in a short time. They might just as well leave society and go live a lonely, rough life on a desert island.

Poverty is an evangelical counsel, not a commandment. Transforming a counsel into a commandment has usually created long-lived economic utopias but short-lived sects.

Sure, anglos can rationalize it any way they want, like any other religious point - we see the results after a while.

Its more interesting to me that you did not capitalize Christian.

Anyway, Martin Luther said interest was OK 500 years ago. ;)

I never capitalize anything, if you noticed.
I also never "like" posts.

There would be a lot to say about luther, but I can't be bothered honestly.
Plus some here could do it way better than me anyway.
 

Sitting Bull

Woodpecker
Sure, anglos can rationalize it any way they want, like any other religious point - we see the results after a while.

You got it wrong on all counts. The article I mentioned was defending an official pronouncement by Pope Pius VIII (not exactly an anglophile) against typically anglo accusations.
 

Sitting Bull

Woodpecker
I don't care who said what - usury is the enslavement of others, if that's not evil to you then we are not on the same side.

In a simple one-to-one usury situation, usury is indeed the enslavement of the borrower to the lender.
But the situation becomes more complex when usury is generalized and "state-sponsored".
Let us consider what might be the simplest example - in today's world, someone has a savings account in his or her bank with the fixed, legal, lowest interest rate, which the bank grants to basically any customer. Who is he or she enslaving ?
 

Oberrheiner

Pelican
Don't know, we don't have that here.

Also I looked into pie 8, usury was forced upon him by the napoleon code, he had no choice and just had to come up with some theological blabla to rationalize it after the fact.
That's a general problem with organized religions, they are structures of power and as such if they want to keep this power they need to submit to greater powers.

It would be better imho for emj to write about how the current pope is pro-gays and pro-migrants and what the theological justification for this is ..
Usury is not a fight anymore in the usa, everybody worships money anyway.
Or maybe religion is simply not a fight anymore in the usa since everybody worships money - you tell me.
 

Sitting Bull

Woodpecker
Don't know, we don't have that here.

Really ? But I thought your profile said you were from France. In France, about every bank has one or several types of "Compte Livret" as I described above

It would be better imho for emj to write about how the current pope is pro-gays and pro-migrants

Absolutely, but that's another subject.

Usury is not a fight anymore in the usa, everybody worships money anyway.
Or maybe religion is simply not a fight anymore in the usa since everybody worships money - you tell me.

I can't speak on the behalf of other people, but it is still a fight for EMJ and a few other Catholic authors, in any case. Only the future will tell if they have been heard ...
 

Oberrheiner

Pelican
Well, that's another debate entirely, but sure why not.

Basically all the livrets I know are based off of the livret a, which (afaik) must be mostly backed by sovereign bonds, and gets you 0,5% interests a year.
Also it should be said that if you do the real math france (like most other western countries) is actually in a recession, so even those 0,5% you get come from more debt.
So, putting you money there :
- makes you lose money (it's less than inflation).
- supports the plans france was more or less forced to ratify from (among others) the un, eg. replacement migration.
- puts your children even further into debt than we already are.

Sounds like a great plan for everybody ? :) But yes, you can do it if you insist, sure.
Or you could invest that money on yourself, for instance paying off the house, starting a new business (alone or with like-minded people), helping your kids get a better education (although in this country it's not really a money problem), etc.
It's not like there's a lack of ideas if you take 2 minutes to think about it.

PS there could be some inaccuracies in my data, I must admit I didn't check this subject since negative interest rates entered the equation, since they basically mean that you lose money by saving and earn some by getting debt, which sounds both crazy and not sustainable.
But I'm sure someone will tell me I'm wrong and there's a lot of money to be made on others this way.
Which might be right, I just have a problem with exploiting my fellow man.
Maybe some naive belief in do unto others etc.

Anyway, bedtime !
 

typtre

Robin
1.7%? That's not even the fake inflation, and if and when the dollar crashes all gains be wiped out anyway.

Buy physical gold if you just wanna forget about it.
 

redbeard

Hummingbird
Gold Member
Anybody have knowledge on "Series I Savings Bonds?" Seems like an easy, low-risk investment that earns ~3% APY. The only downside is that you can't cash out within the first year of buying. In that case, it might make sense to make separate purchases to keep yourself liquid.

They also offer paper bonds!


Information from the government here: https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/research/indepth/ibonds/res_ibonds_iratesandterms.htm
 

C-Note

Ostrich
Gold Member
Anybody have knowledge on "Series I Savings Bonds?" Seems like an easy, low-risk investment that earns ~3% APY. The only downside is that you can't cash out within the first year of buying. In that case, it might make sense to make separate purchases to keep yourself liquid.

They also offer paper bonds!


Information from the government here: https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/research/indepth/ibonds/res_ibonds_iratesandterms.htm
Yes, those are very safe investments and guaranteed 3% is a good deal. You could probably do the same thing that people do with CDs and ladder the maturity dates so that you cash out of a certain percentage of your holdings every six months or so.

Personally, the money I put in bonds (about 30% of my investments right now) I have in mutual funds that invest in inflation-protected securities, high-yield municipal bonds, and a long-term government and corporate bonds. Those types of funds generally average 5% over the long run and you can cash out anytime you want to. There is more risk with those kinds of bonds. Some years they'll return less than 1%, followed by years in which they return 8%. So, if you don't want the risk, the I-bonds give you more security at a lower long-term return.
 

aynrus

Pelican
Anybody have knowledge on "Series I Savings Bonds?" Seems like an easy, low-risk investment that earns ~3% APY. The only downside is that you can't cash out within the first year of buying. In that case, it might make sense to make separate purchases to keep yourself liquid.

They also offer paper bonds!


Information from the government here: https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/research/indepth/ibonds/res_ibonds_iratesandterms.htm

Nah, better to just keep it all in coins... i-bond composite rate is 3.54% now
TreasuryDirect has funny ways of locking your account and requiring special affidavit to prove who you are, by the way.
 

aynrus

Pelican
Care to explain?
Well, they lock your account out of the blue (may be because one didn't login for a while, general KYC, etc, not sure what triggers it, but it happens not only with new accounts) and ask you to go into a bank or brokerage branch (but not every bank can provide this service, especially if you're not a customer) where they do a special stamped affidavit that you are you, after you show them your IDs. It can be a major problem overseas, as realistically only US embassy can do this overseas.
It's Form 5444, account authorization.
It has to be US financial institution, not foreign.

"ACCEPTABLE CERTIFICATIONS: Financial institution’s official seal or stamp (such as corporate seal, signature guaranteed stamp, or medallion stamp). (Notary certification is NOT acceptable.)"

Overseas, medallion stamp can be used and - I think - most US embassies can provide this.
If someone is in the US they can just go to a bank that understands how to sign this, but I heard small town banks have problems with it and one likely has to go to big nationwide branch, though got to have an account with them. So it can be difficult in a rural location but I guess no problem to do around US cities. I had to go through the process but I was just lucky to have an account in a major bank and have access to their branch.

This is who can sign identity certification (it says court clerk/judge can, but I heard people had no luck):
 

aynrus

Pelican
Care to explain?
Another thing with TreasuryDirect:

they can (and likely will) make you do the same difficult in-person bank certification or medallion signature process to simply change your default back account. So if you added a bank account and set it to default (there the funds would come from/go back to), and want to change it - again, there's the same signature-required process right now.
 

aynrus

Pelican
TreasuryDirect told me that they started to make it difficult to change bank information starting end of last year (I guess getting ready to CyberWar or whatever as the Hoax tale is drying up).
I was able to change default bank account to previously added one, after much fuss and arguing over the phone (initially was told had to certify paper form for that but I insisted and they did, only because it involved previously added account) - but they said any change involving a new bank account that wasn't added before 2021 will involve full paper certification.

So if you register with them and add a bank account - very likely they'll ask to do paper certification.
If you later want to change to another bank/add another account, they'll 100% ask to do another paper certification (different form)
If you get locked out (like too many failed password entry attempts) or they said do something suspicous online they'll likely ask another paper certification form.
Sounds like major headache for anyone who wants to be able to do changes and travels.

Another thing: no paper I-saving bonds. Only can buy as much as your IRS tax refund is, for the amount of that refund, no more than that - otherwise only electronic.
 
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username

Ostrich
Gold Member
3.5% sounds good until finding out that info above about locking out and having to jump through hoops, plus $10k makes it not worth it.
 
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