Marijuana

Grow Bag

Pelican
Catholic
Same story here in England. Thankfully I don't get the same thing up where I live now, but in every place I visit down south it's rife. You literally only have to walk around most towns and you'll catch a whiff of it in the air. People smoke it openly while they're out and about. It's not legal, but the police treat it as though it was.
 

Lawrence87

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Actually, he is 100% right.

Law enforcement does not have infinite resources. Nonsense crimes like cannabis use suck up so much resources. Resources that could be spent on murders, rapes, organised crime, terrorism, serious drugs.

On top of that, if you legalise cannabis use, you can use it for medical purposes, and tax it just like alcohol and tobacco.

If you want to ban cannabis, you have to ban alcohol and tobacco, both are much more dangerous narcotics, unless you are a hypocrite.

From the UK lunacy thread.

The tax argument is poor, just because something would be a source of revenue doesn't mean doing said thing is good. I could make money scamming elderly people, it doesn't make it a good thing even if I give said money to good causes.

Medical usage doesn't negate it being irresponsible to legalize it for recreational use.

The resource drain (in the UK) is lack of police funding, and also the focus on catching and fining people for minor traffic violations. With adequate funding and appropriate prioritization it would be possible to tackle cannabis as well as the crimes you mention. It's a dumb argument to say people are getting raped because weed is illegal. People are getting raped and selling weed in the streets because you hardly ever see a police presence there, because they are all in lay bys with speed cameras...

Cannabis is particularly dangerous for young people. It's bad enough as it is, but if it were legal more and more young people would develop a problem with it.

I'd support banning tobacco. The difference with alcohol is that cannabis can easily become addictive and destructive. Not many teens sustain a lifestyle of drinking all day every day but some do smoke weed in such a manner. I would support legislation that curbs people going out and getting dangerously drunk. Ultimately I'd say weed did me more harm growing up than any of the occasions on which I drank too much. Because the weed was constant and the drinking was every now and then.
 

Cuchulainn2016

Kingfisher
From the UK lunacy thread.

The tax argument is poor, just because something would be a source of revenue doesn't mean doing said thing is good. I could make money scamming elderly people, it doesn't make it a good thing even if I give said money to good causes.

Medical usage doesn't negate it being irresponsible to legalize it for recreational use.

The resource drain (in the UK) is lack of police funding, and also the focus on catching and fining people for minor traffic violations. With adequate funding and appropriate prioritization it would be possible to tackle cannabis as well as the crimes you mention. It's a dumb argument to say people are getting raped because weed is illegal. People are getting raped and selling weed in the streets because you hardly ever see a police presence there, because they are all in lay bys with speed cameras...

Cannabis is particularly dangerous for young people. It's bad enough as it is, but if it were legal more and more young people would develop a problem with it.

I'd support banning tobacco. The difference with alcohol is that cannabis can easily become addictive and destructive. Not many teens sustain a lifestyle of drinking all day every day but some do smoke weed in such a manner. I would support legislation that curbs people going out and getting dangerously drunk. Ultimately I'd say weed did me more harm growing up than any of the occasions on which I drank too much. Because the weed was constant and the drinking was every now and then.
There is quite of lot of incorrect information in this post.

1. Tax: this is just the cherry on the top, not important.

2. Cannabis should be an OTC medication, as it is far less harmful than most pharmaceutics, even if it is by prescription, it couldnt be illegal outside of this as it would be extremely difficult to prosecute anyone with it under those circumstances.

3. Cannabis is less addictive than nicotine or alcohol, it also has less deleterious effects. However, some bred "super"strains of cannabis are very bad. If you legalise cannabis and proscribe the more dangerous strains then you can very much limit their use.

4. Law enforcement. In the UK the police do not "prevent" even the lowest level of crimes, their sole job is to "detect" low level crimes (ie speeding, drink driving). Other than this, they only investigate crimes to punish the offender after the fact. Thats it. They do not prevent crime or rescue people from crimes. They respond after the crime and investigate it. You could never have enough funding for enough police to prevent rapes and murderers. To put it into perspective, more than half of my local police forces forensic capability is used to investigate cannabis related crimes. Make cannabis legal and you now have the forensic capability of that force doubled when applied to serious crimes. Funding will not change this. No matter how much funding you throw at it. I would rather catch a murderer or rapist than someone who smoked a joint and will only get a fine anyway, if that. Also, the UK police are very well funded, but just like the NHS they always complain they dont have enough money. They can always find money to paint their response vehicles in Gay Pride colours though, even when they say they cant investigate burglaries.

Finally, if you would support legislation that stops people drinking, or smoking, because a small number of people are adversly effected by those drugs, then you are exactly the type of person who would mandate a vaccine against a virus that kills a tiny amount of people, for the "greater good". Might as well legislate against films, music, books, and video games you dont like as well. Maybe legislate against revealing clothing while you are at it? Personal responsibility is a thing, remove it from people, and you lose it.
 

Lawrence87

Kingfisher
Orthodox
3. Cannabis is less addictive than nicotine or alcohol, it also has less deleterious effects. However, some bred "super"strains of cannabis are very bad. If you legalise cannabis and proscribe the more dangerous strains then you can very much limit their use.

I don't see that legalization would promote anything other than the mass marketing the strongest strains. I've known people to end up in mental hospital through excessive cannabis use and there is evidence that it is exceptionally harmful to developing brains etc. It's clearly spiritually harmful. People who say it's harmless are just justifying their drug problems. This is why the comparative arguments are always used. It's not as bad as drinking bleach or whatever, that doesn't mean it's not bad. It's like saying groping someone isn't as bad as raping someone... It's not really a compelling argument.


Finally, if you would support legislation that stops people drinking, or smoking, because a small number of people are adversly effected by those drugs, then you are exactly the type of person who would mandate a vaccine against a virus that kills a tiny amount of people, for the "greater good". Might as well legislate against films, music, books, and video games you dont like as well. Maybe legislate against revealing clothing while you are at it? Personal responsibility is a thing, remove it from people, and you lose it.
I don't know where you get this from. I think that cannabis should be illegal because it harms young people who don't know any better, it damages their development and is extremely spiritually harmful. Thus I don't think it should be given any endorsement or made any easier to get hold of and abuse than it already is.

I don't necessarily think it needs to be made a priority over other kinds of crime or given a harsh punishment, but I think having places were you can go to buy weed legally would be extremely damaging to society overall because it would widen the bracket of young kids who end up damaged by it.

The whole weed is harmless idea is bunk. Hence why the arguements are always about comparative harm. The fact is that weed produces useless, effeminate, unproductive, lazy men with no impulse control, and it's already rampant enough without being legalized and endorsed by big businesses.
 

Early Bird

Woodpecker
Catholic
"The whole weed is harmless idea is bunk. Hence why the arguements are always about comparative harm. The fact is that weed produces useless, effeminate, unproductive, lazy men with no impulse control, and it's already rampant enough without being legalized and endorsed by big businesses."

Yes.

I have the same view of men who watch Marvel movies or wear Batman / Superman t-shirts, still play video games, etc. Nothing more than an extended -- or perpetual -- adolescence. A form of escapism.

I've tried helping some friends with their addictions but they are so deluded it's an almost impossible conversation.
 

Cuchulainn2016

Kingfisher
I don't see that legalization would promote anything other than the mass marketing the strongest strains. I've known people to end up in mental hospital through excessive cannabis use and there is evidence that it is exceptionally harmful to developing brains etc. It's clearly spiritually harmful. People who say it's harmless are just justifying their drug problems. This is why the comparative arguments are always used. It's not as bad as drinking bleach or whatever, that doesn't mean it's not bad. It's like saying groping someone isn't as bad as raping someone... It's not really a compelling argument.



I don't know where you get this from. I think that cannabis should be illegal because it harms young people who don't know any better, it damages their development and is extremely spiritually harmful. Thus I don't think it should be given any endorsement or made any easier to get hold of and abuse than it already is.

I don't necessarily think it needs to be made a priority over other kinds of crime or given a harsh punishment, but I think having places were you can go to buy weed legally would be extremely damaging to society overall because it would widen the bracket of young kids who end up damaged by it.

The whole weed is harmless idea is bunk. Hence why the arguements are always about comparative harm. The fact is that weed produces useless, effeminate, unproductive, lazy men with no impulse control, and it's already rampant enough without being legalized and endorsed by big businesses.
If you legalise cannabis, you can, like alcohol, legislate for what is produced legally, then make extremely harsh penalties for producing and supplying the more dangerous stuff.

Weed will always be here, and will always be taken. It cant be eradicated, and the logical (masculine) way to deal with it is to manage it in the most beneficial way possible. Attempting to ban it harder than it already is banned is the illogical knee-jerk (feminine) way of dealing with the problem.

If you think that cannabis is deleterious to people, then yes, you could ban it, but you must also ban everything else that is deleterious, especially alcohol and cigarettes which is worse. Otherwise you are either being hypocritcal, or illogical in your approach to the problem.

The majority of [young] people will smoke a joint at some point, just as they will have a drink. Would you prefer their first drink comes from an illegal still, or a beer down the pub? Would you prefer they have a joint which relaxes them, or some superSkunk strain that melts their brain?

I have never said its harmless, just that you must plan to get the most out of the situation that exists, and that trying to ban something even harder than it already is banned is pointless.

Also, to be very clear, I do not care about other peoples spiritual, mental or physical health. They make their own choices and bear the responsibility for them. They have all the information they need to make those choices. There will always be people who make the wrong choices. I cannot countenance punishing or infantilising everyone else because of the weak in society. That is exactly why we have all these covid mandates at the moment. It is morally, and spiritually wrong to travel down that path.
 

Lawrence87

Kingfisher
Orthodox
If you legalise cannabis, you can, like alcohol, legislate for what is produced legally, then make extremely harsh penalties for producing and supplying the more dangerous stuff.

Weed will always be here, and will always be taken. It cant be eradicated, and the logical (masculine) way to deal with it is to manage it in the most beneficial way possible. Attempting to ban it harder than it already is banned is the illogical knee-jerk (feminine) way of dealing with the problem.

If you think that cannabis is deleterious to people, then yes, you could ban it, but you must also ban everything else that is deleterious, especially alcohol and cigarettes which is worse. Otherwise you are either being hypocritcal, or illogical in your approach to the problem.

The majority of [young] people will smoke a joint at some point, just as they will have a drink. Would you prefer their first drink comes from an illegal still, or a beer down the pub? Would you prefer they have a joint which relaxes them, or some superSkunk strain that melts their brain?

I have never said its harmless, just that you must plan to get the most out of the situation that exists, and that trying to ban something even harder than it already is banned is pointless.
I'd say that skunk is probably a bit easier to produce than moonshine. And even if it were regulated as to the strength you could obtain legally you are still going to widen the bracket of people who develop a liking for marijuana and then decide to move on to growing or otherwise obtaining the stronger stuff.

Of course you can never eradicate weed and many people will try it and become addicted to it. But I think giving it the status of being legal would give it an endorsement in the eyes of people who otherwise might never touch it, if it were something you could just pick up like you might pick up a bottle of wine when you are doing your shopping at the super market.

Again with the comparison thing. Alcohol is bad and addictive etc. But it's pretty clear when alcohol is a problem for someone. If not for them personally then the people around them. With marijuana it is much more insidious, you can function reasonably well whilst being high on it for every waking hour of your life. The negative effects are subtle, but they definitely exist. Because of its appearance of being harmless I think it is important that this is not added to by it being legalized because in the eyes of many this would just add to the perception that weed is fine and doesn't harm anyone.

When you drink too much it's quite obvious that you are doing your body harm. You'll most likely vomit and spend the next day in a state. Weed allows people to be perpetually under its influence.

It's not about eradicating anything, it's about how legalization would be perceived as adding a government stamp of approval to the misconception that cannabis is harmless. And I think this would be extremely damaging to people. Again I don't think it would require extremely harsh punishment but it should not be encouraged in public spaces, nor be any more readily available than it already is.

The whole if it feels good who are you to stop people doing something line of reasoning is one of the major reasons why our society is in such a state. Pornography and weed are really damaging to young men
 

The Beast1

Peacock
Orthodox Inquirer
Gold Member
I'm glad to see this thread is still kicking. I'm still pro-legalization. If we're going to ban pot, we might as well include alcohol. All of which seems silly.

I had a relapse over Christmas. Family came in and we were having a good time. I pulled out my vape and proceeded to blaze up. Like before, I smoked waaay too much. Truly the one drug I cannot take in moderation.

On new year's eve, I threw my vape battery away and have been 9 days clean again.

More positively, it seems my trick with unison has proven effective at being able to quickly overcome the withdrawal effects.

It's an either/or thing with me and sadly something that I'm just going to have to avoid if I want to be a functional adult.
 

Pinch

Robin
Other Christian
I don't see that legalization would promote anything other than the mass marketing the strongest strains. I've known people to end up in mental hospital through excessive cannabis use and there is evidence that it is exceptionally harmful to developing brains etc. It's clearly spiritually harmful. People who say it's harmless are just justifying their drug problems. This is why the comparative arguments are always used. It's not as bad as drinking bleach or whatever, that doesn't mean it's not bad. It's like saying groping someone isn't as bad as raping someone... It's not really a compelling argument.



I don't know where you get this from. I think that cannabis should be illegal because it harms young people who don't know any better, it damages their development and is extremely spiritually harmful. Thus I don't think it should be given any endorsement or made any easier to get hold of and abuse than it already is.

I don't necessarily think it needs to be made a priority over other kinds of crime or given a harsh punishment, but I think having places were you can go to buy weed legally would be extremely damaging to society overall because it would widen the bracket of young kids who end up damaged by it.

The whole weed is harmless idea is bunk. Hence why the arguements are always about comparative harm. The fact is that weed produces useless, effeminate, unproductive, lazy men with no impulse control, and it's already rampant enough without being legalized and endorsed by big businesses.

Weed isn't harmless.. But to suggest that it produces useless, effeminate, unproductive, lazy men with no impulse control is completely backwards. When anyone blames one thing as the root cause of a whole multitude of issues, THAT in itself is lazy.

Young people don't know any better when it comes to many, many things in life. If you think that making (or keeping) a psychoactive plant illegal is the solution to protecting the youth, well it hasn't worked, it doesn't work and it makes things much worse.

I'd suggest that parents, people in the community, family etc, become whole-heartedly active every step of the way in the kids lives, lead by example, become a true role model and give them something to look up to and aspire to be like. Making something illegal has never worked and never will work.

I'd also say that some of the most faithful and spiritually mature people I've ever met came out of extremely difficult addictions, overcame them and turned to God. I've also seen the opposite, it's true but this is a part of life and those outcomes did not occur or happen because something was either legal or illegal.
 
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Pinch

Robin
Other Christian
When you drink too much it's quite obvious that you are doing your body harm. You'll most likely vomit and spend the next day in a state. Weed allows people to be perpetually under its influence.

I grew up around alcoholics and addicts and I've seen so many, some very, very close, slowly destroy their lives and everyone around them because of booze. There are many, MANY "high functioning" alcoholics out there that can drink until the cows come home and you would never know. Nor would they ever stop and consider what their doing to themselves and those around them.. Because they're addicted.

Alcohol truly turns people inside out and evokes the worst of the ego. It turns people into demons and caricatures of who they truly are.
 

Pinch

Robin
Other Christian
Of course you can never eradicate weed and many people will try it and become addicted to it. But I think giving it the status of being legal would give it an endorsement in the eyes of people who otherwise might never touch it, if it were something you could just pick up like you might pick up a bottle of wine when you are doing your shopping at the super market.

That's why you teach your kids that not everything that is protected or endorsed by the federal & local government/politicians is necessarily true or correct. And with this point you're still not addressing the legality of so many things, social media, alcohol, materialistic pursuits etc that I believe are 100 fold more damaging, especially unchecked, to the Soul and one's ability to commune with God than anything that is growing from the ground.
 

DenizenJane

Woodpecker
Non-Christian
Upon further reflection on this topic, you get a sense of mild disappointment in mankind upon realizing the legal relationship between wheat and cannabis. No, obviously the laws regarding wheat and weed are not identical. But as a private citizen, they are both illegal to grow. Wheat would have the legal edge though, since you don't get a car search out of smelling like bread and your eyes don't get red from eating crackers.

Alas, which product did our teenagers and cool kids end up passing around and selling amongst themselves. Bootleg bread, or devil's lettuce?

A crop that can be grown down to something edible and maybe sorta feed hungry people, or the one you you roll up, set alight, and have a giggle session on?

Its whatever, but its little thoughts like this that confirm that humanity, given all its options, will always incline towards sleaze.:rolleyes:
 

Cavalier

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Upon further reflection on this topic, you get a sense of mild disappointment in mankind upon realizing the legal relationship between wheat and cannabis. No, obviously the laws regarding wheat and weed are not identical. But as a private citizen, they are both illegal to grow. Wheat would have the legal edge though, since you don't get a car search out of smelling like bread and your eyes don't get red from eating crackers.

Alas, which product did our teenagers and cool kids end up passing around and selling amongst themselves. Bootleg bread, or devil's lettuce?

A crop that can be grown down to something edible and maybe sorta feed hungry people, or the one you you roll up, set alight, and have a giggle session on?

Its whatever, but its little thoughts like this that confirm that humanity, given all its options, will always incline towards sleaze.:rolleyes:
Where is it illegal to grow wheat?
 
Probably going to ruffle some feathers with this, but it needs to be said sooner or later, cannabis needs to be destroyed entirely. It must be removed from the ability and reach of weak humans to grow, proliferate, profit off of, and contaminate weaker-willed people with its addictive mediocrity. It serves as a huge roadblock for several people I know to return to abject reality, however tedious that may be. I can't wait to become an inquisitor and poison all the cannabis plants in the realm. Not so people who smoke them suffer, but so the plants themselves wither and die. I once thought about burning all of them, but then everyone would flock to the smoke and inhale all of it to get high. There's more than one way to get rid of the devil's vices than pure abstinence. Sometimes mankind needs a course correction to get off the bad track. Some people are on this crap 24/7 during their waking hours because they can't deal with their soul-killing reality. When hard times starts to create strong men, I sincerely hope they consider destroying every vice that led to the current predicament, especially this odorous reeking plant of complete olfactory repugnance.
 

Cavalier

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Probably going to ruffle some feathers with this, but it needs to be said sooner or later, cannabis needs to be destroyed entirely. It must be removed from the ability and reach of weak humans to grow, proliferate, profit off of, and contaminate weaker-willed people with its addictive mediocrity. It serves as a huge roadblock for several people I know to return to abject reality, however tedious that may be. I can't wait to become an inquisitor and poison all the cannabis plants in the realm. Not so people who smoke them suffer, but so the plants themselves wither and die. I once thought about burning all of them, but then everyone would flock to the smoke and inhale all of it to get high. There's more than one way to get rid of the devil's vices than pure abstinence. Sometimes mankind needs a course correction to get off the bad track. Some people are on this crap 24/7 during their waking hours because they can't deal with their soul-killing reality. When hard times starts to create strong men, I sincerely hope they consider destroying every vice that led to the current predicament, especially this odorous reeking plant of complete olfactory repugnance.
Fully agree. But for some reason the government seems to be encouraging it now. I wonder why? I wouldn’t touch that garbage if I was paid to do it.
 

Lawrence87

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Fully agree. But for some reason the government seems to be encouraging it now. I wonder why? I wouldn’t touch that garbage if I was paid to do it.
When you think of your average stoner, words like "conservative", "traditionalist", and "right-wing" don't usually come to mind. The antifa brigade is probably largely fuelled by marijuana. They encourage weed because it makes you cucked to the globohomo agenda.
 

NotaBene

Robin
Protestant
Gents, I have a question about this. Some background:

- Never smoked pot in my life, in my 40s
- Wife smoked it in high school socially, never addicted, before she was a Christian
- I never had alcohol until around age 25. Now we enjoy it together, dates at home, or socially.
- I also smoke a pipe once or twice a week.

So I'm wondering about trying this stuff out with the wife. I know many of you think it's horrible but what I'm reading is guys who smoked every day for six years, that the effects of addiction are bad. I totally agree, but what about very occasional recreational use? How does it compare to alcohol, about the same?

My neighbor upstairs is definitely addicted, makes "edibles" for income, and gave me a small sample free. I'm sort of afraid of the stuff, and almost threw it out, but wifey wants to try it with me for fun. I have no fear that either of us would be in danger of addiction, more wondering what you all think in terms of trying it out once.
 
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