Meat eating / Vegetarianism in the current world

infowarrior1

Peacock
Protestant
You’re talking about veganism, heart attacks and the 19th century…..sounds great cool no argument here.

What I’m saying is the guy works hard in the gym, it’s not just steroids as you dismissed it as regardless of what he eats.

I think he was probably doing veganism properly by partaking of all the varieties of nutrition sources like Mushrooms, Algae etc. unlike the average malnourished vegan.

But in real life. A simpler diet would require animal products. The Irish diet of Potatoes and Dairy was quite sustainable for example in their poverty.
 

FrancisK

Pelican
Catholic
Gold Member
I think he was probably doing veganism properly by partaking of all the varieties of nutrition sources like Mushrooms, Algae etc. unlike the average malnourished vegan.

But in real life. A simpler diet would require animal products. The Irish diet of Potatoes and Dairy was quite sustainable for example in their poverty.


I don’t know what the guy was eating but he looks like he has put a lot of hard work in that was my only point for the guy saying anybody could attain that physique with just steroids.


Meat and potatoes is by far my favorite meal but veggies also have a lot of stuff your body needs just stay away from the modified garbage get them from a farm or grow them yourself, just because vegans are mainly douchebags doesn’t mean you should blame the veggies for that haha.
 

infowarrior1

Peacock
Protestant
I don’t know what the guy was eating but he looks like he has put a lot of hard work in that was my only point for the guy saying anybody could attain that physique with just steroids.


Meat and potatoes is by far my favorite meal but veggies also have a lot of stuff your body needs just stay away from the modified garbage get them from a farm or grow them yourself, just because vegans are mainly douchebags doesn’t mean you should blame the veggies for that haha.

It's not just that they are douchebags. Most of them are malnourished.
 

Pantheon

Robin
Orthodox
Some more thoughts on veganism:

The moral imperative of the modern world seems to be to eliminate suffering, which in ethical veganism scales down to animals. From a materialistic viewpoint, suffering is just a 'glitch' in the machine. The rationale is ''how can man outwit nature'' rather than harmonize with it. The impression I get is that vegans pose for nature, but since they do not in fact view suffering and pain as morally neutral aspects of life, and make an ethical judgement of them (that it is necessarily wrong to kill an animal), it goes to show that they are in fact not loyal to the ways of nature, but see humans as standing outside the ecological weave. That is, they are rationalists, not naturalists. It amounts to a form of secular "Christianity", where animals are anthropomorphized, and man is dehumanized.

Even if you take man out of the equation, animals will keep killing each other. There is no way out of killing since life is a competition for space and resources. Plants do certainly not "want" to be eaten either, which is why they are poisonous. The goal of political veganism is therefore to create a human environment that does not participate in nature. Symbolically, it is an attack on the archeype of the hunter. The Christian position would be that man does participate in nature, and should not abandon his role as apex predator.

If you view suffering in sentimental and wholly negative terms, life itself must certianly be viewed as an unfortunate accident, to be alleviated by technology. This means the vegan ideology is not really interested in nature, but wants a merely social experience of life, based on convenience. That is, it is an ideology of the petty bourgeoise, which requires safe urban environments and technology. That is not being on the side of nature.

In a state of nature, I can't see why for example the value of a fish's life is greater than the enjoyment a human gets from catching it and making a meal for his family. The value of an individual fish's life, or for that matter another animal, can only be seen in relation to how the species is doing otherwise. If something is endangered, don't kill it. If something is plentiful, go ahead and eat it.

So if the vegan argument is to end factory farming, it seems to me that you should oppose the conditions that uphold it (urbanization, individualism, technology and materialism) but vegan fundamentalists seem to be on the side of these very things ("as long as I buy green products I atone for my sins"). That is a lifestyle choice, not curing the disease.

If you view life as a whole, in a positive light, then suffering and violence clearly plays an evolutionary role, because without natural selection, there would not even exist any biological diversity or beauty, let alone human beings. The quest to end suffering is therefore to miss the forest for the trees and a quest to end nature itself.
 

Tedd

Pigeon
Agnostic
So if the vegan argument is to end factory farming, it seems to me that you should oppose the conditions that uphold it (urbanization, individualism, technology and materialism) but vegan fundamentalists seem to be on the side of these very things ("as long as I buy green products I atone for my sins"). That is a lifestyle choice, not curing the disease.
Yes, vegans want everything to be "green" and "sustainable" as long as they don't really have to change their lifestyle at all. They still want their macbooks, their avocados and matcha lattes, and their mass produced synthetic vitamins they need to retain some semblance of health.

I know a couple that have a small farm where they practice regenerative agriculture and rotational grazing. These people don't even own a car anymore, they ride their horses everywhere. They're a lot more "green" than the average vegan will ever come close to being. And yet they're being smeared and hated on by the vegans because they eat meat and "that's bad for the planet, don't you know?'
 

nagareboshi

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Has anyone heard of the Clean Label Project? Are they legit? The fact that they specifically call out major food brands for being polluted with toxins is appealing to me: https://cleanlabelproject.org/Puori/

Anyways, there are two plant-based protein powders that are approved by this organization. They may be a good solution for believers who wish to consume more protein and less carbs on the fasting days.
 

infowarrior1

Peacock
Protestant
Some more thoughts on veganism:

The moral imperative of the modern world seems to be to eliminate suffering, which in ethical veganism scales down to animals. From a materialistic viewpoint, suffering is just a 'glitch' in the machine. The rationale is ''how can man outwit nature'' rather than harmonize with it. The impression I get is that vegans pose for nature, but since they do not in fact view suffering and pain as morally neutral aspects of life, and make an ethical judgement of them (that it is necessarily wrong to kill an animal), it goes to show that they are in fact not loyal to the ways of nature, but see humans as standing outside the ecological weave. That is, they are rationalists, not naturalists. It amounts to a form of secular "Christianity", where animals are anthropomorphized, and man is dehumanized.

Even if you take man out of the equation, animals will keep killing each other. There is no way out of killing since life is a competition for space and resources. Plants do certainly not "want" to be eaten either, which is why they are poisonous. The goal of political veganism is therefore to create a human environment that does not participate in nature. Symbolically, it is an attack on the archeype of the hunter. The Christian position would be that man does participate in nature, and should not abandon his role as apex predator.

If you view suffering in sentimental and wholly negative terms, life itself must certianly be viewed as an unfortunate accident, to be alleviated by technology. This means the vegan ideology is not really interested in nature, but wants a merely social experience of life, based on convenience. That is, it is an ideology of the petty bourgeoise, which requires safe urban environments and technology. That is not being on the side of nature.

In a state of nature, I can't see why for example the value of a fish's life is greater than the enjoyment a human gets from catching it and making a meal for his family. The value of an individual fish's life, or for that matter another animal, can only be seen in relation to how the species is doing otherwise. If something is endangered, don't kill it. If something is plentiful, go ahead and eat it.

So if the vegan argument is to end factory farming, it seems to me that you should oppose the conditions that uphold it (urbanization, individualism, technology and materialism) but vegan fundamentalists seem to be on the side of these very things ("as long as I buy green products I atone for my sins"). That is a lifestyle choice, not curing the disease.

If you view life as a whole, in a positive light, then suffering and violence clearly plays an evolutionary role, because without natural selection, there would not even exist any biological diversity or beauty, let alone human beings. The quest to end suffering is therefore to miss the forest for the trees and a quest to end nature itself.

The "Christians" who were the original vegans sought to return to Eden since Adam and Eve only subsisted on herbs according to scripture.

But by the removal of Christ. They removed the fountainhead for the fountain. Yet they expect the fountain to still flow with water.

Eden/Paradise cannot exist without God. And given the mess we already made to the beautiful wilderness in many areas of earth it is clear evidence of unredeemed man out of harmony with God such that we failed at stewardship.
 

DanielH

Ostrich
Moderator
Orthodox


This is one of the most vile food products I've ever seen. Ultra processed "vegetable" product made to imitate meat, breaded with "bread" crumbs, and fried in some sort of rancid vegetable oil. Not one component of this item served for human consumption would be identified as food prior to the 20th century. This is poison.
 

MartyMcFly

Ostrich
Other Christian


This is one of the most vile food products I've ever seen. Ultra processed "vegetable" product made to imitate meat, breaded with "bread" crumbs, and fried in some sort of rancid vegetable oil. Not one component of this item served for human consumption would be identified as food prior to the 20th century. This is poison.

I find this weird. If you are a vegetarian for ethical reasons, you shouldn't even want to simulate the taste of meat. It is like watching pornography instead of using a prostitute. Technically, one involves the mind and the other the mind + the action, but it means you have impure thoughts and want to eat an animal, but have the willpower not to actually eat it. Also, even if you eat vegetarian options, why are you supporting KFC knowing they kill billions of chickens every year?

If vegetarian for health reasons-why are you eating fried food from KFC? You are better off making vegetable soup or roasted vegetables at home which is healthier and will likely save you money.
 

Mountaineer

 
Banned
Orthodox Catechumen
Gold Member
I recommend this podcast on the subject, it offers an explanation from the physical and theological perspective. In my opinion vegetarianism and also it's gayer version is a slow-motion suicide in the name of a Satanic cult that places animals equal to man. Stay away.

 

No-Designation Man

Kingfisher
Other Christian
"... Into your hand they are now given. Every moving animal that is alive may serve as food for you. As in the case of green vegetation, I do give it all to you. Only flesh with its soul - its blood - you must not eat." - Genesis 9:2-4

After the flood of Noah's day, earth's environment changed dramatically with the loss of the heavenly ocean that shielded the planet from the radiation from the sun/space. Mankind subsequently went much further into deterioration (notice how quickly the recorded life-spans start rapidly dereasing). I speculate that we we're given meat (at that point) as part of our diet for two reasons:

1) Physical: To compensate for vegetation, alone, no longer being nutritionally sufficient to sustain our actual existense.
2) Spiritual: Constant reminder of being further alienated from Jehovah. The animals that were created "in subjection" to us, were now "in terror"
of us (First part of verse 2 of Genesis chapter 9).

I read @infowarrior1 's post above (#87) with great interest. When man is perfect again and brought back into God's grace in the fullest sense, meat eating will no longer be necessary. However, since we're not at that point yet, vegetarianism/veganism is unnatural and goes against the current arrangement of God.


As an aside, the irony is not lost on me that most, if not all, of the 'meat is murder/save the innocent animals' activist-chicks have no problem having (multiple) human abortions under their own belts.
 

Max Roscoe

Ostrich
Orthodox Inquirer
How about a little more discussion on the "MEAT EATING" part of this thread, which is what I'm very interested in.
I don't think we need to attack the vegan diet anymore.
Criticizing vegans is like attacking SJWs. Everyone outside the cult knows they are wrong, and it's very easy to critique them.

Is there any merit to a meat heavy (as in more than half your food coming from meats) diet?
 

The Beast1

Peacock
Orthodox Inquirer
Gold Member
How about a little more discussion on the "MEAT EATING" part of this thread, which is what I'm very interested in.
I don't think we need to attack the vegan diet anymore.
Criticizing vegans is like attacking SJWs. Everyone outside the cult knows they are wrong, and it's very easy to critique them.

Is there any merit to a meat heavy (as in more than half your food coming from meats) diet?
I used to sing in a choir with an autistic type 1 diabetic. Couldn't stand the guy, he was the epitome of extreme autism.

He switched his diet to Paleo. Soon after he became much less "annoyingly" autistic and was managing his diabetes without the need of insulin. He looked healthier too.

He's a unique one off case, but I'm glad it worked for him because he ended up being a really funny guy.

I eat a mostly protein and fat heavy diet. My wife refuses to believe that my diet works and claims it's my metabolism and genes. I eat 2 slices of bacon,sausage, a bowl of oatmeal (with a scope of unflavored gelatin protein powder), glass of skim milk, and some tea. Lunch is always fruit. And dinner I go crazy on since I'm really hungry. I drink about 8-10 cups (measured from my water bottle ) a day.

I think the gelatin and fat help keep my skin filled out and "greasy" which keeps me looking young. Zoomers have remarked to me that they
think I'm younger than them which boggles my mind.

Take two anecdotal stories for your consideration friend
 

Max Roscoe

Ostrich
Orthodox Inquirer
I eat a mostly protein and fat heavy diet. My wife refuses to believe that my diet works and claims it's my metabolism and genes. I eat 2 slices of bacon,sausage, a bowl of oatmeal (with a scope of unflavored gelatin protein powder), glass of skim milk, and some tea. Lunch is always fruit. And dinner I go crazy on since I'm really hungry. I drink about 8-10 cups (measured from my water bottle ) a day.
Why the skim milk?
 

Theo'sTheories

Robin
Other Christian
How about a little more discussion on the "MEAT EATING" part of this thread, which is what I'm very interested in.
I don't think we need to attack the vegan diet anymore.
Criticizing vegans is like attacking SJWs. Everyone outside the cult knows they are wrong, and it's very easy to critique them.

Is there any merit to a meat heavy (as in more than half your food coming from meats) diet?
I am also wondering this. I was raised vegetarian and in my 22 years of life I still haven't eaten any meat. I don't really feel like I've missed out on much though because it's hard to miss something you've never had. Heavy meat diets are interesting to me because they're just so different from my diet and if meat really is extremely healthy for you, I would very much like to know. I really want to do more research into it this and if you find anything let me know!
 

frankunderwood

Pigeon
Protestant
I used to sing in a choir with an autistic type 1 diabetic. Couldn't stand the guy, he was the epitome of extreme autism.

He switched his diet to Paleo. Soon after he became much less "annoyingly" autistic and was managing his diabetes without the need of insulin. He looked healthier too.

He's a unique one off case, but I'm glad it worked for him because he ended up being a really funny guy.

This makes sense, the brain is a organ like any other and if the diet is wrong it will be dysfunctional. Our brain is about 60% saturated fats and 25% cholesterol and other fats by weight. We get saturated fats mainly trough meat and dairy.

On a spiritual level I think that all the processed food that make us unhealthy is part of the plan. That's because if you are addicted to sugar and caffeine, if you can't think as clearly and have lowered impulse control because of malnutrition, if you are fat, sick and sluggish, then it's going to be that much harder to do what is right. The food addictions can also be a form of training to give in to other temptations in my view.
 

newcomer

Robin
Orthodox Catechumen
I am also wondering this. I was raised vegetarian and in my 22 years of life I still haven't eaten any meat. I don't really feel like I've missed out on much though because it's hard to miss something you've never had. Heavy meat diets are interesting to me because they're just so different from my diet and if meat really is extremely healthy for you, I would very much like to know. I really want to do more research into it this and if you find anything let me know!
Primal edge health on YouTube is keto and carnivore diet guy. The diet helped Jay Dyer as well as fr. deacon Ananias. He got a lot of stuff on his channel, mostly talks about veganism and deep state.
 

MartyMcFly

Ostrich
Other Christian
Haha I see the inconsistency. I've managed to dial in my diet so well that by adjusting the fat content of my milk I can either maintain or bulk. Removing milk causes me to lose weight.
I would advise using whole milk and then cutting it with water to a mix of 70% milk and 30% water. This will save you money and reduce calories as well and you get the same taste as using skim milk. I sometimes do this when I make tomato soup or oatmeal.
 
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