NoMoreTO
Hummingbird
Cosign.
I read that book years ago and so often I find myself talking about some of the themes.
If you really want to be wealthy, be the guy that is living next door, because he might be a millionaire.
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Money Advice For Younger Guys
- Thread starter MichaelWitcoff
- Start date
I read that book years ago and so often I find myself talking about some of the themes.
If you really want to be wealthy, be the guy that is living next door, because he might be a millionaire.
I'm going to be the contrarian here, but here goes anyway:
1. Don't accumulate a lot of college debt. Go to a cheap school, get a degree in something practical.
2. Nobody gets rich by saving money. They do it by making smart investments. If you have no money when you start you should try to get som e at first by saving a little (like to get a down payment on a house). Stop scrimping and saving after you get your first $50k to use as an investment.
3. Buy a decent house in a good area and mortgage yourself to the max. Real estate is a great leveraged investment that can only lose in areas of rising diversity. Real estate is the safest way to short the dollar - a sure bet so long as (((bankers))) print money to serve themselves. At 5% down you're literally shorting the dollar at 20x leverage with very little downside risk - and you can actually live in your investment. It is even a tax advantaged investment since you don't pay taxes on interest paid.
4. Don't pre-pay your mortgage. (why would you want to unwind any of that 20x leveraged dollar short position?) Take extra any money and buy more real estate - rental property in a white area, land, commercial property. If you're a tradesman use it to buy equipment - a second van so you can hire a second crew, some specialized tool that gives you access to high paying specialized work etc.
5. Don't put your money into 401k. Even with matching. Your money will be locked into a limited pool of investments controlled by a pozzed financial corporation. Once it is in, you'll pay a penalty to get it out for great ideas like buying crypto, buying more real estate, investing in a business etc. You want to get surplus money out of their system so you can invest it in good practical things yourself.
6. Buy whatever car you can afford to pay cash for. Generally buy used unless you're rich enough it doesn't matter any more.
7. If you're a corporation drone: early on don't worry about salary. Get a job working for the best quality company you can - even if the job is lower tier and pays less. Just get exposure to the best people you can. The difference between earning 30k, 50k or 70k in the first 5 years will not matter that much if it gets you into a job tier paying $150k a few years earlier. Take a job with more potential to move up (e.g. has more management track potential) over one that doesn't regardless of compensation. Take responsibility for things that are outside of your job. You'll be surprised at how fast you'll get promoted. Compensation in corporations scales non-linearly. It's worth sacrificing early if it gets you into the higher tiers sooner. In good quality corporations or start ups always prefer stock over salary once salary meets your survival needs.
8. Prefer marrying a woman with low or no debt. Imagine spending years paying off a woman's college debt that she accumulated sleeping with other men for 4 years at college.
9. Marry a woman who wants to stay home and raise your children. Ideally you should be planning for 4+ children. Very few women earn more than the cost of having other people take care of 2 kids. It becomes very difficult to afford more than 2 kids with a working wife.
10. Don't marry a woman who is materialistic and spendy. Don't marry one that wants to know your salary, watch your bank account or wants to have any say in how you spend your money. Materialistic women will spend down every penny you earn on the absolute dumbest possible stuff. (But do spend liberally on the legitimate needs of a good woman who is a staying at home raising your children)
1. Don't accumulate a lot of college debt. Go to a cheap school, get a degree in something practical.
2. Nobody gets rich by saving money. They do it by making smart investments. If you have no money when you start you should try to get som e at first by saving a little (like to get a down payment on a house). Stop scrimping and saving after you get your first $50k to use as an investment.
3. Buy a decent house in a good area and mortgage yourself to the max. Real estate is a great leveraged investment that can only lose in areas of rising diversity. Real estate is the safest way to short the dollar - a sure bet so long as (((bankers))) print money to serve themselves. At 5% down you're literally shorting the dollar at 20x leverage with very little downside risk - and you can actually live in your investment. It is even a tax advantaged investment since you don't pay taxes on interest paid.
4. Don't pre-pay your mortgage. (why would you want to unwind any of that 20x leveraged dollar short position?) Take extra any money and buy more real estate - rental property in a white area, land, commercial property. If you're a tradesman use it to buy equipment - a second van so you can hire a second crew, some specialized tool that gives you access to high paying specialized work etc.
5. Don't put your money into 401k. Even with matching. Your money will be locked into a limited pool of investments controlled by a pozzed financial corporation. Once it is in, you'll pay a penalty to get it out for great ideas like buying crypto, buying more real estate, investing in a business etc. You want to get surplus money out of their system so you can invest it in good practical things yourself.
6. Buy whatever car you can afford to pay cash for. Generally buy used unless you're rich enough it doesn't matter any more.
7. If you're a corporation drone: early on don't worry about salary. Get a job working for the best quality company you can - even if the job is lower tier and pays less. Just get exposure to the best people you can. The difference between earning 30k, 50k or 70k in the first 5 years will not matter that much if it gets you into a job tier paying $150k a few years earlier. Take a job with more potential to move up (e.g. has more management track potential) over one that doesn't regardless of compensation. Take responsibility for things that are outside of your job. You'll be surprised at how fast you'll get promoted. Compensation in corporations scales non-linearly. It's worth sacrificing early if it gets you into the higher tiers sooner. In good quality corporations or start ups always prefer stock over salary once salary meets your survival needs.
8. Prefer marrying a woman with low or no debt. Imagine spending years paying off a woman's college debt that she accumulated sleeping with other men for 4 years at college.
9. Marry a woman who wants to stay home and raise your children. Ideally you should be planning for 4+ children. Very few women earn more than the cost of having other people take care of 2 kids. It becomes very difficult to afford more than 2 kids with a working wife.
10. Don't marry a woman who is materialistic and spendy. Don't marry one that wants to know your salary, watch your bank account or wants to have any say in how you spend your money. Materialistic women will spend down every penny you earn on the absolute dumbest possible stuff. (But do spend liberally on the legitimate needs of a good woman who is a staying at home raising your children)
burncushlikewood
Robin
Study at a good university, take a hard undergrad and look at post-grad salary expectations, hardest subjects like computer science and biology, and physics, and chemistry. If you can get into grad school, definitely go, it's well known that the longer you study for the higher your salary. For example in Bermuda there is only 2 ways you can live there if you're not born there. I heard its crazy wild out there, but the only ways you can live there is if one, you buy property there, but the only houses for sale are in the top 10% of price, the other is to work there, but they need doctors and software if you can code. Cook at home when you can, and limit the amount you eat out, eat healthy as well. Exercise, play sports, this will keep you healthy and energetic. Work hard, read books on subjects that you find fascinating, keep good friends around that well help you achieve your goals. Take up hobbies to keep busy, invest your money in stocks as well, look for consistent stocks that will make you money in the long term. Make your days busy and try and learn different skills, and find high paying in demand jobs, Google the jobs that pay the best, do a career aptitude test to find a job that suits you best, understand your MBTI personality to help find your most suitable jobs, or the state and country best for you, I did a test and the states that came back for me were, Georgia, Washington, and New York. Georgia's economy is like Italy, so those are my skill sets. Jobs that are in demand now such as, physicians, civil engineers, software engineers, construction work, 3D printing technician, energy related jobs, nursing, statistician, mathematics. Math is very useful in every career so make sure you work on math skills, learn a programming language, like c++, c, java, ruby, R, swift, matlab etc. Software is very crucial because it is applied in every industry and every step of business processes require software.
This is some of the best hard-hitting Heritage American advice I’ve ever read. Roosh needs to put it on the front page for young bucks.
I was always skeptical of 401ks and thought they were a racket, this was even before I was complete aware of (((()))). I’m a tradesman and all the older men I work with always brag about how much they’re putting in their 401ks and I just grin on the outside.
I married the perfect woman for me, and even though she’s left leaning -which woman isn’t these days? She still has my back. She is also a stay at home mom and loves it. It’s very tough on her caring for a young baby, but I couldn’t fathom dropping my kid off at daycare in the morning.
On a personal level, I just need to figure out an investment. You’ve made some good points though!
My 401k was basically flat for 12 years while the market went up and down from 1999-2012. However, with the huge bull market since then it has more-or-less doubled in value, including the matching. You do have some control on how your money is invested, and I've basically used mine as a total stock market index fund. So, I'm happy with what it has done for me.
I understand, however, the reasoning behind putting that money instead into investments with higher return potential, such as real estate or bitcoin. If you want to have a chance at real wealth, as in being worth more than $3 million by the time you're 40 years old, a 401k isn't going to cut it. A 401k will get you to about $2 million in 30 years, if you max it out. So, if you want more than that, then I agree that a 401k is not your best option.
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401ks vary widely based on employer. Some give you a small menu of funds to choose from, and others let you buy any stock listed on the market if you like. Don't avoid 401ks automatically -- look into the details before making a decision.
Compared to taking the money and investing using a usual brokerage account, here are the benefits of a 401k:
The big drawback to a 401k is there are huge limitations and penalties on withdrawals before you reach 59 1/2 years old. If it's a long-term investment, then that may be OK though.
In short, research carefully exactly what options you have with your 401k -- some are better than others -- and think closely about tax benefits. A lot of investors never consider tax implications of their investments and a good tax strategy can add another 1-2% overall return easily. Some examples are tax loss harvesting and making charitable donations of appreciated stock instead of cash.
Compared to taking the money and investing using a usual brokerage account, here are the benefits of a 401k:
- Your employer may match your contribution, so you double your money invested for "free".
- The money you put in is pre-tax
- No tax on dividends until you take a distribution. This is likely to be when you are older and probably retired so you'll be in a lower tax bracket.
- 401k assets generally cannot be seized by creditors (because it's an ERISA)
The big drawback to a 401k is there are huge limitations and penalties on withdrawals before you reach 59 1/2 years old. If it's a long-term investment, then that may be OK though.
In short, research carefully exactly what options you have with your 401k -- some are better than others -- and think closely about tax benefits. A lot of investors never consider tax implications of their investments and a good tax strategy can add another 1-2% overall return easily. Some examples are tax loss harvesting and making charitable donations of appreciated stock instead of cash.
What would be your take on my situation.
I am going to be living between two countries, bar intervention from Claus Schwab. I want to buy a property in both and am highly averse to renting, which I have never done.
In one I may require to have a permanent address (ownership or min. 12 months rental contract). I probably won't live there that much and if I get a rental it will be temporary before buying something next year, when I will have more money. Something in an area I'd want to live will be $100,000 to buy. You can get them for $80,000 in good, but out of the way areas which will leave me isolated and having to take lengthy journeys to get anywhere. These would not be properties I would want to stay in long-term and I'm not overly keen on looking into rental options for lower-end units
I am also eyeing two other units, which I would live in a bit, but would be used for vacation rentals most of the time. There are two options: a studio, which would net about $19,000 for rental and a two-bedroom, which would net $40,000. The studio has a much higher ROI, but it would not be long-term, the two bedroom would.
So here I am looking at either putting off buying until next year, in which case I might need to get a rental which will be empty for a considerable portion of time; buy a small unit temporarily and use it as a vacation rental (won't turn much cash); buy a better small unit temporarily (which could be a long-term good vacation rental); or just buy what I want straight away.
Then I am looking at a large house with land in a much cheaper country. This will be in the future, not this year, maybe next or the year after. That would be my primary residence.
Though I can afford to buy, I have considered getting mortgages as the interest rate is about 2.7% USD-pegged. The main reason is I get much higher interest than 2.7% and could pay for the apartment via either vacation rental income or via my other interest or my usual income or unused savings.
On the primary residence I don't know what mortgage options there are, but I don't want to buy in a single payment as I don't trust the financial bodies in question, so I'd be looking to pay it in installments, just for safety.
Have you actually talked to mortgage brokers in both countries to see if they will even lend to you? A lot of banks are very hesitant to lend to a "foreigner" (non-permanent resident) with no steady, verifiable income from the country they want to buy in.
Country 1) I am resident; I can provide proof of funds, but it does not make sense to buy outright when money earns more. ROI on rental is 9%, while a mortgage is 2.7%. Though I am very averse to debt.
Country 2) I think the best option is to buy an old home and then build a new one into it, that way it can be paid for in installments, avoiding the risk of one large transfer into the country.
TheSurveryor
Pigeon
Since I couldn't find a thread of a similar enough topic. What is a man to do about their social life when they spend most of their days working long hours or out of town?
Unless you lucked into something now or later then you have to choose your path. You can party like an animal and have nothing to show for it but the memories or you can work your tail off while you’re young and be successful when you’re older without having those memories. I would like to disparage someone who chooses the former but really neither is necessarily wrong they are just different paths.
I worked through my youth and I’m reaping the rewards now but I do know lots of guys who did the partying and still live a good life now that they’re older. Although I do also know even more guys who have nothing in their lives because they partied through their youth.
I’ll also say this, success is one heck of a breeding ground for a social life. If you truly become successful the social life will come to you, trust me on that. Just make sure you’re working and building something that is real and not just spinning on a hamster wheel thinking that you are, otherwise you might as well go party instead.
But back on to the topic of this thread, I do have a bit of an unconventional thought for someone who has nothing and no prospects but wants to take advantage of the forgivingness of youth. It’s a nuclear option and only works if you’re very young, so…..
How good is your credit?
How much money can you borrow through every venue imaginable? Would you have a moral dilemma in regards to screwing over a bunch of jew banks?
What if you could get a sizable amount and squirrel it away? Do you have family or friends that you implicitly trust?
You can do a lot with real cash, even if you’re currently facing 7 years of bad credit because of bankruptcy. Maybe you’re so young that those 7 years won’t matter and you didn’t have any prospects to begin with anyway?
Not so sure how it would work these days but I know a lot of guys who borrowed some crazy money then when the recession hit just said “oops sorry don’t have it anymore”. A lot of those guys made some huge investments with that cash during the recession when the getting was good and came out the other end pretty wealthy.
Just a thought….
How good is your credit?
How much money can you borrow through every venue imaginable? Would you have a moral dilemma in regards to screwing over a bunch of jew banks?
What if you could get a sizable amount and squirrel it away? Do you have family or friends that you implicitly trust?
You can do a lot with real cash, even if you’re currently facing 7 years of bad credit because of bankruptcy. Maybe you’re so young that those 7 years won’t matter and you didn’t have any prospects to begin with anyway?
Not so sure how it would work these days but I know a lot of guys who borrowed some crazy money then when the recession hit just said “oops sorry don’t have it anymore”. A lot of those guys made some huge investments with that cash during the recession when the getting was good and came out the other end pretty wealthy.
Just a thought….
Excellent advice in the OP with one huge caveat.
I strongly recommend mutual funds, specifically index funds, over individual stocks, especially starting out. You can lose everything in the stock market, a lesson I learned when the *grocery store chain* I was working at as a teenager went bankrupt. I was participating in their stock purchase plan, where you could buy shares of the company commission free (commissions were pretty big back then). I lost over $1,000 when the company went bankrupt, which was a huge amount of money for someone my age (that was more than I contributed to the purchase of my first car 2 years earlier).
A grocery store sounds like a pretty stable investment, but it wasn't (the company was actually purchased by a Jewish private equity firm who caused it to go bankrupt but I didn't understand such things at age 17). Anyway, buying a mutual fund will ensure that the poor performance or failure of any one company will not wipe out your investment, because you own a small bit of many different companies.
Besides the risk of individual company failures, studies have shown time after time that individual investors, even highly paid and well educated investment advisors and teams of mutual fund managers, rarely beat average market returns. So if you try to pick stocks, even if you are a fancy Wall Street Financial Guru, you probably won't pick the right ones.
A really good start is the Vanguard S&P 500 Index Fund. Once you have made regular investments there for a few years, you can branch out and try more specialized mutual funds (IE Vanguard Real Estate Investment Fun, Vanguard Energy Fund, Vanguard International Fund, etc.) or possibly individual stocks, but this is still pretty risky. Berkshire Hathaway is a conglomerate of several businesses, and owning Berkshire is highly advisable. S&P Index and Berkshire are the only things I've invested in over the past few years, other than real estate, which has excellent tax benefits.
I strongly recommend mutual funds, specifically index funds, over individual stocks, especially starting out. You can lose everything in the stock market, a lesson I learned when the *grocery store chain* I was working at as a teenager went bankrupt. I was participating in their stock purchase plan, where you could buy shares of the company commission free (commissions were pretty big back then). I lost over $1,000 when the company went bankrupt, which was a huge amount of money for someone my age (that was more than I contributed to the purchase of my first car 2 years earlier).
A grocery store sounds like a pretty stable investment, but it wasn't (the company was actually purchased by a Jewish private equity firm who caused it to go bankrupt but I didn't understand such things at age 17). Anyway, buying a mutual fund will ensure that the poor performance or failure of any one company will not wipe out your investment, because you own a small bit of many different companies.
Besides the risk of individual company failures, studies have shown time after time that individual investors, even highly paid and well educated investment advisors and teams of mutual fund managers, rarely beat average market returns. So if you try to pick stocks, even if you are a fancy Wall Street Financial Guru, you probably won't pick the right ones.
A really good start is the Vanguard S&P 500 Index Fund. Once you have made regular investments there for a few years, you can branch out and try more specialized mutual funds (IE Vanguard Real Estate Investment Fun, Vanguard Energy Fund, Vanguard International Fund, etc.) or possibly individual stocks, but this is still pretty risky. Berkshire Hathaway is a conglomerate of several businesses, and owning Berkshire is highly advisable. S&P Index and Berkshire are the only things I've invested in over the past few years, other than real estate, which has excellent tax benefits.
MountainWestPipeSmoker
Chicken
Plenty of good advice here. A few thoughts:
My advice for young men, in short form:
- Get really good at something other people care about. Put in the time and effort to get good while you're young, and you can ride on that for a long while. At this point, I'd consider the physical trades - construction, plumbing, electrician, etc. Many of those have training routes that don't involve going deeply into debt to spend four years at a college that's convinced that you, personally, are responsible for everything they can come up with they think is bad. On the job training and a solid path up through the ranks while you're getting paid to build stuff with your hands isn't a half bad option. Recognize that you can't do the same things at 40 that you can do at 20, and be sure to plan for that - you don't want to still be framing or slinging drywall at age 40. That sucks.
- Figure out what "Enough" looks like to you, and then live by it. If you're driving a beater at age 20, that's totally fine. If you're still driving a junkyard pull at age 35... well... that's a style choice by then, hopefully. But once you've got an acceptable vehicle, an acceptable computer, an acceptable house... just stick with them. Don't get sucked in by the nonsensical upgrade treadmills that want you paying, paying, paying, always paying. Always monthly payments. Always trapped.
- Look for the hacks. There are certain career fields where "having a nice car" is, if not a hard requirement, a useful thing to look the part and get ahead. A 2020 BMW is damned expensive to lease. A 2010 BMW is getting old for that world. A 2000 BMW just makes you look poor. And a 1980s BMW, with a clean body, well maintained and in good shape, is back to "Cool." You obviously have to maintain it, but it's going to be a lot cheaper than the lease payments on a new one, and, honestly, a lot more fun to drive in the process. You're also unlikely to find yourself driving groups to lunch terribly often. Bonus for autocross markings if you've actually autocrossed it.
- Give. Generously. Not because you're going to get (that's the prosperity gospel heresy), but because you've been given. We love because He first loved us. We give because He first gave to us. Etc.
Plenty above has been said, most of it sane, but one really key point is that if you're going to get married, you want to marry someone who can squeeze a quarter and find three dimes. No man can make so much money that his wife can't spend it twice over. I've said for years (and stand by it) that we spend less as a family than I did single, because my wife is that good at saving money on the things we use.
I'll disagree pretty strongly with "Buy the biggest house you think you can afford," though. Big houses are expensive in time and money, not just to purchase, but to maintain. Get something smaller, and "enough" - and then keep it in good shape. Live in it, love it, make it yours - don't treat it as just a bank account you can cash out for more toys.
Just avoid the upgrade treadmill. You don't need the latest and greatest, unless that thing is making you money directly, and you're resource limited on what you have. That's the consumer trap that gets far, far too many people financially hosed.
Be careful if you go this route. Have a backup plan. YouTube, Spotify, etc, are not your friend. They will host your stuff and pay you for a while, but if there's any sort of controversy that could make them look bad, they'll drop you like a hot potato and keep you from accessing your content. It was a good idea 5+ years ago, but today, a Christian man on YouTube should have plenty of backup options. Ideally, your own hosting such that you can put your content on YouTube, but it's a feed to the site you run (ideally on your own hardware). Assume that YouTube will pull you at the worst possible point, and plan for that. If you've got a plan to ride through that, great. If not, you may find yourself in a world of hurt if that's money you're relying on.
There are plenty of paths to "not wanting for anything" - the easiest and most widely accessible of which is simply to contain your wants.
My advice for young men, in short form:
- Get really good at something other people care about. Put in the time and effort to get good while you're young, and you can ride on that for a long while. At this point, I'd consider the physical trades - construction, plumbing, electrician, etc. Many of those have training routes that don't involve going deeply into debt to spend four years at a college that's convinced that you, personally, are responsible for everything they can come up with they think is bad. On the job training and a solid path up through the ranks while you're getting paid to build stuff with your hands isn't a half bad option. Recognize that you can't do the same things at 40 that you can do at 20, and be sure to plan for that - you don't want to still be framing or slinging drywall at age 40. That sucks.
- Figure out what "Enough" looks like to you, and then live by it. If you're driving a beater at age 20, that's totally fine. If you're still driving a junkyard pull at age 35... well... that's a style choice by then, hopefully. But once you've got an acceptable vehicle, an acceptable computer, an acceptable house... just stick with them. Don't get sucked in by the nonsensical upgrade treadmills that want you paying, paying, paying, always paying. Always monthly payments. Always trapped.
- Look for the hacks. There are certain career fields where "having a nice car" is, if not a hard requirement, a useful thing to look the part and get ahead. A 2020 BMW is damned expensive to lease. A 2010 BMW is getting old for that world. A 2000 BMW just makes you look poor. And a 1980s BMW, with a clean body, well maintained and in good shape, is back to "Cool." You obviously have to maintain it, but it's going to be a lot cheaper than the lease payments on a new one, and, honestly, a lot more fun to drive in the process. You're also unlikely to find yourself driving groups to lunch terribly often. Bonus for autocross markings if you've actually autocrossed it.
- Give. Generously. Not because you're going to get (that's the prosperity gospel heresy), but because you've been given. We love because He first loved us. We give because He first gave to us. Etc.
Plenty above has been said, most of it sane, but one really key point is that if you're going to get married, you want to marry someone who can squeeze a quarter and find three dimes. No man can make so much money that his wife can't spend it twice over. I've said for years (and stand by it) that we spend less as a family than I did single, because my wife is that good at saving money on the things we use.
I'll disagree pretty strongly with "Buy the biggest house you think you can afford," though. Big houses are expensive in time and money, not just to purchase, but to maintain. Get something smaller, and "enough" - and then keep it in good shape. Live in it, love it, make it yours - don't treat it as just a bank account you can cash out for more toys.
Just avoid the upgrade treadmill. You don't need the latest and greatest, unless that thing is making you money directly, and you're resource limited on what you have. That's the consumer trap that gets far, far too many people financially hosed.