Mormonism...

This is me, belchmech. Currently sequestered back home given that COVID caused all the job corps to send their students back home to wait it out. Once I go back though (this would be in Utah) there is something I need to consider. Having lived in Utah for nearly a year thanks to job corp I discovered I liked it, better then home actually. So I'm planning to relocate there but this brings up Mormonism...to join or not to join?

I know that historically and theologically Mormonism is shaky at best but I cant deny the fruits of their efforts. What was once considered uninhabitable is now hospitable and a genuine pleasure to live in. It just seems that to have a family in America at this point your either import or join what is essentially a nature preserve/time bubble. Mormonism seems to be one of those bubbles.

Thoughts guys?
 

buja

Woodpecker
Speaking from a lifetime of experience...

It is a big, big commitment to Heavenly Father and to the Savior that should not be taken lightly.
It takes a lot of time and effort and frustration sometimes but it is worth it.

As far as starting a family, you need to do just as much due diligence as you would for any woman.

My brother married a former missionary, virgin, etc. everything fine on paper...but he ignored many red flags. A proper evaluation of her family dynamics would have helped.

He had to divorce her for his sanity (she was extremely emotionally abusive and psychotic) and doesn't get to see his son as much as he should.

Two friends of mine got frivorced really bad.

I suppose your odds are higher in The Church than out for a successful family life overall.

The Gospel is wonderful and well worth the sacrifice.

PM if you'd like...
 
Mormonism is a theological monstrosity and completely untenable. Its adherents cannot hold themselves together in a theological debate, because learning mormonism means learning a lot of double-think. The apparent fruits are indeed tempting. It may not be a great idea to chase after something rotten just because one of its byproducts seem sweet. The ultimate goal of faith is not to have a nice society. It's theosis, nothing less. Mormonism does not even offer theosis.
 
Mormons go beyond theosis, in that they believe, "As man now is, God once was, as God is, many may become." We view God as wanting his children to literally become like him.

Regarding Mormon marriage...


8 weird Mormon beliefs...

 

911

Peacock
Gold Member
Becoming gods is a recurring belief and a staple of satanism.

Another darker aspect of basic mormon theology is the layers of temple secrecy accessible only to higher-level practitioners, which is a masonic trait. Joseph Smith was a freemason; occult, masonic inspired rituals pervade masonic temple worship.

To an outsider, the mormon faith is a combination of heretical beliefs combined with good Christian living.
 

infowarrior1

Hummingbird
Becoming gods is a recurring belief and a staple of satanism.

Another darker aspect of basic mormon theology is the layers of temple secrecy accessible only to higher-level practitioners, which is a masonic trait. Joseph Smith was a freemason; occult, masonic inspired rituals pervade masonic temple worship.

To an outsider, the mormon faith is a combination of heretical beliefs combined with good Christian living.
Theosis is real. But it doesn't involve ever taking on the essence of Godhood itself. There has never been a case nor can ever be a case of the finite becoming infinite. The Gap between Created and Creator is too large.

We do share in the Divine Nature in regards to Government(Revelation 3:21),Immortality and Glory.

The only thing that may not necessarily be shared by God except for only the Son is Perfection of the Body. But that is de facto assumed.

We are prisms but can never be sources of light ourselves.
 
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Max Roscoe

Kingfisher
I don't think you will find much positive here about Mormonism, though I greatly admire their way of life, family structure, and cohesiveness. I believe they are caving on homosexuality, which is not surprising as they previously caved on plural marriage, which was a sacrament to them.

I visited a Mormon service during a religious series on ROK and the funniest thing was that as a visitor, no one attempted to convert me or really even greet me. They travel all around the world doing year long missions hoping just one person might listen to them just once in their life but when I came to their church they didn't seem to notice or care :squintlol:

I had a Mormon boss as a teenager when I worked at the airport, and he was the best boss I ever had (only good one, really). Cared for everyone working there, wanted us all to succeed, gave us advise on things most people wouldn't. I remember he told me I needed to engage more with the other workers to make us feel like more of a team, and that was excellent advice as the guys were mostly older and I was just there to punch my time card and go home, but I opened up and we became a much better team. It stood out because it's not the kind of think I would have ever realized on my own, and most bosses would just say oh that guy is aloof or not a team player instead of pulling you aside and giving you a few helpful words.

Mormons have no vices, and one would do well to mimic their behaviors and habits. Family game night may seem cheesy but that is the kind of life I would want with a simple wife. As my favorite pastor always said, Take the good with you, and leave the rest behind. That has become a guiding principle in my life.
 

infowarrior1

Hummingbird
I don't think you will find much positive here about Mormonism, though I greatly admire their way of life, family structure, and cohesiveness. I believe they are caving on homosexuality, which is not surprising as they previously caved on plural marriage, which was a sacrament to them.

I visited a Mormon service during a religious series on ROK and the funniest thing was that as a visitor, no one attempted to convert me or really even greet me. They travel all around the world doing year long missions hoping just one person might listen to them just once in their life but when I came to their church they didn't seem to notice or care :squintlol:

I had a Mormon boss as a teenager when I worked at the airport, and he was the best boss I ever had (only good one, really). Cared for everyone working there, wanted us all to succeed, gave us advise on things most people wouldn't. I remember he told me I needed to engage more with the other workers to make us feel like more of a team, and that was excellent advice as the guys were mostly older and I was just there to punch my time card and go home, but I opened up and we became a much better team. It stood out because it's not the kind of think I would have ever realized on my own, and most bosses would just say oh that guy is aloof or not a team player instead of pulling you aside and giving you a few helpful words.

Mormons have no vices, and one would do well to mimic their behaviors and habits. Family game night may seem cheesy but that is the kind of life I would want with a simple wife. As my favorite pastor always said, Take the good with you, and leave the rest behind. That has become a guiding principle in my life.
Probably more upstanding in Public Life. But behind closed doors maybe not so much.
 
I don't think you will find much positive here about Mormonism, though I greatly admire their way of life, family structure, and cohesiveness. I believe they are caving on homosexuality, which is not surprising as they previously caved on plural marriage, which was a sacrament to them.

I visited a Mormon service during a religious series on ROK and the funniest thing was that as a visitor, no one attempted to convert me or really even greet me. They travel all around the world doing year long missions hoping just one person might listen to them just once in their life but when I came to their church they didn't seem to notice or care :squintlol:

I had a Mormon boss as a teenager when I worked at the airport, and he was the best boss I ever had (only good one, really). Cared for everyone working there, wanted us all to succeed, gave us advise on things most people wouldn't. I remember he told me I needed to engage more with the other workers to make us feel like more of a team, and that was excellent advice as the guys were mostly older and I was just there to punch my time card and go home, but I opened up and we became a much better team. It stood out because it's not the kind of think I would have ever realized on my own, and most bosses would just say oh that guy is aloof or not a team player instead of pulling you aside and giving you a few helpful words.

Mormons have no vices, and one would do well to mimic their behaviors and habits. Family game night may seem cheesy but that is the kind of life I would want with a simple wife. As my favorite pastor always said, Take the good with you, and leave the rest behind. That has become a guiding principle in my life.
As individuals, Mormons sure do have vices! Lol But I understand what you mean.

About a decade ago, a Mormon church apostle unofficially attended a local congregation in Utah. No one greeted him and he was essentially ignored. But upon being recognized, the bishopric/local leaders fawned over him, and had him sit up front with them. Later, in a big gathering Mormons call General Conference, he spoke out about the experience. He mentioned saying to the bishop of the congregation, "fortunately you only had an apostle visiting, and as far was you know, not a curious non-member who wanted to learn about the church, and who should have been treated warmly!"

Family game night/family home evening is a cool Mormon practice. You start and end with a prayer, sing a hymn, have a short spiritual message, and have snacks, during it or at the end. I came from a pretty troubled family background, but I have fond memories of it. With my own new blended family, I want to start one. Currently we do a monthly home movie night, but that is passive by nature.

I just ordered a bunch of fun card and board games, which I think my stepkids will like. The local version of Amazon had some tempting prices, and so it is my $100 experiment. I used to go to boardgame conventions back home in America, and I want to share my enthusiasm, as I try to create stronger family bonds.
 
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Mormons are very disproportionately employed in the CIA, FBI, and NSA.
This is true. Also, many Mormons serve in the military, as officers.

A Mormon apostle, Neal Maxwell, who is dead now, spoke about how as a young WW2 veteran, he got a job with the new CIA, as the person who received and collated incoming reports from agents, out in the field. He was utterly shocked at the horrific deeds being done in the name of America! Maxwell reached a point where he could no longer tolerate it, and so he quit. During his tenure, the CIA was discouraged by church leaders from recruiting on church university campuses, due to a concern about church members having to deeply compromise their values, to work for them. But Neal Maxwell died of cancer, and times have changed. Intelligence agencies drool at the prospect of having clean living former Mormon missionaries who are fluent in foreign languages and deeply knowledgeable about other cultures, working for them. I suspect former Mormon missionaries, from England, Australia, etc., get similar treatment, from their governments, after they return home from overseas missions.

Though they are not perfect, I respect the FBI. I have known a few Mormon FBI agents over the years, who seemed to be upstanding men. They tried to carry on the "Untouchables" persona. On the other hand, I've known a few ex employees of the NSA and CIA, who seemed to have been used and discarded, like old condoms, by their agencies. Spycraft tends to be an ugly business.
 
I don't want to shit on mormons. I don't want to talk about how bad certain
mormons can be. I'm just talking from a theological perspective. The quote
you gave, “as man now is, God once was, as God is, many may become”, is
an example of what I'm talking about. This isn't theosis, it's apotheosis.
And y'all even extend the apotheosis to God himself, saying that God was just a
created being who elevated himself to deity. Theosis is a drastically
different concept. Theosis means that God condescended from the throne of
heaven all the way down to the earth, and even further down into the heart of
the earth, all so that he could bring us back to heaven with him. See the
difference? Apotheosis is about making yourself into a god. Theosis is about
love and communion between God and creation. Satanists are into apotheosis,
but Christians are into theosis. I'm sorry, I don't mean to be insulting, the
theology just really really sucks.
 
I don't want to shit on mormons. I don't want to talk about how bad certain
mormons can be. I'm just talking from a theological perspective. The quote
you gave, “as man now is, God once was, as God is, many may become”, is
an example of what I'm talking about. This isn't theosis, it's apotheosis.
And y'all even extend the apotheosis to God himself, saying that God was just a
created being who elevated himself to deity. Theosis is a drastically
different concept. Theosis means that God condescended from the throne of
heaven all the way down to the earth, and even further down into the heart of
the earth, all so that he could bring us back to heaven with him. See the
difference? Apotheosis is about making yourself into a god. Theosis is about
love and communion between God and creation. Satanists are into apotheosis,
but Christians are into theosis. I'm sorry, I don't mean to be insulting, the
theology just really really sucks.
I realize to someone with a mainstream Christian theological background, this Mormon doctrine does seem shocking and heretical. But from the Mormon perspective (I am just trying to show how Mormons view it), it is all about becoming a loving parent in this life, and then a loving parent/god in the next. It is not about being mad with power and ego.

From my own perspective, I always found the idea kind of exhausting and overwhelming. And I have played so-called "god games" on my pc, where I get impatient or angry with my digital people, who annoy me in some way, and so I end up punishing them with earthquakes or plagues, but then feel bad about it.
 
The reason one should follow a religion is that it's true. Mormonism and Joseph Smith do not hold up to scrutiny ("reformed Egyptian" comes to mind).
Mainstream Christianity gets hammered too, by the academics, skeptics and atheists. Mormonism has not been around for near as long, and so can be much better examined up close and found wanting.

Truth comes in different forms.
 

PillBoxer

Pigeon
I lived up in Mormon Country during my young years. It's an amazing contrast that they live and create an safe and (visually) Christian society but believe the oddest stuff. If other religions could achieve even half the nurturing atmospheres that the mormons do, they might actually make people believe in God again.

But the beliefs are just way too much for a logical person to accept. You keep feeling like the other shoe is going to drop and they're going to turn on outsiders.
 
I lived up in Mormon Country during my young years. It's an amazing contrast that they live and create an safe and (visually) Christian society but believe the oddest stuff. If other religions could achieve even half the nurturing atmospheres that the mormons do, they might actually make people believe in God again.

But the beliefs are just way too much for a logical person to accept. You keep feeling like the other shoe is going to drop and they're going to turn on outsiders.
In the Mormon subculture, Utah is viewed by some as "Zion," while everywhere else is the "mission field." Utah Mormons tend to have a talent for seriously annoying non-Utah Mormons, due to this attitude! Lol Senior church leaders have said this perspective needs to stop, but it continues, at least to an extent.
 

Athanasius

Kingfisher
I have the same key issue with Mormonism as I do with Islam. It claims to be another revelation but accepts that the Bible is God's word too (the KJV is in the quad of inspired LDS books). However, the Bible contradicts Mormonism at every turn. That's even before you get to the false history, conflicting visions, the Egyptian funerary document, and Smith's actions which have been chronicled for years by people like Sandra Tanner (Brigham Young was her ancestor), Jason Wallace, Bill McKeever, James White, and a host of others.
 
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