Try it when you're 50+, come back and let us know how much you enjoy the other 5 hours of your life you're not sleeping.Tornado said:
Need help picking between government and private sector job.
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Aliblahba said:
Your money and I assume your mission decisions came from the gubmint, just through a contractor. You were a temp. Your pride is misplaced.
When applying to guv jobs they're only interested in duties and responsibilities. So if you were an armorer they want know how many small arms you had under your belt. It doesn't matter that you were in a non-deployment unit and they were only used once a year at rifle quals.
In the private your resume needs to curtail # of work orders opened, turnaround time on repairs, a low % deadline report, awards given for going above an beyond, ect.
The guv works off a budget, private sector doesn't. A friend of mine turned down a guv telecom job way back, but his coworker did. The latter ended up working 1/3 less (literally), but the difference was in retirement. My friend had better upward mobility and worked into a 2 level management position. He retired out with significant buyout/pension. The guv guy left after 30 with a meager pension, and had to work after retirement. He also struggled having to go back into the private sector and put up profitable numbers, instead drinking coffee and reading the paper all day.
Personally I like to work and be productive, and hate having to throttle down on the job site. It makes you lethargic and prone to accidents. In the private sector you get rewarded for hard work, which makes them money. The guv get a budget every year. Big difference.
In the private your resume needs to curtail # of work orders opened, turnaround time on repairs, a low % deadline report, awards given for going above an beyond, ect.
The guv works off a budget, private sector doesn't. A friend of mine turned down a guv telecom job way back, but his coworker did. The latter ended up working 1/3 less (literally), but the difference was in retirement. My friend had better upward mobility and worked into a 2 level management position. He retired out with significant buyout/pension. The guv guy left after 30 with a meager pension, and had to work after retirement. He also struggled having to go back into the private sector and put up profitable numbers, instead drinking coffee and reading the paper all day.
Personally I like to work and be productive, and hate having to throttle down on the job site. It makes you lethargic and prone to accidents. In the private sector you get rewarded for hard work, which makes them money. The guv get a budget every year. Big difference.
It's interesting to hear that people think the connections from a government job will serve you better in the future. Normally you'd think it'd be the connections and skills you learn from being in the actual market (private sector) that would be valuable for starting a business. But I guess in modern kleptocracies like the USA, UK, China, India, Russia and increasingly much of the rest of the world a rolodex full of the shot callers in the bloated government sectors is very valuable. That said for every ex government worker in a plush consulting role or running an overpaid contracting business, I bet there is many more successful business people who came up through the private sector.
OP I'd choose private sector, with government sector, despite all its perks and promises, you'd need at least 20 years of tenure and some serious office politics to reach the top positions that allow you to enter the world of cronyism and revolving doors. Whereas in private sector it's more down to your acumen and drive. And above all, in private sector you're less likely to be surrounded by quota filling special snowflakes that will drag you down and instead will be around similarly driven individuals. Choice is simple.
OP I'd choose private sector, with government sector, despite all its perks and promises, you'd need at least 20 years of tenure and some serious office politics to reach the top positions that allow you to enter the world of cronyism and revolving doors. Whereas in private sector it's more down to your acumen and drive. And above all, in private sector you're less likely to be surrounded by quota filling special snowflakes that will drag you down and instead will be around similarly driven individuals. Choice is simple.
Aliblahba said:
It's true that if you are good at making money and fit into a preconceived role that people think of as "good worker" private sector can see you make a lot more money.
I've always been an obvious eccentric, book smart only, and gubmint work let me build up cred indirectly with degrees and licenses, such that they had no choice but to hire me. they could think I'm weird, but they need my license and can't fire me. I would have been treated worse in the private sector where my oddness would have been seen as icky--not one of the cool kids....
Aggressive guys with good sales skills will find them wasted in gubmint where procedure is central.
Why not do a combination of both and do government contracting?
You get the money (probably more) by not being totally government but get the job-security because you do all of their work. Is their an equivalent of government contracting supporting the INTEL agencies that require high-level clearances?
Yeah, you would have to give up freedoms like traveling to certain places without approval but the money would be damn good. I support the "No Such Agency" and the only drawback is that I would have to jump through hoops in order to travel to Columbia...which I why I goto Panama and Costa Rica...to at least get a shot at some Colombian chicks.
You get the money (probably more) by not being totally government but get the job-security because you do all of their work. Is their an equivalent of government contracting supporting the INTEL agencies that require high-level clearances?
Yeah, you would have to give up freedoms like traveling to certain places without approval but the money would be damn good. I support the "No Such Agency" and the only drawback is that I would have to jump through hoops in order to travel to Columbia...which I why I goto Panama and Costa Rica...to at least get a shot at some Colombian chicks.
I honestly find it puzzling the degree of pragmatism so called 'red pill' people have. On the one hand you whine about how government has made feminism destroy women, on the other hand you are readily willing to join the very institutions which have made this mess in the first place. I believe it is called hypocrisy and none better at all than any hamster spinning woman. No government when it suits you, big government when it suits you.
Be a man and make your money in the free market. Haven't you even considered the moral aspects of being paid to slack off on the taxpayer dole?
Besides, government is only going to get smaller, fixed pensions and benefits for new employees will not be there, since they are simply not economically viable.
Make money in the private market, learn as much as you can, open your own business abroad, don't pay tax, move in with your money in 10-15 years when western countries are bankrupt.
Be a man and make your money in the free market. Haven't you even considered the moral aspects of being paid to slack off on the taxpayer dole?
Besides, government is only going to get smaller, fixed pensions and benefits for new employees will not be there, since they are simply not economically viable.
Make money in the private market, learn as much as you can, open your own business abroad, don't pay tax, move in with your money in 10-15 years when western countries are bankrupt.
scandibro said:
I'll start to "be a man" when you stop being naive enough to believe in a "free market" in a kleptocracy.
If you grew up in Denmark, where your profile says you are, you already massively benefitted from a heavily taxed, socialistic government system ( which I advocate) and your opinions are bizarrely disconnected from your situation.
iknowexactly said:
Benefitted?
Don't get me started. I despise the socialist policies in Denmark.
People have no idea about the realities of socialist Scandinavia. The scandinavian wealth was created way before the welfare state model. In the 50s Denmark had lower tax rates than the US and some of the lowest taxes in Europe.
Since the late 60s the comparative wealth of Denmark has only declined from top 5 gdp/capita to low twenties.
Despite the biggest government sector in the world, Denmark is only 18th on the recent list of quality of life for elderly citizens. 400.000 danish citizens out of 5 million in total are on anti-depressant drugs. Cancer treatment is way below US standards. The survival rate for prostate cancer is 30% less than the US. Waiting times at hospitals in emergency rooms are often 8-12 hours with no food and drink provided. House break ins are in the top in Europe because police doesn't investigate due to spending their time writing out tickets for minor offences to fill the state coffers. Everything is massively taxed, cars have up to 250% tax, all VAT tax is 25% even on food. Cigarettes, chocolate, alchohol is massively taxed. 90% of your electricity bill is made up of taxes. Immigrant muslim ghettos are rampant where crime rates and radical islamism is massive. Legions of people telling you what to do and what not to do. Rampant feminism and favorable laws for women, laws against fathers and men. Indoctrination at all levels of the education system.
But sure, I know all of this doesn't matter for the socialist who is so scared of failing on the free market that he or she is willing to accept just about no freedom as long as there is (perceived) security.
I've left Denmark and I am not coming back until the country has bankrupted itself or cut tax rates in half. One of which WILL happen becuase of simple economics.
Btw, I grew up in a leftist household, even voted far left twice, until I figured out what socialism is actually about when you put emotion aside.
JayMillz
Hummingbird
Tornado said:
Although you are asking for advice, I won't try to pontificate to you and don't have a predisposition one way or the other, having worked solely in the private sector my entire professional career. I commend you though for the analysis you are doing and wish you luck with whatever choice you make. In this economy, it's good to hear about folks that have options like you do.
scandibro said:
Ummm....
I never claimed "red pill" or "alpha". What I DO claim is adapting to the set of rules and options within your nation getting the best net results while minimizing risk. I don't know about Denmark, but here in the USA, they pay contractors a pretty nice amount to do government workers "dirty work". In many cases, government contractors are paid much more for the same job done in the private sector (with the extra coming from holding certain clearances).
Yes, it would be nice to make all of your income in the free market BUT with a country as big as the USA, there are 200 million others trying to do the same thing.
The USA is also a "bottom-line" type of nation, so folks don't really look at HOW you found a way or niche to make money, they just see the net result.
scandibro said:
Red pill and morality have nothing to do with each other. Some would argue pumping and dumping women to be in the grey area of the morality index(I am not one of them). As for manning up, what is possibly more manly than power? Politicians are at the top of the pecking order. There is a reason they are hated so much, its called jealousy. I am not a government employee but I would take up a good position in a heart beat for a very capitalist reason: greed.
Magyarphile said:
I don't know man, I work in a field which is ripe with opportunity for those willing to compromise their morals (affiliate marketing). I could have made a lot more money if I sold these bs 'trial' fraud products which steal money out of innocent peoples bank account. I might even have been able to forget about it for some time, but I believe it will do the damage and eventually you will be 'pot committed' to it and begin rationalizing something you know is wrong and that is when you become a real douchebag.
So yeah, the money may be good in the government, the power may be there, but you're doing the wrong thing and it will turn you bad.
Ethics is what I'm getting at. I can't do things which directly conflict with my ethics.
kenny_powers
Kingfisher
Tornado said:
You are in the DC area? 5 k is not enough of a pay gap to justify even an extra 5 hours work per week. Life is too short for that noise.
My advice, go Gov. for 1-2 years make some connections and work on some good projects. When you are ready to make more money in say 18-36 months out reach out to private sector for much more than the 5k.
I agree with the others saying it's partly a personality fit. I've had experience on both sides, and have friends who've done it -- sometimes going from government to private contractor on exactly the same project.
If you don't like bureaucracy, skip the gov't job. For example, you may find that $100 to upgrade your computer with more memory/whatever will massively improve your productivity. That may take months in the government for procurement, but in private industry, just go out and buy it and submit the receipt.
As for job security, if you're in a field that in general is in high demand (sounds like you are), then that's probably not an issue. It would be different if you had some obscure skill where there are limited opportunities. I had a friend working in gov't and in a very narrow field -- they'd get people with PhDs applying for _internships_ because there were so few jobs in the field.
Gov't will give you a bit more free time since you only work the clock. Many people do compressed workweek, so 9 hours/day and every 2nd Friday is off because you put in the extra hour the previous 8 days (the alternating Friday is an 8-hour day). When the clock strikes 5 or whatever, if the work isn't done, that's fine. Shut down, and resume tomorrow.
Private industry is more flexible, and I think works better for people who like no hassles and really getting things done.
If you don't like bureaucracy, skip the gov't job. For example, you may find that $100 to upgrade your computer with more memory/whatever will massively improve your productivity. That may take months in the government for procurement, but in private industry, just go out and buy it and submit the receipt.
As for job security, if you're in a field that in general is in high demand (sounds like you are), then that's probably not an issue. It would be different if you had some obscure skill where there are limited opportunities. I had a friend working in gov't and in a very narrow field -- they'd get people with PhDs applying for _internships_ because there were so few jobs in the field.
Gov't will give you a bit more free time since you only work the clock. Many people do compressed workweek, so 9 hours/day and every 2nd Friday is off because you put in the extra hour the previous 8 days (the alternating Friday is an 8-hour day). When the clock strikes 5 or whatever, if the work isn't done, that's fine. Shut down, and resume tomorrow.
Private industry is more flexible, and I think works better for people who like no hassles and really getting things done.
Tornado said:
A lot of people have taken this to a conversation about what career is better, but this was about a job. Sometimes a government job is a shitty place to be, but a good place to be from. Sometimes it is exactly the opposite. You have to evaluate your particular situation as you go.
greensteelhead
Robin
Good luck, mate. Just remember : the lessons learned about men, women , feminists , white knights, manginas and all the other quirks of human nature here will serve you well. Have no fear: 90% of the world does not have Manosphere knowledge and will fail. Control the frame, develop yourself, run a work game (not to fuck but to be interesting and in control), and you will always go far in your career.
scandibro said:
It doesn't matter what you say you "despise", the taxpayers of Denmark spent a fuckload on your education and health care and on a highly developed safe environment. You can be ungrateful if you want, your opinion doesn't change the economic facts. Money talks, bullshit walks.
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