This guy is a moron! He should be railing against Somalis and Pakistanis, not Eastern Europeans.
Nigel Farage: "immigrants from India and Australia better than eastern Europeans"
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RE: Nigel Farage: "immigrants from India and Australia better than eastern Europe...
His reason d'être is having an anti-eu stance.
For the average voter, "their" working class job is more likely to be filled by an Eastern European than a Somali/Pakistani.
Also, as they are white too it makes it harder for the media to pin the "racist" tag on him.
Handsome Creepy Eel said:
His reason d'être is having an anti-eu stance.
For the average voter, "their" working class job is more likely to be filled by an Eastern European than a Somali/Pakistani.
Also, as they are white too it makes it harder for the media to pin the "racist" tag on him.
RE: Nigel Farage: "immigrants from India and Australia better than eastern Europe...
Farage has to do better on immigration policy if he wants my vote.
UNLIMITED immigration for slim, attractive, single women.
- A panel of men will assess their photos, which will be as tightly regulated as passports, no duckface or myspace angles to hide fatness.
- BMI limits apply, with regular health checks providing advice on nutrition and portion control for those who slip.
Farage has to do better on immigration policy if he wants my vote.
UNLIMITED immigration for slim, attractive, single women.
- A panel of men will assess their photos, which will be as tightly regulated as passports, no duckface or myspace angles to hide fatness.
- BMI limits apply, with regular health checks providing advice on nutrition and portion control for those who slip.
"(Today 02:11 AM) Handsome Creepy Eel [69]
This guy is a moron! He should be railing against Somalis and Pakistanis, not Eastern Europeans."
Farage is railing against these groups but in a very clever way. The UKIP points based immigration policy will only let in a maximum of 50,000 per year and according to the quality of worker/ professional that the UK requires at the time. Thus unskilled, non English speaking Somalis and Pakistanis would not be allowed in. But qualified, skilled, useful people from Australia, Canada, India etc will get in. And only up to 50,000 per year. Far better than 400,000- 500,000 gross per annum the UK has suffered under since the Bliar government.
This is not about race, this is about smaller numbers and higher quality. England is already one of the most crowded countries in the world. This situation is simply unsustainable.
And yes , Hindu, Sikh and Christian Indians have been coming to the UK in modest numbers for decades, integrating and doing very well. It's the uncontrollable EU migration , the illegal immigration and "assylum" across open EU borders that is the real problem.
This guy is a moron! He should be railing against Somalis and Pakistanis, not Eastern Europeans."
Farage is railing against these groups but in a very clever way. The UKIP points based immigration policy will only let in a maximum of 50,000 per year and according to the quality of worker/ professional that the UK requires at the time. Thus unskilled, non English speaking Somalis and Pakistanis would not be allowed in. But qualified, skilled, useful people from Australia, Canada, India etc will get in. And only up to 50,000 per year. Far better than 400,000- 500,000 gross per annum the UK has suffered under since the Bliar government.
This is not about race, this is about smaller numbers and higher quality. England is already one of the most crowded countries in the world. This situation is simply unsustainable.
And yes , Hindu, Sikh and Christian Indians have been coming to the UK in modest numbers for decades, integrating and doing very well. It's the uncontrollable EU migration , the illegal immigration and "assylum" across open EU borders that is the real problem.
RE: Nigel Farage: "immigrants from India and Australia better than eastern Europe...
Exactly.
I dont understand the hate for India and Indians either, anyone who's lived here can see that people from India have integrated well in our society and in many other societies in the world. While 28,000 romanians have been arrested in the last 5 years here. 92% of atm robberies in london have been from Romanian street gangs. I think comparing hotness of women is ridiculous, especially as its mostly men that immigrate.
I don't think anyone's suggesting we should have an open door to India like we do to eastern europe either.
Anyway, you could have posted this in the UK elections thread, rather than starting a thread trying to imply that "someone is a racist, what do you all think about that?" after it seems many here don't want to talk about issues like that at all.
Guitarman said:
Exactly.
I dont understand the hate for India and Indians either, anyone who's lived here can see that people from India have integrated well in our society and in many other societies in the world. While 28,000 romanians have been arrested in the last 5 years here. 92% of atm robberies in london have been from Romanian street gangs. I think comparing hotness of women is ridiculous, especially as its mostly men that immigrate.
I don't think anyone's suggesting we should have an open door to India like we do to eastern europe either.
Anyway, you could have posted this in the UK elections thread, rather than starting a thread trying to imply that "someone is a racist, what do you all think about that?" after it seems many here don't want to talk about issues like that at all.
What UKIP have very cleverly done is to address a huge and very serious issue in the UK over the last 18 years that desperately needs to be addressed ( excessive uncontrolled immigration) and done it in a very intelligent ( I.e. Non racist) manner.
That is why all the establishment parties and media are doing their very best to smear and undermine Nigel and UKIP. Good luck to them on 7th May!
That is why all the establishment parties and media are doing their very best to smear and undermine Nigel and UKIP. Good luck to them on 7th May!
RE: Nigel Farage: "immigrants from India and Australia better than eastern Europe...
Last time I checked Indian immigrants in Canada quickly ticket up to the top income brackets in not even two generations, while Nigerians have the highest percentage ofbasvanced educated (Masters, Doctorate, etc) then any other group. Yeah with Nigerians you run the risk LD getting some dude who will scam ATMs, or with Indians a tear indusing IRT, but the majority bust balls and get unto the top bracket quickly, far more then any people from FSU IMO.
Immigration is also ROI for the UK. It essentially enables them to borrow more debt and regardless what people think, nationals akak are true "Britt" get far more freebies and goodies then a newcomer. Newcomers essentially enable the ability of debt and to subsidize laboir.
My cousins come here and are forced to fry chicken with only half the access to social programs then me as a full Canadian. He has advanced degrees in Education and Psychology but Canada won't recognize them even though he was put through a nearly copy of the British schooling system. Yet he has to fry chicken and pay taxes while the Govt can boroow money off his head. Its all debt attaintment and labour suppression, they will always look how to get deals.
Fast Eddie said:
Last time I checked Indian immigrants in Canada quickly ticket up to the top income brackets in not even two generations, while Nigerians have the highest percentage ofbasvanced educated (Masters, Doctorate, etc) then any other group. Yeah with Nigerians you run the risk LD getting some dude who will scam ATMs, or with Indians a tear indusing IRT, but the majority bust balls and get unto the top bracket quickly, far more then any people from FSU IMO.
Immigration is also ROI for the UK. It essentially enables them to borrow more debt and regardless what people think, nationals akak are true "Britt" get far more freebies and goodies then a newcomer. Newcomers essentially enable the ability of debt and to subsidize laboir.
My cousins come here and are forced to fry chicken with only half the access to social programs then me as a full Canadian. He has advanced degrees in Education and Psychology but Canada won't recognize them even though he was put through a nearly copy of the British schooling system. Yet he has to fry chicken and pay taxes while the Govt can boroow money off his head. Its all debt attaintment and labour suppression, they will always look how to get deals.
Poland has one of the lowest birthrates in the world.
All the youth leaves for different countries, and the young females that stay are more career minded now due to Western influences.
What does this mean for the future of the Polish population? How will countries like Poland and Sweden survive if they don't change their mindset?
On top of more immigration than ever before, it's as if everything Europe has fought for the last few thousands of years is for nought.
All the youth leaves for different countries, and the young females that stay are more career minded now due to Western influences.
What does this mean for the future of the Polish population? How will countries like Poland and Sweden survive if they don't change their mindset?
On top of more immigration than ever before, it's as if everything Europe has fought for the last few thousands of years is for nought.
DickDastardly
Robin
delete
RE: Nigel Farage: "immigrants from India and Australia better than eastern Europe...
Yeah man, I agree with all that. I'm not trying to say that Indians make "bad" immigrants. It's a highly contextual topic, in which we're discussing what is the best source of immigration to the UK, specifically.
My stance is that for the long term, eastern Europeans are after all part of the whole "Judeo-Christian European" civilization. That doesn't make them any better or worse than Indians or any other group that isn't part of that civilization. But, in the context of the UK, the fact that Eastern Euros belong to that same cultural and ethnic paradigm has to be considered a plus in their favor.
Indians have their own ancient, deeply engrained culture that is very different from European culture. And they look different from Europeans. In a century (hell, far earlier) any Poles or Slovaks or whatever that settle in the UK will be indistinguishable from the native population. It's basically like mixing water with lemon flavored water. The resulting mixture will be homogenized and not that different from the original drink.
Indians on the other hand, no matter how successful or well integrated they become, will continue to form a population within a population. Like oil mixing with water. Whenever you have more than one distinct group of people occupying the same territory, there is bound to be friction over one thing or another. Indians will always bitch that they're not being 100% accepted into the wider society and the native Brits will moan about how 90% of medical school spots go to Indians. And on and on. It's inevitable. These kinds of problems would not arise with an Eastern European immigrant population that dissolves completely into the host society within a generation or two at most.
Now, if you were to ask me who makes better immigrants to Singapore, or to Madagascar? I'd probably say Indians. It's all context dependent, and I don't think it's any insult to Indians to say that people from one part of Europe make better immigrants to another part of Europe than do people from outside of Europe.
WalterBlack said:
Yeah man, I agree with all that. I'm not trying to say that Indians make "bad" immigrants. It's a highly contextual topic, in which we're discussing what is the best source of immigration to the UK, specifically.
My stance is that for the long term, eastern Europeans are after all part of the whole "Judeo-Christian European" civilization. That doesn't make them any better or worse than Indians or any other group that isn't part of that civilization. But, in the context of the UK, the fact that Eastern Euros belong to that same cultural and ethnic paradigm has to be considered a plus in their favor.
Indians have their own ancient, deeply engrained culture that is very different from European culture. And they look different from Europeans. In a century (hell, far earlier) any Poles or Slovaks or whatever that settle in the UK will be indistinguishable from the native population. It's basically like mixing water with lemon flavored water. The resulting mixture will be homogenized and not that different from the original drink.
Indians on the other hand, no matter how successful or well integrated they become, will continue to form a population within a population. Like oil mixing with water. Whenever you have more than one distinct group of people occupying the same territory, there is bound to be friction over one thing or another. Indians will always bitch that they're not being 100% accepted into the wider society and the native Brits will moan about how 90% of medical school spots go to Indians. And on and on. It's inevitable. These kinds of problems would not arise with an Eastern European immigrant population that dissolves completely into the host society within a generation or two at most.
Now, if you were to ask me who makes better immigrants to Singapore, or to Madagascar? I'd probably say Indians. It's all context dependent, and I don't think it's any insult to Indians to say that people from one part of Europe make better immigrants to another part of Europe than do people from outside of Europe.
WalterBlack
Ostrich
RE: Nigel Farage: "immigrants from India and Australia better than eastern Europe...
British people don’t identify with Europeans very much. The average British born and raised person doesn’t consider of any race doesn’t consider himself a “European”. To then “Europe” is the land on the other side of the English channel. The British identify more with the Anglosphere countries than mainland Europe. Just because somebody has the same skin tone doesn’t necessarily mean that they will assimilate better than other races. Japanese-Americans are very integrated into mainstream US culture.
Europeans don’t see themselves as the same race either – they seem themselves, as French, Italian, German etc. Grouping all of these multiple ethnicities together and calling them “White” is an American thing. Italians were not considered “white” when they first started coming to the US in big numbers 100 years ago.
Just 20 years ago neighbours of the same colour were killing each other eastern Europe, like Yugoslavia with Serbians vs Croats vs Bosnians.
So acceptance comes down to skin colour? One of my brother’s closest friends is a white Serbian guy who came to UK aged 12. When he arrived he was getting shit from the white British kids about his accent and he ended up hanging out with Indian kids. I didn’t see much European solidarity there.
I’ve never heard anybody bitch about being accepted into the wider society or medical school.
Immigrants (unless they are from a hyper religious/and or exclusionary culture e.g. Ultra-orthodox Jews, fundamentalist Muslims, the Amish) become more assimilated into host populations into time. I have nephews and who can barely speak Punjabi, where both sets of parents were born and raised in UK. Their future kids will probably only speak English.
How does an Indian fit in to Madagascar better than UK?
Fast Eddie said:
British people don’t identify with Europeans very much. The average British born and raised person doesn’t consider of any race doesn’t consider himself a “European”. To then “Europe” is the land on the other side of the English channel. The British identify more with the Anglosphere countries than mainland Europe. Just because somebody has the same skin tone doesn’t necessarily mean that they will assimilate better than other races. Japanese-Americans are very integrated into mainstream US culture.
Europeans don’t see themselves as the same race either – they seem themselves, as French, Italian, German etc. Grouping all of these multiple ethnicities together and calling them “White” is an American thing. Italians were not considered “white” when they first started coming to the US in big numbers 100 years ago.
Just 20 years ago neighbours of the same colour were killing each other eastern Europe, like Yugoslavia with Serbians vs Croats vs Bosnians.
Fast Eddie said:
So acceptance comes down to skin colour? One of my brother’s closest friends is a white Serbian guy who came to UK aged 12. When he arrived he was getting shit from the white British kids about his accent and he ended up hanging out with Indian kids. I didn’t see much European solidarity there.
Fast Eddie said:
I’ve never heard anybody bitch about being accepted into the wider society or medical school.
Immigrants (unless they are from a hyper religious/and or exclusionary culture e.g. Ultra-orthodox Jews, fundamentalist Muslims, the Amish) become more assimilated into host populations into time. I have nephews and who can barely speak Punjabi, where both sets of parents were born and raised in UK. Their future kids will probably only speak English.
Fast Eddie said:
How does an Indian fit in to Madagascar better than UK?
RE: Nigel Farage: "immigrants from India and Australia better than eastern Europe...
I didn't say that. I said that while I think there are some countries, like the UK, for which eastern European immigrants are a better fit than Indians, there are other countries, like Singapore and Madagascar to give random examples, for which Indian immigrants are probably a better fit than E. European immigrants.
Anyway, listen man, I think we've both presented our stances on this issue, on a high level. Playing rhetorical pong with ever longer walls of text isn't going to add much value at this point. We're just going to have to agree to disagree over the extent to which shared cultural and ethnic identity matters in selecting immigrants who are a "good fit."
Peace.
WalterBlack said:
I didn't say that. I said that while I think there are some countries, like the UK, for which eastern European immigrants are a better fit than Indians, there are other countries, like Singapore and Madagascar to give random examples, for which Indian immigrants are probably a better fit than E. European immigrants.
Anyway, listen man, I think we've both presented our stances on this issue, on a high level. Playing rhetorical pong with ever longer walls of text isn't going to add much value at this point. We're just going to have to agree to disagree over the extent to which shared cultural and ethnic identity matters in selecting immigrants who are a "good fit."
Peace.
Question: is it the case that EE immigrants don't fit in well in the UK? It seems to be implied by the guy they're quoting. I really don't know; I am american and the only EE person I'm close to is a first Generation-Polish American, but he's about as American as it gets.
RE: Nigel Farage: "immigrants from India and Australia better than eastern Europe...
They do fit in yeah.
The gripe is more economical; they're basically better at just about every entry level job than our lazy useless natives.
They have brought a fair amount of crime with them too and also exploit our benefits systems to the max (which is entirely our own fault for being so lax on our own people).
They do fit in yeah.
The gripe is more economical; they're basically better at just about every entry level job than our lazy useless natives.
They have brought a fair amount of crime with them too and also exploit our benefits systems to the max (which is entirely our own fault for being so lax on our own people).
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