Only God Can Find You A Good Wife

Blade Runner

Ostrich
Orthodox
I referred only to what the right roles are; what ought to be done.

Your or Mr. Jones's conclusions are related to the ebb and flow of society. While interesting, it is generally a different topic.
 
My life partner, a Filipina, was in a beautiful Catholic cathedral in Manilla, and prayed that she would find a good mate. And this particular cathedral is believed to be a special place for prayerful requests, where miracles have been granted. A few weeks later, she came across me online, a faraway American, and decided that I was the answer to her pleading to God. She started a friendship, and we slowly got to know each other, over the following few years. The rest is history as they say, and we are now together, and despite our struggles, happy. I now live in the Philippines.

This is a story we often remind each other of, as part of the foundation of our relationship. It is our story.
 

JavaLoco

Chicken
Good day. I'm a noob to this iteration of Roosh, though have followed his progression for a long time. Hat's off to you for your willingness to embrace new ideals.

I just read this post and I agree, in principal.

As a Christian who suffered through a difficult marriage for 20+ years, I found red pill through the likes of Dalrock. Drawing from that, I'd consider that one key element you missed is not only the rebellion of a man looking for a wife, but the culture of rebellion fostered in women in the church.

This has probably been discussed at length, but women are not taught to look up to or respect their husbands. They are taught that he is weak and that they are the spiritually superior ones.

How do you address that rebellion?
 
I recently read the Christian marriage guide, "Discovering the Mind of a Women," by Ken Nair. The book came out in 1995, and seemed somewhat dated to me, in that it kept on bringing up how men must be humble and submissive to their wives. I realize husbands can be serious jerks in various ways, but the author only lightly discussed how wives can be dysfunctional and nightmarish for their husbands, and what the men must do in those circumstances. I would be curious to knows if an updated version of the book had been released, within the last few years, in an attempt to address the current environment between the sexes.

I would recommend the guide, because the writer brings up many good points. But I had to really laugh, when at one point the author actually stated that *women have no sex drive!* Lol! Yep, he has the out of date and very false thinking that women just like sex for the hugs and kisses... All of them...

"In Discovering the Mind of Women husbands learn to understand their wives as Christ would. From this point they learn to respond to their wives in a consistent Christlike manner. A radically transformed and renewed marriage is the result. Drawing from his own story and the stories of husbands whose marriages were dissolving, Ken Nair reveals major problems in life and marriage. After discussing the problems, he reveals relationship altering concepts which not only will revive a marriage, they will radiate throughout couple's lives as well."

 
I recently read the Christian marriage guide, "Discovering the Mind of a Women," by Ken Nair. The book came out in 1995, and seemed somewhat dated to me, in that it kept on bringing up how men must be humble and submissive to their wives. I realize husbands can be serious jerks in various ways, but the author only lightly discussed how wives can be dysfunctional and nightmarish for their husbands, and what the men must do in those circumstances. I would be curious to knows if an updated version of the book had been released, within the last few years, in an attempt to address the current environment between the sexes.

I would recommend the guide, because the writer brings up many good points. But I had to really laugh, when at one point the author actually stated that *women have no sex drive!* Lol! Yep, he has the out of date and very false thinking that women just like sex for the hugs and kisses... All of them...

"In Discovering the Mind of Women husbands learn to understand their wives as Christ would. From this point they learn to respond to their wives in a consistent Christlike manner. A radically transformed and renewed marriage is the result. Drawing from his own story and the stories of husbands whose marriages were dissolving, Ken Nair reveals major problems in life and marriage. After discussing the problems, he reveals relationship altering concepts which not only will revive a marriage, they will radiate throughout couple's lives as well."

These books are bought by women for their husbands.
 

TripleG

Kingfisher
Gold Member
The role of women goes even beyond that. After reading E. Micheal Jones' books there is a conclusion to be drawn: almost every man that turned away from logos was either betrayed by the woman he loved, or corrupted by the lust for a woman - right before the change in morals happened.

Men begin by loving the sexual liberation until they are betrayed by a woman they love, after which all they want to do is destroy society. You see this time and time again with thousands of historical figures. Women play a crucial role in moving the cycle of society - they are somehow intuitively attuned to politics and treat men according to that.

It's like they feel the ills of a society deeper and mirror it for all to see the moral corruption.

The bible covers this best, especially Proverbs 31:3

"Give not thy strength unto women, nor thy ways to that which destroyeth kings".

however then Proverbs 31:30 does mention that a God-fearing woman is the best of all:

"Favour is deceitful, and beauty is vain: but a woman that feareth the Lord, she shall be praised."
 

Augustus_Principe

Woodpecker
Great article. I truly appreciate these types of articles & discussions, as myself and most others are "new" to this and have to de-program ourselves from "Game".

While it is hard for me to put into words, I think I understand not needing Game and relying solely on God. If you follow Christian (Catholic in this case) teaching, you put God first above all. If you truly live your life this way, you will never put a woman in a pedestal for example. This will naturally create a feeling that she continually needs to win you over for the rest of your lives together. You will also expect a woman to follow your lead, as that is what the bible teaches.

I can go on with more examples, but it makes sense when you read the bible, follow traditional Catholic teaching & what Church Fathers say. If you live your life in accordance to the faith, you dont need secular Game because all the lessons that Game tries to teach you, ie Alpha traits such as dominance, having a woman take your lead, making a woman work for you, etc etc etc, will happen as you follow your Faith. At least this is the conclusion I am coming to the more I am educated in Traditional Catholicism.
 
Hi,

Thank you for the article @Roosh.

If we look at how western societies were structured in the past, it was clear that there were very clear distinctions in the role every man and woman had to play in society.

And western societies were heralded as one of the greatest civilisations in the world.

This is just my humble opinion, but I do not think that western democracies and civilisations would have managed to accomplish what they had accomplished just by being merely "secular" and purely rational / scientific.

I believe that there was a spiritual dimension which was also responsible for the progress that the western societies experienced.

A spiritual dimension which seems completely forgotten and discarded in today's day and age under the guise of "secularism" and where it is fashionable to be an atheist.

If we look at the big cities, whether it's in the western world or even the big cities in developing nations, we can see clear parallels in how the citizens (men and women) conduct themselves and what is more evident is the fact that people are emphasising the physical / material / emotional aspects of their lives and nature.

But very little priority is given to the spiritual side of things.

It has led to a situation where people have all sorts of solutions to their problems in the form of an app where one just needs to press a couple of buttons to solve their issues.

In short, it has led people to believe that there is no need for God.

What we are witnessing in today's world is a severe spiritual deficiency as people longer believe that they require God.

I was hearing some stories in London and in England during the Eid-Al-Adha festival where mosques were decorated stylishly and the churches on the other hand were decrepit and eggs were thrown at the church windows. Why did this happen ?

The spiritual side of things is very much required in tandem along with the physical / mental / emotional side of things.

And unfortunately, our current culture seems to have neglected this aspect to a detrimental effect.

Kind Regards.
 
Only God can find you a good wife, but I feel frustrated with hearing that as advice. It may address what your priorities in life should be, but it leaves out any actionable advice on specifically finding a wife. Focusing on self-improvement my whole life hasn't in itself found me a wife because I didn't approach women. There is still a gap left that no one seems to have figured out about what steps to take to approach women with marriage in mind.
 
Only God can find you a good wife, but I feel frustrated with hearing that as advice. It may address what your priorities in life should be, but it leaves out any actionable advice on specifically finding a wife. Focusing on self-improvement my whole life hasn't in itself found me a wife because I didn't approach women. There is still a gap left that no one seems to have figured out about what steps to take to approach women with marriage in mind.

SkyDancer, I would say that you are in the right place, to find help! The forum members will definitely be able to assist you with this important matter, so don't give up hope. I would say start off by going over the forum topics in the "meeting women" and "women general" sections, and then find good threads and start reading.
 

redbeard

Hummingbird
Gold Member
Only God can find you a good wife, but I feel frustrated with hearing that as advice. It may address what your priorities in life should be, but it leaves out any actionable advice on specifically finding a wife. Focusing on self-improvement my whole life hasn't in itself found me a wife because I didn't approach women. There is still a gap left that no one seems to have figured out about what steps to take to approach women with marriage in mind.

The problem with "actionable advice" is that finding a wife is 100x harder than finding a woman to fornicate with (ugly truth). It's not as easy as "go do 100 approaches with this exact opener."

The entire forum is working to figure out how to help men in your situation, since you're definitely not alone in your frustration.

That being said, what have you done to meet a marriage-minded woman? How long have you been going to church? How involved are you in your parish?

Unless you have *really* exhausted all options, then there's no reason to get frustrated.
 

wannable alpha

Woodpecker
I have seen many men and women from all religions say similar stuff about how matches are made in heaven, trust in God etc. But that stuff works out only if you don't have many expectations in your life and are okay with marrying the first single woman you come across irrespective of her personality, attractiveness and other qualities. Such an attitude can also work out if you are naturally part of a large social circle due to family, location, job and income. It's very easy to say trust God in such a scenario.

Doing well in school, college, career or business all require hard work and being street smart enough to be in the right place at the right time and knowing the right people. Finding a good wife is no different IMO.
 

redbeard

Hummingbird
Gold Member
But that stuff works out only if you don't have many expectations in your life and are okay with marrying the first single woman you come across irrespective of her personality, attractiveness and other qualities. Such an attitude can also work out if you are naturally part of a large social circle due to family, location, job and income. It's very easy to say trust God in such a scenario.

How many young married couples do you know personally? I've met dozens of happy couples where the husband is not "naturally part of a large social circle," all he did was work hard, pray, and get involved in his parish.
 

wannable alpha

Woodpecker
all he did was work hard, pray, and get involved in his parish.
Being involved in religious organizations is also a type of game. I remember in my American college years there was a Baptist Student Union which was popular with many college students, men and women.

A guy with whom I had a few classes was part of a smaller church (busy in evangelizing).He called the BSU a dating and socializing club where "people go to find boyfriends and girlfriends".

I didn't see anything wrong in that. Those guys had the social awareness to know where to look. Some guys don't realize that part.
 
There's a few interesting topics that are at the heart of this issue including the topical which is: Is there a place for game for marriage minded men (both in courtship towards marriage and during it.)

I'm going to start a separate thread on that for married men (I don't see one) but have been reading the other topics first. I've seen a few remarks here that there is "marriage game" out there and I've tried a few tactics with my wife when she's tried a few shit tests on me. My wife is quite religious but nonetheless, she's still a woman. This leads to the other topic:

Even lining up a woman outside of strongly traditional cultures may require game in that women have a certain mentality that's globally universal. Roosh knows this better than anyone. I welcome his insights and comments on what I say below. Will even religious women engage in hypergamy, unreasonable expectations set by thirsty beta orbiters, shit tests, and flaking because they're women and even religious women are exposed to the pitfalls of so-called equality and consumerism?

Even back during the origins of game, I mean back in the early 80's, I was concerned that the largest problem(s) were that the requirement to practice on hundreds of women was socially destructive and that somehow the cultural expectations of women became that "cool and interesting" game-men PUA's was the "natural" state of men. This reduced men to acting like PUAs that women would sleep with, but stymied emotional-marital relationships. Back then, I said that the challenge was that a man had to be an academy award level method actor to entertain a woman to the point that she would fall for him, sleep with him, and then and only then could he be in a position where he had enough leverage to actually have an adult, spiritual relationship with her but by then, after going through that, would he want to?

Roosh has unpublished his books including Don't Bang Denmark but I think it was an interesting anthropological cautionary tale in this regard. What it took for him to sleep with Danish women was so spiritually draining, he didn't want to bother. That's how I viewed the PUA game. It just wasn't worth it for me. I didn't want to spend years contributing to a cynical PUA culture for relationships that naturally lent themselves to casual sex rather than marriage.

But even so, I had mature conversations with PUAs and I acknowledged that they had genuine skill and these were transferable to other facets of life (such as business) and marriage. I use internal "frame" in business all the time. I came up with many of these concepts on my own and it's neat to see Roosh scientifically categorize them.

If I may ask a (polite) question to Roosh: Did Roosh really believe that all of the women he slept with via game were "in rebellion" and not good potential marital partners in a Christian relationship or did the PUA game that he applied necessarily make it difficult for him to connect to women at this level because they were attracted to this person he portrayed rather than his actual self as well as the game causing the women to be ideal bedmates rather than future wives? Did "game" change Roosh and the women during his relationship with them?

I read in his books that he picked up many young college girls who probably weren't necessarily in rebellion or even looking for casual sex (they were probably naive) but he, as a charming person (and I say that factually about him, he's quite likable in person), led them to a relationship where they hoped that marriage/family would happen down the road because that's how (otherwise) normal, healthy dating works at its best?

In the case of my wife, I met her and was interesting and cool (but not exceptionally so or fake, it was self-improvement and introspection that got me to that point) so we could have a long term courtship. We had sex. We discussed marriage, religion, commitment, morals and having shown each other we could be trusted to be good parents and partners (and having met her family) tied the knot and had a kid.

That's how (I think) it worked for most people prior to the 1970's (minus the pre-marital sex).
 

Roosh

Cardinal
Orthodox
Will even religious women engage in hypergamy, unreasonable expectations set by thirsty beta orbiters, shit tests, and flaking because they're women and even religious women are exposed to the pitfalls of so-called equality and consumerism?
Faith can give women resistance to committing sin, whereas secular women have practically no resistance at all. You can find the most pious woman in the land, but that will still not guarantee your marriage is a success. The point is to trust in God when it comes to these matters instead of your own skill or knowledge. You won't be able to guarantee any outcome in life.
I had mature conversations with PUAs and I acknowledged that they had genuine skill and these were transferable to other facets of life (such as business) and marriage. I use internal "frame" in business all the time.
No skill is worth learning if the price is committing sin. Marriage and business skill can be learned without fornicating. In fact, most rich men are quite clueless about how to pickup women. It's a delusional to think that you are becoming a better person from sin.
Did Roosh really believe that all of the women he slept with via game were "in rebellion" and not good potential marital partners in a Christian relationship or did the PUA game that he applied necessarily make it difficult for him to connect to women at this level because they were attracted to this person he portrayed rather than his actual self as well as the game causing the women to be ideal bedmates rather than future wives? Did "game" change Roosh and the women during his relationship with them?
I only believe that now, not when I was sleeping with the women. Looking back, for a woman to sleep with a transient stranger from a foreign land, she had to be in deep rebellion. She threw away her countrymen, her language, her nation for a fleeting sexual encounter with a faithless but novel man.

You will attract the mirror reflection of your spiritual state. I was in deep rebellion so the women I attracted were the same. For men who find this hard to believe because they met a "nice" women, they were in a more mild state of rebellion, so they met a woman who was only in a mild state of rebellion as well.
I read in his books that he picked up many young college girls who probably weren't necessarily in rebellion or even looking for casual sex (they were probably naive) but he, as a charming person (and I say that factually about him, he's quite likable in person), led them to a relationship where they hoped that marriage/family would happen down the road because that's how (otherwise) normal, healthy dating works at its best?
Those young girls were certainly in rebellion... people just call it "experimenting" these days. There's no such thing as "healthy dating" if pre-marital sex is involved. Most of my "relationships" were purely sexual, and even if a girl did want a relationship from me, how could I accept that my future wife did sexual things with me so quickly, learned by doing it with so many other guys? She always had a huge basket of red flags, as you'd expect, and I would have to debate if those red flags were worth accepting instead of realizing that I was the main source of the red flags.
 
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Aboulia

Woodpecker
Orthodox
No one is immune from committing sin except Jesus Christ. Faith can give women resistance to committing sin, whereas secular women have practically no resistance at all. You can find the most pious woman in the land, but that will still not guarantee your marriage is a success. The point is to trust in God when it comes to these matters instead of your own skill or knowledge. You won't be able to guarantee any outcome in life.

Careful Roosh. Jesus Christ is not immune from committing sin. He was fully capable of, but chose not to. Radically different. To assert otherwise denies the humanity of Christ. If Christ wasn't human, then human nature didn't ascend to heaven, and therefore there is still an unbridgeable gap between us and God and we end up with Islam.
 

Blade Runner

Ostrich
Orthodox
I think all of this gets confusing because there is quite a bit of jargon, and in many ways it coincides. What most on this forum currently seek is becoming more confident and secure in the appropriate way as men, which is "masculinity". "Game" is a colloquialism for attracting girls irrespective of intent - it may or may not lead to picking girls up, depending on the goal of the man. Employing game in itself over the long haul in a virtuous way is courting; beyond that it is masculinity in marriage. Using game for shorter term sexual encounters is straight pickup.

It is not a wonder that most relationships in the post arranged marriage world came out of long term social or quasi social environments: school, work, church, or meaningful clubs/hobbies/activity groups. These all provide social proof and time enough to see the real character of someone you may be interested in. The rapid increase in globalism, travel, work travel, and length of careers all counteracted more natural ways to connect with people, and perhaps more importantly, sustain them.

I can speak significantly from personal experience here in that I'm a professional in a field that required a long time of training. While some of the story has to do with [my] religious tradition, I would say that the biggest wrench in general when looking back at all these years is that if you didn't meet a compatible person in the more natural ways I have just discussed, the odds grew paradoxically out of touch. I say it was a paradox because as a man ascends and even becomes more attractive (they want you to be a "made" man already) it's later in the game, and then the age gap thing starts hitting, since of course a well off man doesn't want washed up post 30 year olds. My conclusion is that the most important issue standing in the way of marriage is the idea of female careers, since it wastes peak SMV/fertility, trading some idea of security and dependence for a dream scenario (have fun for a while, then get bailed out) that likely won't happen.
 
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