Preparedness During Civil Strife

Lace em up

Woodpecker
Its amazing how unprepared people are. In the days before hurricane Sandy I shopped for batteries, flashlights, 12 volt phone charger, non-perishables, first aid supplies etc.. The day of, as the storm was surely going to hit us, I filled the gas tank on my Jeep before safely parking it.

The very next day, after the storm, the lines at the gas stations were stretching a half a mile.

How do you not fill your tank when you have days of warning before a hurricane.
 

Lace em up

Woodpecker
If you can learn how to hunt now. You CAN turn that ammo into smoked meat that will keep for a long time relatively easily
Its my understanding that if doomsday occurred and mass hunting for food ensued, the wildlife population would drop rapidly and dramatically.

Freshwater sources of fish are mostly stocked by fish and game management. Are they going to still be stocking trout in your favorite creek?

Salt water fishing is possibly the only viable option, in a long term survival situation.
 

Easy_C

Crow
Correct. There’s nothing stopping you from being able to get some now and the advantage for those resources will go to those who know how to hunt, not people who think they can just grab a rifle and be successful. Plus a lot of areas are extremely remote and likely won’t have the same rate of depletion.
 

ralfy

Pigeon
For some, it's the same as preparing for pandemics, peak oil, global warming, war, economic collapse, and others: sustainable skills such as gardening, micro-farming, organic and regular farming, permaculture, hydroponics/aquaponics/vermiculture, husbandry, and more, alternative medicine ("where there is no doctor") including basic and intermediate health care, herbal medicine, etc., basic structural engineering (including basic or better electrical repair, vehicle repair and maintenance, household and fence maintenance, some carpentry), renewable and muscle-powered energy (solar power systems to books about nineteenth-century farming, repair, etc., bicycles or cargo bikes, etc.), self-defense (including physical exercise, hand-to-hand fighting, learning to use and maintain knives, archery kits, and firearms), food preparation, preservation, and long-term storage, and bugout situations (72-hr supplies in a backback, bugout vehicle or other means of transport, and so on) and hopefully, plans to evacuate to certain places that have at least water supplies and places to plant.

In short, combinations of skills and supplies needed for short- and long-term crises. Learning to work with close relatives and friends as well as being part of a community of people who have similar beliefs and enough self-sufficiency skills will be very helpful.

In any case, assume that there are only a few days' worth of fuel, medicine, and various supplies in each town and city because of the need by businesses to keep inventory and opportunity costs low.
 

Handsome Creepy Eel

Owl
Gold Member
Freshwater sources of fish are mostly stocked by fish and game management. Are they going to still be stocking trout in your favorite creek?
Can you elaborate on this? I thought most fish in rivers were local fish who lived there naturally. Or is it that rivers are too industrialized/dammed so someone has to help them to spawn?
 
Can you elaborate on this? I thought most fish in rivers were local fish who lived there naturally. Or is it that rivers are too industrialized/dammed so someone has to help them to spawn?
I know some trout species were introduced and is frequently managed -particularly lakes - by stocking them. That could be in relation to the number of sport fishers (though many just catch and release) . You are right about being dammed up effecting things - atlantic salmon used to breed (before the industrial revolution) in the Connecticut river but disappeared after hydro power.
 

Lace em up

Woodpecker
Can you elaborate on this? I thought most fish in rivers were local fish who lived there naturally. Or is it that rivers are too industrialized/dammed so someone has to help them to spawn?
It seems the federal government stopped keeping detailed reports back in 1998. However many state fish and wildlife agencies keep their own detailed reports. For example, heres a 2019 report for Ohio’s Lake Erie Fisheries. There is also the Atlantic States Marine Fisheries Commission.
 

EndlessGravity

Woodpecker
I know some trout species were introduced and is frequently managed -particularly lakes - by stocking them. That could be in relation to the number of sport fishers (though many just catch and release) . You are right about being dammed up effecting things - atlantic salmon used to breed (before the industrial revolution) in the Connecticut river but disappeared after hydro power.
I know, for example, our larger lakes here had to be nurtured back to health by adding back fish. Agricultural runoff had ruined the water. I'm unsure how often fish are added back in or if it was just over a few years to get it back to normal.

In any serious breakdown, I would expect fish in lakes to be harvested away and any game hunted down within months. Just think about how many people are in your metro. Probably won't be able to find a squirrel alive within the week if it comes to that.
 

Dr. Howard

Peacock
Gold Member
Looking online it still looks like there is .308 to be had. If someone wanted to rush out and buy a rifle they'd have to get an M1 or a SCAR....big money but that's kind of what you have to pay when you are buying in peak demand.
 

Dr. Howard

Peacock
Gold Member
I know, for example, our larger lakes here had to be nurtured back to health by adding back fish. Agricultural runoff had ruined the water. I'm unsure how often fish are added back in or if it was just over a few years to get it back to normal.

In any serious breakdown, I would expect fish in lakes to be harvested away and any game hunted down within months. Just think about how many people are in your metro. Probably won't be able to find a squirrel alive within the week if it comes to that.
I don't know if I buy into the hunting depletion. I would concur with that if it was 1950 but today, in order to hunt someone would need to:

  1. Own a gun capable of killing game
  2. Own ammunition for that gun
  3. Be competent with that gun
  4. Be in good enough physical shape to leave the house
  5. Have a vehicle that can get remotely close to wild habitat
  6. Be competent in finding game
  7. Be competent in dressing that game
  8. Be competent in cooking that game
People today that barely know how to operate a microwave can't become hunters overnight. I think people will be starving while a deer eats the flowerbeds at the abandoned home across the street
 

Leonard D Neubache

Owl
Gold Member
Charter arms 38 Special in the car (sometimes HK vp9sk) PPQ full size for home.

Now to find ammo!
Americans are fortunate in as much as they can buy as many guns as they like. I urge anyone who has money to dump into guns and ammo to consider how many gunfights you think you're going to get into and live through. Most people are lucky if the number of gunfights they survive is greater than one.

On that basis consider that one gun and a lot of bullets is not always the best option. If you have the option to arm other people then maximum guns in the maximum number of hands trumps the maximum number of bullets for the same price.

The guy with one gun and 10,000 rounds is going to get smoked by the ten guys who each have a couple of mags.

As for game depletion, anyone who's ever been camping during peak tourist season has had a slight glimpse at the hell those areas will turn into if some kind of disaster dislocates the population. Even at peak tourism, only a fraction of the hunters, fishers and campers are out at any given time. If every dick with a rabbit gun, a pop up tent or a hand reel decides to pick up and head into the forest with their family in tow then it's going to be a nightmare. They will end up eating each other while the rare few capable of venturing deeper might escape to the places that less than .01% of the others can follow them to.

If your plan is to head for the hills then you will need to do the following.

1) Establish caches of supplies along a trail that continues deeper into the wild.
2) Establish a cache of supplies at what will be your bug-out location.
3) Establish another cache of supplies that will get you back home again so you don't starve/freeze/dehydrate to death out there.
4) Be the first guy on the trail when disaster strikes so you don't get bushwhacked along the way.
 
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EndlessGravity

Woodpecker
I don't know if I buy into the hunting depletion. I would concur with that if it was 1950 but today, in order to hunt someone would need to:
I hadn't considered this before, before you mentioned it earlier, and it's a fair point. However, @Leonard D Neubache is probably right. It'll all turn into a crazy shitshow. You'll probably have morons shooting hog with pistols everywhere. I've never hunted so I can't speak reliably but I have experience fishing and understand parts of the industry. I'm skeptical even salt water fishing will hold up in a metro of say, 3 million people.

I'm seeking out more experience living 100% off-the-grid for short periods in very rough areas. Is hunting a difficult skill to pick up, in your opinion?
 

Leonard D Neubache

Owl
Gold Member
I know the question wasn't directed at me, but trappers have always had better results than hunters.

Hunting nowadays is a sport and often has many rules attached which alter the way it is approached. In reality if you're facing starvation you're not going to be fucking around with mating calls and stuff like that. You're going to be stringing a piano wire noose across a choke point and coming back to see what you find the next day. If you're in a static location you're going to leave out a nice big salt block and wait with your rifle. Very illegal now. Nothing you're going to think twice about when your family is hungry and there are no park rangers left.
 

EndlessGravity

Woodpecker
I know the question wasn't directed at me, but trappers have always had better results than hunters.

Hunting nowadays is a sport and often has many rules attached which alter the way it is approached. In reality if you're facing starvation you're not going to be fucking with mating calls and stuff like that. You're going to be stringing a piano wire noose across a choke point and coming back to see what you find the next day. If you're in a static location you're going to leave out a nice big salt block and wait with your rifle. Very illegal now. Nothing you're going to think twice about when your family is hungry and there are no park rangers left.
Meant it for both of you really and your insight is always welcome. That's good perspective and I had started to look into trapping methods (out of simple interest). I fish very well but myself and a close friend are going to put the skills to a very real test sometime in the next month or two.
 

Leonard D Neubache

Owl
Gold Member
Roo and deer mostly, though it's not hard here. I don't call pest-controlling wallabies hunting. We can literally shoot a hundred of them a night on most of the farms out here.

I'm mostly passing on things I've learned from a decade of reading what professionals have written as well as picking the brains of a lot of old timers around here. I don't envy north American hunters, what with bears and cougars and drunk fudds wandering around.
 
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