Home
Forums
New posts
What's new
New posts
Latest activity
Log in
Register
What's new
New posts
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Home
Forums
Other Topics
Off topic discussion
Puerto Rico votes for statehood
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Robert High Hawk" data-source="post: 1107485" data-attributes="member: 12429"><p>Well this discussion has become quite spirited!</p><p></p><p>First off, @Fisto, and @El Flaco, I would like to apologize for using and retract the term "projecting". That's condescending psychobabble, and it was in poor form to use it. "Mischaracterizing my argument" would have been better. </p><p></p><p>Now to address the points at hand. </p><p></p><p>@Fisto, you dismiss my entire argument, picked out a single line, and ignored the outright and direct primary fault I subscribe concerning, as well as my concurrence with the facts stated by the majority of posters.</p><p></p><p> That is your choice to do so, however I can only disagree at this point. Let's take the particular line you singled out of context to dismiss my argument: ""Puerto Rico never had a chance". I said that in the context of deleterious government policies imposed on the island that keep it from it's economic potential. Is this not a point that regardless of one's political opinion, is worth acknowledging has exacerbated poor governance? Puerto Rico will never be on par with the US.</p><p> If you want to go into some of the insane PR government policies and facts, happy to do so. It would be a long read, but my sense was that most readers here are interested specifically in how this situation relates to the USA.</p><p> Also, you clearly don't want Puerto Rico to be a state (neither do I), yet you said that PR didn't "deserve" independence in 1950. What is your point here? Are you pro-Puerto Rican Independence or not? Or only now but not back then? If so why?</p><p></p><p>My argument is that it takes two to tango in any dysfunctional relationship, and we should write the ship, get Puerto Rico off of welfare/subsidies, remove economic handicaps and then slowly grant greater autonomy in the direction of Independence. </p><p></p><p>Again, heartily welcome other serious courses of action here for a substantive discussion how to fix this, rather than focusing on who is a victim and who is not. If I came across as condescending, my bad. Let's hopefully move forward in a productive direction. </p><p></p><p>@Boston BMW</p><p></p><p>You are ascribing things to me that I never said. Did I ever say that Puerto Rico is not a net drain on the USA? Did I ever say Puerto Ricans as a whole are some magical minority group that is great for America? What exactly are you talking about here?</p><p></p><p>As for being anti-colonialist, Puerto Rico has ALWAYS been a Colony, so I think you are characterizing my tact. I had the audacity to mention faulty US policy that has exacerbated an already lesser achieving economy in Puerto Rico, and has increased migration from the mainland as well as handicapped the Puerto Rican economy. Did I ever claim Puerto Rico would be equal to the US or worthy of statehood otherwise?</p><p></p><p>A great way to discourage Puerto Ricans out of the continental US would be to find a realistic way to improve the situation there. I don't think US culture and Puerto Rican (latin) culture is very compatible, and whatever steps we can do to preserve and strengthen both separately, starting with poor policy reformation, by BOTH the US and Puerto Rico, would go a long way. Please (sincerely) don't read into that statement more than just what it says. </p><p></p><p>Finally regarding the flag thing, I think a minor color tweek vs an entire design does not make the PR flag derivative of the US flag. It's derivative of Spanish flags, with a US inspired color. Fair?</p><p></p><p>I sincerely hope we can get some substantive ideas on how to move forward realistically. Too many potential Miss World and Miss Universes are at stake here, as well as some pretty outstanding Salsa music.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Robert High Hawk, post: 1107485, member: 12429"] Well this discussion has become quite spirited! First off, @Fisto, and @El Flaco, I would like to apologize for using and retract the term "projecting". That's condescending psychobabble, and it was in poor form to use it. "Mischaracterizing my argument" would have been better. Now to address the points at hand. @Fisto, you dismiss my entire argument, picked out a single line, and ignored the outright and direct primary fault I subscribe concerning, as well as my concurrence with the facts stated by the majority of posters. That is your choice to do so, however I can only disagree at this point. Let's take the particular line you singled out of context to dismiss my argument: ""Puerto Rico never had a chance". I said that in the context of deleterious government policies imposed on the island that keep it from it's economic potential. Is this not a point that regardless of one's political opinion, is worth acknowledging has exacerbated poor governance? Puerto Rico will never be on par with the US. If you want to go into some of the insane PR government policies and facts, happy to do so. It would be a long read, but my sense was that most readers here are interested specifically in how this situation relates to the USA. Also, you clearly don't want Puerto Rico to be a state (neither do I), yet you said that PR didn't "deserve" independence in 1950. What is your point here? Are you pro-Puerto Rican Independence or not? Or only now but not back then? If so why? My argument is that it takes two to tango in any dysfunctional relationship, and we should write the ship, get Puerto Rico off of welfare/subsidies, remove economic handicaps and then slowly grant greater autonomy in the direction of Independence. Again, heartily welcome other serious courses of action here for a substantive discussion how to fix this, rather than focusing on who is a victim and who is not. If I came across as condescending, my bad. Let's hopefully move forward in a productive direction. @Boston BMW You are ascribing things to me that I never said. Did I ever say that Puerto Rico is not a net drain on the USA? Did I ever say Puerto Ricans as a whole are some magical minority group that is great for America? What exactly are you talking about here? As for being anti-colonialist, Puerto Rico has ALWAYS been a Colony, so I think you are characterizing my tact. I had the audacity to mention faulty US policy that has exacerbated an already lesser achieving economy in Puerto Rico, and has increased migration from the mainland as well as handicapped the Puerto Rican economy. Did I ever claim Puerto Rico would be equal to the US or worthy of statehood otherwise? A great way to discourage Puerto Ricans out of the continental US would be to find a realistic way to improve the situation there. I don't think US culture and Puerto Rican (latin) culture is very compatible, and whatever steps we can do to preserve and strengthen both separately, starting with poor policy reformation, by BOTH the US and Puerto Rico, would go a long way. Please (sincerely) don't read into that statement more than just what it says. Finally regarding the flag thing, I think a minor color tweek vs an entire design does not make the PR flag derivative of the US flag. It's derivative of Spanish flags, with a US inspired color. Fair? I sincerely hope we can get some substantive ideas on how to move forward realistically. Too many potential Miss World and Miss Universes are at stake here, as well as some pretty outstanding Salsa music. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Home
Forums
Other Topics
Off topic discussion
Puerto Rico votes for statehood
Top
