Quiet Quitting / Decline in Worker Productivity
- Thread starter DanielH
- Start date
I find this very hard to believe even in Europe. Priests are able to have working spouses which adds to their family income. Without looking at their financial statements, who knows what they are bringing in or the extent of their wealth.
When I was looking at Orthodox parishes, I avoided the ones where the priest drove a luxury vehicle (Mercedes in my example) There is also a Catholic priest who is a former high level executive of a large company in my area.
I'm not saying your priest or all priests are like this, but for sure there are ones who don't seem to take Jesus word's on modesty to heart.
Promotions and 'merit' raises are small. Most people fail to negotiate starting salary which is where you have the most leverage. There are levels with salary ranges that are 50-75k. Some of this is geographical location based but some is simply bad business sense.
Working more than your allotted time is a habit you need to stop early.
Eventually yes, but I don’t know nearly enough about the field to do so yet. Only been in it for 9 months or so.
I’ve done a lot of things ranging from copywriting to leading wilderness trips for troubled teenagers to being a security guard. Right now I’m in the HVAC trade.
This is definitely true. Jobs are entirely economic relationships, where leverage over the transactional aspect is all that matters and when bargaining power for the employee is by far the strongest when changing jobs to meet an employer's immediate need. Loyalty is a vice - company men get punished with stagnant pay.
Most companies merit raises are about 3 percent yearly and raises are 5 percent.
If you start at 75 k with this metric it will take you 10 years to get to 100k with a 3 percent yearly merit.
Typically the path in corporate world is:
What you need to do is work to a point where you have some leverage, then move to another company for a 5 -10 percent pay increase, then repeat.... Then once you're in a senior manager position, you have to stay somewhere for a while before you can get a director role.
If the company youre at is giving you stocks and bonus then there's additional reasons to stay there, but if your base isn't high enough, you bounce for the right cash in your pocket amount and start over somewhere else.
IM3000
Kingfisher
I'm not in the US, but I doubt that my experience would be different if I was. Granted, I was blessed with finding a profession where I can use a combination of my natural abilities and my formal education. On top, my field does have a considerable entry barrier. Not many people can do it and I cannot be replaced by college grads. Yes, I count my blessings.
Anyway, I'd still argue that if you have skills which are a) in demand, b) essential for your employer, c) rare and d) applicable to a lucrativ and recession-proof industry, then you should be in a position to work normal hours, switch off your cell phone outside of office hours and enjoy your days off. Basically, you'll still have a life while getting paid a good buck.
IM3000
Kingfisher
Indeed. If you don't manage yourself properly, nobody will do it for you.
I think the US has always been about going above and beyond when it comes to working hours v. many other western nations. Actually, I know it was true for generations, and I am sure it just keeps shifting in that direction. Covid allowed people to work from home, but it also allowed people to be available 7 AM to 7 PM.
Certainly, if you have a niche that can dictate you power, then you can do more so what you please, within reason. Just with legal immigration, and dieversity quotas, those careers are harder to find. Add in AI technology and it is going to get a lot tougher.
I'm honestly not sure at my age what I could even learn to do and end up in a position like that. Some could say I missed the boat by not job hopping when I was younger. But I could have job hopped and ended up laid off and on the bench like many others I know as well, who now drive uber and hustle to pay the bills. I will never know, I took the safe route. Manual labor is out for me, I have too many back issues.
Maybe Finance? It seems like the guys in finance make really good money and don't put in crazy long hours. But I could be wrong. When I came out of college, nearly 25 years ago, the field I went into paid better than finance. But legal immigration and technology advances have really kept wages stagnant since that time.
At my age, it seems best to just keep working 7 days a week, about 70 hours a week, avoid anything other than finding ways to save money, and retire as young as I can. I've been doing it about 25 years, I can do it a few more and I should be free. But for the younger guys, or when people ask me, it would be nice to give solid advice. As of right now, if a young White man asked me what I think he should do, I honestly have no idea. I don't know what fields they can get into that would provide for them a decent life. Again, all I know of is finance, so that might be the right answer.
Douglas Quaid
Kingfisher
This is the best way to go, or choosing a much more enjoyable job with a lower pay ceiling but still enough money (what I did).
Solo plumbers, electricians, hvac and maybe some other trades seem to have it the best. The only problem is all the bs you have to go through to get to that point (apprenticeship and working for someone else for several years). But it would be worth it when you get there.
I was a laborer for a general contractor, and they'd use the same plumber for a lot of the jobs. He was doing his own thing, picked his own jobs and drove around in an old Ford Ranger. Guy had it made.
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IM3000
Kingfisher
I don't know how old you are, but I found my profession at nearly 35 years old...I do argee though, there is a cut-off point at a certain age. A career change at 50 will probably be a significant challenge.
I’m not very far off from 50. It would take a few years to switch fields, and by that time I will be retired, or close to it, in my field.
IM3000
Kingfisher
I see. That's definitely a tough thing to pull off. I'm sure that it can be done somehow, but only you can assess this for your situation. Maybe you can do your job but in a more lucrative industry? Good luck in any case.
No too far off from 50 means you're in your 40's you should be saying that instead, you're not too old for anything. I have uncles in their 60's one with a large debilitating health issue who could easily retire but instead are starting new large business ventures that they know nothing about, the numbers looked good and they want the challenge so that was that. You're only holding yourself back handicapping yourself and brother I've heard you talk like that before.
If I could retire, there are millions of things I would rather do than work to make more money that I don't need. Granted, I say this because I have worked 7 days a week for over 2 decades straight and I have missed out on a lot of things that I want to do. Travel, have friends, maybe have a relationship, maybe even kids, just enjoy down time, visit with my family, learn and grow, etc.
You asked above, and my personal answer is that I wouldn't start my own business in the USA right now. I could be wrong, but this isn't 1985 USA anymore. We have seen many times where our tax dollars are used to bail out corporations and the C-team bonuses, and small businesses are told "tough luck". And now it is to a point where all the corporations are controlled by the Wall Street Big Three, who also own all the members of the federal govt., so it will only get worse when it comes to this kind of unfair policy. If other people can start a small business and make it work, I very much support them and try to support local small businesses when I can. But it isn't for me.
I appreciate the support, but I have no interest in starting a small business or working any longer than I have to do so. I believe it is too late for me to switch careers, but even if it wasn't, I have no idea what I would go into. What is an average White man to do these days? Manual labor is out. Most office work is reserved for dieversity/H-1B/career wahman. Which gets back to my question...
Forget about me, what should young White men try to do in the USA? What paths are available for them, in 2023? Much less by 2043.
Brother every successful man I know including myself works 7 days a week, unless you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth or you just got dumb lucky with something every adult man I know who has done well in life works every day. Sure you might take a vacation here and there you might even get married and have kids but barring a special occasion/circumstance you are at work. I just left my warehouse and I'm down in my basement office doing more work, I would rather do this than go watch TV or something. You could do everything you say you're missing out on, just get some random 40 hour a week job take a sick/vacation day whenever and do that but you want more than that life right? I could do the same, I can go get some random job and have all the free time in the world but I don't want to live like that, I want more.
I have tell you, in regards to a business you are dead wrong in your assessment it is actually the complete opposite of what you are saying. I know more people that have opened businesses in the past 5 years than at any point in my life to an extreme degree, a wide range of businesses, and they have all done well some incredibly well, people and relatives I know personally. I currently run two businesses at the moment and I feel like I missed out by not venturing into something new the past few years, all my relatives blew past me with their businesses. I'm actually planning on selling one to do just that, take on a new challenge that I have in mind....two actually but one for sure. Wall street and the government don't have anything to do with it, you're not going to start a multi national conglomerate and hell if you do then god bless you, you'll be happy to deal with those things. Small businesses have definitely not been told "tough luck" the past few years, they may not have gotten as much as the big guys but do you have any idea how much free money was handed out to worthless contribute nothing businesses the past few years? The numbers I could tell you would shock you, I'm talking from a dumpy little pizzeria to hotel owners they didn't even have to be struggling they all got handed big cash for nothing.....I know I got my share as much as I could. That one mom and pop shop that you heard about that shut down was because of their own doing in most cases because they didn't adapt and squandered their business, believe me it wasn't for a lack of handouts or available funding to prop them up.
I know we all get nostalgic for the past around here and societally it's true things were a lot better in the past there is no question about that but that is absolutely not true financially and especially business wise. The barriers to entry back in the 80's and 90's were insurmountable for just a common person, that's gone now there are multiple avenues for funding and peoples assets have skyrocketed. My family owned party stores growing up, "successful" party stores, and we were broke....dead flat broke even though we owned good stores. Those same stores today would have made us extremely wealthy and they would have huge value. My father worked 7 days a week, the idea of living in a big house, driving a new car or getting on a plane were pipe dreams to me when i was a kid those were things that only rich people had and did. Now everyone has and does those things, anyone who actually works anyway whereas before those things were out of reach for common people.
Brother I don't know your skillset or you personally to tell you what to do but this mindset you have needs to go, the craziest part is that the things you're saying the reality is actually the complete opposite.......get this stuff out of your head please for your own sake. Nobody is handcuffing you and nothing is holding you back it's just what you choose and how you choose.
I like you, but it's pretty insufferable the doom pill.
Take the below with well intention from someone on the other end of the spectrum:
As I've said:
Either you've not played it right because of risk adverse mentality, or you're not capable of pivoting, or you're too comfortable doing what you're doing.
Sounds like you're the epitome of time grinding away opportunity due to the slow, steady assurance of a meal ticket, however measley it is, over the risk of going without.
I'm 33. It's hard to say what Id do if I didn't go into the Marines after college...I understand I'm a rare breed, most people aren't willing to raise 5+ kids, breed dogs, raise chickens, build construction projects, take grad school classes at night and have athletic hobbies like powerlifting and be competitive in them... Forgive the appearance of arrogance, but that mentality of just going nonstop isn't something you learn playing it safe. I've been very successful in spite of poor decisions I've made at times, why? Because I don't let fear of failure get in the way of doing hard things.
My brother is 31, he's doing pretty well, makes a little over 100k a year. He's a data guy who works for an energy company, wont get to management for a couple years, but is trending that way. He's wayyyyy too comfortable and way to risk adverse to create generational wealth like I do...., but he is going to do just fine playing the semi-save bet. Hes moved 3 jobs and gotten from 40k to 100k salaries over the last 8 years with a second son on the way soon...If were to give advice to myself, id give the same advice that I have to him:
Be bold. Find something you're passionate about and learn how to make yourself uniquely skilled at it. Don't play politics, but know how to navigate the players in the room, and learn people's motivations. The faster you do that, and the more you can quantify money saved or revenue to generated, the faster you'll propell yourself. Be a silent professional...a robot if you have to... You'll find the people to be honest with at times, but in general keep all conversation light, and put everything in writing. But don't be afraid to set incredibly high goals for yourself.
If you play the game of "no one has my butt covered like I do" you can bypass a lot of woke crap. Doesn't mean it won't happen. I got a promotion and an HR complaint in the same week (allegedly due to sexist comments, which I demanded an investigation over and the Hr people lost their minds when I called out an underperforming employee who was the complainer)
Well, there is an answer. Data, you mean a "Data scientist" or something like that? I'm not even worried about myself, I am more worried about what young men can do. It would be nice, when they ask me what my advice is, to be able to give them advice. My only advice is finance, unless you have perfect grades and can get into healthcare.
I am risk adverse. I don't know if it is genetic, life experiences, or a combination of the two, but I am risk adverse. But I am super big picture philosophical. And I don't believe a society with a future demands their men either be big risk takers or just sit on the sidelines and never have families. And that is where we are, which is why things are falling apart so quickly. Big risk takers should be rewarded if their risk pays off, I am completely good with that. But it shouldn't be a requirement to have an average life, which it is becoming that way.