Responding To Claims That Yahweh Was A Volcano God/Demon

JoeChill

Robin
Protestant
Gold Member
A lot of people on the dissident right sneeringly call Yahweh a "volcano demon." As a Christian, I am both disturbed and appalled by this libel and would appreciate any help in refuting this notion. I welcome any articles, books, videos, podcast episodes that tackle this issue and explain why it isn't true.

As far as I can tell, this idea seems to originate from Nissim Amzallag. Amzallag claims that 3,200 years ago, southern Canaan developed a cult worshiping a deity named Yahweh (a god of metallurgy) long before the Israelites began to worship this deity. You can read more about this theory here:


I'm posting this thread because I do not like to see people mock God and I am disturbed by the increasing numbers of Europeans who are becoming hostile to Christianity. Please help.
 

Cavalier

Woodpecker
Orthodox Catechumen
You really have to look at the source. More Jewish lies. Anyone can make up anything they want and make it sound believable. Unfortunately it is really impossible to prevent the gullible or those with little faith from believing it. Satan wants people to go through the trouble of refuting it. The easier to snare the unwary. Best to just avoid giving any thought to such nonsense.
 

JoeChill

Robin
Protestant
Gold Member
You really have to look at the source. More Jewish lies. Anyone can make up anything they want and make it sound believable. Unfortunately it is really impossible to prevent the gullible or those with little faith from believing it. Satan wants people to go through the trouble of refuting it. The easier to snare the unwary. Best to just avoid giving any thought to such nonsense.
I understand and respect your point of view. Nevertheless, I really do believe that Christians should engage with the general public and be prepared to answer objections/challenges to the faith. If we don't do that, we run the risk of people thinking that we don't have anything to say to challengers, which isn't true.

I've seen a lot of people leave the faith as a result of productions like Zeitgeist and I think it's worthwhile to show people why such productions are wrong.

I was impressed with Myles Poland's debate with Adam Green. He helped unmask Adam Green as a man without any proof for his claims. We need to be able to challenge those who hate us and spread lies about us. Ignoring problems (apostasy and unbelief) only makes these problems grow.
 

Cavalier

Woodpecker
Orthodox Catechumen
I understand and respect your point of view. Nevertheless, I really do believe that Christians should engage with the general public and be prepared to answer objections/challenges to the faith. If we don't do that, we run the risk of people thinking that we don't have anything to say to challengers, which isn't true.

I've seen a lot of people leave the faith as a result of productions like Zeitgeist and I think it's worthwhile to show people why such productions are wrong.

I was impressed with Myles Poland's debate with Adam Green. He helped unmask Adam Green as a man without any proof for his claims. We need to be able to challenge those who hate us and spread lies about us. Ignoring problems (apostasy and unbelief) only makes these problems grow.
As someone who was mired in Freemasonry, Rosicrucianism and The Western Mystery Tradition I would tend to disagree. The Jew lies always use an element of truth or a seemingly reasonable comparison from antiquity to ensnare those that give the lie any deep thought or analyses. To research the subject would allow for a window through which Satan can influence your thoughts and raise doubts about the faith. No Christian could possibly believe this and a non Christian will find a million reasons to reject God.
 

JoeChill

Robin
Protestant
Gold Member
As someone who was mired in Freemasonry, Rosicrucianism and The Western Mystery Tradition I would tend to disagree. The Jew lies always use an element of truth or a seemingly reasonable comparison from antiquity to ensnare those that give the lie any deep thought or analyses. To research the subject would allow for a window through which Satan can influence your thoughts and raise doubts about the faith. No Christian could possibly believe this and a non Christian will find a million reasons to reject God.
Okay. But what about the following scenario? Let's say a teenage son starts to have questions about the faith (because of things that he was told by his peers or things he read online) and he starts bringing up these questions/challenges to his parents. Wouldn't it be better for the parents to explain why the teenage son is wrong instead of just berating the son? This is an issue that is all too common these days.
 

Cavalier

Woodpecker
Orthodox Catechumen
Okay. But what about the following scenario? Let's say a teenage son starts to have questions about the faith (because of things that he was told by his peers or things he read online) and he starts bringing up these questions/challenges to his parents. Wouldn't it be better for the parents to explain why the teenage son is wrong instead of just berating the son? This is an issue that is all too common these days.
Unfortunately the more you try to explain it away the more you may just convince him it might be true. The best thing would be to have a strong church life so that the teenager is familiar with the faith and can talk to a priest. The priest would do a better job at preventing the belief in heresy. Be careful yourself because once you start trying to explain it away you leave yourself open to demonic influence. Just reject it, don’t research a logical reason to just reject it.
 

Cavalier

Woodpecker
Orthodox Catechumen
For starters look up Marcionism. Marcion actually compiled the first New Testament using only a few books he liked. He believed the God of the Old Testament and The God represented by Jesus were different Gods. He believed himself to be a true Christian and allowed a false belief to lead him into heresy. The Church denounce him as a heretic and he was excommunicated. Only God knows what became of his soul.
 

The Beast1

Peacock
Orthodox Inquirer
Gold Member
Unfortunately the more you try to explain it away the more you may just convince him it might be true. The best thing would be to have a strong church life so that the teenager is familiar with the faith and can talk to a priest. The priest would do a better job at preventing the belief in heresy. Be careful yourself because once you start trying to explain it away you leave yourself open to demonic influence. Just reject it, don’t research a logical reason to just reject it.
I'm sorry but this is a naive take. I was raised in a strongly Christian household, went to church every Sunday, and sang in choir. Want to know what caused my apostasy? Our pastor retired and I found his replacement weak willed and impassionate. In fact, so did many others of our church.

I stopped caring and let the devil beguile me with, "Was I really going to church for God or for a passionate pastor?"

The truth is, a good pastor is very important to ones Christian experience. After rediscovering my faith, I accepted that a good pastor is required for me to continue to maintain my faith. I've left churches where I felt the pastor lost his passion for Christ.

This isn't even a scriptural problem but one related to community. The Bible has a story about Jesus smiting a fig tree that hadn't bore fruit. Quite the allegory there. Jesus let's church communities die that aren't producing faithful Christians. It's a pastors job to protect his flock with passion for Jesus Christ.

And also, I've noticed that most people's hang ups with Christianity are hang ups related to the old testament IE what it means to be Jewish. I consider this to be because Jews control so much of our media they fill heads with outright Jewish lies. Christianity lite is really just secular Judaism minus the kosher.

A good pastor will explain that God has many times been reasoned with and that God being an unchanging perfect being really isn't true. He's a God that changes and grows and the new testament is proof that God, in all of his previously jealous anger, came to be a loving God who loves his creation and wants what's best for us. Not to forget of course, salvation through Christ Jesus.
 

Cavalier

Woodpecker
Orthodox Catechumen
I'm sorry but this is a naive take. I was raised in a strongly Christian household, went to church every Sunday, and sang in choir. Want to know what caused my apostasy? Our pastor retired and I found his replacement weak willed and impassionate. In fact, so did many others of our church.

I stopped caring and let the devil beguile me with, "Was I really going to church for God or for a passionate pastor?"

The truth is, a good pastor is very important to ones Christian experience. After rediscovering my faith, I accepted that a good pastor is required for me to continue to maintain my faith. I've left churches where I felt the pastor lost his passion for Christ.

This isn't even a scriptural problem but one related to community. The Bible has a story about Jesus smiting a fig tree that hadn't bore fruit. Quite the allegory there. Jesus let's church communities die that aren't producing faithful Christians. It's a pastors job to protect his flock with passion for Jesus Christ.

And also, I've noticed that most people's hang ups with Christianity are hang ups related to the old testament IE what it means to be Jewish. I consider this to be because Jews control so much of our media they fill heads with outright Jewish lies. Christianity lite is really just secular Judaism minus the kosher.

A good pastor will explain that God has many times been reasoned with and that God being an unchanging perfect being really isn't true. He's a God that changes and grows and the new testament is proof that God, in all of his previously jealous anger, came to be a loving God who loves his creation and wants what's best for us. Not to forget of course, salvation through Christ Jesus.
God never changes. That is heresy.
 

The Beast1

Peacock
Orthodox Inquirer
Gold Member
God never changes. That is heresy.
Then explain Genesis 18:16-33. If God never changes, then how did Abraham convince God to hold off on destroying Sodom and Gomorrah? Abraham literally talks God back from 50 righteous to 10 to spare the cities.

Ultimately God was correct, there were no righteous in either city but the fact remains: Abraham reasoned with God to hold off on destroying the city until he could prove there were no righteous.

Sure God's plan for humanity never changes but God can surely be reasoned with as the previous passage shows.

I'm sorry but I've dealt with answers like yours before from others. This is why so many teenagers leave the church. Even if I'm wrong and I'm quite happy to change my understanding of the text, your blind faith is good when you have years of experience and perspective to simply trust in God's plan. A teenager needs a different method of attack because of a lack of perspective.
 
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Cavalier

Woodpecker
Orthodox Catechumen
Then explain Genesis 18:16-33. If God never changes, then how did Abraham convince God to hold off on destroying Sodom and Gomorrah? Abraham literally talks God back from 50 righteous to 10 to spare the city.

Ultimately God was correct, there were no righteous in either city but the fact remains: Abraham reasoned with God to hold off on destroying the city.
Firstly the unchanging nature of God is a belief of the Orthodox Church. Secondly God knew what the outcome was going to be so he indulged Abraham knowing there would not be 10 righteous people. Of course if there had been he would have spared them but he knew there wasn’t. He had to let Abraham learn that for himself.
 

The Beast1

Peacock
Orthodox Inquirer
Gold Member
Firstly the unchanging nature of God is a belief of the Orthodox Church. Secondly God knew what the outcome was going to be so he indulged Abraham knowing there would not be 10 righteous people. Of course if there had been he would have spared them but he knew there wasn’t. He had to let Abraham learn that for himself.
Which doesn't change what I wrote, why would an unchanging God take the time to indulge in Abraham's inquiry? Why didn't God go, " I'm all powerful, have faith in me Abraham, there's only sinners there."

Yes, God's plan for mankind and his chruch on Earth are unchanging. However, God clearly can be reasoned with, that to me implies a God that can change his plan — which by the way a pause in his plan to nuke Sodom and Gomorrah is indeed a change. God could have nuked the two cities right then and there, told Abraham tough cookies there aren't any faithful there, and be done with it but God indulged in Abraham's inquiry anyway.

This is the type of inquiry a teenager will ask. I mean this kindly but you've done a poor job of preventing apostasy.
 

Cavalier

Woodpecker
Orthodox Catechumen
Which doesn't change what I wrote, why would an unchanging God take the time to indulge in Abraham's inquiry? Why didn't God go, " I'm all powerful, have faith in me Abraham, there's only sinners there."

Yes, God's plan and his chruch are unchanging. However, God clearly can be reasoned with, that to me implies a God that can change his plan — which by the way a pause in his plan to nuke Sodom and Gomorrah is indeed a change. God could have nuked the two cities right then and there, told Abraham tough cookies there aren't any faithful there, and be done with it but God indulged in Abraham's inquiry anyway.

This is the type of inquiry a teenager will ask. I mean this kindly but you've done a poor job of preventing apostasy.
He wanted Abraham to understand that the city was unrighteous. He knew that to just to say to Abraham “ I am God who are you to question me“ would push Abraham away. So he had to let Abraham learn for himself. Kind of how you sometimes have to deal with a teenager. But OK. You research Yahweh was really a demonic volcano God. Then come back and post a reply refuting that. Then we can analyze whether your argument could convince someone inclined to believe that is true that it is in fact false.
 

GodfatherPartTwo

Kingfisher
Protestant
Which doesn't change what I wrote, why would an unchanging God take the time to indulge in Abraham's inquiry? Why didn't God go, " I'm all powerful, have faith in me Abraham, there's only sinners there."

Yes, God's plan for mankind and his chruch on Earth are unchanging. However, God clearly can be reasoned with, that to me implies a God that can change his plan — which by the way a pause in his plan to nuke Sodom and Gomorrah is indeed a change. God could have nuked the two cities right then and there, told Abraham tough cookies there aren't any faithful there, and be done with it but God indulged in Abraham's inquiry anyway.

This is the type of inquiry a teenager will ask. I mean this kindly but you've done a poor job of preventing apostasy.
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. God does not change. I don't like the way you say God can be reasoned with, it's baked with the assumption that God can be unreasonable and we have to calm Him down sometimes.

God could have been curt with Abraham but instead He was patient and graceful with him. I don't think it's because He had to pick His words carefully so as not to lose Abraham but because that's His Nature, He is kind, loving and patient, especially to the Church.

There is another passage where Moses seemingly changes God's mind. It would be incorrect to view that God, who created all things, has decreed the end from the beginning, knows all things, just lost His cool and its a good thing Moses was there to calm Him down.
 

NoMoreTO

Hummingbird
Catholic
I've seen a lot of people leave the faith as a result of productions like Zeitgeist and I think it's worthwhile to show people why such productions are wrong.

I enjoyed the original Zeitgeist years back. It exposed 911 in part 1 and did a great job on the Federal Reserve in Part 3.
Recently I was trying to explain the World Trade Centre to a friend and tried to look it up on YouTube. The only available part was part 2, which is the religious conspiracy which you mention above, that tries to say Christianity is an offshoot of paganism and Our Lord is what Jordan Peterson would call an Archetype. A reminder what information is allowed and pushed, to me this is a clear case of how the elites are trying to push this.

What would I do if confronted with this type of argument is to just ask them detailed questions about the theory, most won't be able to actually come up with anything beyond an article or two, and a theory from some archaeologist. A question such as "how exactly do they know the egyptians called the God Yaweh?, isn't that a hebrew word?" Then I would point to the whether they believe in God and try to shift things back to bigger questions about our existence. I think people who are interested in these stories or alternative theories are largely disappointed with how emasculated Christianity in it's current form is. Largely, they just want something totally disconnected from the Tribe and this is the nugget they are looking for.

I've had difficulty managing people who bring things like this up also, and those who will shed Christianity because it's not politically expedient to the "White" cause. Which couldn't be further from the truth.
 

The Beast1

Peacock
Orthodox Inquirer
Gold Member
He wanted Abraham to understand that the city was unrighteous. He knew that to just to say to Abraham “ I am God who are you to question me“ would push Abraham away. So he had to let Abraham learn for himself. Kind of how you sometimes have to deal with a teenager. But OK. You research Yahweh was really a demonic volcano God. Then come back and post a reply refuting that. Then we can analyze whether your argument could convince someone inclined to believe that is true that it is in fact false.

First, I consider this a failure of your
faith and a very poor answer. Letting someone experience the salary of sin just to teach them a lesson is a path I wish for no one. I hope you figure out a better way to deal with such an inquiry for your own children because sometimes people don't come back to Christ from apostasy.

As for the Yahweh being a volcano God. The answer to that is simple, is volcanism in the bible? No, then the theory is really conjecture from anthropologists about early man from an incomplete archeological record. Fun conjecture but an incomplete record when held against the gospel.

Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. God does not change. I don't like the way you say God can be reasoned with, it's baked with the assumption that God can be unreasonable and we have to calm Him down sometimes.

God could have been curt with Abraham but instead He was patient and graceful with him. I don't think it's because He had to pick His words carefully so as not to lose Abraham but because that's His Nature, He is kind, loving and patient, especially to the Church.

There is another passage where Moses seemingly changes God's mind. It would be incorrect to view that God, who created all things, has decreed the end from the beginning, knows all things, just lost His cool and its a good thing Moses was there to calm Him down.

Don't assume I baked anything into my text beyond what I wrote. God's plan never changes, but God can be reasoned with on how he carries out his plan.

Especially in your example, that's exactly what happened. Take a look at Exodus 32:
When the people saw that Moses vdelayed to come down from the mountain, the people gathered themselves together to Aaron and said to him, w“Up, make us gods who shall xgo before us. As for this Moses, the man who brought us up out of the land of Egypt, we do not know what has become of him.” 2 So Aaron said to them, “Take off the yrings of gold that are in the ears of your wives, your sons, and your daughters, and bring them to me.” 3 So all the people took off the rings of gold that were in their ears and brought them to Aaron. 4 zAnd he received the gold from their hand and fashioned it with a graving tool and made a golden1 calf. And they said, a“These are your gods, O Israel, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt!” 5 When Aaron saw this, he built an altar before it. And Aaron bmade a proclamation and said, “Tomorrow shall be a feast to the Lord.” 6 And they rose up early the next day and offered burnt offerings and brought peace offerings. And cthe people sat down to eat and drink and rose up dto play.

7 And the Lord said to Moses, e“Go down, for your people, whom you brought up out of the land of Egypt, have fcorrupted themselves. 8 They have turned aside quickly out of the way that gI commanded them. They have made for themselves a golden calf and have worshiped it and sacrificed to it and said, ‘These are your gods, O Israel, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt!’ ” 9 And the Lord said to Moses, “I have seen this people, and behold, hit is a stiff-necked people. 10 Now therefore ilet me alone, that jmy wrath may burn hot against them and kI may consume them, in order that lI may make a great nation of you.”

11 But Moses implored the Lord his God and said, “O Lord, why does your wrath burn hot against your people, whom you have brought out of the land of Egypt with great power and with a mighty hand? 12 nWhy should the Egyptians say, ‘With evil intent did he bring them out, to kill them in the mountains and to consume them from the face of the earth’? Turn from your burning anger and orelent from this disaster against your people. 13 Remember Abraham, Isaac, and Israel, your servants, to whom you pswore by your own self, and said to them, q‘I will multiply your offspring as the stars of heaven, and all this land that I have promised I will give to your offspring, and they shall inherit it forever.’ ” 14 And the Lord rrelented from the disaster that he had spoken of bringing on his people.

15 Then sMoses turned and went down from the mountain with the ttwo tablets of the testimony in his hand, tablets that were written on both sides; on the front and on the back they were written. 16 uThe tablets were the work of God, and the writing was the writing of God, engraved on the tablets. 17 When vJoshua heard the noise of the people as they shouted, he said to Moses, “There is a noise of war in the camp.” 18 But he said, “It is not the sound of wshouting for victory, or the sound of the cry of defeat, but the sound of singing that I hear.” 19 And as soon as he came near the camp and xsaw the calf and the dancing, Moses’ anger burned hot, and he threw the tablets out of his hands and broke them at the foot of the mountain. 20 He took the calf that they had made and burned it with fire and ground it to powder and scattered it on the water and made the people of Israel drink it.

Moses convinced God to hold off on punishing the Israelites and instead let Moses be the one to do so. Why? Because God's punishment would be like killing a fly with a bazooka when Moses could achieve the same result for much less
The text reads, "and the Lord relented from the disaster" is crystal clear. God was walked back from his proverbial belt lashing whooping of the Israelites and instead let Moses do a spanking instead. How God went about enacting his plan changed.
 

GodfatherPartTwo

Kingfisher
Protestant
Don't assume I baked anything into my text beyond what I wrote. God's plan never changes, but God can be reasoned with on how he carries out his plan.

Moses convinced God to hold off on punishing the Israelites and instead let Moses be the one to do so. Why? Because God's punishment would be like killing a fly with a bazooka when Moses could achieve the same result for much less
The text reads, "and the Lord relented from the disaster" is crystal clear. God was walked back from his proverbial belt lashing whooping of the Israelites and instead let Moses do a spanking instead. How God went about enacting his plan changed.
In no way did Moses change God's decree. God had the same information that He had before Moses even spoke. If you're a subscriber to Middle Knowledge, where God has to make His decisions within the parameters set by free actions of creatures then I can see why you believe this.

God changes man, not man changes God.
 

The Beast1

Peacock
Orthodox Inquirer
Gold Member
In no way did Moses change God's decree. God had the same information that He had before Moses even spoke. If you're a subscriber to Middle Knowledge, where God has to make His decisions within the parameters set by free actions of creatures then I can see why you believe this.

God changes man, not man changes God.
Moses didn't change God's decree, that is not what I said! God wanted to punish the Israelites and Moses convinced God to let himself be the one do the punishing instead of God, hence God relenting.

As for middle knowledge, i've never heard of this concept before. I'll have to look into this but I've never heard of it before our conversation. What I've said is simply my own understanding from reading the text.
 

infowarrior1

Crow
Protestant
Especially in your example, that's exactly what happened. Take a look at Exodus 32:


Moses convinced God to hold off on punishing the Israelites and instead let Moses be the one to do so. Why? Because God's punishment would be like killing a fly with a bazooka when Moses could achieve the same result for much less
The text reads, "and the Lord relented from the disaster" is crystal clear. God was walked back from his proverbial belt lashing whooping of the Israelites and instead let Moses do a spanking instead. How God went about enacting his plan changed.

God has refused mercy in certain circumstances:

Ezekiel 14:12-16
12And the word of the LORD came to me, saying, 13“Son of man, if a land sins against Me by acting unfaithfully, and I stretch out My hand against it to cut off its supplya of food, to send famine upon it, and to cut off from it both man and beast, 14then even if these three men—Noah, Daniel, and Job—were in it, their righteousness could deliver only themselves, declares the Lord GOD.

15Or if I send wild beasts through the land to leave it childless and desolate, with no man passing through it for fear of the beasts, 16then as surely as I live, declares the Lord GOD, even if these three men were in it, they could not deliver their own sons or daughters. They alone would be delivered, but the land would be desolate.

Not even Moses pleading got God to draw back his decision to bar him from Canaan:

Deuteronomy 3:23-28
23At that time I also pleaded with the LORD: 24“O Lord GOD, You have begun to show Your greatness and power to Your servant. For what god in heaven or on earth can perform such works and mighty acts as Yours? 25Please let me cross over and see the good land beyond the Jordan—that pleasant hill country as well as Lebanon!”

26But the LORD was angry with me on account of you, and He would not listen to me. “That is enough,” the LORD said to me. “Do not speak to Me again about this matter. 27Go to the top of Pisgah and look to the west and north and south and east. See the land with your own eyes, for you will not cross this Jordan. 28But commission Joshua, encourage him, and strengthen him, for he will cross over ahead of the people and enable them to inherit the land that you will see.”

In reference to this incident when Moses and Aaron disobeyed God:

2Now there was no water for the congregation, so they gathered against Moses and Aaron. 3The people quarreled with Moses and said, “If only we had perished with our brothers before the LORD! 4Why have you brought the LORD’s assembly into this wilderness for us and our livestock to die here? 5Why have you led us up out of Egypt to bring us to this wretched place? It is not a place of grain, figs, vines, or pomegranates—and there is no water to drink!”

6Then Moses and Aaron went from the presence of the assembly to the entrance to the Tent of Meeting. They fell facedown, and the glory of the LORD appeared to them. 7And the LORD said to Moses, 8“Take the staff and assemble the congregation. You and your brother Aaron are to speak to the rock while they watch, and it will pour out its water. You will bring out water from the rock and provide drink for the congregation and their livestock.”

9So Moses took the staff from the LORD’s presence, just as he had been commanded. 10Then Moses and Aaron gathered the assembly in front of the rock, and Moses said to them, “Listen now, you rebels, must we bring you water out of this rock?” 11Then Moses raised his hand and struck the rock twice with his staff, so that a great amount of water gushed out, and the congregation and their livestock were able to drink.

12But the LORD said to Moses and Aaron, “Because you did not trust Me to show My holiness in the sight of the Israelites, you will not bring this assembly into the land that I have given them.”

13These were the waters of Meribah,a where the Israelites quarreled with the LORD, and He showed His holiness among them.
 

infowarrior1

Crow
Protestant
Moses didn't change God's decree, that is not what I said! God wanted to punish the Israelites and Moses convinced God to let himself be the one do the punishing instead of God, hence God relenting.

As for middle knowledge, i've never heard of this concept before. I'll have to look into this but I've never heard of it before our conversation. What I've said is simply my own understanding from reading the text.

I recommend reading this too:
God dealt with Abraham in human terms for his own sake; but even before the conversation started, the matter was decided. God did not change nor compromise, but in fact, in feigning ignorance (v. 21), dropped a very strong hint that intercession on Abraham's part was desired.

This incident was more than a typical ANE barter-exchange, then: It was also a tone-setting meeting laying down the terms upon which God would relate to His covenant people. He knew what they would do; but He also wanted them to come to Him in their need. (And in any event, since all 6 members of Lot's family eventually fouled up, it was proven that there were no righteous people in Sodom on that day.)

This general principle of intercession -- which of course was always foreknown -- can be seen in other cites commonly used in this argument: Exodus 32:10-14; Numbers 16:20-35 and 44-50; 2 Kings 20:1-7, and Amos 7:3, 6. But let's look at some other key cites.



Unless God explicitly says otherwise God is open to mercy. God could have destroyed Israel if Moses didn't intercede.

But God chose Moses so that like Christ he can intercede. As Christ pleads on our behalf. So Moses pleaded on behalf of Israel.

Even all the Public and Major Miracles that God does also carry a Symbolic value. God doesn't do miracles arbitrarily. And many things God also doesn't do coincidentally.

Even the crossing the Red Sea which historically happened. God intended it also to be symbolic of Baptism.
 
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