Secession a Possibility?

budoslavic

Owl
Gold Member
This is ridiculous. States should stop obeying and enforcing the law. Law isn't law, when millions suffer and are put out of work. States should take a page out of Mexico's book, chase the federal government out when they try enforcing these unjust edicts. That includes gun-control.
States should follow Florida's playbook. I just posted this in the other threads (Biden-Harris Administration & Criticisms of COVID narrative & Policy).

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Gov. DeSantis Tells Biden: “Go F*ck Yourself”​

Florida Governor Ron DeSantis on Wednesday did not mince words on a congested conference call with Biden and federal health authorities who are seeking to prohibit domestic travel to and from the Sunshine State. DeSantis and Biden exchanged salvos of biting barbs after the criminal president said the federal government had authority to “restrict movement” of the people.

Citing concerns over the widespread proliferation of Covid-19 variants, Biden said he might have to prohibit vehicle and air traffic until the CDC and NIH were confident that currently available vaccinations had a proven efficacy against emerging strains, such as highly transmissible anomalies from the United Kingdom, Brazil, and South Africa.

Also on the call were “Deep State” Dr. Fauci and acting CDC Director Rochelle Walensky, both of whom championed Biden’s idea and told DeSantis that surging cases in Florida threatened to undermine the federal government’s expansive efforts to mitigate spread across the country. Florida, Dr. Fauci said, was the epicenter of Covid-19 mutations, and argued that new variants accounted for between 15-35% of new cases in Florida.

Walensky argued on the call that any attempt by DeSantis to resist a federally mandated travel ban would be immoral, selfish, and possibly illegal.

Biden echoed her words, and he berated DeSantis for having left Florida’s economy open during “the dark days of Covid.” Moreover, Biden claimed he had unilateral and constitutional authority to protect the nation’s health from “rogue politicians” acting in contravention of established health guidelines.

DeSantis’s initial reply was brief and blunt: “I will not comply,” he said, and then cited the CDC’s own statistics showing a nationwide decline in active Covid-19 cases.

Florida had arrested the spread of Covid-19, DeSantis argued, and accused Biden of targeting Republican states that supported Donald Trump.

“Florida absolutely will not comply,” DeSantis repeated. “Instituting a travel ban or restriction of movement would be a gross example of federal overreach with no grounding in law or science. We have Covid-19 in check, and you’re trying to exert unlawful authority over our state and its people,” he chided Biden.

Biden then tacitly threatened to withhold federal funding and to deny Florida access to Covid-19 vaccinations.

“C’mon, man, Florida needs our help, and you need vaccines, which are hard to come by, isn’t that right, Dr. Fauci,” Biden said.

The “Deep State” doctor replied in the affirmative, telling DeSantis that he expects the prevalence of the UK variant to double or triple every week to 10 days.

“Governor, do you want to be responsible for reinfecting the nation? Truth is, we don’t even know how effective current vaccines are against the UK strain.”

DeSantis told Dr. Fauci he trusted his own state health authorities over financially incentivized federal officials.

“How much do you stand to earn from these vaccines, Dr. Fauci? And, Joe, if you continue with this course of action, I will authorize the state National Guard to protect the movement of Floridians,” DeSantis said.

“Address me as Mr. President or President Biden,” Biden said.

“I will not, and you can go fuck yourself,” DeSantis said before hanging up.

In closing, it seems obvious that Team Biden favors perpetual lockdowns and a stagnant economy, keeping Americans imprisoned under a de facto state of medical martial law.

 

Cicero12

Sparrow
No. If succession wasn't possible when people only had cannons and muskets, how the fuck is possible when the US government has literal drone swarms and nukes?
 
States should follow Florida's playbook. I just posted this in the other threads (Biden-Harris Administration & Criticisms of COVID narrative & Policy).

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Gov. DeSantis Tells Biden: “Go F*ck Yourself”​


This is fantastic, but there is a possibility that he might be like Alberta's Jason Kenny after a "vacation to Switzerland."
 
If Biden intends to restrict travel, that MIGHT be the final straw that breaks the back of the American union. You can only violate people for so long, before they lose any respect for law and order.
Add in:

* The dollar hyperinflating or the price controls come for the groceries.
* The incoming gun grabs.
* To a lesser extent high profile assassinations on either side.
 
No. If succession wasn't possible when people only had cannons and muskets, how the fuck is possible when the US government has literal drone swarms and nukes?

The American government cannot afford to nuke itself. The land is too valuable.

As evidenced by last years events, nobody gives a damn, let alone nobody has the stomach to fight in this country.

Let's talk about the American government. Bin Laden was right: our federal government is a paper tiger. Every person can be purchased for a price. CIA? FBI? Military? They all have a price. They all can be bought. Whether that's pensions, benefits or a good paycheck, these people thrive and die by incentive - not the other way around.

All these government agencies talk a good deal about 'fighting' domestic terrorism, but reality is brutal. These agencies would soundly be defeated. They already have enough enemies: bratva, yakuza, sinaloa cartel, muslim brotherhood, etc. I'm really astounded the federal government is this dumb. If you wage war against peaceful people, they will not only turn against you - they will turn to your enemies to de-legitimize and debase you. Just like Italians tolerated the Sicilian Mafia during fascism, we could see the same happen here, if Biden gets his wish come true, with his 'war' on domestic 'terrorism' and 'insurgents'.

I hope cooler and smarter heads prevail, but that seems to be passing.
 

Renzy

Pelican
Brightline Watch Poll Shows Nearly a Third of Americans Support Breaking up the United States Into Like-Minded Countries


Secession

We asked respondents, for the first time, their views about a scenario in which the United States would break up into more than one country. Secession is a genuinely radical proposition. Until recently, we would have regarded it as too marginal to include in a survey. But state legislators in Mississippi and Texas and state GOP leaders in Texas and Wyoming have openly advocated secession in recent months, prompting us to design two survey items to gauge perceptions of this idea.4 We caution that these survey items reflect initial reactions by respondents about an issue that they are very unlikely to have considered carefully.

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Our first question is generic and framed in terms of reducing conflict:

“Some people say the divisions within our country have grown so deep that we would be better off dividing into more like-minded regions that would govern themselves separately. Do you support or oppose the idea of the United States dividing into more than one nation?”

Overall, 29% of respondents supported the dissolution of the country into like-minded regions (10% strongly, 19% somewhat). Support was highest among Republicans (35%) and independents (37%) compared to only 21% among Democrats. Though most Americans reject the prospect of secession, these results at least suggest that a substantial minority of people do not instinctively reject the idea.

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The unwillingness of respondents to reject secession outright is widespread and context-dependent. Republicans express greater support for secession overall than Democrats, but Democrats are more amenable to secession than are Republicans in regions they dominate.
 
^^^
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Ever read The Nine Nations of North America? The map sort of looks like the above. We're not just culturally different geographically. We can't agree or communicate on social issues. Meanwhile the parasitic elite robs all of us. Maybe the future is in regional federations. I can imagine sporting teams being drastically impacted by this.

I asked on the Texas devastated by extreme cold spell thread if any native Texans want to give the over/under odds on Texit happening. Texit would get the secession ball rolling.

When you have responses like this it makes me wonder:

I'm calling it, saboteurs. Texas' power grid is independent from the rest of the 47 mainland states. The weather dipped in most major cities on the eastern part of Texas minus Houston around valentine's day. Not long enough to cause these "blackout" conditions, only meddling at the power-grid level is causing it. Globohomo operatives are trying to put the boot down on them before they get too far along in their return to their own republic like they were 200 years ago.

I'm here in the Hill Country, still going though this mess. Lost three kid goats. Both of my aquariums all of my fish were killed. My entire water system (well water and outside well house) gonna have to be redone at the cost of several thousand dollars. Have not had water for a week now. Starting to smell like my goats....

Turns out that all of our power generation plants were only running at 60% capacity for "greenhouse gas reduction" thanks to Biden's DOE & EPA. They refused a plea from Gov. Abbot to increase to 100% capacity days before the polar vortex even hit. They demanded ERCOT buy power from outside sources or charge $1500 a kW hour which is like paying $1500 a gallon of gas. Would love to put a link here to spread this information, but I have been a lurker for years and only recently joined. You cannot find this information on the left leaning mockingbird media.
 

Easy_C

Peacock
Don’t have the link on my phone but on my work PC I just saw the news feed pop up a poll from Bright Line Watch which found 29% of Americans support a split.
 
Matt Taibbi has written at least 1 article discussing civil war so a split has crossed the vernacular. Just a brief search shows he also discussed how Democrats are eroding civil liberties. I think Democrats will be cool with the rising inflation and the incoming $3+/gallon gas but that will continue to poke the conservative bear. Texas apparently got their request for using more nuclear power declined by the DOE for environmental reasons. They or Idaho are the ones that could kick this off but I'm not holding my breath.

I don't think we'll ever get that "peaceful" option. It will ultimately boil down to civil war even if there are attempts at a techno-totalitarian state. I've already made my switch to Linux among other countermeasures and I'm kind of sticking my neck out here by posting on this forum. I don't see how the elite can continue to chip away at civil liberties without violence happening. The proles will be fighting on the streets and the elite, Bezos and up, will be on their private islands.
 

Tl;dr
Door kickers aren't necessary and digital deplatforming will force gunowners to turn in their firearms.

I also suggest reading the comments. I think this is a breaking point for most conservatives. The commies already neutered the first amendment. Now the fat lady sings.
 

Towgunner

Kingfisher
I do think secession is very much in the cards. I'm looking beyond some of the more overt headlines, such as "Texas introduces bill to secede" etc. First, such articles are growing in number. But, when I see things like state legislatures banning cross dressing treatments and banning males from competing with females all of these things are the opposite of the biden administrations policies. biden, or perhaps more accurately, harris, and the fully aligned congress are NOT good. Worst still are all the executive orders biden, or more then likely, harris, or more then likely blm, issued since day 1. But, what I'm starting to see is a lot of non compliance. And I hope this trend continues and I think it will. Coupled with this is the very obvious physical and mental fragility of biden. This past week his feed got cut, harris is taking calls, congress wants to strip him of war powers and take away the nuke codes. This administration might have a lot of "bark" but as for their bite, well, its an old senile man. This is given me optimism. I think we need a lot of non-compliance going forward. As for secession, I see it happening. This country is far too splintered and the divides are irreconcilable. For instance, you can't compromise with giving or not giving a 3 year old hormone blockers. Either you're a sick f*&k or you're a member of the human race. Ditto for pedophilia. Ditto of fat acceptance. And even with the less disturbing things, you can't compromise with taking away basic fundamental rights such as speech or association or gun rights etc. Either you support freedom of speech of you don't.
 

Papist

Robin
I'm not American, but can states not peacefully secede from the Union? I had an idea they could, but then the Confederate States were not allowed to, so I'm a bit confused. I always thought self-determination was seen as a virtuous, trendy position.
 
There are two methods to consider on the topic of secession: explicitly seceding and implicitly seceding. The first scenario would occur with a statewide referendum to gauge the will of its populace. If say, Texans decide they no longer want to be part of the U.S., a joint resolution upholding the referendum, authorized by its legislature and signed by its governor would be sent to U.S. Congress. A bill of secession is an unequivocal act of law. This method is how most people would imagine the process occurs.

Then thereʻs the method that might be harder to achieve but would have permanence. The federal government canʻt force a state to exist. If every township and county in the state dissolved its charter with the consent of its populace, the state itself could follow suit and pass legislation of dissolution. As an example, Californiaʻs numerous municipalities could self-disable with the intent of surrendering the territory to a receiving state. So the northern counties could go to the proposed greater state of Idaho and the rest could go to a reinstated Republic of California. All of which would not require the consent of the other 49 states. Since the Republic preceded the State of CA, one could argue the Republic has a substantial legal standing. This would be the end-run that could defuse anti-secession talk.
 

Elipe

Kingfisher
My two cent on this is that the threat of the future isn't from the federal government. As another poster pointed out, FedGov is a paper tiger. More the threat is corporations, because you still have a lot of idiots that support secession from the FedGov but not from corporations. People still worship Microsoft, Amazon, Apple, all those big corporations that want to keep online dossiers on you for wrongthink and so that they can deplatform you... not only from social platforms, but also from financial platforms.

Corpocracy is the Big Bad of this century.
 

Blade Runner

Pelican
My two cent on this is that the threat of the future isn't from the federal government. As another poster pointed out, FedGov is a paper tiger. More the threat is corporations, because you still have a lot of idiots that support secession from the FedGov but not from corporations. People still worship Microsoft, Amazon, Apple, all those big corporations that want to keep online dossiers on you for wrongthink and so that they can deplatform you... not only from social platforms, but also from financial platforms.

Corpocracy is the Big Bad of this century.
Totally agree. Here and there they do some scary stuff, but that's mixed in with ... not even being able to secure the Capitol building. Haha, what a joke. That's why we need to be scared of what the current admin is and stands for, so we can turn it around and get a strong leader to not sleep with the enemy like the Biden family, but rather put a dead horse head in their bed and send a message. Let's hope that happens and the gloves come off in 2022 and beyond. We shall see.
 

paninaro

Pelican
There are two methods to consider on the topic of secession: explicitly seceding and implicitly seceding. The first scenario would occur with a statewide referendum to gauge the will of its populace. If say, Texans decide they no longer want to be part of the U.S., a joint resolution upholding the referendum, authorized by its legislature and signed by its governor would be sent to U.S. Congress. A bill of secession is an unequivocal act of law. This method is how most people would imagine the process occurs.

Then thereʻs the method that might be harder to achieve but would have permanence. The federal government canʻt force a state to exist. If every township and county in the state dissolved its charter with the consent of its populace, the state itself could follow suit and pass legislation of dissolution. As an example, Californiaʻs numerous municipalities could self-disable with the intent of surrendering the territory to a receiving state. So the northern counties could go to the proposed greater state of Idaho and the rest could go to a reinstated Republic of California. All of which would not require the consent of the other 49 states. Since the Republic preceded the State of CA, one could argue the Republic has a substantial legal standing. This would be the end-run that could defuse anti-secession talk.

Won't the federal government react to this once this starts? They'll just say "Hey, Texas if you are no longer considering yourself part of the US, then we'll cut off funding." and suddenly there is no funding for social security checks, school lunches, food assistance, highway projects, air traffic control, the military bases close up, banks shut out of the banking system, and on and on.

It took the UK years to figure out how to make Brexit actually work, and it's a work in progress. I wonder how Texas will be able to pull this off. States are so connected to the federal government economically that' it's a big effor to unravel all that.
 
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