Testosterone injections

Blade Runner

Ostrich
Orthodox
Yeah, my happy zone is around 750. My doctor wanted me to try to 140 because he said most guys tend to like the 900 range, but I started turning back into my old self a bit too much for my liking. My natural level in my twenties was probably above 1000.
Does the physiologic/natural effect of testosterone make you curious about the link between the physical and spiritual realm? I am all about promoting self control but it is interesting that sexual immorality (I know there have been a lot of debates on that over the years here) is clearly the balancing point/tip toe of cost-benefit over human history regarding testosterone. Without testosterone basically none of us would be here from a civilizational point of view and children producing one. God knows women are fairly ambivalent in comparison regarding sexuality.
 

Blade Runner

Ostrich
Orthodox
Getting back to the topic at hand, I know a lot of the guys on T nation had said that the late Dr. Crisler (and I have read his papers) said that you can pretty much take 7-10 mg / day of T with little change to physiology or adverse effects but major gains from its beneficial effects once you age out of naturally producing as much.
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
Getting back to the topic at hand, I know a lot of the guys on T nation had said that the late Dr. Crisler (and I have read his papers) said that you can pretty much take 7-10 mg / day of T with little change to physiology or adverse effects but major gains from its beneficial effects once you age out of naturally producing as much.
I had a lot of respect for Doctor John. I have had dinner with him (and his ex wife), been to his house and stayed in his guest room. I just found out recently about how he died and am saddened by it. I would be interested in a T gel if I could because of the more normal rise and fall of T levels. He was always banging that drum.
 

Blade Runner

Ostrich
Orthodox
I had a lot of respect for Doctor John. I have had dinner with him (and his ex wife), been to his house and stayed in his guest room. I just found out recently about how he died and am saddened by it. I would be interested in a T gel if I could because of the more normal rise and fall of T levels. He was always banging that drum.
This is really interesting because from a medical point of view (I have followed the research over the years) the anabolic steroid (overreaction, scare, worry) thing is largely just a reflection of the society = anti-male. Abuse and supraphysiologic levels can have their issues for sure, and that's why I find particularly interesting the replacement guys who are quite level headed and realistic about this stuff. If you can get a good pattern or practicality with a gel to replace for someone considering it at age 50, and it's not crazy expensive, it sounds like a great option.

If you have the money to do that and are in the 50s age range, considering your T value, I think it would be foolish to not at least consider it. I see the wasting going on in people over 60. But I must point out as well that this past generation that medical science has been able to keep alive for such a long time rarely worked out/trained with weights. I don't know many relatives (who have longevity) who actually look really good. They just look good for their age.
 

FrancisK

Kingfisher
Gold Member
Getting back to the topic at hand, I know a lot of the guys on T nation had said that the late Dr. Crisler (and I have read his papers) said that you can pretty much take 7-10 mg / day of T with little change to physiology or adverse effects but major gains from its beneficial effects once you age out of naturally producing as much.

That’s the new method that a lot of guys are using, micro doses sub q which in theory leads to much more stable blood levels which leads to less sides.
 

Blade Runner

Ostrich
Orthodox
That’s the new method that a lot of guys are using, micro doses sub q which in theory leads to much more stable blood levels which leads to less sides.
Is it less than that range (7-10mg) that Crisler spoke of? What's your take on the gel stuff. Man, some of the pricing on that is unreal, even for those of us who could afford it. It just seems like a ripoff in the USA.
 

FrancisK

Kingfisher
Gold Member
Is it less than that range (7-10mg) that Crisler spoke of? What's your take on the gel stuff. Man, some of the pricing on that is unreal, even for those of us who could afford it. It just seems like a ripoff in the USA.


To be honest I haven't done any in depth research on it myself as I really haven't had any complications from test use alone so there hasn't been any need for me to change what I'm doing. But from the snippets I have read and other peoples experiences the 10-20mg a day seems to be in line with what most do, some adjust based on levels but to be honest levels don't mean all that much what really matters is how you feel. If your numbers are supposedly in line but you don't feel good then you need to adjust your dose, the numbers on a sheet of paper mean nothing you're doing this to feel better and everyone is different.

Mind you these are guys that had issues in the first place so that's why they tried a different method, if your current method isn't giving you any problems then why change it up?

As far as the gel goes the experiences I have heard is that the main issue is that it makes your levels fluctuate wildly and rapidly, which of course is what leads to side effects. It's just another product for people with the stigma towards needles if you ask me, but that's a whole other topic don't get me started on that one!
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
This is really interesting because from a medical point of view (I have followed the research over the years) the anabolic steroid (overreaction, scare, worry) thing is largely just a reflection of the society = anti-male. Abuse and supraphysiologic levels can have their issues for sure, and that's why I find particularly interesting the replacement guys who are quite level headed and realistic about this stuff. If you can get a good pattern or practicality with a gel to replace for someone considering it at age 50, and it's not crazy expensive, it sounds like a great option.

If you have the money to do that and are in the 50s age range, considering your T value, I think it would be foolish to not at least consider it. I see the wasting going on in people over 60. But I must point out as well that this past generation that medical science has been able to keep alive for such a long time rarely worked out/trained with weights. I don't know many relatives (who have longevity) who actually look really good. They just look good for their age.
I agree. The benefits are all over the place with TRT, IF properly administered.
 

jarlo

Woodpecker
Orthodox
This absolutely nutty article probably belongs in the clown world thread, but I thought it fit here in a way. It got some backlash and so was removed from the website, but I found it on the Wayback Machine and it is quite the laugh.

Dear Men: Stop Working Out.

Physical fitness creates a cycle of toxic masculinity that must be eradicated.


Toxic masculinity refers to the cultural norms in a patriarchal society that equates masculinity with control, aggression and violence. Men are conditioned from a young age to believe that emotion, compassion and empathy are somehow “unmanly”.

One of the main tactics used by those in power of a male-driven society is the exploitation of physical strength. Western governments use propaganda to perpetuate a narrative that men must work out and maintain a level of physical fitness if they want to be respected in society. This belief was created purposefully as a way to ensure that the patriarchal agenda lives on by continuing to force women into submission via intimidation.

Women are, on average, intellectually superior to men. This intellectual maturity allows them to have a greater hold on their emotions when faced with confrontation. In comparison, the fragility of toxic masculinity creates an atmosphere where men feel the need to prove themselves as an “Alpha”, resulting in extreme aggression and physical confrontation. This reaction is enhanced when levels of testosterone are increased in the male body through physical fitness.

Studies have shown that signs of aggression in male dogs decreased exponentially following castration. Dr. Nicholas Dodman, veterinarian and behavior specialist says, “Neutering your male [dog] has valuable behaviour benefits. It can minimize numerous unwanted behaviors, prevent frustrations and improve quality of life“. This same logic can be applied here – the lower the testosterone, the happier the man and the safer the society.

Unfortunately, castration is not an option for humans at this point in time due to lack of research in the field of synthetically engineered sperm which is necessary for procreation.
– Anonymous Medical Doctor with a PhD.

As a progressive society, we must acknowledge the fact that increased volumes of testosterone and the lack of emotional intelligence amongst men is being used as a weapon by our government to continue the cycle of misogynistic oppression towards women.

To the woke males out there: You need to take accountability for your fellow man’s actions and make a conscientious effort to put an end to this form of sexism. Don’t remain a sheep for the rest of your life.

Sincerely,
A concerned feminist.

TLDR: Keep on lifting and sticking your butts full of testosterone.
 

FrancisK

Kingfisher
Gold Member
This absolutely nutty article probably belongs in the clown world thread, but I thought it fit here in a way. It got some backlash and so was removed from the website, but I found it on the Wayback Machine and it is quite the laugh.

Dear Men: Stop Working Out.

Physical fitness creates a cycle of toxic masculinity that must be eradicated.










TLDR: Keep on lifting and sticking your butts full of testosterone.

I always wonder what people are thinking when they write shit like that and if they think people actually go for it, or maybe what type of person would go for it. Even after everything we have seen it still boggles my mind that there are living breathing people like that, that actually made it somewhere in life.....
 
This absolutely nutty article probably belongs in the clown world thread, but I thought it fit here in a way. It got some backlash and so was removed from the website, but I found it on the Wayback Machine and it is quite the laugh.

Dear Men: Stop Working Out.

Physical fitness creates a cycle of toxic masculinity that must be eradicated.










TLDR: Keep on lifting and sticking your butts full of testosterone.

Of course women are known for their self-control when it comes to their emotions. Or anything else really.
 

Dr Mantis Toboggan

Pelican
Gold Member
This absolutely nutty article probably belongs in the clown world thread, but I thought it fit here in a way. It got some backlash and so was removed from the website, but I found it on the Wayback Machine and it is quite the laugh.

Dear Men: Stop Working Out.

Physical fitness creates a cycle of toxic masculinity that must be eradicated.










TLDR: Keep on lifting and sticking your butts full of testosterone.

I remember when that article made the rounds a year or two ago and I believe it's satire, but the fact that it easily could be serious is damning enough in itself.

Tucker had Ian Smith (gym owner in New Jersey who refused to shut down and has appeared on that show and others periodically throughout the year) on the other night and started getting into how "they" seem to want to keep people weak despite the fact that physical health is one of the best defenses against the virus.
 

FrancisK

Kingfisher
Gold Member
Bookmarked thread here lol.

I know this is something I really needed in my life for quite some time.

If your blood work numbers come back low and you’ve fixed anything in your life that could contribute to that, as in diet, exercise, stress and a healthy lifestyle in general then by all means. No need to suffer through an ailment when you don’t have to especially one so hugely important to being a man.

But just make sure it’s something you actually do need and not just something you want or something to cover up for other fallacies....
 

MichaelWitcoff

Hummingbird
Orthodox
Trying to get off the TRT and a couple friends recommended Pine Pollen tincture instead. It’s loaded with testosterone and definitely does the trick, but I had some trouble falling asleep yesterday due to the surge in energy. After my workout yesterday I felt like I could have done a second workout with no issue and I was in a great mood all day.
 

redbeard

Hummingbird
Gold Member
Oh yea 100%, my super juiced out for years crazy irresponsible with it friend knocked up his wife twice all geared up and I know lots of other people have as well. I was speaking in regards to raising your natural testosterone levels, it's not the same thing as fertility.


IN FACT, new studies are showing that it actually benefits you to have raised testosterone to promote fertility. A TRT dose would not necessarily hinder your ability to knock a chick up. When you start blasting huge doses and using other compounds, mind you some of these steroids were specifically originally researched as male contraceptive, that's when you start having issues. But even then some people don't, it's very individual.
"You know what they call guys who use steroids for contraception?"
"Dad"
 

jarlo

Woodpecker
Orthodox
Trying to get off the TRT and a couple friends recommended Pine Pollen tincture instead. It’s loaded with testosterone and definitely does the trick, but I had some trouble falling asleep yesterday due to the surge in energy. After my workout yesterday I felt like I could have done a second workout with no issue and I was in a great mood all day.
Why are you trying to get off TRT? I started getting interested in TRT prior to committing fully to Orthodoxy, so I'm now evaluating whether it's something I should still do in light of my faith. I'm scheduled for a "final discusssion" with a doctor next week after which I'd begin TRT - labs are all done.
 

FrancisK

Kingfisher
Gold Member
If I can get the same effect through something completely natural and organic, I'd much rather take that than injecting chemicals into my body.


Can't argue with that, give yourself 6 months and see where your levels are at.....most people will recover but to what degree is very individual. Make sure you are putting yourself in the best position for that as far as health and lifestyle.

Even if your numbers on a piece of paper say your levels are in the tank it doesn't matter, all that matters is how you feel. If what you feel like isn't what you want, well then hey it just is what it is and either live with that or jump back on TRT for life......sucks but that's how it goes.
 
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