The Bitcoin (BTC) thread


Gold Member
Anyone got any experience of how to buy BTC on Paxful SAFELY...

I'm not inviting horror stories (I know they're out there) but I'm in a location where Paxful is the only platform that operates...

But it's pretty sketchy...

Made a small purchase yesterday, and it's a step of faith to send funds and hope all's good.

Any (helpful) tips to avoid being scammed?

I am going to disclose that I am not really familiar with how Paxful allows you to meet in person because their website seems to be quite sparse with cash-in-person ads, but it seems to have that feature, and I just looked at the website there are no offers in my area.., and I searched a lot of other nearby towns and cities, and there were not too many ads listing to interact in-person. Maybe I should make an account on there... I would prefer that there were some kind of "within x # of miles" selection on their website, too).

I suppose that you were referring to other payment methods using paxful? If you are buying the bitcoin, and you have an ability to reverse your payment, then the one sending you the bitcoin is taking more of the risk. That's part of the reason that if I am selling bitcoin, I prefer cash and in person transactional method.

If you are getting enough ads on the website for your area and you are contemplating meeting in person, then there is nothing wrong with meeting in person and doing trades in person, if the platform is used as a mechanism that facilitates connecting buyers and sellers. You can respond to ads and you can create your own ads with the terms that you want in order to screen out shenanigans... Of course, you might not be able to screen out all shenanigans.

Before Localbitcoin's changed it's platform (in about summer 2019), it used to be a great means for local buyers and sellers to meet up in person, and some of my means for filtering out potential scammers was to set my BTC trade limits pretty low... something like between $300 and $3k, and I would adjust my willingness to negotiate based on my own cashflow, the current market situation (for example there might be a lot of crazies during certain FOMO periods) or even if someone might want to go beyond my limits based on reasons that seemed completely reasonable to me.

I would also frequently tell my counter-parties that I would be more than willing to consider adjusting my buy/sell terms, such as the limit, after I had traded with them for a few times. I may or may not be negotiable on rate, and that might depend on if I had already set high rates or what the terms of any competition might be.. If I am the only game in town or there are not too many other similarly situated buyer/sellers, then I might NOT be as willing to negotiate rate changes.

Once you get to know some buyers and sellers, then sometimes it could be better to set a discount rate for those frequent customers - that might be a case by case assessment, and Paxful does not seem to have a lot of buyers/sellers using the in-person cash feature.

Anyhow, my sense is that once you figure out means to meet, then you can also figure out means to screen out scammers. You can also do your BTC trades in the lobby of a police station or some publicly open space or a space that you choose and set up rather than the other person set it up (that is if you create your own ad).. You have less ability to set the terms of your BTC trade if you are less established on those platforms, so you need to establish a reputation by making several small trades, or you can choose to trade with counter-parties that have already established good reputations within such platforms and that can build your reputation on that platform, too.

If there are bitcoin or crypto meet-ups in your area, then that can be a means to get involved and meet people for BTC trades, even if you might not want to spend a lot of time getting involved in the meetups. I am not currently in a good area for meet-ups but some larger cities will have meet-ups... and maybe there is going to be more needs for meet-ups in the future if there are fewer channels for non-KYC BTC trading but there are members of the community interested in buying/selling bitcoin. Sure, some people are not even going to mind KYC/AML in regards to their BTC trading, if they believe that they do not have a sufficient amount of other non-KYC options available (such as in person cash trades) - and concededly more difficult to accomplish meet-ups or having a lot of people interested in BTC in more rural or small town/city areas...


Gold Member
"Glacier" protocol comes to mind, although it reads like an academic paper (ever lab vulnerability is consider real-world and needs protection...bit too hollywood)
I am not sure exactly your point, Guy80.

Are you referring to this? or do you have a better link?


Of course, there are going to be a variety of solutions of both self-custody and also custody with third parties.

It seems to me that some institutions are not even authorized to engage in self-custody, so they will need to establish relations with custodians for their BTC.

Also, seems to me that individuals have way more flexibility especially if buying BTC directly. There may be some accounts that individuals have such as 401ks or other kinds of retirement accounts that will not allow for self-custody, but they might allow for options to custody with third parties, and surely sometimes the 401ks or other retirement accounts might control which specific funds are within the ability to select - however, the more common that bank custody of BTC or other kinds of developments of third-party BTC custody options, then the more some of the individual retirement funds will have those BTC selection options available.

For example, I have a 401k, and mine is not very flexible, it only has 5 kinds of funds that can be selected. Accordingly, with my 401k, I allocate in various proportions in each of the 5 options.. and it might look like 35, 25, 20, 15, 5 (or some other allocation variation depending on where I am at in terms of my personal situation, and of course, I do no need to invest in all 5 options), but there are some 401ks that are more flexible and competitive and they will allow for 100s of investment (allocation) options within their program, and those kinds of funds might even have something like GBTC, and they might include additional BTC related funds in the future, too.

Part of my point remains that you are going to look at BTC custodial solutions in different ways whether you are an individual or an institution, and surely a few years ago, I was on the case of my uncle when he was investing in GBTC and I reminded him that he could also buy BTC directly - even though he seemed to preferGBTC as a way to expose himself to BTC volatility. People are going to make differing allocation and custody calculations, and even fail to see some of the power of directly holding at least a portion of their BTC.


Gold Member
Could be, but the real players won't touch it...

Those kinds of purported "real players" will likely be chasing the train later down the road, but no problem.

To each at his own pace, and surely there are a decent number of regular guys that do not really understand or realize what bitcoin is, so those guys should get a bit of a pass. There are some guys who have studied into bitcoin, yet they fail/refuse to at least consider taking a 1% to 10% position in bitcoin (sure, 1% as a kind of minimum), and surely have to have less sympathy for those guys who know but fail/refuse to take even a minimum reasonable position.

The same was true several years ago, but the investment thesis for bitcoin (or at least the hedging aspect) should have become a lot more apparent in the past year or two.. and maybe even moreso when witnessing some seemingly amazing devolution macro-economic happenings in the past 6 months or so.

Edited: By the way, once guys figure out ways to get bitcoin or to source BTC accounts, there are likely so many decently easy ways to get into bitcoin, even in very small quantities, such as DCA'ing at $5 per week, that it seems even less prudent if guys do not consider even those kinds of bare minimum kinds of hedging. Swan bitcoin is one avenue for USA residents (except for NYorkers), but there are other kinds of services around the world.. including maybe instead of $5 per week, there might be different minimums that guys would deal with.
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Gold Member
I just got a notification from Robinhood that it crested the 11k mark today. What's that mean for us average joes ?

There are better ways to monitor BTC price, such as bitcoin wisdom

There are also better ways to expose yourself to bitcoin volatility.

My understanding is that robinhood does not even allow you to withdraw your bitcoin, so therefore, you are not really holding bitcoin - even though you are exposing yourself to bitcoin volatility.

Regarding the direction of BTC, you tell me.

Surely, bitcoin seems to be posturing for upwards price movements, but nothing is guaranteed in bitcoin - even though the BTC charts are currently looking pretty damned bullish for bitcoin.. and even BTC fundamentals and various BTC price prediction models, such as stock to flow, 4-year fractal and s-curve exponential adoption based on networking and metcalfe principles are also looking pretty damned long term bullish for bitcoin - even though short-term prices can surely go all over the place..

Of course, a 7-day BTC price appreciation of more than $2k (and $1,700 of that in less than a two-day period - culminating two days ago and subsequently seeming to hold its own) does feel pretty good while we are in this current (as I type) $11,200 price arena, and such recent shooting upwardly of the BTC price may even serve as a kind of mini-confirmation for guys who have been investing and DCA'ing into BTC for a decent amount of time.
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What would be the best ways to clean your bitcoins ?. I did the KYC stuff ( dumb ) when i was first getting into buying and i have some bitcoins i want to disconnect from my ID. I feel the government has no right at this point to know what i'm up to or to tax ( extort ) me on bitcoin, while they are borrowing and colluding with the central bank to print money from thin air. Just better to be prepared for the next rally when bitcoin will gain a bigger target on its back.
I invested in crypto early 2017 and missed out on the bull run (was traveling for those months and had no access to my ledger nano wallet). I could have made ~700% gains. I didn't invest a whole lot, but enough to make it worthwhile. I know things will get back up there again, hopefully by next year some time. This time, I am not traveling, and I plan on cashing out most of my holdings, and if I can time things right, possibly buy back in once the price gets lower after the bull run. These things are impossible to predict, but as long as one doesn't invest at the peak of the bull run, and has enough patience, they should be able to make profits. The key is having a good plan and not getting swayed by emotions either during the quick rising of prices of the quick crashing of prices.

I have mostly ETH, some BTC, BCH, LTC, and some smaller coins.


So is this a good time to lock in profits? Its temptaing to hodl and see your holdings increase in value but quite often when we see these rises, the crash and downturn is pretty brutal.


Gold Member
So is this a good time to lock in profits? Its temptaing to hodl and see your holdings increase in value but quite often when we see these rises, the crash and downturn is pretty brutal.
I never suggest playing all or nothing.

Accordingly, I suggest figuring out how much you want to invest into BTC, and then DCA into it and establish your allocated amount.

Now, if you have already established a comfortable allocated amount, then you might choose to put in more and to play around with that additional investment amount by selling small amounts of BTC from that additional amount as it goes up, otherwise, just let your allocation continue to ride (and if you are investing an amount that is comfortable to you, then you should not be preoccupying yourself with short term BTC price moves)...

To each their own.. seems like you are inclined to sell.. so that is your choice.


Gold Member
BTC Fib Retracement Chart Looks like a flight to quality this week with Gold setting a new USD ATH (See Fib Extensions Chart) The BTC C wave now into the beginning of Fast impulsive 3rd wave up... and Silver climbing the Fibonacci Retracement Ladder, BTC Next stops are Fib .618 at 12,487, and then the A wave high at 13,868 followed by Fib .786 at 15,750+/-. BTC C wave Target 18,000+/- but as the upper trend channel line indicates could easily break through the previous BTC ATH in Q1 or Q2 2021...

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