The Boomer Question

bucky

Ostrich
I'm working 7 days a week so that I can feel comfortable having children.
That was a bit too much of a wall of text for me to get through, let alone parse and analyze in detail, but let's focus on the first sentence. Don't get me wrong, I generally like your posts and find them interesting, but you should not be advising men on the feasibility of having a family. You don't want a family, you just struggle to admit it for some reason. If you did, you'd make it happen like men around you do every day.

You live at a standard that most men in the world who have children would consider unimaginably luxurious, in a country where you have opportunities they could never fathom, yet you're afraid you might not be "comfortable" if you had a family. I have a cousin who did some missionary work in Peru. She met a family that literally lived in a large cardboard box in an alley. Said they were probably the happiest people she's ever met. You don't need wealth to be happy, please God, or have a family. Anyone out there advising men who aren't destined for the priesthood that having a family is too hard or impossible is not doing God's work, in my opinion.
 
That was a bit too much of a wall of text for me to get through, let alone parse and analyze in detail, but let's focus on the first sentence. Don't get me wrong, I generally like your posts and find them interesting, but you should not be advising men on the feasibility of having a family. You don't want a family, you just struggle to admit it for some reason. If you did, you'd make it happen like men around you do every day.

You live at a standard that most men in the world who have children would consider unimaginably luxurious, in a country where you have opportunities they could never fathom, yet you're afraid you might not be "comfortable" if you had a family. I have a cousin who did some missionary work in Peru. She met a family that literally lived in a large cardboard box in an alley. Said they were probably the happiest people she's ever met. You don't need wealth to be happy, please God, or have a family. Anyone out there advising men who aren't destined for the priesthood that having a family is too hard or impossible is not doing God's work, in my opinion.
I want a family. I don't want a family if that means my children will be 2nd class citizens in a 3rd world country and no chance to fight for a better life. I don't want a family if it means I have to keep working the entire time they are children, either on the road, or long hours at the office. I don't want a family if it means I get laid off and can't find another job due to vast over-population of the USA, jobs eventually going the wayside due to technology increases, and being an evil white male that must not be hired unless the last resort.

I don't care how r-select men live and then have children. I am not an r-select man. I am a K-select man, who comes from a long line of small families from K-selection. It is my genetics. I'm not going to have children and then say "well best of luck kids, it ain't my problem". I'm not wired like that. Most of the west was this way, only having big families due to labor shortages and at the time just as having many kids and those kids survived as modern medicine changed the game.

IMO, many here are at the bargaining stage of grieving the collapse of the west. The 5 stages of grief when it comes to the reality that the west is collapsing and no one is coming to rescue you...

1. Denial - things have always been this way. I think most here are past that stage.
2. Anger - Angry that the supposed leaders didn't do their job. I think most here are past that and now laugh about it calling it "clown world".
3. Bargaining - This is where I think many on this board are stuck. "Well, you can learn to live with less. Move to a rural area. Work in the trades. Go to church. Things will work out.". Things are much more worse than these solutions will fix. Don't take my word for it, read up on the Bolshevik revolution and what they did to church going country folks that they called "kulaks".
4. Depression - I made it past this stage. It all hit at the same time that I aged enough that sometimes depression sets in as the promising future becomes the past.
5. Acceptance. I accept how bad things are going to get. And if I bring kids into this world I don't want to just throw them into the wolves and say "best of luck". I want to try to hand as much down to them as I can, both financially and wisdom.

If you are anyone else wants to know more, please feel free to PM me. I don't want to take away from this Boomer thread. I can add the boomers didn't have to deal with any of this so asking them for advice on it would be futile. My advice is to accumulate as many resources as possible. That is not just money, but land, water, connections with other like minded men, and wisdom. If moving to a rural area doesn't cut into this, then great. If it does, then you may have to tough it out in your urban hell hole for a while, and accumulate more. The only fighting chance we have is accumulation of as much as possible and then bringing this together as a team. We don't survive this as the "rugged individual nonsense" the GOP pushes.
 
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bucky

Ostrich
I want a family. I don't want a family if that means my children will be 2nd class citizens in a 3rd world country and no chance to fight for a better life.
Get at it, then. Every year you continue to dither and rationalize not doing it, women who are young enough to give you kids get further and further out of reach. Which, it seems obvious to me, is what the force that's whispering all of those excuses in your ear wants.

We've likely beaten this dead horse enough but, that said, you'll probably see me again if I see you continue to advise men here to not have kids.
 
Get at it, then. Every year you continue to dither and rationalize not doing it, women who are young enough to give you kids get further and further out of reach. Which, it seems obvious to me, is what the force that's whispering all of those excuses in your ear wants.

We've likely beaten this dead horse enough but, that said, you'll probably see me again if I see you continue to advise men here to not have kids.
Read my advice again. You don't survive this without resources. I don't have the resources yet. I certainly will NOT put my kids in that situation. If you want more please PM me.
 

bucky

Ostrich
Read my advice again. You don't survive this without resources. I don't have the resources yet. I certainly will NOT put my kids in that situation. If you want more please PM me.
You claim to have been working seven days a week for decades and yet you still don't have "the resources" to have a family, unlike millions of other men around you. I don't know exactly what you're doing wrong (although overworking yourself is likely part of it) . I don't want to continue beat this dead horse either, but I also don't want to let you duck out with a "PM me" while you're giving other men harmful advice. No one should listen to your advice about whether having a family is doable, because it absolutely is, if you really want it. Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.
 

Cartographer

Pelican
Gold Member
Get at it, then. Every year you continue to dither and rationalize not doing it, women who are young enough to give you kids get further and further out of reach. Which, it seems obvious to me, is what the force that's whispering all of those excuses in your ear wants.

We've likely beaten this dead horse enough but, that said, you'll probably see me again if I see you continue to advise men here to not have kids.

Read my advice again. You don't survive this without resources. I don't have the resources yet. I certainly will NOT put my kids in that situation. If you want more please PM me.

Respectfully, gents, I think you're both wrong.

You can't hold all men to the "crash early, crash often" method.

You can spend the rest of your life trying to torque the risk down to zero (but I don't recommend it).

I also don't think you're arguing apples to apples. You guys ever watch old tv shows or read old books where a man didn't get married until his 50s? It's been a common thing for a long time for guys to take that position if it's right for them. If done through a pursuit of God's will then how can that man be wrong?

On the other hand, I've noticed (and experienced) that men in their 20s are very susceptible to the black pill and trying to tell them that there's nothing to live for until they've crossed every t, etc., is not a good mentality for most of them.

I think that most guys are better suited to the crash early/often method but for those men who don't work that way, pushing them into it is going to yield really bad results.

My two cents.
 
Respectfully, gents, I think you're both wrong.

You can't hold all men to the "crash early, crash often" method.

You can't spend the rest of your life trying to torque the risk down to zero.

I also don't think you're arguing apples to apples. You guys ever watch old tv shows or read old books where a man didn't get married until his 50s? It's been a common thing for a long time for guys to take that position if it's right for them If done through a pursuit of God's will then how can that man be wrong?

On the other hand, I've noticed (and experienced) that men in their 20s are very susceptible to the black pill and trying to tell them that there's nothing to live for until they've crossed every t, etc., is not a good mentality for most of them.

I think that most guys are beter suited to the crash early/often method but for those men who don't work that way, pushing them into it is going to yield really bad results.

My two cents.
I agree. That is why I am not telling other men to, or not to have children. I am already in my mid 40's and I am happy that I didn't have kids earlier. I wasn't ready. Other men were and good for them.

My only message is to make sure you realize how bad things are going to get and prepare for it. If you have the resources that make you comfortable to have children, then by all means go for it. I don't. I know myself and it would take way too long to explain here. Other men I see posting here, things they can do with their hands, things they are capable of, are more than ready for children. That just isn't me.
 
You claim to have been working seven days a week for decades and yet you still don't have "the resources" to have a family, unlike millions of other men around you. I don't know exactly what you're doing wrong (although overworking yourself is likely part of it) . I don't want to continue beat this dead horse either, but I also don't want to let you duck out with a "PM me" while you're giving other men harmful advice. No one should listen to your advice about whether having a family is doable, because it absolutely is, if you really want it. Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.
I'm not ducking out. If you are interesting please PM me. I don't want to take from this thread and this forum.
 

Elipe

Pelican
I don't want a family if that means my children will be 2nd class citizens in a 3rd world country and no chance to fight for a better life. I don't want a family if it means I have to keep working the entire time they are children, either on the road, or long hours at the office. I don't want a family if it means I get laid off and can't find another job due to vast over-population of the USA
  1. Hardship will be the crucible that makes your grandchildren or their children the ones that win back their country. Read about the Spanish Reconquista. Not possible without Christian Spaniards having children through 500 years of Muslim occupation. That's roughly 25 generations that had to suffer as 2nd class citizens in a 3rd world country. But they won and built a world-class empire after they kicked the last Muslim (and Jew) out. At least, you should have kids so that my kids have more comrades, which means my kids will be your kids' comrades too.
  2. Your ancestors did back-breaking labor in the fields while they had children because they wanted a future where you could be as comfortable as you are right now. They suffered so that you could whine about having to work in an air-conditioned office to support raising children. I don't mean that as an insult, I'm just saying, it is what it is. Just be open to the possibility that you are not the generation God has appointed to do the American Reconquista. But every right-thinking man who has children today is a man contributing to that future American Reconquista.
  3. The USA is far from overpopulated. Your bigger risk in not being able to find another job comes from COVID tyranny, not from overpopulation. And in that, you should consider yourself blessed: you are resisting the Mark of the Beast or a precursor to it. If precursor, you are proving that you will resist against the Mark. That alone will make God very happy with you. I have faith that our Lord will work all things out for our good. If this good is to be achieved while we and our children live in poverty, so be it. They will not be poor in spirit, and something far better than you and me or our children will emerge in the future. I may not get to hang the traitors, but I will smile down from high on my descendants who do.
And as for how this relates to the Boomer Question, this is another example of how we are not repeating the mistake of the Boomers. We are thinking about the future, not limiting our perspective to the material here-and-now. I am willing to do what Boomers weren't... suffer for my progeny. No greater love hath a man.
 

bucky

Ostrich
Respectfully, gents, I think you're both wrong.

You can't hold all men to the "crash early, crash often" method.

You can spend the rest of your life trying to torque the risk down to zero (but I don't recommend it).

I also don't think you're arguing apples to apples. You guys ever watch old tv shows or read old books where a man didn't get married until his 50s? It's been a common thing for a long time for guys to take that position if it's right for them. If done through a pursuit of God's will then how can that man be wrong?

On the other hand, I've noticed (and experienced) that men in their 20s are very susceptible to the black pill and trying to tell them that there's nothing to live for until they've crossed every t, etc., is not a good mentality for most of them.

I think that most guys are better suited to the crash early/often method but for those men who don't work that way, pushing them into it is going to yield really bad results.

My two cents.
Agree, and I'm not saying you should necessarily get married in your twenties and just hope for the best. I got married in my forties myself, and had my first kid in my mid-forties. But if you've been working for decades without even taking weekends off and you're still claiming that you can't afford kids because of those darn Boomers, you shouldn't be advising anyone about having or not having a family, especially based on the bizarre idea that you need to save up enough money to raise a family while never working again before having kids.

I hate to pick on ISMT because I generally like him, but I wish he'd stop with the "having kids is too hard" stuff because I genuinely believe it's very harmful.
 
Agree, and I'm not saying you should necessarily get married in your twenties and just hope for the best. I got married in my forties myself, and had my first kid in my mid-forties. But if you've been working for decades without even taking weekends off and you're still claiming that you can't afford kids because of those darn Boomers, you shouldn't be advising anyone about having or not having a family, especially based on the bizarre idea that you need to save up enough money to raise a family while never working again before having kids.

I hate to pick on ISMT because I generally like him, but I wish he'd stop with the "having kids is too hard" stuff because I genuinely believe it's very harmful.
Hold up here. How old are you? I am in my mid 40's now. Had I been about 5 years older, working 20+ years, 7 days a week would have been enough for me. Things just got that much worse. I am blessed I am not 10 years younger. There are countless charts on middle class income v. COL and it continues to free fall from the mid 1960's through today. The older you are, the easier it would have been to amass wealth.

My guess is you are now in your late 40's or older, and yes, in your time working from say 22 to 44, 7 days a week, would have been enough for me to have a family (say 1995 to 2017).
 

bucky

Ostrich
Hold up here. How old are you? I am in my mid 40's now. Had I been about 5 years older, working 20+ years, 7 days a week would have been enough for me. Things just got that much worse. I am blessed I am not 10 years younger. There are countless charts on middle class income v. COL and it continues to free fall from the mid 1960's through today. The older you are, the easier it would have been to amass wealth.

My guess is you are now in your late 40's or older, and yes, in your time working from say 22 to 44, 7 days a week, would have been enough for me to have a family (say 1995 to 2017).

I don't want to say my exact age either, but I'm only a few years older than you. Five at the most, probably less. There isn't some threshold there were I just sneaked in right before the boomers made it impossible to have a family. Every time you claim otherwise, you should specify that you're talking about saving enough to never work again before you have kids because that's such a bizzare and unusual idea that it really only applies to you, not to men in general.
 
I don't want to say my exact age either, but I'm only a few years older than you. Five at the most, probably less. There isn't some threshold there were I just sneaked in right before the boomers made it impossible to have a family. Every time you claim otherwise, you should specify that you're talking about saving enough to never work again before you have kids because that's such a bizzare and unusual idea that it really only applies to you, not to men in general.
For me, if I was 5 years older it would have been enough. Probably even 3 years older. I got out of college into the working world fast enough to beat the economic issues of the late 1990's/early 2000's but not early enough to benefit from the bull market of the 1990's.

I can't speak for other men, I can only speak for myself. The field I am is being destroyed with legal immigration and H-1B visa workers. It is being further decimated by diversity initiatives. As a middle aged white male I know the reality is I am the last to be hired and the first to be laid off. My back and joints are starting to give out, probably from so many years of working nonstop and also because of a sleep schedule that is completely messed up from working at times 3 jobs. So manual labor and the trades are out for me.

It isn't that I don't want to work. It is that I don't want to depend upon a paycheck to pay my mortgage and massive healthcare payments/care payments, etc. It would be easy for me to lose my job and hard to find a new one and in the meantime I could lose it all in this system. I don't want that pressure put on myself and my family. I honesty don't think it would be fair to do that to them.
 

scorpion

Hummingbird
Gold Member
It_is_my_time: I have to agree with bucky here. If you honestly want to have a family you need to get the ball rolling on that very soon if you're already in your mid 40s. 99.9999% of men who have fathered children throughout history have done so without first laboring for 20 years, 7 days a week to accumulate the resources to support them. You are essentially building an idol out of money and thinking that it will insulate you and your children from trouble and hardship. I can assure you, it most certainly will not. Put your faith in God, not money, to protect your family. The alternative explanation, as bucky pointed out, is that you really actually don't want a family deep down and have constructed this elaborate plan about needing all this money as a sort of psychological defense mechanism or excuse. Not every man is called to fatherhood. Maybe it's not for you. If so, you should be honest with yourself about that. Either way you definitely should quit posting this blackpilling nonsense about having to work for decades in advance to be able to afford children. Not only is it asinine and fear-based, it demonstrates a lack of faith in God's providence and is needlessly discouraging to other men. I say all this in the spirit of love, because I would like to see you achieve your goal of being a father. Yes, times are very tough. But having children is always a leap of faith. You can do it soon. And if you don't do it soon you probably never will.
 

Wutang

Hummingbird
Gold Member
Since apparently money and working is the absolute pre-requisite for having a wife and kids, you should have pushed harder and worked 8 days a week instead of 7.
 
I can feel the Boomer energy force seeping in. This is like a mountain climber who summited on a warm and sunny day giving advice to a climber attempting to summit at night during a blizzard. I'm going to trust my own judgement for these maneuvers, which certainly includes historical/religious teachings but does not include Boomer teachings
 

Caduceus

Pelican


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Great post !

It would be helpful to know what year this house plan and price is from...it looks like from the 1940s or 1950s, so it would be the "great" or "silent" generation buying these, not boomers.

Some of the names and descriptions on this house plan are great.
Bedrooms are called "chambers".
The (wooden ?) double door outside the back of the house leading to the basement is called a "cellar door."
The ground floor has a decent sized "library" which assumes anyone with enough money to buy this house will of course be a educated person who will want a room full of books.

Anyone know what it says in that tiny room to the left of the stairs on the ground floor ? Does it say "inventory", or "pantry", or something else ?
Also what is a "trunk room" ?? Is it to store your luggage ??
It doesn't seem to be a closet as these are separate and are labelled "CLO". There are 2 CLOsets on the top floor.

Shame it only has 1 bathroom considering there are 3 "chambers" (bedrooms)....I guess if you want a house with 2 bathrooms that's gonna cost an extra 50 dollars. :D
Doesn't seem to have a garage or driveway at all...meaning it's probably close to a city or town center....and not far away in the suburbs where I would need a car.
So if I want a garage and 2 bathrooms, probably gonna have to cough up at least 1200 dollars I guess.
That's over my budget !
Gotta talk to my bank manager, and see if if I can get a loan for the extra 203 dollars.
 
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Magnus Stout

Woodpecker
Orthodox
If life is a school for the soul, each generation--through good times and bad--has unique lessons to learn and grow spiritually. Each generation has the same goal (theosis), but different obstacles to overcome. Our best guide to judging seems the parable of the talents:
... The talents in the parable denote the totality of all the good things given by God to man. Material talents—these are wealth, favorable living conditions, social status and good health. Talents of the soul—these are a lucid mind, a good memory, various abilities in the arts and crafts, the gift of eloquence, courage, sensitivity, compassion and many other qualities which are placed in us by the Creator. There are also talents of the spirit...

God blessed the Greatest Generation (GGs) to defeat tyranny and give birth to the Baby Boomers (BBs). I believe the fault of the GGs was refusal to reflect on the horrors of WWII and learn and discuss those spiritual lessons. They were a naive generation (largely coming from small and rural towns) that was thrown into the "meat grinder." When they returned from War, they sought to create an overly soft and materialistic society instead of working to resolve the problem of the alienation of man and properly exorcise the demons of nihilism posed by the dominant 'isms of the time.

Their children--the Baby Boomers (BBs)--were eventually repulsed by their superficiality. Put differently, the GGs buried their trauma and PTSD through creating a superficial society focused on materialist values. They wagered that they could avoid the demons of nihilism by pampering their children, the BBs.

Yet, this was predominantly why the BBs were drawn to the counter-culture: seeking "meaning" in drugs, cults and Eastern mysticism. The BBs had a comparatively easy life devoid of privation (unlike their parents), so they could freely explore the "why" of life (see, Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs below). The GGs failed to pass on the spiritual nectar that their children were clamoring for as to the meaning and purpose of life.
iu


On the whole, the BBs saw themselves as a very special generation with elevated sensibilities. They famously declared: "never trust anyone over 30!" And, they were half-right: no single generation in history has had the wealth and power of the Baby Boomers. But, if responsibility is equal to power, what have they accomplished?

Again, going back to the Parable of the Talents:
But he who had received one talent went and buried it in the earth and hid his lord's silver. This servant hid his one talent; that is, he did not manifest the least desire to use it profitably. It is important to pay attention to the fact that this servant buried his talent in the earth. This means that he used the abilities given to him by God only for the better arrangement of his earthly, worldly affairs, and not for the benefit of his soul.... For his negligent attitude toward spiritual matters, the third servant received only one talent. But he could have increased this talent also, had he wanted to do so. But he, on account of his laziness, remained inactive. Being wicked, he went so far as to accuse his lord of unjustness: “Thou art an hard man,” says the servant, reaping where thou hast not sown. “Thou didst not given me sufficient gifts, and desirest of me that I myself succeed spiritually and look to the benefit of others. I was afraid to use thy money in trading so as not to lose it completely, and incur punishment for this from thee. I went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine. At least I have returned the money to thee intact.” This servant even proudly boasted that he returned his talent to the lord intact. He seemingly does not notice that by insulting his lord, by calling him a cruel and avaricious man, he pronounces the sentence against himself. If the lord is cruel, then it was incumbent on him to make an even greater effort and to be fearful; if the lord demands what is another's, then all the more will he demand his own. And the lord pronounced his judgment on this lazy and impertinent servant: Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents. For unto every one that hath shall be given, and he shall have abundantly: but from him that hath not shall be taken away even that which he hath. And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. As in the parable of the minas, grace is taken away from the negligent and given to him who brings the greatest fruits to God's Kingdom. The richer a man is in virtues and other spiritual gifts and talents, the greater benefit he brings to his neighbors.

When I reflect on this Parable, I am struck by how similar many Boomers are to the actions of the wicked and slothful servant who refuse to invest their talents. Here, the BBs were given the 5 talents above but wasted 4. Put differently, if the BBs were merely wicked (as the single talent servant above) they could have preserved at least the 50's and 60's America they inherited. Instead, the BBs were mega-Wicked: they ushered in a Sodomite society drowning in occultism in the name of "progress."

A poignant example of their wickedness: the Boomers murdered 1/3 of my generation--Gen-X. This they also did in the name of "progress" and "liberation," otherwise known as the Satanic sacrament of abortion. Abortion is still legal and there is no mass repentance of this grievous sin. Further illustration of their Evil: just look how many were willing to shut down society (damn the younger generations) and line up for the Mark of the Vexx.... Both Trump (Father of the Vexx) and Biden (idiot monkey coercing the vexx) are overwhelmingly approved by their generation. All levers of power in United States government (legislative, executive and judicial) are still dominated by BBs.

So, while God will judge the Wicked, we should look to them as examples of how NOT to live. Put differently: hate the sin, but love the sinner. Gen-X's must deal with the grievous material and spiritual wreckage that the BBs will leave behind, while striving not to hate them personally. That will be our cross to bear.
 
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