The cashless society thread

Mercenary

Hummingbird
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

Vicious said:
Nowhere in the source does it say having cash will be illegal, that's ridiculous hyperbole. The thread title is something I'd expect on a click bait site like Jezebel.

The article clearly states "Sweden is the place where, if you use too much cash, banks call the police because they think you might be a terrorist or a criminal. " which implies the assumption of illegal activity.

It's not illegal to own SOME cash.....now.
But the title implies it could be soon.
Even if isn't made illegal, the Swedish banknotes you are hiding at home will eventually become worthless pieces of paper anyway.

Precious metals in the form of physical coins are the both the safest and easiest thing to store and carry around and exchange worldwide.
Gold (and therefore gold coins) are sold tax free at the moment in most countries.
However, the only countries I know of where you can buy silver (and therefore silver coins) totally tax free are Estonia and Norway.
If anyone knows any other countries, please say so.
 

Ember

Ostrich
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

There is zero chance this will happen in the UK any time soon. There would be riots. Sweden has so many other issues anyway that this might not seem a big deal to them.
 

Aurini

Ostrich
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

Negative interest rates. Good Lord. The Bible forbids usury, and here we are engaging in brand new sins the Jews of old never even thought of.
 

Vicious

Crow
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

The article clearly states "Sweden is the place where, if you use too much cash, banks call the police because they think you might be a terrorist or a criminal. " which implies the assumption of illegal activity.

That's an unsourced opinion at best, at worst it's a standard practice for ALL western nations. Tracking large sums of money transfers is hardly new to security agencies. The logical jump that it's about to become illegal is an Evel Kneivel like feat.
 

debeguiled

Peacock
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

kimbo said:
This has been a long time coming, and people will accept it because:

Like it's been said in this thread already, most never use cash anyway and most don't see further than their own nose.

"Om du har rent mjöl i påsen" means you have nothing to worry about if you have nothing to hide. Basically: Swedes trust their government.

They recently changed the bills, instead of kings and scientists like the founder of Sweden (Gustav Vasa) and the man who came up with modern taxonomy it's now film stars and film directors. People won't be sorry to see those go.

It seems like this would only work in a country that has a high level of trust in their government like Sweden has been traditionally. I would like to know too from any members in Sweden if this has changed recently based on things like the migrant crisis.
 
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

If I were a Sweede, I'd be moving my funds to US Dollars for anything in excess of what I need for daily expenses. And I'd keep my passport current. Sweden is ground zero for globalist interests sacrificing the native people of a land to foreign hostile elements.
 

Travesty

Crow
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

This is a very interesting thread with great thoughts.

I really believe unless the bankers are tried and executed in the next decade or so this will spread.

I think at some point everyone's net worth (except the power holders) will be made public to even exert more control, so everyone is keeping an eye on each other.

Self-policing, and self-restraining seems the big goals whether it is race tension, class tension, liquidity policy. This is the only way a few hundred people can control billions easily.
 

Vienna

Kingfisher
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

Travesty said:
This is a very interesting thread with great thoughts.

I really believe unless the bankers are tried and executed in the next decade or so this will spread.

I think at some point everyone's net worth (except the power holders) will be made public to even exert more control, so everyone is keeping an eye on each other.

Self-policing, and self-restraining seems the big goals whether it is race tension, class tension, liquidity policy. This is the only way a few hundred people can control billions easily.

This has been a thing for at least a few years in Sweden.

The evening tabloids run a big article in every respective county each year, listing the top 250 earners/net worths in 'your' area. Goes without saying they're left-leaning papers.
 

Vienna

Kingfisher
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

debeguiled said:
kimbo said:
This has been a long time coming, and people will accept it because:

Like it's been said in this thread already, most never use cash anyway and most don't see further than their own nose.

"Om du har rent mjöl i påsen" means you have nothing to worry about if you have nothing to hide. Basically: Swedes trust their government.

They recently changed the bills, instead of kings and scientists like the founder of Sweden (Gustav Vasa) and the man who came up with modern taxonomy it's now film stars and film directors. People won't be sorry to see those go.

It seems like this would only work in a country that has a high level of trust in their government like Sweden has been traditionally. I would like to know too from any members in Sweden if this has changed recently based on things like the migrant crisis.

The current Social-Democrat/Green goverment enjoy the lowest trust (and parliamentary support) in Swedish history, I believe. They have to tackle political scandals on a weekly basis which whittles away at their already laughable stock.

Needless to say, trust in their handling of the migrant crisis has until now been sinking. With the new harsh Swedish immigration laws passed, things are looking better.

In most other major areas of government, particularly finance and taxes, Swedes still have a fairly high trust in government.

That's my point of view at least, and I also have to point out that the average Swede doesn't give a shit about politics. Since Swedes are deathly afraid of any kind of confrontation, you will rarely hear a political opinion from the average Swede. Making sure everyone feels good and no feelings are hurt is a bigger priority than having a possibly confrontational yet interesting and thoughtprovoking discussion, to a Swede. Unless he or she has downed a fifth of vodka.

Background: born in Sweden, with an inherited Italian temperament and acquired love of political debate. Not the best combo in Jante Law country.
 

Slim Shady

Ostrich
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

This will lead to massive inflation, which will be very interesting indeed in a heavily taxed socialist welfare state...
 

kosko

Peacock
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

Physical items will always have value. At the most extreme the Govt shuts down the cash market for good and only you barter, or use metal or encryption backed transactions happen in the real world. You would still be forced into digital cash and if you wanted a pay day on your assets then it would have to be in controlled digital cash. The big thing with digital cash, the value will nose dive and you can expose yourself to less risk with only keeping liquid a small percentage of your actually worthy resources.

Next for Sweden will be Garunteed Annual Income (GAI) which will only be dolled out via digi cash to force full conversion. This scam is to further make a need to print money to help tide deflation. The premise is that with free money you can keep the much needed consumer and set game going as people have money they must spend into the system.

The Banks fear cash runs as they can't run without the recycle of money flowing in so they can so magic to it and try and inflate it.
 

Laner

Hummingbird
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

DarianFrey said:
Travesty said:
This is a very interesting thread with great thoughts.

I really believe unless the bankers are tried and executed in the next decade or so this will spread.

I think at some point everyone's net worth (except the power holders) will be made public to even exert more control, so everyone is keeping an eye on each other.

Self-policing, and self-restraining seems the big goals whether it is race tension, class tension, liquidity policy. This is the only way a few hundred people can control billions easily.

This has been a thing for at least a few years in Sweden.

The evening tabloids run a big article in every respective county each year, listing the top 250 earners/net worths in 'your' area. Goes without saying they're left-leaning papers.

I remember something about the heirs to Tetra Pak going off to live in England so they could at least enjoy their wealth without the ever present media 'tsking' them.
 
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

Was predicted over 20 years ago.

It'll be sold to the people as a solution of convenience and the fact that the government can shut your cash flow off if you become a dissident will be dismissed as paranoia.
 

kosko

Peacock
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

Let us not discount the lazy cost cutting motives for States to go digital. Many have outsourced money printing to private firms whom will charge what they like and many States now are paying more to print a $1 bill for example then what the value on the note is. For coins this is especially true with the price of metals fluctuated so much. In Canada the penny web after it was stripped of most of its Copper was costing .07 to press and was scrapped.

Now my view is that it isn't pure budget tweaking as a push towards cashless systems. More means of pushing control and collections of "data" is the chief reason. Having a data base tied to your unique government identifier (slave number, social insurance #,social security). Is valuable information the Govt can use to moniter spending habits etc. plus when the coffers run lose you can always sell that information to private interests for a quick buck.
 

Deepdiver

Crow
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

This was an interesting newsletter from one of the Editors in Bill Bonner's Agora publishing empire that even has me thinking that there are patterns to Digital Currencies that can have a serious upside.

Tomorrow Is the Biggest Day in the History of Digital Currencies

BY TEEKA TIWARI, EDITOR, THE PALM BEACH LETTER

For the past three months, I’ve been pounding the table about digital currencies. They’ve been some of our most popular plays.

Now you may be wondering whether digital currencies are really money at all.

Here’s the truth about money: It can be anything.

Take the U.S. dollar. There’s nothing backing it up – we went off the gold standard in 1971. So, the dollar really is… just a promise… an “act of faith.”

A digital currency is no different. It’s simply internet-based money. And like any other medium of exchange, many people around the world have decided it is money.

They believe they’ll be able to use digital currencies in the future to buy stuff. That alone makes it have value.

Now that we’ve gotten that out of the way, let me tell you what’s driving up digital currency prices (like any other currency, the digital currency market fluctuates).

These Two Forces Are Driving up Digital Currency Prices

When we initially recommended the digital currencies, we wrote they were some of the best alternative investments you could make to protect yourself from low/negative interest rates and the War on Cash.

So far, our thesis has been spot on…

At the beginning of the year, the Federal Reserve indicated it would raise rates four times. And as recently as last month, at least two rate hikes were on the table.

But with the poor May U.S. jobs report and June’s Brexit (the United Kingdom’s vote to leave the European Union), those rate hikes are now off the table.

In fact, the odds of a rate cut are now higher than those for a rate hike.

Brexit and negative interest rates are pushing investors into chaos hedges such as gold and digital currencies.

[“Chaos hedges” are protection from times of turbulence.]

The day after the Brexit vote, gold was up 5.5%, and our main digital currency recommendation was up 3%. But those jumps are just the beginning…

Why You Need to Act Now

You see, tomorrow, July 10, is when one the biggest events in the history of digital currencies is scheduled.

The last time this event happened, it ignited a 12-month bull market in one of our digital currencies – the biggest rally in its history.

The event is called “the halving.” It’s a process digital currencies use to prevent inflation.

Here’s why this rare event is so important… It should send digital currency prices higher.

<See Chart Image bottom of this post>

As you can see from the chart above, the halving was more than a one-day event.

Prices for our favorite digital currency had already moved up over 100% in the six months before the halving.

Six months after the last halving in November 2013, prices for our currency play were up 918%. A year after the halving, prices were up an astonishing 8,476%!

So, even if you get in months after the halving, you could still make big gains from this rare event.

Now, our first digital currency isn’t the only one that will get a boost from the halving, though. Our other two plays should ride this tailwind, too.

Although I expect the halving to boost digital currency prices, potential price appreciation isn’t the only reason you need to own these currencies.

They can be a safe haven for your wealth. Let me explain…

The War on Cash

As I mentioned above, governments around the world are pushing negative interest rates and threatening to ban cash.

A negative interest rate is when a government or bank charges you to hold your money in a bond or account. It’s like a second tax on money you have already earned.

I know it sounds crazy, but this is happening all over the world. More than 20 countries have already implemented negative rates. And the United States has been flirting with the idea, too.

To sidestep these negative rates, citizens in countries affected by them have been hoarding their cash.

For instance, in Japan, one of the hottest-selling items in the country has been safes. People are using them to store their cash at home rather than a bank.

If the U.S. Federal Reserve goes forward with negative rates, buying a safe to hoard your cash won’t be enough to protect your money.

That’s because negative interest rates will be accompanied by the other government policy I’ve told you about… the War on Cash.

These two forces could wreck your retirement plans if you don’t take action right now.

You see, the government knows that if it institutes negative interest rates, people will begin to hoard their cash, just like in Japan.

After all, why would anyone pay to put their money in a bank?

For negative interest rates to really work, though, the government needs to ban cash. Not all cash at first, but at least large denominations to start.

For example, in February 2016, European Union central bank head Mario Draghi pushed to ban the 500 euro note.

The very next day, he was supported by former U.S. Treasury Secretary Larry Summers, who then called for an end to the U.S. $100 bill.

If large denomination notes are banned or removed from circulation, it would be difficult to hoard money in your home. Imagine trying to store $100,000 worth of savings in $1, $5, or $10 bills.

You’d need a bank vault.

But there’s a better way…

An alternative way to “hide” your money from negative interest rates…

If you want to protect your money, you’ll need to find investments that maintain the privacy and portability of cash… but aren’t hurt by low or negative interest rates.

And digital currencies do just that.

Consider this… $1 million in $20 bills would weigh over 100 pounds. That would require a massive carrying case to move around.

On the other hand, $1 million in digital currencies can be carried in a flash drive. That’s because your money is in digital form.

Now, some investors may opt to buy gold to shelter their wealth from negative rates or a cash ban. And I do recommend owning some gold.

It’s the safest and most secure way to protect the value of your money… but it’s not very convenient.

Although gold is a good store of wealth, you can’t just break off a piece of gold and anonymously go buy something with it.

When you’re ready to buy something, you’ll need to convert your gold into some other form of currency.

And like cash, our favorite digital currency is liquid.

It is accepted by more than 100,000 merchants as payment, including Overstock, Cisco, Wal-Mart, Starbucks, and Microsoft.

And best yet, when you use digital currencies, you remain anonymous. So, your financial privacy will be secure.

What to Do Next

The War on Cash and negative interest rates are radical and insane measures. They are also huge threats to your financial security…

But you can protect your wealth from these government policies by sheltering a small portion in digital currencies.

Not only will digital currencies insulate you from negative interest rates… they’re primed to go higher. Especially with the halving almost upon us.

Regards,

Teeka Tiwari
Editor, The Palm Beach Letter

P.S. My team and I have put in hundreds of man-hours looking for the best ways to buy digital currencies. After extensive research, we’ve put together a presentation with the simple steps you should take to cash in on these huge price moves before time runs out.

To learn which three digital currencies I’m recommending – and how to buy them – watch my new presentation before the halving happens tomorrow.

http://pros.palmbeachgroup.com/1605PBLEthereum/MPBLS704/?

Note this link is a rather long read and they are selling an investment advisory newsletter/subscription yet the infomercial "info" aspect is interesting - I get NO compensation or financial benefit from sharing this - just curious to see what other RVF critical thinkers ideas, opinions are.
 

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The Beast1

Peacock
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

At the end of the day, I'd rather have a small stash of gold coins than some bitcoin. The elimination of bitcoin exchanges and ease of its conversion will be one of the defining moments for bitcoin. It's only a matter of time for governments to wise up.
 

godfather dust

Hummingbird
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

Yeah the first thing the government would do in a cashless society would be to ban bitcoin.

I like it if I don't want government and multinational corporations knowing about a transaction but as a long term investment very foolish IMO.
 

Surreyman

Kingfisher
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

Ok, nobodies said it yet.

What's to stop the Swedes (if this does happen) simply trading in Euros, Dollars or Pounds? If I was paying day labourers in Sweden, I'd just pay them in Euros.
 

BallsDeep

Kingfisher
Gold Member
RE: Sweden to go 100% cashless making it ILLEGAL to own physical money

Surreyman said:
Ok, nobodies said it yet.

What's to stop the Swedes (if this does happen) simply trading in Euros, Dollars or Pounds? If I was paying day labourers in Sweden, I'd just pay them in Euros.

Your neighbor will call the cops on you and the Labor Board will visit. That's how it's done in Scandinavia.
 
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