The Classical Literature Thread

That's the courtly love movement of the Middle Ages, not some outgrowth of modern leftism.

Shakespeare's comedies were were full of love and romance, which typically ended in marriages. This was of course considered popular entertainment at the time and not "high art," but pre- and early modern literary expressions of love and romance weren't nearly as overwhelmingly grim as you make them out to be.

It is leftist, because leftists always make empty preaching about love, empathy, and equality.

And the art being old does not make it logical or intellectually sophisticated because Jews have been infiltrating Western society since ancient times and have spread this dumb concept to lower the intelligence of gentiles by elevating their oxytocin and lowering their testosterone.

Roosh has written many articles about the stupidity and leftism of romance:

 

Hypno

Crow
A great short story by Kurt Vonnegut that covers our current situation is Harrison Bergeron. http://www.tnellen.com/cybereng/harrison.html
He's more famous for Slaughterhouse Five which is more famous for the context and his approach in describing the Allies holocaust in Dresden 1945 than the novel itself.

I'd like to go back and re-read some of the stuff I read in high school with the benefit of age.

Odyseus, and now add the Aneid.
Oedipus, Antigone
Molliere
Camus The Stranger
Beowulf
Grendel
Voltaire Candide

There are some real truths about the human condition in those and other books, and you don't always grasp them when you are young.
 

Diocletian

Woodpecker
A great short story by Kurt Vonnegut that covers our current situation is Harrison Bergeron. http://www.tnellen.com/cybereng/harrison.html
He's more famous for Slaughterhouse Five which is more famous for the context and his approach in describing the Allies holocaust in Dresden 1945 than the novel itself.

I'd like to go back and re-read some of the stuff I read in high school with the benefit of age.

Odyseus, and now add the Aneid.
Oedipus, Antigone
Molliere
Camus The Stranger
Beowulf
Grendel
Voltaire Candide

There are some real truths about the human condition in those and other books, and you don't always grasp them when you are young.

One major defect of high school lit classes is that besides great classics they always have you read a lot of truly awful stuff that for whatever reason is now considered "great"--Jane Eyre comes immediately to mind.

Beowulf was great--it not only portrays masculine men as heroic but also as noble, and where it portrays women it shows them as feminine. The Seamus Heaney translation is the most popular but I think its kind of dull. Get the interlinear translation by Howell Chickerling:

"Beowulf replied, Ectheow's son:

"Our famous meeting, my lord Hygelac, is scarcely a secret to much of mankind, such crashing battle Grendel and I set dancing in hall, where so many times he grieved the Scyldings, humbled those victors, made life a misery. I avenged all that so well that none, no kinsman of Grendel wrapped in foul sin, not any on earth who lives the longest of the evil race, can boast of that dawn-clash. I arrived and greeted Hrothgar in ring-hall; the famous man, kinsman of Healfdene, gave me a seat with his own sons once he had learned my journey's purpose. The gathering rejoiced; never have I seen, in all my days under Heaven's roof, a greater mead-feast of noble retainers. His famous queen, peace-weaver of nations, walked through the hall, encouraged the striplings; time and again before she was seated she gave gold bracelets. At times his daughter took vessels of mead to the veteran nobility throughout the whole hall."

On a related note this upcoming Amazon show based on the Silmarillion looks like its going to be awful.
 

Diocletian

Woodpecker
It is leftist, because leftists always make empty preaching about love, empathy, and equality.

And the art being old does not make it logical or intellectually sophisticated because Jews have been infiltrating Western society since ancient times and have spread this dumb concept to lower the intelligence of gentiles by elevating their oxytocin and lowering their testosterone.

Roosh has written many articles about the stupidity and leftism of romance:

How can a literary work be leftist if it was written centuries before leftism and the conditions that created it existed? That doesn't make sense.

As cheesy and goofy as courtly love was, as a form of entertainment it was still geared towards medieval Germanic kings, princes, knights, and warlords in a society deeply permeated by the Catholic Church; it was also a society with very little Jewish influence.
 
How can a literary work be leftist if it was written centuries before leftism and the conditions that created it existed? That doesn't make sense.

As cheesy and goofy as courtly love was, as a form of entertainment it was still geared towards medieval Germanic kings, princes, knights, and warlords in a society deeply permeated by the Catholic Church; it was also a society with very little Jewish influence.
In actual fact the Romantic period in Germany was highly reactionary and anti-modernistic. On this forum, people just love to interpret periods of time according to the degeneracy of today. I still have to chuckle at that Renaissance thread.
 
How can a literary work be leftist if it was written centuries before leftism and the conditions that created it existed? That doesn't make sense.

As cheesy and goofy as courtly love was, as a form of entertainment it was still geared towards medieval Germanic kings, princes, knights, and warlords in a society deeply permeated by the Catholic Church; it was also a society with very little Jewish influence.

The empires of the Europe were already infiltrated by Jews:


But then again, so were the empires of Asia:

 
How can a literary work be leftist if it was written centuries before leftism and the conditions that created it existed? That doesn't make sense.

As cheesy and goofy as courtly love was, as a form of entertainment it was still geared towards medieval Germanic kings, princes, knights, and warlords in a society deeply permeated by the Catholic Church; it was also a society with very little Jewish influence.
I think you're right. The whole Left-Right divide was devised during the French Revolution, based on the seating arrangement in parliament with Jacobins on the left and those supporting monarchy on the right. Ideas associated with modern leftism such as socialism, anarchism, humanism, and utilitarianism predate the French Revolution by hundreds of years, but that's just the result of thinking in -isms. I think a more accurate term would be leftish because it suggests association with those ideas without being apart of the leftist movement itself.

And nobody in their right mind would call William Shakespeare or his works "leftist". He really didn't leave any trace of political thought in his work. He was more a "social issues" kind of guy.

That guy you quoted has a weird obsession with oxytocin levels.
 
Last edited:
I think you're right. The whole Left-Right divide was devised during the French Revolution, based on the seating arrangement in parliament with Jacobins on the left and those supporting monarchy on the right. Ideas associated with modern leftism such as socialism, anarchism, humanism, and utilitarianism predate the French Revolution by hundreds of years, but that's just the result of thinking in -isms. I think a more accurate term would be leftish because it suggests association with those ideas without being apart of the leftist movement itself.

And nobody in their right mind would call William Shakespeare or his works "leftist". He really didn't leave any trace of political thought in his work. He was more a "social issues" kind of guy.

That guy you quoted has a weird obsession with oxytocin levels.

You are not in your right mind and are anti-intellectual if you like romance because you are disregarding logic in favor of emotions and effeminacy.

The leftist movement is defined by its core belief in equality which is not a proven fact of science.

And since you admit that the ideas of the left predate the French Revolution by hundreds of years, it is not a surprise that such ideas would be found in the works of earlier authors.

The left conspires to brainwash the masses, making them anti-intellectual by promoting ideas that appeal to emotions rather than logic like romance.

Besides why would you support an idea that is emotional rather logical, that is feminine and driven by oxytocin and estrogen rather than testosterone?

I would also like to add that being romantic and bonding elevates oxytocin which can lower testosterone levels and thus intelligence.
 
Last edited:
You are not in your right mind and are anti-intellectual if you like romance because you are disregarding logic in favor of emotions and effeminacy.

The leftist movement is defined by its core belief in equality which is not a proven fact of science.

And since you admit that the ideas of the left predate the French Revolution by hundreds of years, it is not a surprise that such ideas would be found in the works of earlier authors.

The left conspires to brainwash the masses, making them anti-intellectual by promoting ideas that appeal to emotions rather than logic like romance.

Besides why would you support an idea that is emotional rather logical, that is feminine and driven by oxytocin and estrogen rather than testosterone?

I would also like to add that being romantic and bonding elevates oxytocin which can lower testosterone levels and thus intelligence.
Dude, why are you so obsessed with oxytocin? You're starting to sound like a Vulcan with this whole "logic over emotions" thing.

Nowhere in my post did I say that I liked romance. I am just saying that William Shakespeare didn't write his works with "brainwashing the masses" in mind. I do think that romance and white knights are pretty cringe, but guys do have feelings you know.
 
Last edited:
Dude, why are you so obsessed with oxytocin? You're starting to sound like a Vulcan with this whole "logic over emotions" thing.

Nowhere in my post did I say that I liked romance. I am just saying that William Shakespeare didn't write his works with "brainwashing the masses" in mind. I do think that romance and white knights are pretty cringe, but guys do have feelings you know.

Because it is the truth that oxytocin reduces testosterone levels and feminizes men.
 
I‘d really like a source on that. Sorry to be that guy ;)

This study shows that ejaculation causes the pituitary gland to release oxytocin and prolactin which can lower testosterone levels:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0306453000000536?via=ihub

The release of oxytocin is the worst thing that happens after an orgasm because it induces feelings of love and empathy which can lower your testosterone and thus your intelligence.

For more information on the properties of oxytocin:

 
This discussion on classical literature has been successfully slid.

To bring it back, I highly recommend the wonderful and hilarious Renaissance story The Decameron. Bonus points that it takes place during a pandemic.
 
Top