The decline of rock music

Days of Broken Arrows

Crow
Gold Member
Uzisuicide said:
I disagree somewhat with some opinions here. After Kirk Cobain, rock music DID become a pity party. Songs were about not being able to fit in to society, suicide and self loarhing. Although those types of songs were always part of the genre, they completely saturated it after Cobain. The hair band days of: "Girls, Girls, Girls", "We're Not Gonna Take It" and "Nothin' But a Good Time" were replaced by "I Hate Myself and Want To Die."

Weanwhile hip hop and rap videos were showing guys with bling throwing money out of convertables with hookers humping their leg. Rock music is in a rebuilding phase and has been for some time now.

Yes, let's discuss Kurt Cobain. He's the so-called "independent spirit" who had no issue taking money from a major label, kissing up to MTV, and glad-handling corporate magazine writers.

But his hypocrisy runs far deeper than that. Cobain was a self-proclaimed "male feminist," yet he made phone calls threatening to KILL (!!!) female music writer Victoria Clark.

Think about that. Think about the most "sexist" thing most of us have done. I'll bet no one threatened to kill a woman -- and was stupid/arrogant enough to leave the threat on her answering machine.

All of which leads me to a larger point, namely that the posturing of Cobain and his peers turned adolescents off to rock and pushed them toward hip hop. Kids can smell hypocrisy a mile away.

Here is one of many recordings of our beloved musical male feminist. For more, Google Kurt Cobain Victoria Clark (no quotes) and see what happens.

 

911

Peacock
Gold Member
^The Smashing Pumpkins singer is pretty based and privy to the industry's agenda, like many other artists before him (Prince, Hendrix, Waters etc).

Rock is in decline because it no longer serves the purpose of social engineering it was originally intended for, as the archetype of antisocial, anti-Christian rebellious male it promoted has now become too masculine, too white and too energetic. They want tamer, feminized, rootless and raceless dumb drones:


If you want to understand how the music industry is run, what its agenda is, who the actors are, you have to watch this incredibly revealing expose from Adam Green, I'm actually shocked that it's still up:

 

Nonpareil

Pelican
Gold Member
Days of Broken Arrows said:
Uzisuicide said:
I disagree somewhat with some opinions here. After Kirk Cobain, rock music DID become a pity party. Songs were about not being able to fit in to society, suicide and self loarhing. Although those types of songs were always part of the genre, they completely saturated it after Cobain. The hair band days of: "Girls, Girls, Girls", "We're Not Gonna Take It" and "Nothin' But a Good Time" were replaced by "I Hate Myself and Want To Die."

Weanwhile hip hop and rap videos were showing guys with bling throwing money out of convertables with hookers humping their leg. Rock music is in a rebuilding phase and has been for some time now.

Yes, let's discuss Kurt Cobain. He's the so-called "independent spirit" who had no issue taking money from a major label, kissing up to MTV, and glad-handling corporate magazine writers.

But his hypocrisy runs far deeper than that. Cobain was a self-proclaimed "male feminist," yet he made phone calls threatening to KILL (!!!) female music writer Victoria Clark.

Think about that. Think about the most "sexist" thing most of us have done. I'll bet no one threatened to kill a woman -- and was stupid/arrogant enough to leave the threat on her answering machine.

All of which leads me to a larger point, namely that the posturing of Cobain and his peers turned adolescents off to rock and pushed them toward hip hop. Kids can smell hypocrisy a mile away.

Here is one of many recordings of our beloved musical male feminist. For more, Google Kurt Cobain Victoria Clark (no quotes) and see what happens.


A few posters have mentioned Cobain, which is salient because I think a lot of the problems with music today started with him, not his artistry (OK songwriter, great singer, but shitty guitar player) but more his image and the aura surrounding him even still.

It doesn't matter which genre it is, once the corporate hooks get dug in, all the art is drained - it even happened with the so-called 'Indie' scene.

People act like Grunge was some sort of 'beautiful counterculture expression about saying 'fuck you!' to 'the corporations!'' when really it was just another stream that would eventually be penetrated and monetized, and indeed was; Grunge led to faggy 'post-Grunge' like Everclear, Matchbox 20 and the Goo Goo Dolls.

Grunge music came about as a response to the excess of the 1980's - where everyone and their mom was getting rich 'playing the market' and Wall Street was at the height of its power. All of this excess caught up to America as it always does and naturally created a recession in the early 90's, giving rise to a generation that both lacked hope and distrusted any person or entity with money...perhaps the greatest irony being now looking back that the 1990's is looking like the last decent decade we had and probably will have for a while.

Punk music, as much as I'm not the biggest fan of it, is what Grunge told itself it was.

When punk was back in vogue in the early-mid nineties, and bands like Rancid and NoFX started getting mainstream radio airplay, did they immediately jump ship and sign with a major label? No, they stayed with their small indie labels, turning down potentially tens of millions of dollars (though not all of their peers had the same principles - see The Offspring and Green Day) because they knew their music wasn't for everyone and didn't want to sell out their principles. I may not be a fan of their music, but I admire their integrity.

That a band like Chumbawamba (as much ass as they suck...), who spoke about being 'anarchists and anti-capitalism' can somehow sleep at night when their breakthrough album, 1997's Tubthumping (featuring that abominable 'I get knocked down!' song) was released on fucking EMI, one of the biggest record labels in the game, is baffling to me.

I also find it funny so many of these Antifags and ultra leftists are so for 'inclusion at any cost' when many of them devour punk music - even many of the artists are lefties - and yet they're card carrying members of what's probably the most deliberately exclusive genre of music out there (self awareness isn't a leftie strong suit...look at what the members of NoFX said about the Vegas shooting to see what the average leftist thinks about any non leftist).


Imagine Kurt Cobain wasn't a junkie coward who blew his brains out because for all of his life he was a skinny, dirty loser who probably got called 'faggot' tons and then one day he wakes up with access to a Gulfstream, a black mastercard, high end drugs and a sea of top shelf pussy (provided of course he becomes a slave to the (((recording industry)))) and he has no way to deal. If he was alive today, what would that look like?

1. He's still making edgy if simplistic minimalist Grunge, on a small label, while saying 'fuck the man!' - rich but not nine figures rich, net worth: 7-10 million.

Or...

2. Sometime around 1998 he sells out and commits to a ten album deal with a major label. He becomes richer than God, but Nirvana is now making the type of gay, by the numbers 'power pop' that Green Day and his contemporary Dave Grohl's band is making. Because of his enormous wealth, fame and influence, he, like Bruce Springsteen, Neil Young, Billie Joe Armstrong and all these faggy new artists at the Grammies is constantly going on about how bad Orange Man is, he probably even gets #metoo'd but he's a liberal marionette (Seattle...) at this point so it gets scuttled quickly. In a turn that mirrors my attitude towards Green Day after American Idiot, I find I can no longer enjoy Nirvana when my mom, who used to tell me to 'turn that shit down!' when I was blasting Insomniac, tells me how much she 'enjoys the latest Nirvana record!' as his music has evolved from a desperate nihilistic scream to 'cool enough for today's (by all metrics lamer) children, but accessible enough for Boomers!', his net worth is over 200 million.

Almost all of his contemporaries went with option two, I refuse to believe he would have been any different.
 

questor70

Ostrich
lonewolf1992 said:
Rock music is the new jazz and the guitar is the new sax. People don't give a shit about people who create music with their hands. Machines and computers are the new gods and the operator on top is the one directing the crowd. If not an operator then put a Clown with tattoos with a slutty girl and you get in a nutshell what kids these days aspire to be.
PS: I love Rock

Well said. All top 40 music (dominated by hip hop and modern country) is little more than a lifestyle brand with a soundtrack attached. People mourned the devaluation of music in favor of image in the MTV era but these days I don't think anyone really listens to music for its own sake anymore. Pop stars exist only to be the subject of online chatter and/or wank material--everything BUT musicians.

And it makes sense because there's really no real way to make money directly off the music anymore. You have to turn yourself into a brand and then constantly tour.

And the extensive use of backing tracks and autotune has turned tours into a smoke-and-mirrors sham. Post Malone is a great example of this.
 

911

Peacock
Gold Member
ilostabet said:
This is a bit off-topic, but what kind of music do you listen to 911?

A lot of more obscure genres, but also classical, blue note jazz, early rock/psych, soundtracks (Morricone etc), early electronic, early funk (1965-80), synth, and good quality pop from 1965-2010ish from all around the world.

I've got about 2,000 vinyl albums and a 100,000+ digital song library, used to DJ sporadically.
 

Oberrheiner

Pelican
Nonpareil said:
When punk was back in vogue in the early-mid nineties, and bands like Rancid and NoFX

Punk was never en vogue.
Also rancid is not punk, this is punk :

Uzisuicide said:
I disagree somewhat with some opinions here. After Kirk Cobain, rock music DID become a pity party. Songs were about not being able to fit in to society, suicide and self loarhing.

True that.
When I was young the message was fuck society it's shit and we don't want any of it, at some point it turned into boohoo I'm a loser and I don't belong.

Rap is not a good counter-example though, it showed morons shoving cash and deformed asses in your face as a model of success to their moron audience, making them humiliated and jealous, and often provoking desperate and violent behavior afterwards (how am I going to pay for that lambo I can't even spell my own name !?).
 

911

Peacock
Gold Member
These guys above, the Exploited, were over the hill in the UK by 1983, punk was shoved aside as a novelty genre in Europe and replaced with clean-cut synth pop/new wave (Duran Duran, Depeche Mode etc), which fit the era of banking/monetary system-fueled economic growth.

Punk was most definitely in vogue, it was heavily promoted in the UK in the late 70s as the edgy, rebelious genre du jour for GenXers, once the boomer post-hippie prog genre and hedonistic disco scene run their course.

It only caught on a decade later in America, as the genre of choice for suburban progeny from broken/divorced narcissistic boomer households, colonizing college radios, esp. in So. California and parts of the east coast like DC.

This is kind of the anthem of American punk, now a vid with 14m million views...

"SLC Punk!" is a movie that captured this scene,
 

Mountaineer

Kingfisher
Gold Member
Nonpareil said:
Punk music, as much as I'm not the biggest fan of it, is what Grunge told itself it was.

When punk was back in vogue in the early-mid nineties, and bands like Rancid and NoFX started getting mainstream radio airplay, did they immediately jump ship and sign with a major label? No, they stayed with their small indie labels, turning down potentially tens of millions of dollars (though not all of their peers had the same principles - see The Offspring and Green Day) because they knew their music wasn't for everyone and didn't want to sell out their principles. I may not be a fan of their music, but I admire their integrity.

Punk's main fuel was hate towards the establishment and cigar smoking suits. Publishing music under independent labels and not selling out was a point of honour. That's why the Punk underground has so much variety. When your budget is peanuts you rely on creativity and DIY. Punks mastered this. It's clear to see why the corporate owned major labels wanted to subvert this self governing subculture post 2000.

There was a good documentary on how major band front men deal with raising their children and still playing shows. I think the majority of grown up punks are quite good, woke parents.

 

redpillage

Ostrich
Gold Member
Well at least on the death and melodic metal side things are in good shape. Check out:

Amon Amarth
Insominum
Trivium
Be'lakor
Eye Of The Enemy
Killswitch Engage
Omnium Gatherum
Lamb Of God
Hatebreed
Decapitated
Meshuggah
Parkway Drive
Falkenbach
Kalmah

I really think you guys are going to enjoy this Turley Talks podcast on the subject - believe it or not, he's a Christian scholar/professor with a huge following:


Enjoy!
 

redpillage

Ostrich
Gold Member
Steve mentioned Saxon which - to my shame - I didn't even know. They sound pretty damn awesome!!


If you're having black pill day just put on those guys and you'll be all pumped and ready for the day in 5 minutes flat.

And here's Alisa with The Sky Of Slavs if you want to practice your Russian:


Here's a more commercial version which is pretty awesome - definitely would count as commercial rock in my book:



Marry me!

So bottomline: If you extract yourself from all the synthetic crap that's being peddled in the West there's a ton of awesome music out there. The more you look the more you find.
 

Days of Broken Arrows

Crow
Gold Member
911 said:
These guys above, the Exploited, were over the hill in the UK by 1983, punk was shoved aside as a novelty genre in Europe and replaced with clean-cut synth pop/new wave (Duran Duran, Depeche Mode etc), which fit the era of banking/monetary system-fueled economic growth.

Punk was most definitely in vogue, it was heavily promoted in the UK in the late 70s as the edgy, rebelious genre du jour for GenXers, once the boomer post-hippie prog genre and hedonistic disco scene run their course.

It only caught on a decade later in America, as the genre of choice for suburban progeny from broken/divorced narcissistic boomer households, colonizing college radios, esp. in So. California and parts of the east coast like DC.

This is kind of the anthem of American punk, now a vid with 14m million views...

"SLC Punk!" is a movie that captured this scene,

Do you know "Teen Love" by No Trend? It's cut from the same cloth as "Institutionalized."

Back in the '80s, to avoid music industry stupidity, we'd ferret out music on independent labels. This is as indie as you can get. No Trend was a band from the suburbs of DC that pressed their own discs on No Trend Records. I still own one.

 

911

Peacock
Gold Member
Sounds good DOBA, I don't know them. There was a thriving DC punk scene, a lot of the progeny of the MIC and political class. There was a good podcast on that scene I heard a few years ago.
 

NoMoreTO

Ostrich
I was trying to put together a reasonable list on my spotify called "New Rock" - post 2010. There really wasn't very much out there. I remember going to my friends, a couple of them were saying "yeah theres still good bands', but when it came to putting the list together, there really wasn't anything.

Shoot me any good tunes , I don't take to really hard rock as much anymore since hitting my 30s, just a good tune with a good beat, bass, guitar, drummer and vocals.

This is all I really came up with, up for some recos' on new rock that is actually solid.
Sedona - Houndmouth
Stoeln Dance - Milky Chance
Wish I knew you - The revivalists
I don't know - sheepdogs
Aint no rest for the wicked - Cage the elephant
Oh the Boss is coming - Arkells
Hold on - Alabama Shakes
Creature Comfort - Arcade Fire.
 
I used to listen to extreme underground metal, now I prefer slower riffs. Stoner rock is the most accessible and pleasant thing I can recommend. The likes of Sleep (Matt Pike seems very very based in some interviews too).

I like this Greek band, I saw them live once. I think it sounds very "southern" if that makes any sense:

 

911

Peacock
Gold Member
At the risk of sounding too jaded and negative, one big problem with rock today is that it has all been done before. Guys with a guitar, bass, drums have played together for 60 years now. The song above is OK, but it sounds a whole lot like the riff from CCRs "Fortunate Son" declined in a minor key and slapped with vocals from the register of the Cult''s Ian Astbury circa 1994...
 

Oberrheiner

Pelican
911 said:
Punk was most definitely in vogue, it was heavily promoted in the UK in the late 70s

I wasn't there in the 70s, as you can see from my quote of Nonpareil we were talking about the 90s.
Anyway, saying that punk was put aside in the 80s makes no sense to me since it was never mainstream to begin with, and I didn't see the scene decline either - it just changed, with bands like minor threat or uniform choice appearing.
Arguably it did decline in the 90s when hardcore bands started sounding more and more like metal, I'm thinking about bands like merauder or all out war here.

I wouldn't call ST punk, it always sounded way too fabricated and way too clean to be credible IMHO - it was the sound of the bourgeoisie.
But yeah I guess one could call their first couple of albums skater punk or something, it just never sounded honest to me.
Also this is not against them, they have some great songs, you can't bring me down comes to mind - plus that video was the first time I saw a 7-string guitar before it became trendy in the mid-90s.
 

NoMoreTO

Ostrich
911 said:
At the risk of sounding too jaded and negative, one big problem with rock today is that it has all been done before. Guys with a guitar, bass, drums have played together for 60 years now. The song above is OK, but it sounds a whole lot like the riff from CCRs "Fortunate Son" declined in a minor key and slapped with vocals from the register of the Cult''s Ian Astbury circa 1994...

Very True.

I think that's the answer to the perennial question to Rock Stars: "Who are your influences". If you were a teenager listening you'd think its all new.

Sometimes recreation of similar songs with similar riffs and melodies put together a little differently isn't so bad. Someone will find a way to be creative and mix it up.
 
The people in the underground scene nowadays would find a sub-genre they like and within that sub-genre the bands might sound the same to the normal person. I used to like the concerts growing up, but it was a big part of my red pill journey to see how insecure and mentally disabled some of these people in the crowd were. Today's hardcore punk ethos and ideology are straight out of Salinsky's playbook.
 

Oberrheiner

Pelican
Even in the 80s hardcore/punk was always rather left-leaning, however what one must keep in mind is that leftism still meant something at that point in time.
For instance fighting for the workers against the capital, not for minorities against normal people.
Or at least that's what we were led to believe .. the truth I'm afraid will never be known.
 
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