The decline of rock music

CynicalContrarian

Owl
Gold Member
Eusebius said:
Rock was a product of an era which is now gone. Just like jazz and classical music. All these genres live on with their aficionados, but the days when they were the beating heart of a culture are gone.

Then again, the music industry has changed a great deal & is always changing.
Bands may have complained ten years ago that the internet was ruining record sales.

Yet the era of selling ten+ million copies of one album was only really a thing of the 80's & 90's.
Selling ten million copies of one record offhand wasn't really a thing in the 50's & 60's.

Or filling stadiums the size of sports fields, was a big thing of the 80's & 90's. Not so much prior or since.
 

infowarrior1

Hummingbird
Eusebius said:
Rock was a product of an era which is now gone. Just like jazz and classical music. All these genres live on with their aficionados, but the days when they were the beating heart of a culture are gone.

Too bad what replaces them is horrid. Just like what happened to our buildings.
 

Hermetic Seal

Kingfisher
Gold Member
I actually think that technically, musicians are better now than they've ever been. You can find elementary school kids on YouTube who can play Hendrix songs perfectly. The vast resources available to aspiring guitarists, not to mention cheap, high-quality, easily available instruments, make it easier than ever to pick up.

The downside is that most of those kids learn the classics but don't really end up doing anything new/innovative with their technical talent. You can be a great player, but have zero creativity.

I'm not a technically talented guitarist at all, my discipline about learning songs note-for-note is basically zero. But I'm great at improvising and composing music. Honestly, I'd rather work in my limitations than be technically brilliant but uncreative.
 

LINUX

Ostrich
Gold Member
HermeticAlly said:
I actually think that technically, musicians are better now than they've ever been. You can find elementary school kids on YouTube who can play Hendrix songs perfectly.

In my opinion, this has more to do with the availability of finding free sheet music and instructional videos on youtube.The kids are copying other artist, not writing their own music that will go down in history.

The Beethoven's, Mozart's, Zeplin's, George Strait's, Queen's and Metallicas of the world are all gone.

It's more of society to blame though, the top 50 songs on spotify are mostly mumble rap and hookers singing about money. I guess people sing toward the masses and adapt the musical ability needed to please them.

Sometimes you have exceptions though. Alan Walker is an example. He wrote a famous EDM song called "faded" in his bedroom at his mom's house when he 17 using a $200 HP laptop and asking random people on myspace to help him. He had a vision and now he'll never have to worry about money ever again and now his video has 2.7 billion views. 0% nudity, 0% drugs, 0% sex, 0% semi nude woman, 100% hard work , 100% talent. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60ItHLz5WEA
 

Salinger

Woodpecker
I actually think that technically, musicians are better now than they've ever been. You can find elementary school kids on YouTube who can play Hendrix songs perfectly. The vast resources available to aspiring guitarists, not to mention cheap, high-quality, easily available instruments, make it easier than ever to pick up.

You are talking about the outliers in our society. Most kids these days are way too into gaming or wasting time on the Internet to learn to play an instrument. Plus, music programs have been cut from the schools so they're not getting a music education there either.

Just look at the bands of today. Everything is a 4-chord song with the same progressions as other songs.

This should be a great time in history to learn how to play an instrument as the free tutorials on the Internet make it possible to learn without needing to pay an instructor to teach you. However, kids these days are too involved with other media to care about mastering a craft.
 

Hermetic Seal

Kingfisher
Gold Member
I think we're talking past each other here... I agree with you guys. Yes, the general level of musicality is obviously way down, and creativity (especially in anything with mainstream exposure.) But for those with the drive to become good players, they have a better shot at it than ever before thanks to the quality of resources and affordable equipment.

As for a career in music... that's a totally different story.
 

BlastbeatCasanova

Kingfisher
Well at least on the death and melodic metal side things are in good shape. Check out:

Amon Amarth
Insominum
Trivium
Be'lakor
Eye Of The Enemy
Killswitch Engage
Omnium Gatherum
Lamb Of God
Hatebreed
Decapitated
Meshuggah
Parkway Drive
Falkenbach
Kalmah

I really think you guys are going to enjoy this Turley Talks podcast on the subject - believe it or not, he's a Christian scholar/professor with a huge following:


Enjoy!

Great list, I'm surprised a lot of guys on this forum aren't into metal/heavy rock. I've rambled on about it before on this forum but the musicianship and lyrics leagues above whatever mainstream stuff is peddled on the airwaves these days. There are some good bands on that list that are still fairly accessible, Trivium and KSE are excellent. I prefer Parkway Drive's older stuff, they have become too area/soft rock for me. Meshuggah are legends but not so much of a gateway band.

Haha, I saw the trailer for that movie and ordered it right away. Never had the time to watch it unfortunately :(

In the meantime, here is a song
which shows that it doesn't need to be all whiny and ball-less :

Never thought I'd see Kublai Khan on this forum. You have good taste my friend. They're heavy as fuck and his lyrics are pretty good IMO. That scene of hardcore and metalcore is thriving

^ That song you posted is unbearable. Just loud noise and some guys screaming, I know this is what older people used to say about heavy metal, but in this case it is true.

At least mofo's like Sepultura or Slayer had great guitars, drums and bass, true musicians with virtuosism. And the screams where bereable.



Classic response from someone who just doesn't get it. Which is fine, but to call it "just loud noise" is kinda dumb.
 

Rocha

Ostrich
Gold Member
Great list, I'm surprised a lot of guys on this forum aren't into metal/heavy rock. I've rambled on about it before on this forum but the musicianship and lyrics leagues above whatever mainstream stuff is peddled on the airwaves these days. There are some good bands on that list that are still fairly accessible, Trivium and KSE are excellent. I prefer Parkway Drive's older stuff, they have become too area/soft rock for me. Meshuggah are legends but not so much of a gateway band.



Never thought I'd see Kublai Khan on this forum. You have good taste my friend. They're heavy as fuck and his lyrics are pretty good IMO. That scene of hardcore and metalcore is thriving



Classic response from someone who just doesn't get it. Which is fine, but to call it "just loud noise" is kinda dumb.

It is also indeed dumb to call dumb an opinion against your musical taste...

But that shit is unbereable to my ears, I guess they are more refined than yours.
 

Player_1337

Pelican
Gold Member
Feels like rock music (in the mainstream at least) has been dead since around 2010. The last truly new, big, and innovative rock band was Radiohead (really starting around 1997 with OK Computer). Though I'm not a big fan, The Foo Fighters have also had huge success it seems (they started in the mid-90s, but didn't get really big until the 2000s).

The last time 'punk' was big, was with the burgeoning of pop punk bands in the 90s (some don't even consider this authentic punk music). Green Day and Blink 182 are the only ones with any significant, enduring fame/longevity-- the rest sort of faded away or became more niche.

You then had the explosion of NYC "garage" rock and indie bands in the early 2000s (Interpol, The Strokes, White Stripes, etc.)
That same decade was also bogged down with a lot shitty 'core' and 'screamo' bands.

The rise of music/rhythm games (think Guitar Hero and Rock Band) also made rock music "mainstream" for a while (from around 2006-2010), but the market became over-saturated.
 

911

Peacock
Gold Member
Youth will always rebel to try and gain more freedom, that's the way of life.

The mark of good social engineering programs is to make the changes that are created seem like a natural process, especially for people who lack historic perspective.

"Teenage rebellion" only became a big thing with the Boomers, it started out in the 1950s with films like "Rebel Without a Cause" and the character of James Dean, a teen in jeans, t-shirt and leather jacket who beats up his father and rebelled...for no reason whatsoever.

In the film, his father is totally emasculated:





This is an attack on fatherhood, and family. You went from Ward Cleaver father characters, strong, masculine and wise, to this clueless father in an apron (precursor of Homer Simpson) who gets beat up by his teenage boy who is like a foot shorter, with the young audience lapping it up. They've sown the seeds for a generational wedge and a hostile, rebellious youth culture, which is more susceptible to being steered by new media and new destructive social engineering troika of sexual revolution, mass youth culture and new drugs created by the deep state (sex, drugs and rocknroll). LSD was manufactured, promoted and distributed by the deep state, just like crack cocaine two decades later.

It's the basic implementation of the "Authoritarian Personality" doctrine, from the book published by the American Jewish Committee in 1950, which was the Frankfurt School's main attack against American fathers, written by Adorno and Levinson. The book basically reduced healthy, normal 1950s families to fascism, and advocated against it in a successful bid ot destroy the family. The book became a college standard that was pushed in psych classes.


Boomers watched Rebel Without a Cause in their early teens were primed for the bigger demolition job of the 1960s counterculture.


Since that time, every new generation has been rebelling against "the Man", and most of these rebellions are fake, pushed by the industry to continue the work started by Adorno in the 1950s.
 
Last edited:

911

Peacock
Gold Member
Am I the only one who tends to believe the Cobain's murder theory? dude was found with a large quantity of heroin in his blood, enough to kill most and certainly enough to not make you able to remove syringe, put cap on it, remove elastic from arm, put everything aside and take a shotgun, exercise a certain pressure to pull the trigger and shoot himself. It's something that borders the impossible.
Meanwhile Courtney Love never sued the guy who explicitly and publicly accused her of being responsible for the alleged murder. This private detective went on to divulgate the registration of his phone conversations with Courtney which is another serious felony and yet she never did anything legally against him. Quite suspicious. If you are sure of your innocence, you shouldn't avoid any legal proceeding against someone who slandered you in multiple occasions.

Hank Harrison, Courtney Love's father, believes his daughter had Cobain killed. He's probably right. Harrison has deep state connections, being involved as a manager with the Grateful Dead, who were created to spread mindless LSD culture in a social engineering project designed to dumb down the Boomer masses and destroy their families and social structures.

 

Oberrheiner

Pelican
The mark of good social engineering programs is to make the changes that are created seem like a natural process, especially for people who lack historic perspective.

Oh man, you really are simeon, but in reverse ..
Stop taking everything so seriously like it's always the jews conspiring or whatever.

I have kids (and cousins, and nephews), I don't need "historical perspective" to tell you that.
Youth wants freedom, and it's your duty as a parent to teach them why it makes sense to follow the rules and respect authority - and how they should be able to discern when it doesn't.
Although that second part is the french side of things I suppose, if you're (for instance) german you won't be taught that :)

Anyway, take care, relax, and prepare for what's coming.
 

Eusebius

Hummingbird
Gold Member
Hank Harrison, Courtney Love's father, believes his daughter had Cobain killed. He's probably right. Harrison has deep state connections, being involved as a manager with the Grateful Dead, who were created to spread mindless LSD culture in a social engineering project designed to dumb down the Boomer masses and destroy their families and social structures.


I think Cobain was murdered too. The outline of it is pretty clear, including who Courtney hired to do the job and what later happened to him (hint: he's not around these days).
 

Zep

Kingfisher
I actually think that technically, musicians are better now than they've ever been. You can find elementary school kids on YouTube who can play Hendrix songs perfectly. The vast resources available to aspiring guitarists, not to mention cheap, high-quality, easily available instruments, make it easier than ever to pick up.

The downside is that most of those kids learn the classics but don't really end up doing anything new/innovative with their technical talent. You can be a great player, but have zero creativity.

I'm not a technically talented guitarist at all, my discipline about learning songs note-for-note is basically zero. But I'm great at improvising and composing music. Honestly, I'd rather work in my limitations than be technically brilliant but uncreative.

Yup. The technical abilities I'm seeing of musicians is mind-boggling, they have access to videos of old players and other great resources to save themselves years of wasted time on inefficient technique. Kids get good real fast these days. BUT, the problem as you pointed out is creativity. The bedroom producer is a blessing and a curse. The good thing is the bedroom producers ( BP's from now on ) can realize a vision, or an idea, the problem I'm seeing is that they are good, but, not great. Greatness I'm thinking comes from the creative tension between people in a room together. The Eagles, The Police, Chicago, Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, all were bands jamming in a room ... and fighting too!, constantly putting pressure on each other to make sure the music was the best it could be. Tension is part of the creative process, it seems to make the best music. David Bowie was a genius, but, he still needed his incredible musicians to really bring his ideas to such a high-level. I doubt it was him who came up with that guitar part to "Stay". or the 100's of other beautiful musical motifs in his tunes.

Kids need to start jamming again.
 

Dr. Howard

Peacock
Gold Member
I'm here mainly for the punk rock commentary. In the 90's and early 2000s my brothers and I spent way too much time in it/around it. Punk rock became co-opted much like other kinds of music. Good rock and punk still exist today, but like an earlier poster mentioned, you have to look to find it. Its the bad side of being able to self publish to the internet, you really have to search for it.

Back to the punk rock side. Your suspects are Epitaph Records and Fat Wreck Chords. Epitaph owned/started by the very Jewish bassist for Bad Religion. Fat Wreck Chords owned by the very Jewish Fat Mike of NOFX. If you doubt their agendas, wonder why Bad Religion is Anti-Christian but not anti-semitic? Seems weird for a band that thinks religion is ruining the world and Humanist Philosophy is the answer. Or, listen to "the brews" and "don't call me white" by NOFX

Generally, bands signed to Epitaph/Fat Wreck Chords have "made it" in the punk rock world and once they sign, have to change their tune to fit the lame, 'controlled opposition' theme of the day. It began in the late 90s when they changed from being anti-corporate (over the target) to being all about PETA and Vegan. Then they became anti-war in Iraq and Anti-Bush...when Obama was elected they stopped hating the government and became pro-gay and anti-racist. When Obama left office they all jumped on the transgender bandwagon. Their politcs are now aligned with the "woke" corporations.

There seems to be a 'watershed' moment circa occupy wallstreet when groups like Antifa, punk rock anarchists etc got too close to having a real impact and were subsequently coopted/infliltrated and turned into propaganda tools.

A formerly great band, subject of a documentary called "we're never going home" named Against Me, documents the band being courted by Fat Wreck Chords and Sire Records. Fat Wreck Chords released the documentary to try to seem 'more cool' than Sire and convince the band to stay on their label. The real impact of the documentary, which ends with no conclusion, is seen a decade later when the band finally did 'sell out', joined a large label, half the band quit and the frontman became transgender. How edgy.
 

Oberrheiner

Pelican
Back to the punk rock side. Your suspects are Epitaph Records and Fat Wreck Chords.

Yeah but that's again shitty pop/punk from california.
How come they're always from california btw ?

Punk in drublic came out in 1994, the whole genre was already long irrelevant.
Agnostic front's live at cbgb came out in what, 1990 ?
And this was the end of "true" punk/hardcore, after that everything was mixed with metal.

Then ok look at the brews, what is it about ? A fat jew fantasizing about being a skinhead ?
How can you take there people seriously ? Have you seen the guy ? How many fights you think he's even been in ?

This is all the bourgeoisie dreaming about being what they're not.
I don't know how one can seriously listen to that shit.

I think they didn't even listen to it themselves :
 
I am very thankful about the all the good materials and videos on the forum on cultural subversion. It is short, convincing and straight to the point. Especially videos such as the movie reviews from BlackPilled. It is fascinating to see from an outside point of view to American culture. I also realized that my childhood heroes "The Offspring" were signed to (((Geffen))). They became too soft to even be called pop punk after "Americana", which itself had some self-loathing chucked in.
 

armenia4ever

Kingfisher
Great list, I'm surprised a lot of guys on this forum aren't into metal/heavy rock. I've rambled on about it before on this forum but the musicianship and lyrics leagues above whatever mainstream stuff is peddled on the airwaves these days. There are some good bands on that list that are still fairly accessible, Trivium and KSE are excellent. I prefer Parkway Drive's older stuff, they have become too area/soft rock for me. Meshuggah are legends but not so much of a gateway band.

I actually got really into hard-core and metal core in high-school and still love it. Everything from KSE to AILD to The Ghost Inside and August Burns Red.

Remember, you got to start gen xers and older off with easier metal core. Stuff like this:


And more along the lines of rock Ballad feeling:


Anyway, back to the topic at hand. Rock was all about rebellion, but at a certain point all of its offshoots - the sub genres were mainstream. There was nothing to rebel against. (Hence why Punk was birthed)

It was "hard" and now it's soft.

It's not just Rock either. Alot of these bands that have been around for decades get progressively poppier and there music much less complex to make it as relatable as possible to a wide audience.

1. Thing is its hard to compete against the "new" and even simpler stuff of artists like Billie Eilish or even EDM which is basically just base music and drugs, but attracts massive attendance during concert tours.

2. People grow out of their edgy phase and/or other music becomes the new edge. Me and my wife went to the last Warped Tour in 2019. The founder announced it would be the last one because attendance has been dwindling for years now.

Despite everything from Deathcore to punk to rap, it wasn't edgy enough for Gen Z and even some millennial to come out. The torch isn't being passed on. So what's taking its place?

Whatever is playing on the radio now I guess - that and music seems to be less of something you focus all your attention on and more like something you have on in the background or maybe go to a festival for because of friends so you can drink, party, and do some ecstasy.
 
Top