The E. Michael Jones thread

Wutang

Hummingbird
Gold Member
Is that debate between EMJ and Vaush worth watching? I'm kind of interested but it's also a pretty big time sink to watch the entire thing.
 

Raskolnikov

Sparrow
Orthodox
These are great points. We have done the experiments and they don't work. We tried, and failed. Now it's ironic that they don't want to let the (white) man go (and do his own thing with his own "people" whatever that means) because he is the most competent in making high civilization and material "progress" - though they'll never admit it. It's not a value judgment except for the fact that nearly all people (from all four corners of the Earth) obviously will do anything to get to the civilizations that europeans create, which betrays their position and argument of egalitarianism. Whether that matters or not - in a cosmological sense- is irrelevant; it's an objective, verifiable fact.
You know, I mean if whites were still racially conscious and conscious of a Christian ideal of society, some sort of white supremacy (I know that's an evil word, but bare with me) might work out as well. In the John Wayne sense of the word. I don't care what the modern narrative is, plenty of cultures have been very appreciative of white guidance and have actually gladly retained much of it until the new globohomo programming started to seep in and they learned they would just be handed stuff for complaining about supposed oppression. I wonder how much of that would disappear if people just categorically stopped rewarding it. Russia is white supremacist is some sense, because Slavic Russians are the titular nation and even though it's a multiethnic state, them being the boss is more or less accepted and works out for the benefit of everybody. Exceptions I'd say are mostly due to foreign instigation, like Sunni Wahhabis or some Asiatic groups. Doesn't mean they are oppressed, doesn't mean there's animosity, just that theres a general hierarchy and a sense of functional order. Same with Chinese people pretty much all over Southeast Asia. They have high IQs, they are working hard and they run the show. Or Diaspora Germans in Eastern Europe and Central Asia until WWI, where they tend to be respected to this day. I don't think devastating conflict is a necessary outcome if you take certain multicultural instigators out of the equation, who should live in their own ethnostate anyway. But even with regards to blacks, plenty of African tribes weren't really hostile to white traders and colonists, the Kabaka of Buganda actually liked them quite a lot and worked with them to gain an edge over competitors. But then again, I don't see a Christian revival coming in the near future.
 

Tom Slick

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Same with Chinese people pretty much all over Southeast Asia. They have high IQs, they are working hard and they run the show.
Speaking from experience, I believe this is not generally true. Just as with another group that is good as getting embedded within certain markets and businesses and then working their advantage, usually until they utterly destroy that market through corruption and racing to the bottom, such as Jews taking over art or Chinese getting involved in nearly anything, it's not high IQ, it's cunning, helping your in-group, and working your advantage by having separate moral codes for the in-group and out-group.

Chinese have a joke about themselves, they actually say, "We are the Jews of the East," when describing how they do business.
 

Wutang

Hummingbird
Gold Member
I think cunning and general "trickiness" requires a certain baseline IQ - you have to at least be able to outsmart the people you are screwing over. It's why other minority immigrant groups such as Africans and Muslims usually don't perform as well as Chinese or Jews do even though they too are also super tribal and aren't known for their honesty or being willing to abide by local social norms.
 

DanielH

Ostrich
Moderator
Orthodox
I think you win the debate when you upset your opponent enough to want to physically fight you.


So I saw a strawman and quite an emotional response to what I assume was a fairly common sense argument rooted in natural law. That's the only clip from the debate I've seen and I'm glad I didn't watch the rest of it now. Any clip with Vaush is frustrating, not in the least because of his profanity and pure evil opinions. And it's evil, not mental illness, it's evil.
 

It_is_my_time

Crow
Protestant
So I saw a strawman and quite an emotional response to what I assume was a fairly common sense argument rooted in natural law. That's the only clip from the debate I've seen and I'm glad I didn't watch the rest of it now. Any clip with Vaush is frustrating, not in the least because of his profanity and pure evil opinions. And it's evil, not mental illness, it's evil.
Yea, he and Destiny are pretty infuriating. It is constantly "do you have a study for this?" or "do you have any proof of that?" and then the source is given so they find some propaganda piece from CNN to counter it and claim "well we don't know for sure so we can't conclude that" all the while what is discussed is rampantly obvious to the average person.

How E. Michael Jones has the patience to put up with it is amazing. Only through Christ could a man be THIS patient. It is pretty remarkable.
 

Denam8487

Robin
Catholic
Yea, he and Destiny are pretty infuriating. It is constantly "do you have a study for this?" or "do you have any proof of that?" and then the source is given so they find some propaganda piece from CNN to counter it and claim "well we don't know for sure so we can't conclude that" all the while what is discussed is rampantly obvious to the average person.

How E. Michael Jones has the patience to put up with it is amazing. Only through Christ could a man be THIS patient. It is pretty remarkable.

"Explain to me- no, listen, let me talk, I want you to explain to me, help me understand why CP is bad... Do you have any peer-reviewed studies which empirically spell out why it is bad if a person who wants to healthily use CP in good faith? And before you cite any statistics, I'm letting you know that I will preemptively reject them." -Vaush (probably)
 

Raskolnikov

Sparrow
Orthodox
Speaking from experience, I believe this is not generally true. Just as with another group that is good as getting embedded within certain markets and businesses and then working their advantage, usually until they utterly destroy that market through corruption and racing to the bottom, such as Jews taking over art or Chinese getting involved in nearly anything, it's not high IQ, it's cunning, helping your in-group, and working your advantage by having separate moral codes for the in-group and out-group.

Chinese have a joke about themselves, they actually say, "We are the Jews of the East," when describing how they do business.
yeah I've actually heard about that, maybe they are not the best example. They do seem very Jewy in more than one way, we need to look out for them. Though it would be interesting to see a nation where Han and Jews are isolated and have to play off each other. Judging by the Baizuo stuff and the masculinity campaign, the Chinese have grown somewhat weary of the cultural effects, although they have blamed it on the South Koreans and Japanese so far.
 

Early Bird

Woodpecker
Catholic
Is that debate between EMJ and Vaush worth watching? I'm kind of interested but it's also a pretty big time sink to watch the entire thing.

My thoughts on the EMJ vs. Vaush debate.

If you don’t want to waste your time watching you can waste your time reading my rant instead :squintlol:


This was similar to his debate with Styxx on the same subject. It wasn't really a good debate insofar as theatrics or entertainment are concerned: EMJ proceeds honestly, while his opponents are flippantly dismissive, arrogant, crude and intentionally amorphous. This debate lacks the coherent punch of a “Ben Shapiro dEsTRoYs!!” video, and that is perhaps because EMJ is not really aggressive with his tactics nor is he acting for a camera. Logos is always central, which is good. But this affords less honest opponents the illusion of scoring points or gaining ground, especially to the average or secular viewer.

A quick observation on personality types and how this factors in here:
I might get some flack for using astrology as an example (I understand astrology is not permitted or recognized by the church, though I believe that has more to do with consulting oracles/mediums and attempting to predict/cheat one’s destiny or manipulate the world through unholy means at the expense of belief in our God-given free will and salvation through the church...as such things relate to Kabbalah, occultism, Freemasonry, etc. as a portal to the demonic). But what about as a mere observation of personality patterns? If it is understood and accepted that we all have a given nature – some bull headed, some meek, and so on -- I don’t see how such an observation or insight would be incongruent with natural law. No different from noticing cultural or ethnic patterns. It doesn’t mean those patterns are absolute, but it can aid our understanding of ourselves to the end of better serving God. Perhaps a topic for another thread.

The reason for this angle is that I’ve noticed a similarity with the style and behaviour of both Vaush & Styxx, and this is congruent with the negative traits of all the other Aquarians I’ve known personally. While Styxx isn’t quite as cringe, he has a similar attitude – rude, arrogant, rebellious, disagreeable for the sake of being disagreeable, contrarian, and basically acts like a Jew (embodiment of that revolutionary spirit).

The Aquarius is said to be the ‘visionary’ of the zodiac, and so are particularly inclined to revolutionary and non-conformist ideas. They favor futuristic and wishy-washy mumbo-jumbo over what’s tried and true, and tend to view history as boring and no longer relevant. Example at 51:45 – “reality has moved forward, it’s the future, old man...sorry”). They embody the stereotypical bleeding heart granola yoga liberal who drives a hybrid to save the whales, or the more hardcore anarchist/SJW. They are the type to say the classic cringe line “I’m kind of spiritual but not religious.“ They thumb their nose at tradition and strongly dislike control or authority of any kind. They recoil in horror at the mere thought of an objective reality or imposed order. They tend to be somewhat androgynous in appearance (which contributes to their dislike of binary categories and their natural attraction to more alternative forms of expression). They seem to enjoy the odor of their own **** so much that everything around them just ends up smelling. So it would follow with regards to pornography that they are particularly sensitive to what they perceive to be an attack on their absolute and total freedom to do as they please.

Just some insight to frame the opponent and therefore add more context to the debate.

Vaush is the reddit fedora neckbeard atheist caricature par excellence when he continually asks to “sEe ThE eViDeNCe” after EMJ provides consistent examples and makes extremely cogent points. As someone who defends pornography and pedophilia, Vaush is already lost right out of the gate and is blind to this reality.

As my man Chesterton says: “The special mark of the modern world is not that it is skeptical, but that it is dogmatic without knowing it. It says, in mockery of old devotees, that they believed without knowing why they believed. But the moderns believe without knowing what they believe - and without even knowing that they do believe it.”

It’s clear Vaush has no interest in learning anything from the discussion, but is instead focused on fighting a representative of the OpPrEsSiVe pATriArChY. His analogies are absurd and not relevant to the topic. His desperate and pathetic slur of "anti-semitism" exposes both his frustration and his true intentions.
 
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Sitting Bull

Woodpecker
Trad Catholic
I liked your list of Vaugh's characteristics @Early Bird. I just wanted to add something about this :

The Aquarius is said to be the ‘visionary’ of the zodiac, and so are particularly inclined to revolutionary and non-conformist ideas.


True, but at the same time Vaugh's audacity and "transgressiveness" is so fake. Vaugh never makes any transgression that we have not all been conditioned for a long time to be afraid to question. He is a late-generation transgressor, not a pioneer transgressor.

At some point, Vaugh makes a show of bravery by claiming he would have been Gulaged in the USSR for his opinions. Well, maybe he would have, but that's just because a lot of people were Gulaged there, not because of the firmness of his beliefs.

I find it hard to believe that Vaugh would have even dared to brag about his porn use in the not-so-distant past when it was still frowned upon. He probably would have limited himself to opposing the marriage institution or something like that.
 

Early Bird

Woodpecker
Catholic
I liked your list of Vaugh's characteristics @Early Bird. I just wanted to add something about this :




True, but at the same time Vaugh's audacity and "transgressiveness" is so fake. Vaugh never makes any transgression that we have not all been conditioned for a long time to be afraid to question. He is a late-generation transgressor, not a pioneer transgressor.

At some point, Vaugh makes a show of bravery by claiming he would have been Gulaged in the USSR for his opinions. Well, maybe he would have, but that's just because a lot of people were Gulaged there, not because of the firmness of his beliefs.

I find it hard to believe that Vaugh would have even dared to brag about his porn use in the not-so-distant past when it was still frowned upon. He probably would have limited himself to opposing the marriage institution or something like that.
Agreed.
 

Raskolnikov

Sparrow
Orthodox
This may sound harsh but its nice to think that slimy rats like Vaush will spend eternity in hell.
I can relate, but I recommend praying for everyone who ignites that feeling within you. Not easy, I certainly have difficulty bringing myself to do it, but it will reconcile your feelings. What we are shooting for is to be able to cry for every lost soul, even those that seem to deserve it (they all deserve it after all, because God's justice is perfect).
 

Boone947

 
Banned
Trad Catholic
This may sound harsh but its nice to think that slimy rats like Vaush will spend eternity in hell.
We are not allowed to wish for anyone’s eternal damnation, instead we should earnestly pray to God for Vaush’s conversion and salvation, "I desire, therefore, first of all, that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings, be made for all men ... for this is good and acceptable in the sight of God, who will have all men be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the Truth," (I Tim. ii. 1)
 

StSeb

Sparrow
Catholic
We are not allowed to wish for anyone’s eternal damnation, instead we should earnestly pray to God for Vaush’s conversion and salvation, "I desire, therefore, first of all, that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings, be made for all men ... for this is good and acceptable in the sight of God, who will have all men be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the Truth," (I Tim. ii. 1)
You are right. It's wrong to wish that on someone
 

Sitting Bull

Woodpecker
Trad Catholic
I have to say, seeing doctor Jones play the harmonica was very out of character and immensely amusing. :D

Well, not that out of character. He used to be in a rock band in his early years, you know, and a few years ago he produced an album of two dozens of similar political songs :


For free you can only hear small portions of the songs, but the Neocon song is available in full on Youtube :

 
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