The God pill

doc holliday

Pelican
Gold Member
RIslander said:
Shits been getting deep on RVF lately... the forum is really evolving. I'm learning a lot about life from recent threads.

I wish I could say I like what I am learning.

RIslander, could you expound more on what it is that you're learning that you're not liking from some of these threads?
 

doc holliday

Pelican
Gold Member
KMK said:
The claim that one can receive guidance from god in exchange for prayer, meditation, regular attendance of mass and sacraments, etc is BS. Speaking from experience. I look at anyone who claims to have gotten something from traveling down that road with a lot of suspicion.

So you're a nihilist who doesn't believe life has any meaning or that any meaning that you might find in life is purely from your material and sexual pursuits?
 

MikeS

Pelican
Aurini said:
MikeS said:
It's not very often I've witnessed an atheist becoming religious - I actually still have a hard time wrapping my head around how it happens.

For me it was studying Godel's Incompleteness Theorem and realizing the implications. If math has proven that math can't be proven... that means one of two things must be true. Either that there is no truth - math is a social construct - and even the notion of the "self" is a lie (this is the current post-modernist belief, taught in Universities - though seldom so blatantly) or else there is a prime mover behind and before time, the Alpha and the Omega, who is Truth itself...

I have no issues with the idea that there is no truth, nor a self that's more than an accumulation of experiences and learned knowledge and abilities on top of some base individual traits from our genes.
So far - I'm past 40 - it hasn't been necessary for my happiness and motivation in life to believe in a soul or an afterlife or any of the other concepts religions have given us.

However I will concede that when I was reading everything from astronomy over metaphysics, epistemology, rudimentary quantum mechanics, religion history and a number of other subjects during some very knowledge hungry years in my early 20s (so long ago now that I would need a lot of repeat reading to remember much in terms of details), there most definitely seemed to be structure to the universe that could certainly be explained by the presence of some kind of creating intelligence (that may or may not exist anymore, if it ever did).

But to me even if such an intelligence should exist, I don't see how it would have any direct bearing at all on the - in my opinion - man-made religions and all the positive and negative teachings and massive historical cultural and social influences of those.
Well, other than having spurred on the imaginations of the creators of those religions, but as an atheist/agnostic/really-don't-think-of-myself-with-any-such-label I also think that such imaginations could have been spurred on by other things, most likely primarily just a search for answers and a structure to life and society.
 

RIslander

Hummingbird
doc holliday said:
RIslander said:
Shits been getting deep on RVF lately... the forum is really evolving. I'm learning a lot about life from recent threads.

I wish I could say I like what I am learning.

RIslander, could you expound more on what it is that you're learning that you're not liking from some of these threads?

To be honest I am not sure how to put it in words. I suppose the best explanation I can give is how I'm learning about the futile nature of our lives, especially straight white men living in the west, however everyone at whole. The fact I am not capable of being religious, which seems to be the only way to create any meaning to life after taking the red pill, is depressing to me. I guess the best reasoning I can give is that it is clear I'm not alone on my outlook of our existance and the fact that many others feel the same reinforces the nihilism I feel.

The forum has changed my life for the better in countless ways but for the worse in a couple ways. The red pill is tough to swallow.
 
Mushrooms though. I'm interested in that.

As someone whose experimented with them a lot (and most psychedelics) and received basically no value other than basically being told to stay out of the spiritual world, how did the dots get connected here for you?
 
The Father said:
One of the more interesting arguments i've heard for God's existence is that people crave him: Go back to the earliest societies, to primitive drawings on cave walls, humans have always looked toward a concept of god or gods. It's timeless and universal. And the fact that people have always craved God is interesting because of the other things people crave: Humans only crave things that exist - food, water, sex, etc.

The thing about being human is that it's the ultimate paradox

We are able to perceive exactly where we are and we are able to create better than any other life form that we know of, but we are also ultimately flawed because of our urges and human biology. We are constantly in a state of power and being powerless at the same time, because of how our bodies and minds work. It's the ultimate contradiction and it's why perfectionists and overly empathetic or ultra aware people can develop severe depression - because there's never anything you'll be able to do to get rid of one side of you - you will always live between those two sides intermittently. It can drive some people crazy.

If you also add to that that humans are built to find meaning (some people more than others) - it freaks some people out that ultimately we are the ones that create meaning in our lives in the physical world, and ultimately, we don't know for sure what this physical world is. Once you've experienced everything you want to experience in the physical world - where do you go? Some people turn to drugs, some to religion, and some are able to find meaning in their everyday life. Some even kill themselves.

Whether you find god, or whether you are able to find fulfillment in everyday life - I think it all comes back to acceptance, seeing good in the world, and figuring out how you can position yourself to live a healthy life where you can put out and receive good energy. Every man will have a different way of doing that.

Black pill, negativity, and living in a constant state of internal and external conflict is not a sustainable long term strategy for life.

Something I would note though is that you don't have to withdraw from keeping other people and groups of people accountable in society. I think that can be a healthy part of a fulfilling life - you just have to get the balance right.
 

MikeS

Pelican
ArloDash said:
Mushrooms though. I'm interested in that.

As someone whose experimented with them a lot (and most psychedelics) and received basically no value other than basically being told to stay out of the spiritual world, how did the dots get connected here for you?

I've tried LSD once, mushrooms a few times and the relatively psychedelic types of MDMA quite a lot of times (all of it over a fairly brief period a couple of decades ago).
I saw some pretty lights (still remember how I felt looking at the stars when I was on LSD), a lot of outright hallucinations (mostly LSD which truly alters perception, less intense with mushrooms in the doses I had) and felt fantastic and "one with the universe" (mostly the MDMA).
I also felt like I had dozens of amazing insights into my own mind, the universe and all matters deep and complex.

Once the effects wore off and I had slept off the physical wear and tear everything just felt like what I considered it to be... figments of extreme over stimulation of various centers in the brain, given context and form by my mood, expectations, knowledge etc.
I'm certain someone religious or someone having those topics on his or her mind, would be much more prone to having religion themed hallucinations and impressions and amplified thoughts and insights (real or imagined). Just like my hippie-light personality of my early 20s felt a greater understanding of astrology and spirit animals when taking psychedelic drugs.
 

la bodhisattva

Kingfisher
The Father said:
Ski pro said:
It’s April 1st on Monday. You’re early.

Did he get banned for this, or some other post?

Hopefully for this because it just a completely shithead thing to post. Especially within a thread that is borne from grief, growth, and introspection.

As for my faith. I'm a lifelong Christian. Baptized at 10 in an American Baptist church.
Growing up my religion would have been defined as Born-Again. The boogeyman of the Left and also the Catholic and Anglican sects. The American and Southern Baptist sects represents a rather discordant approach to a "redpill" existence. I've written on this forum before about Christianity's overall submission to SJW and the essential behavior of pussy pedestalization. But in Baptist communities, it seems a bit different. There is a weird blue pill perception that is undeniably red pill at its core, without anyone really noticing. Sort of like a subconscious script of the wife ruling the roost in public discourse, but the unspoken acknowledgement that everyone within the congregation(s) knows that the husband really calls the shots.

I suppose a decent example from my current drunk mind is that heathens and SJWs attribute who decides what's for dinner or how to decorate a room as a sign of progressivism. A wife who decorates the bedroom in a feminine way is the husband's subjugation to female empowerment. Instead, the husband simply does not care. In truth, if the husband genuinely cared about his interior design, there is no question that the wife would submit to his preferences.

I see this in my own family. My parents have been happily married for 40 years. My parents' areas of the house always had my mother's touch (an anti-feminist, Christian, conservative angel of a woman if I must say)...simply because my dad didn't care if the bathroom had a flower border or smelled like lavender instead of cedar wood. If he did, there would be absolutely no question that my mom would embrace, not merely accommodate, to his wants. Not because she was afraid (I've never once heard my parents raise their voices to one another), but because she is a devout, Baptist woman who understands her role within the marriage per scripture.

Coincidentally, growing up in the church, I only saw divorce from non-church going classmates at public school and never knew someone with depression or anxiety until college, where, as it happens, was my first intense exposure to a population with a high percentage of atheism.
 
I'm not an atheist, so I guess I can make a comment in this interesting thread.

I respect Christianity...so please don't be offended by my next comments.

The truth that I see in many religions is that you have to accept in both good and evil. There is no true path to righteousness...both good and evil exist together and you must learn to understand and navigate the challenges that dichotomy presents.

For example, Chinese religious beliefs accept the Yin and Yang...shadow comes with light, they cannot exist without each other.

Another example is Hinduism and the 30 million + gods and deities that live in the minds of the believers. Each of these gods is a reflection of the many faces of mankind...both good and sometimes not so good.

Even the English language reflects the dichotomy of good and evil that exists within religion...God (similar to the word good) and Evil (similar to the word Devil).

The fear I have in accepting God is that I then must also accept the Devil (in Western religion, but the same applies in just about every other religion).

Despite the evil I see in the world every day, I don't want to accept the Devil exists. Therefore, I don't want to accept that God exists. It's not that I don't believe, it's just too confronting to accept.

Maybe that's why the story about the rabbi's concluding that God doesn't exist but still choosing to pray is so compelling.
 

Avoy

Robin
Roosh said:
Would it be fair to say that if men who realize the futility of hedonism and go onto a more pious path, then there can be a small subset of women that can also reform?

Reform for women can't take place until they drop their "strong and independent" ethos, which goes against the natural order. Women submit to men who submitted to God. God leads men who leads women. Some women (e.g. nuns) skip over men and go directly to God, which is fine. I would be skeptical of a woman who is born again but did not submit to either man or God.

What is this "submit to God" thing you speak of exactly? You mentioned earlier he speaks to you through your own voice in your head. Are you saying you will follow what you divinely intuit or base your life solely on what's written in the Christian bible?
 

doc holliday

Pelican
Gold Member
RIslander said:
doc holliday said:
RIslander said:
Shits been getting deep on RVF lately... the forum is really evolving. I'm learning a lot about life from recent threads.

I wish I could say I like what I am learning.

RIslander, could you expound more on what it is that you're learning that you're not liking from some of these threads?

To be honest I am not sure how to put it in words. I suppose the best explanation I can give is how I'm learning about the futile nature of our lives, especially straight white men living in the west, however everyone at whole. The fact I am not capable of being religious, which seems to be the only way to create any meaning to life after taking the red pill, is depressing to me. I guess the best reasoning I can give is that it is clear I'm not alone on my outlook of our existance and the fact that many others feel the same reinforces the nihilism I feel.

The forum has changed my life for the better in countless ways but for the worse in a couple ways. The red pill is tough to swallow.

I think herein lies the problem with modern day life in that while science has allowed humans to live more luxuriously and comfortably than ever previously imagined, it has also served to disconnect too many people from any spiritual sense of being which I think is the basis of forming any sort of meaning from one's life. In times past, when people had to struggle for survival on a day to day basis, they would fall back on their religious beliefs and faith to see them through. I myself am quite religious (I'm a Hindu) and I know that when I'm going through difficulties, I dig down deep into my spiritual beliefs and it is only through that, that I have been able to not let my life's challenges destroy me. So many people these days have no spiritual grounding so when they inevitably undergo difficulties (science has not yet found a way to prevent bad things from happening), they can't cope and thus have to turn to prescription psych meds, recreation drugs or in the worst case scenario, suicide.

Just as you aren't able to be religious, I am wholly unable to place my faith in science, or gaya or whatever it is that "enlightened" modern day people believe in the western world today. Many studies have shown people with deeply held religious beliefs are much happier and are able to far better cope with the realities of the finiteness and limitations of human life, whereas people with blind faith in science or government or humanism tend to have bleaker outlooks on life. Religious people tend to have far stronger connections to their fellow man whereas city dwellers who are completely focused on their material pursuits are atomized islands with no deep, meaningful connections to anyone. Too many people are struggling with the emptiness of life in the modern era and I contend that it is this lack of spirituality, this lack of understanding how serendipitous human existence really is, which has created this crisis in the human experience.
 

Rorogue

Kingfisher
Avoy said:
Roosh said:
Would it be fair to say that if men who realize the futility of hedonism and go onto a more pious path, then there can be a small subset of women that can also reform?

Reform for women can't take place until they drop their "strong and independent" ethos, which goes against the natural order. Women submit to men who submitted to God. God leads men who leads women. Some women (e.g. nuns) skip over men and go directly to God, which is fine. I would be skeptical of a woman who is born again but did not submit to either man or God.

What is this "submit to God" thing you speak of exactly? You mentioned earlier he speaks to you through your own voice in your head. Are saying you will follow what you divinely intuit or base your life solely on what's written in the Christian bible?

I think I saw a Muslim speaker say something like 'A woman should submit to her husband. Her husband should submit to God'

I think the Muslims believe that a woman doesn't have clear access to God- at least not as clearly as a man does. She has to get to God through submitting to her husband.

Based on the evidence I have seen of women in the west who try to 'improve themselves' yet are still messed up and unhappy, I would say I agree.
 
Is the God pill actually a seperate pill from the black pill?

Seems to draw the same conclusion as nihilism as far as mans ability to better himself or the world around him.

The only difference is rather than accept that in pesimistic fashion, theres a slither of hope that a higher power intervenes or a resignation in that its all part of gods plan.
 

Fortis

Crow
Gold Member
I was gonna write a big masturbatory post as I am wont to do, but I think the best I can do in this thread is step back for a second and think.

I can honestly say that a lot of the forum is falling into various shades of black pill. Especially those of us who have gone through the grind to smash chicks.

You spend so much time, then you get your girls and you start to feel like something is still missing. Doesn't matter if the girls are hot or not. It just starts to feel like you're playing a real-life video game that you can't opt out of and you're always playing.

I can see why Roosh and the other guys are reaching for something beyond all of this.
 

questor70

Ostrich
Sisyphus said:
the scientific method can be used to explain a lot of what we experience, it falls short in addressing the most meaningful questions a sentient person faces. Which I think explains why many of these people are so miserable

I hate to tip my nerd hat here but I use select pop culture as a proxy for religious texts and the premise of Star Trek: The Motion Picture is exactly what you're talking about above. Take someone who is a master at Jeopardy. Their mind is a living encyclopedia. That's what V'Ger was in the movie. But it said that knowledge alone is fool's gold which holds no deeper meaning. The conclusion that the film had to say would be considered blue-pill, that it's human connection (OK, love) in different forms that matters most. V'Ger finds that in the process of looking for his creator (a spiritual quest).

A problem I see with red-pill as be-all-end-all is that it attacks the concept of love (at least romantic love) on the basis that women only love what men do for them, not who men are (because men are human doings rather than human beings.) If you take that ideal away from a man it may protect him from being taken to the cleaners, but it leaves a yawning void in its wake.

The turning towards religion therefore can be a search for a higher form of love.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agape
 

Avoy

Robin
Rorogue said:
I think I saw a Muslim speaker say something like 'A woman should submit to her husband. Her husband should submit to God'

I think the Muslims believe that a woman doesn't have clear access to God- at least not as clearly as a man does. She has to get to God through submitting to her husband.

Based on the evidence I have seen of women in the west who try to 'improve themselves' yet are still messed up and unhappy, I would say I agree.

I watch some of Jesse Lee Peterson's videos occasionally. He says as much. It's not only a Muslim thing. He may have even brought it up in the interview he did with Roosh recently. It was an interesting exchange. Righteous Roosh speaking with faith based Peterson.



Queue the SJW meltdown on the last video: "Women look up to men as men look up to God." Interesting take on sharing your struggles with loved ones or women in general. The advice is sound, but the release valve is not really discussed for men. A silent prayer every morning isn't going to cut it for most when life has you feeling overwhelmed.
 
For those who are skeptical as to the claims of Christianity. I think you will find those series of videos enlightening:

Case for the Soul the non-physical mind

Series on the Resurrection of Jesus

For more on the resurrection of Jesus I recommend the book by a homicide detective that investigated the stories of the Gospel:
https://www.amazon.com/Cold-Case-Ch...gates-ebook/dp/B00A71Y7I8?tag=duckduckgo-d-20

This is an argument for a cosmic consciousness giving rise to a universe which closely resembles God:


Those 2 videos argue that the evidence in Quantum physics so far talks about the basis of the universe being information. Matching some of the words of Scripture.

Hebrews 1:3
Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;


There is also the claims of William Lane Craig and the past Christian Philosophers.
 
Fortis said:
I was gonna write a big masturbatory post as I am wont to do, but I think the best I can do in this thread is step back for a second and think.

I can honestly say that a lot of the forum is falling into various shades of black pill. Especially those of us who have gone through the grind to smash chicks.

You spend so much time, then you get your girls and you start to feel like something is still missing. Doesn't matter if the girls are hot or not. It just starts to feel like you're playing a real-life video game that you can't opt out of and you're always playing.

I can see why Roosh and the other guys are reaching for something beyond all of this.

The exactly feeling when I saw this scene:

Living a good life. Then dying of old age. And I wonder.

Is that it?

It feels like bullshit if that's all our life is.
 
Avoy said:
Roosh said:
Would it be fair to say that if men who realize the futility of hedonism and go onto a more pious path, then there can be a small subset of women that can also reform?

Reform for women can't take place until they drop their "strong and independent" ethos, which goes against the natural order. Women submit to men who submitted to God. God leads men who leads women. Some women (e.g. nuns) skip over men and go directly to God, which is fine. I would be skeptical of a woman who is born again but did not submit to either man or God.

What is this "submit to God" thing you speak of exactly? You mentioned earlier he speaks to you through your own voice in your head. Are you saying you will follow what you divinely intuit or base your life solely on what's written in the Christian bible?

The book of Daniel is surprisingly congruent with world history. As far as I know. That raises the legitimacy of the bible a lot:

Especially the part when it predicted the destruction of the city of Tyre by Alexander off the seashore and the division of his empire between his 4 generals initially.
 
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