The God pill

Wutang

Hummingbird
Gold Member
debeguiled said:
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Rod Dreher of American Conservative sees St. Benedict as an example for believers to follow when it comes to how to navigate the post-Christian society the West is now. He calls for people of faith to batter down the hatches to focus on cultivating their own communities while distancing dependence on the wider society.

The former leader of Anglican communion has written bout this:

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/religion/2017/05/benedict-option-new-monasticism-21st-century

This will demand a distancing from the assumptions of capitalism and the all-powerful market, and it will indeed entail the risk that Christians will find themselves de facto excluded from some professions. Dreher – an Eastern Orthodox Christian and a prominent conservative blogger in the United States – is sharply critical of a Christian rhetoric that ignores the evils of public acquisitiveness and selfishness while castigating personal delinquencies. He points to the tradition of monasticism as a model for developing alternative community patterns – hence the reference to Benedict – and invites a close reading of the saint’s precepts for monks as a guide to the practical challenges of living in close quarters with others. What lies in the more distant social or political future is not for us to see; but for now, what we need is a community life that seeks to live and worship with integrity and hopes to attract and persuade by the quality of its mutual care and the fulfilment of its members.

So the focus of Dreher’s case, advanced in this book energetically, though a little repetitively, is that Christian integrity does not depend on winning arguments in political terms. Instead it is by creating a culture – with a consistent ethical and imaginative identity, because it is centred on the love of God and truth for their own sake – that arguments about public morality are won.
 

Roosh

Cardinal
Orthodox
Someone who attended my Austin talk wrote out his interpretation of my visit to St. Anthony's Monastery:

I’m standing out here surrounded by cacti outside the gates of St. Anthony’s Monastery in Florence, Arizona. I wanted to attend the Vespers, this is an evening prayer of about two hours long, and I came ready to worship God. But the monk, the monk I talked to, upon seeing bushy bearded and road weary me, said “since you’re Armenian Orthodox you must attend the service from the Narthex.” Rules are rules and I consented of course but through the glass and the door I couldn't see or hear anything.

Useless.

Screw this, screw the Greeks, I thought to myself as I left the scene with discreet respect. So I was walking around the monastery, smacked in the deserts center, adorned with great fountains, birds of all kinds, architecture that could only be created as a tribute to the creator, and immovable godly trees with the sun perfectly peaking through its leaves and branches.

And in the midst of this beauty I felt a soft boil of rage begin to form in my gut. And I engaged with it and let it cut through my brain, heated, till it reigned unchallenged deep within me. How dare they exclude a christian? How can they tell me I’m not allowed to worship God like them? Just cuz I’m in a different church. Just cuz my beard is more full.

Feeding the anger, hating all Greeks, my rage reached a peak and I decided to leave. And as I was leaving, the service had just completed and who do I see smiling and laughing with his fellow Greeks but the same monk who so calmly denied me. I was begging he’d say something to me, begging almost to the point of prayer. “Ah my friend, how did you like the Vespers?’ My primal contempt I somehow surpass and told him it was hard to enjoy it behind the wall and the glass. When he says nothing my indignance gives a nudge and says

“You know, with all due respect, I’ve been to a lot of monastery’s, four to be exact, and this is the first time I’ve been excluded and not allowed to worship God”

‘you're allowed to worship God just not in the nave.”

At this my rage seeped out and I let him have it as much as a monk should reasonably have it and told him whatever rules you have I abide by them, I obey them, and I respect them. What you're doing is wrong. He starts diving into the theological basis and church history and this reason and that and I’m not interested and don’t want to hear it anymore He prattles on and out of respect to him I’m trying not blow my top when just then over his shoulder I notice an elderly monk, ancient it seemed, inching closer down the path towards me, assisted by another monk.

The monk who denied me turned his head to comprehend the object of my sudden fixation. “Ah, that is Elder Ephraim, a holy man, founder of 18 monasteries across this country spiritual mentor to hundreds who is destined for sainthood.

Something compelled me, some ghost or a force, and I went over to him without saying a word, touched the ground, raised up my hands to him and remained looking down. He placed his right hand between my palms and did kiss it and I received his blessing.

Looking up at this ancient elder, I beheld a man who seemed to me to be from some different realm. Glowing peacefulness vibrating holiness a man who dedicated himself totally to Jesus Christ.

He looked deep through my eyes into my soul and my soul did respond. Joy overtook me. contentful stupor. He smiled a smile too warm for words, this ancient elder from some other realm, then said goodbye and continued to inch down the path, still assisted by the younger monk who nodded and smiled to me as he passed.

The other monk, the one who calmly denied me continued his rebuttal to my past life protestations and I heard the words but I was so blissfully disconnected none did stick and none made sense until he said: “Ah I’m sorry, I see you’re having yourself a moment.” What was I angry about? We continued to talk, me and this monk I used to resent, and I said to him I was going to go to the bookstore here but noticed it was locked.

“Well I can open it up.”

How about that? We went on to have a lovely half hour chat. He recommended I read a book written by Elder Ephraim. I bought an icon I was looking for, the ladder of divine ascent. I told him some things, some spiritual battles I was going through.

We talked about different forms of grace. I was given grace all at once, shot of love, right to the arm. For other people, he said, its a step by step process. I never thought of that. I need to understand that because I don't meet a lot of people who’ve received the same kind of grace I've received. I bought some more things, a book for my mom. I can walk out of here happy knowing I was blessed by an exceedingly holy man.

I’m grateful, so grateful, the way the timing of it all played out. Everyone cleared out and thats how I noticed him, went over to him, and was able to absorb his essence. God bless him. God bless all the men here who have dedicated their lives to Jesus Christ.

Though just be forewarned if you're not Eastern Orthodox you have to hang out in the Narthex. And thats it. Onwards.
 

Dr. Howard

 
Banned
Gold Member
Wutang said:
debeguiled said:

Rod Dreher of American Conservative sees St. Benedict as an example for believers to follow when it comes to how to navigate the post-Christian society the West is now. He calls for people of faith to batter down the hatches to focus on cultivating their own communities while distancing dependence on the wider society.

The former leader of Anglican communion has written bout this:

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/religion/2017/05/benedict-option-new-monasticism-21st-century

This will demand a distancing from the assumptions of capitalism and the all-powerful market, and it will indeed entail the risk that Christians will find themselves de facto excluded from some professions. Dreher – an Eastern Orthodox Christian and a prominent conservative blogger in the United States – is sharply critical of a Christian rhetoric that ignores the evils of public acquisitiveness and selfishness while castigating personal delinquencies. He points to the tradition of monasticism as a model for developing alternative community patterns – hence the reference to Benedict – and invites a close reading of the saint’s precepts for monks as a guide to the practical challenges of living in close quarters with others. What lies in the more distant social or political future is not for us to see; but for now, what we need is a community life that seeks to live and worship with integrity and hopes to attract and persuade by the quality of its mutual care and the fulfilment of its members.

So the focus of Dreher’s case, advanced in this book energetically, though a little repetitively, is that Christian integrity does not depend on winning arguments in political terms. Instead it is by creating a culture – with a consistent ethical and imaginative identity, because it is centred on the love of God and truth for their own sake – that arguments about public morality are won.

So, the Amish were right all along?
 

Kid Twist

 
Banned
Nothing lasts forever in this world, but it turns out that Christian integrity (vis a vis societies, countries, or large groups of people) depends on not allowing "arguments" to take hold in the first place. In this I mean ceding power to totally asinine and obviously destructive elements to a society. What has transpired in the West is precisely that ... the indifference in countering really destructive ways of thought for humans, things that we already knew would cause such chaos from history, our forefathers, times past, etc.

The Amish were right in that they maintained the proper role of elders, who were virtuous men that decided on what was proper for the people. The West threw this structure and thinking away, and chaos ensued.
 

MichaelWitcoff

Hummingbird
Orthodox
There are many Benedictine societies in the USA, in which the Rule of St. Benedict is applied to the life of a layperson to the greatest possible extent (without the stuff specifically for monastics). Catholics, Orthodox, and even Protestants have begun to join them. Worth looking into if you like the Benedict Option.
 

wwtl

 
Banned
infowarrior1 said:
Youtube keeps recommending atheist videos to me. Like how history and scripture doesnt line up or that many prophecies are unfulfilled.

Interesting.

YouTube keeps "recommending" me completely unrelated MSM videos in my native language, but only on certain videos with English language Christian content. If I open some video game or music stuff instead, these recommendations completely vanish.

So it's completely obvious, what the "algorithm" is doing there.
 

redbeard

Hummingbird
Catholic
Gold Member
wwtl said:
infowarrior1 said:
Youtube keeps recommending atheist videos to me. Like how history and scripture doesnt line up or that many prophecies are unfulfilled.

Interesting.

YouTube keeps "recommending" me completely unrelated MSM videos in my native language, but only on certain videos with English language Christian content. If I open some video game or music stuff instead, these recommendations completely vanish.

So it's completely obvious, what the "algorithm" is doing there.

There are browser extensions that remove the feed, suggested, comments, and up next on YouTube. That way you only see the video you chose.

Search: "(browser) distraction free YouTube"
 

wwtl

 
Banned
redbeard said:
wwtl said:
infowarrior1 said:
Youtube keeps recommending atheist videos to me. Like how history and scripture doesnt line up or that many prophecies are unfulfilled.

Interesting.

YouTube keeps "recommending" me completely unrelated MSM videos in my native language, but only on certain videos with English language Christian content. If I open some video game or music stuff instead, these recommendations completely vanish.

So it's completely obvious, what the "algorithm" is doing there.

There are browser extensions that remove the feed, suggested, comments, and up next on YouTube. That way you only see the video you chose.

Search: "(browser) distraction free YouTube"

I like the comments and recommendations on the guitar videos I watch. Just when I open a Christian video about Bible studies, suddenly 90+ % globohomo TV stations installed by allied forces in 1945 appear in the suggestions, which only 70+ boomers watch. The manipulation is so blatantly obvious.
 

Roosh

Cardinal
Orthodox
infowarrior1 said:
Youtube keeps recommending atheist videos to me. Like how history and scripture doesnt line up or that many prophecies are unfulfilled.

Interesting.

Same happened to me with one atheist video, and I never watch that sort of thing.
 
When you pray, should you wait as long as it takes for God to tell you what to do, or should you start doing something yourself? Some people say that you should completely stop all your efforts to solve your problems yourself and just wait and trust.

I've been waiting for some answers to some problems/challenges/dilemmas for a very long time, and I've done next to nothing. In fact what little I've done has amounted to nothing more than thinking and looking for information from time to time. But I have made no real effort at all, I've completely frozen.

For a lot of my challenges I don't know what to do at all but for others I can think of some things I can at least try.

The problem is that I feel useless and unproductive, and it's been so long waiting, and now I'm getting so impatient that sometimes I wonder if I should just start doing something. From time to time I get the feeling that I should take action, but then I think, what if it's just me telling myself that. It's so irritating that God isn't saying anything to me. He's gone mute on me. When He talks, is it unmistakable, or subtle? It seems like I'm stuck with only my own thoughts. Maybe He has spoken and I've been missing it.

Is He doing things behind the scenes and some day He'll say go! or make something happen to get the ball rolling? Is He waiting for me to do something? Is He waiting for me to become a better person first? Is He letting me get frustrated but determined to hold on and keep waiting? I don't know how much longer I can wait.

I've asked Him so many times to give me some clue as to which it is, but He's not telling me anything. I feel like I'm doing this all wrong.

Sometimes I tell Him, I'm not giving up on you and you better not give up on me. I'm going to keep holding on, and I trust you, and I'm looking forward to being amazed at whatever crazy, unexpected genius solution you've got in store. And I do mean it. But I feel like I'm freefalling into nowhere. Sometimes I'm excited, but these days the wait is becoming too much. It's been about a year now. It's hard.

What's He up to? At this point I'm just as keen to hear even one word from Him than I am to get answers.
 

Tail Gunner

Hummingbird
Gold Member
Vladimir Poontang said:
When you pray, should you wait as long as it takes for God to tell you what to do, or should you start doing something yourself? Some people say that you should completely stop all your efforts to solve your problems yourself and just wait and trust.

I've been waiting for some answers to some problems/challenges/dilemmas for a very long time, and I've done next to nothing. In fact what little I've done has amounted to nothing more than thinking and looking for information from time to time. But I have made no real effort at all, I've completely frozen.

For a lot of my challenges I don't know what to do at all but for others I can think of some things I can at least try.

The problem is that I feel useless and unproductive, and it's been so long waiting, and now I'm getting so impatient that sometimes I wonder if I should just start doing something. From time to time I get the feeling that I should take action, but then I think, what if it's just me telling myself that. It's so irritating that God isn't saying anything to me. He's gone mute on me.

Is He doing things behind the scenes and some day He'll say go or make something happen to get the ball rolling? Is He waiting for me to do something? Is He waiting for me to become a better person first? Is He letting me get frustrated but determined to hold on and keep waiting? I don't know how much longer I can wait.

I've asked Him so many times to give me some clue as to which it is, but He's not telling me anything. I feel like I'm doing this all wrong.

Sometimes I tell Him, I'm not giving up on you and you better not give up on me. I'm going to keep holding on, and I trust you, and I'm looking forward to being amazed at whatever crazy, unexpected genius solution you've got in store. And I do mean it. But I feel like I'm freefalling into nowhere. Sometimes I'm excited, but these days the wait is becoming too much. It's been about a year now. It's hard.

What's He up to?

Trusting in God does not preclude you from trusting in yourself. Nor does trusting in God preclude you from taking action yourself.

When God issued his warning to Noah, Noah trusted in God -- but Noah also spent decades of his life building an ark. God forced Noah to build an ark. God gave us free will, not a free ride.

Our choices impact our lives on a daily basis. I suggest that you become proactive in both prayer and action, rather than purely reactive. God often opens doors for people while in the midst of action.

On the other hand, what you believe is good for you might not be what God knows is good for you. He may not help you for that reason. Or He may know that you need to handle the situation yourself as part of your personal growth.

Develop an action plan and then perform at least one action per day, in your spare time, towards achieving your goal. One day, you may spend two hours working towards that goal. On another day, it may be just a two minute phone call. Either way, you are heading towards your goal rather than simply waiting for something to happen. Good luck.
 
Tail Gunner said:
Vladimir Poontang said:
When you pray, should you wait as long as it takes for God to tell you what to do, or should you start doing something yourself? Some people say that you should completely stop all your efforts to solve your problems yourself and just wait and trust.

I've been waiting for some answers to some problems/challenges/dilemmas for a very long time, and I've done next to nothing. In fact what little I've done has amounted to nothing more than thinking and looking for information from time to time. But I have made no real effort at all, I've completely frozen.

For a lot of my challenges I don't know what to do at all but for others I can think of some things I can at least try.

The problem is that I feel useless and unproductive, and it's been so long waiting, and now I'm getting so impatient that sometimes I wonder if I should just start doing something. From time to time I get the feeling that I should take action, but then I think, what if it's just me telling myself that. It's so irritating that God isn't saying anything to me. He's gone mute on me.

Is He doing things behind the scenes and some day He'll say go or make something happen to get the ball rolling? Is He waiting for me to do something? Is He waiting for me to become a better person first? Is He letting me get frustrated but determined to hold on and keep waiting? I don't know how much longer I can wait.

I've asked Him so many times to give me some clue as to which it is, but He's not telling me anything. I feel like I'm doing this all wrong.

Sometimes I tell Him, I'm not giving up on you and you better not give up on me. I'm going to keep holding on, and I trust you, and I'm looking forward to being amazed at whatever crazy, unexpected genius solution you've got in store. And I do mean it. But I feel like I'm freefalling into nowhere. Sometimes I'm excited, but these days the wait is becoming too much. It's been about a year now. It's hard.

What's He up to?

Trusting in God does not preclude you from trusting in yourself. Nor does trusting in God preclude you from taking action yourself.

When God issued his warning to Noah, Noah trusted in God -- but Noah also spent decades of his life building an ark. God forced Noah to build an ark. God gave us free will, not a free ride.

Our choices impact our lives on a daily basis. I suggest that you become proactive in both prayer and action, rather than purely reactive. God often opens doors for people while in the midst of action.

On the other hand, what you believe is good for you might not be what God knows is good for you. He may not help you for that reason. Or He may know that you need to handle the situation yourself as part of your personal growth.

Develop an action plan and then perform at least one action per day, in your spare time, towards achieving your goal. One day, you may spend two hours working towards that goal. On another day, it may be just a two minute phone call. Either way, you are heading towards your goal rather than simply waiting for something to happen. Good luck.

Thanks for responding. It's totally unnatural for me, like with probably most people, to do absolutely nothing when I have a problem to solve or something to achieve. That's why it feels so weird to do nothing and wait. I'm proud (in the good sense) that I've proven so far that I can just let go and trust. I didn't think I could do that, so it's good to know that I can.

If you're right in saying that I should take action, and I do hope you are right, at least I'll be able to go back and think of things to get on with, hopefully this time with some help. This inaction is driving me mad. But what if He wants me to keep waiting? I'd hate to let Him down by effectively saying "I can do this myself, I waited, you didn't come, I don't need you". I'm sure you've heard stories of people being put in tough situations to force them to need God, or being made to wait a long time.

Or maybe I've turned this waiting game into a matter of personal pride, i.e. look at me God, I'm so good at waiting, where's my reward. But if He does want me to take action I'd appreciate it if He'd let me know, otherwise I'd be wasting time. Noah at least had the luxury of being told what to do. But all I'm getting is crickets. I'll ask Him one more time to tell me something. If I get nothing, I'll seriously consider taking action.
 

Tail Gunner

Hummingbird
Gold Member
Vladimir Poontang said:
Tail Gunner said:
Vladimir Poontang said:
When you pray, should you wait as long as it takes for God to tell you what to do, or should you start doing something yourself? Some people say that you should completely stop all your efforts to solve your problems yourself and just wait and trust.

I've been waiting for some answers to some problems/challenges/dilemmas for a very long time, and I've done next to nothing. In fact what little I've done has amounted to nothing more than thinking and looking for information from time to time. But I have made no real effort at all, I've completely frozen.

For a lot of my challenges I don't know what to do at all but for others I can think of some things I can at least try.

The problem is that I feel useless and unproductive, and it's been so long waiting, and now I'm getting so impatient that sometimes I wonder if I should just start doing something. From time to time I get the feeling that I should take action, but then I think, what if it's just me telling myself that. It's so irritating that God isn't saying anything to me. He's gone mute on me.

Is He doing things behind the scenes and some day He'll say go or make something happen to get the ball rolling? Is He waiting for me to do something? Is He waiting for me to become a better person first? Is He letting me get frustrated but determined to hold on and keep waiting? I don't know how much longer I can wait.

I've asked Him so many times to give me some clue as to which it is, but He's not telling me anything. I feel like I'm doing this all wrong.

Sometimes I tell Him, I'm not giving up on you and you better not give up on me. I'm going to keep holding on, and I trust you, and I'm looking forward to being amazed at whatever crazy, unexpected genius solution you've got in store. And I do mean it. But I feel like I'm freefalling into nowhere. Sometimes I'm excited, but these days the wait is becoming too much. It's been about a year now. It's hard.

What's He up to?

Trusting in God does not preclude you from trusting in yourself. Nor does trusting in God preclude you from taking action yourself.

When God issued his warning to Noah, Noah trusted in God -- but Noah also spent decades of his life building an ark. God forced Noah to build an ark. God gave us free will, not a free ride.

Our choices impact our lives on a daily basis. I suggest that you become proactive in both prayer and action, rather than purely reactive. God often opens doors for people while in the midst of action.

On the other hand, what you believe is good for you might not be what God knows is good for you. He may not help you for that reason. Or He may know that you need to handle the situation yourself as part of your personal growth.

Develop an action plan and then perform at least one action per day, in your spare time, towards achieving your goal. One day, you may spend two hours working towards that goal. On another day, it may be just a two minute phone call. Either way, you are heading towards your goal rather than simply waiting for something to happen. Good luck.

This inaction is driving me mad. But what if He wants me to keep waiting? I'd hate to let Him down by effectively saying "I can do this myself, I waited, you didn't come, I don't need you".

God knows what is in your heart. If you are insincere, he will know it. If you are sincere, you do not need to prove it to him (by waiting for his intervention). He already knows the condition of your heart.

"Then hear thou in heaven thy dwelling place, and forgive, and do, and give to every man according to his ways, whose heart thou knowest; (for thou, even thou only, knowest the hearts of all the children of men)" 1 Kings 8:39 KJV

What you can do, however, to show your love and respect for God is to fast one day a week for a certain period of time or abstain from things that you love -- in His honor.
 
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