The "Hotep" movement
- Thread starter Roosh
- Start date
I'm black and this thread is the first I'm hearing of these guys. But...I don't have Twitter or any social media except Facebook which I rarely use, so I guess it's not surprising that I didn't encounter these guys before.
@Fortis
I lol-ed at the bean-pie/NOI reference. A nice touch.
@Fortis
I lol-ed at the bean-pie/NOI reference. A nice touch.
Kingsley Davis
Ostrich
Fortis said:
What do you think about his exhortation to black people to return to Africa? Seems counterintuitive to me, considering the fact that black people are unquestionably American. Their ancestors were in America at least as long as most white people's ancestors.
His remark about Qatar was also a little off; I've been to the Gulf states and to other Arab countries, and there are tons of black Arabs there as a result of years of slave trading. They can't really hate black people while having a heavy dose of African genetics themselves. I'm a dark ass Indian guy, and when I traveled to other Arab countries everyone thought I was from the Gulf -- Qatar/UAE/Oman especially have a ton of genetic influence from black people and Indians thanks to historical trading ties to East Africa and the subcontinent (as well as slavery).
"Arab" isn't a race, when I was there I saw people who could pass for Nordics, people who looked Central African, and everything in between. I think the worst thing I saw or heard of happening was my friend being called "my nigga" by some cab driver. Apparently some North Africans are extremely racist towards refugees from Sub-Saharan Africa, but a lot of these North Africans would themselves be considered black if they came to the states.
You don't have to agree with everything he is proposing. Actually in a truly prulalistic openness of views and opinions it is unlikely that you will agree on everything even with your best buddies or the men here on the forum for that matter.
As for Quatar and Gulf states - you should better give it a rest. Of course it is not about logic with those guys, since so many former black slaves interbred with their owners, that it does not matter that they look sometimes the same. The 99,9% Caucasian Ottoman Sultans also did not care and would have conquered and enslaved all of the Caucasian Christian Kuffars if they could. If you deny that there is a problem, then be my guest:
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2013/06/201362472519107286.html Even Al-Jazeera propaganda thinks there is a problem.
But .... nothing to see here. The gulf states are beacons of multicultural utopia just as the ISIS videos tell us they are.
As for Quatar and Gulf states - you should better give it a rest. Of course it is not about logic with those guys, since so many former black slaves interbred with their owners, that it does not matter that they look sometimes the same. The 99,9% Caucasian Ottoman Sultans also did not care and would have conquered and enslaved all of the Caucasian Christian Kuffars if they could. If you deny that there is a problem, then be my guest:
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2013/06/201362472519107286.html Even Al-Jazeera propaganda thinks there is a problem.
But .... nothing to see here. The gulf states are beacons of multicultural utopia just as the ISIS videos tell us they are.
He lost me at "go back to Africa" but I can see why he might say that. He may have visited Tanzania, but I'd like to see him do at least a year abroad in Tanzania before he dismissively tells anyone they should move to a location. I've been abroad for nearly 2 years and I still hesitate before telling anyone "move to china! all your problems will be solved!" There is a ton of bullshit you deal with living in Asia that you don't have back home but also a ton of pluses that make me really like it. It's a balance.
Doesn't matter if we are also black. There would be tons of challenges we'd face moving to an African nation. We would be outsiders there and I doubt many of us are used to a place of that nature where it's blazing hot, reasonably poor medical standards, questionable construction standards, poor infrastructure (in comparison to America) and a slew of other problems. Is that really something we can genuinely tell our brothers to go into? I couldn't.
There are a lot of blacks who complain about USA and rightfully so, but those same blacks also recognize that America is probably still in the top 5 best places to live as a black man. There is a ton of bullshit but also a lot you can do there. I left because I wanted to leave but I don't fault any black man for staying and taking advantage of all that stuff.
I did take issue with him criticizing the black people who complain. The American way is to complain and point out the bad things. That's just how we are. It isn't just blacks. It's a deep part of the American character. We let others know what we don't like.
The thing with that though is that we are so deeply alienated from Africa at this point that it isn't like going back home. We have almost no connection to that place other than DNA.
We aren't going to just show up and suddenly go "ahh, my people" in fucking Bantu languages while dancing to perfectly synchronized drum beats that unlock our latent African ancestral memories. :lol:
The thing that I don't think a lot of people realize is that many black Americans are just too deeply American to go back. I love being American. There is no other passport I want. Fuck dual citizenship.
Same with most white americans and Europe. I don't have too many white friends back home who keep in touch with their distant European cousins (if they even have any). I think this idea of returning back to the homeland is a hokey and overly sentimental.
That's a lot like trying to crawl back into the womb. Doesn't work that way. You can return to the location but the state is vastly altered. For all I know the tribe or kingdom I may have descended from is now all the way up north Africa. Who the fuck knows?
We cannot undo the past, we can simply move forward. If a few more African nations stabilize I would consider visiting, but I would be going in the capacity of a visitor, not as some dude trying to "reconnect" with his roots. I know where my roots are and they are on the east coast of USA. Why should I feel lesser somehow for admitting that?
all that said, I enjoyed his other points. He comes across as intelligent and willing to take a stand on issues. I really did resonate with his point about the alt-right: Stop hiding behind avatars and take a stand, be a person instead of a frog meme.
I'd be willing to watch more discussions involving this guy. Roosh, you should reach out to him and do a youtube video or something.
:idea:
Doesn't matter if we are also black. There would be tons of challenges we'd face moving to an African nation. We would be outsiders there and I doubt many of us are used to a place of that nature where it's blazing hot, reasonably poor medical standards, questionable construction standards, poor infrastructure (in comparison to America) and a slew of other problems. Is that really something we can genuinely tell our brothers to go into? I couldn't.
There are a lot of blacks who complain about USA and rightfully so, but those same blacks also recognize that America is probably still in the top 5 best places to live as a black man. There is a ton of bullshit but also a lot you can do there. I left because I wanted to leave but I don't fault any black man for staying and taking advantage of all that stuff.
I did take issue with him criticizing the black people who complain. The American way is to complain and point out the bad things. That's just how we are. It isn't just blacks. It's a deep part of the American character. We let others know what we don't like.
The thing with that though is that we are so deeply alienated from Africa at this point that it isn't like going back home. We have almost no connection to that place other than DNA.
We aren't going to just show up and suddenly go "ahh, my people" in fucking Bantu languages while dancing to perfectly synchronized drum beats that unlock our latent African ancestral memories. :lol:
The thing that I don't think a lot of people realize is that many black Americans are just too deeply American to go back. I love being American. There is no other passport I want. Fuck dual citizenship.
Same with most white americans and Europe. I don't have too many white friends back home who keep in touch with their distant European cousins (if they even have any). I think this idea of returning back to the homeland is a hokey and overly sentimental.
That's a lot like trying to crawl back into the womb. Doesn't work that way. You can return to the location but the state is vastly altered. For all I know the tribe or kingdom I may have descended from is now all the way up north Africa. Who the fuck knows?
We cannot undo the past, we can simply move forward. If a few more African nations stabilize I would consider visiting, but I would be going in the capacity of a visitor, not as some dude trying to "reconnect" with his roots. I know where my roots are and they are on the east coast of USA. Why should I feel lesser somehow for admitting that?
all that said, I enjoyed his other points. He comes across as intelligent and willing to take a stand on issues. I really did resonate with his point about the alt-right: Stop hiding behind avatars and take a stand, be a person instead of a frog meme.
I'd be willing to watch more discussions involving this guy. Roosh, you should reach out to him and do a youtube video or something.
:idea:
I suppose this ties into another point that bothers me a fair bit. Why can't American nationalism include non-whites who have a stake in America. I'd rather die than give up my citizenship. My ancestors have fought and bled in wars for America? What more must I do to prove my value? Why does it always seem to come down to "you need to be with your people cuz demographics + proxomity = warlozlozlzolzozlzolzozlzozlzozlzolzozlzo!!!!"
Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to move into some all white area in america and bring "progress" to them, but I don't really get why it's automatically assumed that my allegiance is to a color and not to my nation. There are TONS of blacks I actively dislike. Why is it assumed that we blacks are going to always select other blacks over whites?
Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to move into some all white area in america and bring "progress" to them, but I don't really get why it's automatically assumed that my allegiance is to a color and not to my nation. There are TONS of blacks I actively dislike. Why is it assumed that we blacks are going to always select other blacks over whites?
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Zelcorpion said:
That, and putting women on a pedestal
I would love to hear what the alt-right are right about.
Seems to me that they're just a bunch of scared white men.
Scared of a changing world, scared of their inability to change with it.
Scared of others seeing themselves as equal, and asking they be treated as such.
Just scared little men.
Seems to me that they're just a bunch of scared white men.
Scared of a changing world, scared of their inability to change with it.
Scared of others seeing themselves as equal, and asking they be treated as such.
Just scared little men.
Lumumba said:
They're right about the fact that you have to go back, for one thing.
Fortis said:
Exactly - many folk contributed to the creation of the US, most blacks did not come voluntarily to the US. They worked for generations for the wealth of the nation, later they fought in the wars, they earned their right to stay with sweat, blood and labor and now SJW shitleads like that troll above say, that Americans should compete with 2 billion 3rd world citizens who are willing to work for 1$/hr? Why? Why the fuck should anyone open up borders to compete with the entire fucking world? I don't see the gulf states doing that, I don't see China, Japan, Israel, Hong Kong, Mexico or Singapore doing that! So why the fuck should Western countries open borders to anyone?
Yeah - compete - go fuck yourself Lumumba with those SJW bullshit phrases. That is not competition. That is tantamount to opening the doors to raping, pillaging and killing hordes - and dare you not resist, because that is racist! Only racist when Western countries do it, anyone else is allowed to.
"Yeah - compete - go fuck yourself Lumumba with those SJW bullshit phrases. That is not competition. That is tantamount to opening the doors to raping, pillaging and killing hordes - and dare you not resist, because that is racist! Only racist when Western countries do it, anyone else is allowed to."
@zelcorpion
Why are you so triggered?
Racism 's racism regardless of who does it. If the South Africans start grabbing lands from whites because they're white, that's racist too. I'm not saying countries should have an open door immigration policy - that's stupid - the problem with alt-right cultists is that thEy don't even want immigration from non-white countries. Even if those non-white countries have been affected by actions your own country has taken. See Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria et al. Whether you like it or not, you have a moral responsibility to take in refugees fleeing conflict from countries that you are bombing. Look at African countries like Kenya, they've taken Somalian refugees en masse. And they've done it because they have a responsibility to. They do get criticised as racist against Somalis sometimes, you might not hear about such things because your focus isn't on Africa.
As for the crime brought by refugees and immigrants, how much is it and is it proportional to the rest of the population?
@zelcorpion
Why are you so triggered?
Racism 's racism regardless of who does it. If the South Africans start grabbing lands from whites because they're white, that's racist too. I'm not saying countries should have an open door immigration policy - that's stupid - the problem with alt-right cultists is that thEy don't even want immigration from non-white countries. Even if those non-white countries have been affected by actions your own country has taken. See Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria et al. Whether you like it or not, you have a moral responsibility to take in refugees fleeing conflict from countries that you are bombing. Look at African countries like Kenya, they've taken Somalian refugees en masse. And they've done it because they have a responsibility to. They do get criticised as racist against Somalis sometimes, you might not hear about such things because your focus isn't on Africa.
As for the crime brought by refugees and immigrants, how much is it and is it proportional to the rest of the population?
Lumumba said:
There is no reason. There is just you, and the place you have to go back to. And then the going back. It's very Zen that way.
You know Zen, right? It's from a culture that's produced something of value, unlike your own.