The Nagorno-Karabakh conflict thread (Armenia vs Azerbaijan)
- Thread starter La Águila Negra
- Start date
So basically the wars these days boil down to who can mass more drones, as if it were a zerg rush in Starcraft? Aren't anti-air missiles supposed to be way cheaper than drones to manufacture and use?
Herr Dickenstein
Pigeon
I don't want to derail the topic too much, but Putin's depravity must be stated here because it's relevant for this conflict. Those countries were supposed to be Russia's allies. Is that how you treat your allies? By grabbing their territory? That's surely a wonderful enticement for everyone else to embrace the "friendly" hug of the bear. Should France snatch Louisiana, following your logic? After all, that's what allies are here for, to fuck each other over.
Putin's fanboys can't seem to realize that Russia doesn't have allies, only hostages. They grab territories, fund color revolutions or the corrupt authorities just like the CIA does, and they blackmail countries by threatening to cut off their gas in winter. That's just the tip of the iceberg. Look up Pridnestrovie and so on.
Every single country that wanted to be friends with Russia ended up getting shat on. Russian foreign policy is based solely on its narrow economic and militaristic interests, they are not protectors of Christians nor do they fight for any higher values. That's not a strange fact nor an exception, but for some reason, Putin's fanboys cannot grasp this simple fact because they desperately want to believe in the cool big daddy who bravely stands up to Western clown world.
If you actually want to praise a country that's an example of traditionalism, shed all your wet dreams about Russia and focus your gaze on Poland. The Poles would never build Europe's biggest mosque in their capital (like Putin did) and I honestly doubt they would condone the massacre of Christians, like Putin does.
Armenians were completely unprepared for drones. Note that these aren't even the newest in drone technology.. Even though Israel has been selling shitloads of these pests to Azeris, they always keep grade A technology for themselves and sell old stuff from the warehouse. Turkish Bayraktar drones, which are being supplied to Azeris in almost unlimited quantities, are ancient technology.
There are systems against drones, even Russia has some, but no one seems to be willing to sell it to the Armenians. The worst thing about drones is that they prevent any possibility of a serious Armenian counter-attack, their air supremacy simply doesn't allow Armenians to group forces. As soon as they do, they are mowed down by drones. The only hope for Armenians is to stand their ground in the mountains and lose as little territory as possible until winter arrives. Winter will slow down the Azeri advance. They have no hope whatsoever of ever reconquering the territories that Azeris will capture in the process, they can only play the game of attrition and hope that the human cost will, hopefully, become too high for the dictator Aliyev.
As you can see, the flat southern half of Artsakh by the Iranian border is almost completely under Azeri control now, it is a matter of days until they reach the border of Armenia proper. That territory is indefensible and Artsakh has lost the border with Iran. Armenians can only hold the lines in the mountains where they're dug in.
I also do not want to derail the topic too much , but your understanding of the Ukrainian conflict is not really accurate
As per Russia , Russia has natural allies such as France and Italy & Iran.
The main problem is the zionist takeover of the USA and the EU.
Saw this one on a pro-Azeri channel. Don't know what they are saying/writing but the military fatigues (+ lack of bodies) on the ground could indicate that the Armenian guys deserted (ditching their uniforms)
Abandoned Armenian military hardware
Last village before the Azeri will reach Armenia proper, filmed from the Iranian border
Compilation of some drone attacks
Armenian soldiers after capturing an enemy BMP2.. The whispering and looking over the shoulders - at the sky? speak for itself
This is a translation of a comment left by Alexander Kharchenko, a Russian reporter working for ANNA News (known for the insane Daraya Tank Wars series filmed in Damascus 2013-2015). Very interesting observations
* The Azeris are closing in on the Lachin pass. This corridor is the lifeline of NK to Armenia. Once they capture/ establish fire power over this vital road NK will be cut off from Armenia.
NB: approximately half the population of Artsakh has fled to Armenia proper, the other half lives in shelters. That's 75 000 people
* Putin has spoken for the first time publicly about the situation
He called it a tragedy. 5000 lives have been lost already, according to Russian intel. He called both Azerbaijan and Armenia important Russian partners
* Something that needs to be repeated is the fact that the Armenian army still hasn't engaged the Azerbaijani army
It's the Artsakh Republic that is on the front lines, their ranks filled up with some volunteers from Armenia Proper and abroad. It's a conscripted, local militia armed with obsolete military hardware that is fighting the special forces units of a very powerful regional military
All the regular Armenian army's shiny toys, like the TOR2, Su-30 and Iskander missiles still have not been used. They are parked in the garage waiting for... what exactly?
* There are rumours brewing as a result of this. They have been going around for a couple of weeks now. First it was about the Yerevani clans not being too disappointed about NK clans being removed from the face of the earth. On a national level they are competitors after all. These rumours are getting louder by the day, and are now mostly about the Armenian Prime Minister and Soros' lapdog Pasinyan.
Pasinyan has sold Artsakh out
The reasoning is that to gain access to NATO/EU, Armenia has to solve the NK question. With that issue still on the table Armenia can't go anywhere. It's the main issue that is keeping Armenia in Russia's orbit. The Armenian population both in and out of Artsakh will never accept a voluntary incorporation of NK into the Azerbaijani state. Pasinyan let this fiasco happen so that he can get his way
The NATO cheered him on because it is a win/win for them.
1.If Pasinyan gets his way, NK returns to its (according to international law) rightful owner and Armenia is drawn towards the West and away from Russia.
2.If Pasinyan doesn't get his way it will mean that Russia has taken the bait. Just like it did in Georgia and the Ukraine, two nations who now hate the Russians with a vigor but at some point had friendly relations. If Putin intervenes it will blow up Azeri-Russo relations for decades to come. It would also mean that the Russo-Turkish rapprochement will fail and Turkey will be pushed back to NATO
I am fairly sure that high ranking military leaders and the pro-Russian opposition are fully aware that there is a rat in the kitchen. It stinks.
* This article states that Pasinyan, a couple of weeks before the invasion (August), has urged the Armenian lobby to arrange a meeting with Pompeo. It could be that he had intel on what was coming and wanted reassurance. Pompeo flatly refused to meet
caspiannews.com
* Pasinyan has burnt the bridges to the only power that stood between Armenia and Azerbaijan/Turkey. It's a move that's too moronic to be believed as genuine
The Russians protect Armenia through the CSTO and there was an oral agreement on the Russians standing guard for NK. Pasinyan nuked that agreement knowing fully well that the Azeris had been preparing for war since the 90s
* Azerbaijani TOS 1A cooking off, it was clearly quite fully loaded
* More nasty tricks from the Azeris
* Erdo being Erdo. Never a dull moment with this clown
NB: approximately half the population of Artsakh has fled to Armenia proper, the other half lives in shelters. That's 75 000 people
* Putin has spoken for the first time publicly about the situation
He called it a tragedy. 5000 lives have been lost already, according to Russian intel. He called both Azerbaijan and Armenia important Russian partners
* Something that needs to be repeated is the fact that the Armenian army still hasn't engaged the Azerbaijani army
It's the Artsakh Republic that is on the front lines, their ranks filled up with some volunteers from Armenia Proper and abroad. It's a conscripted, local militia armed with obsolete military hardware that is fighting the special forces units of a very powerful regional military
All the regular Armenian army's shiny toys, like the TOR2, Su-30 and Iskander missiles still have not been used. They are parked in the garage waiting for... what exactly?
* There are rumours brewing as a result of this. They have been going around for a couple of weeks now. First it was about the Yerevani clans not being too disappointed about NK clans being removed from the face of the earth. On a national level they are competitors after all. These rumours are getting louder by the day, and are now mostly about the Armenian Prime Minister and Soros' lapdog Pasinyan.
Pasinyan has sold Artsakh out
The reasoning is that to gain access to NATO/EU, Armenia has to solve the NK question. With that issue still on the table Armenia can't go anywhere. It's the main issue that is keeping Armenia in Russia's orbit. The Armenian population both in and out of Artsakh will never accept a voluntary incorporation of NK into the Azerbaijani state. Pasinyan let this fiasco happen so that he can get his way
The NATO cheered him on because it is a win/win for them.
1.If Pasinyan gets his way, NK returns to its (according to international law) rightful owner and Armenia is drawn towards the West and away from Russia.
2.If Pasinyan doesn't get his way it will mean that Russia has taken the bait. Just like it did in Georgia and the Ukraine, two nations who now hate the Russians with a vigor but at some point had friendly relations. If Putin intervenes it will blow up Azeri-Russo relations for decades to come. It would also mean that the Russo-Turkish rapprochement will fail and Turkey will be pushed back to NATO
I am fairly sure that high ranking military leaders and the pro-Russian opposition are fully aware that there is a rat in the kitchen. It stinks.
* This article states that Pasinyan, a couple of weeks before the invasion (August), has urged the Armenian lobby to arrange a meeting with Pompeo. It could be that he had intel on what was coming and wanted reassurance. Pompeo flatly refused to meet
Russia, Azerbaijan Discuss Settlement Of Nagorno-Karabakh Conflict
The working visit of the speaker of Azerbaijan's parliament, Sahiba Gafarova to Russia this week brought several issues of mutual interest under t
* Pasinyan has burnt the bridges to the only power that stood between Armenia and Azerbaijan/Turkey. It's a move that's too moronic to be believed as genuine
The Russians protect Armenia through the CSTO and there was an oral agreement on the Russians standing guard for NK. Pasinyan nuked that agreement knowing fully well that the Azeris had been preparing for war since the 90s
* Azerbaijani TOS 1A cooking off, it was clearly quite fully loaded
* More nasty tricks from the Azeris
* Erdo being Erdo. Never a dull moment with this clown
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* Russia's first hard response to the Turkish aggression (since the conflict started)
An illegal fuel market in the Turkish held Syrian border regio got destroyed by a missile strike
* The Russians have taken up positions right on the Armenian - NK border
* Turkey's aggression against Russia continues, in several regions. Quick overview
1. The recent Turkish-Ukrainian deal on the purchasing of the Bayraktar TB2 attack drone is a hostile move
2. Erdogan has made statements about the Crimean Tatars
3. The Turks have withdrawn from several outposts in Syria and there seems to be movement in Idlib (note : that will be an operation against the SAA, not the PKK/YPG)
4. (unconfirmed) There is chatter that the Georgians are also interested in buying the Turkish attack drones
5. (unconfirmed) There are rumours the Turks want to open a military base in Azerbaijan. A Turkish military base will be a NATO base, which is unacceptable for Russia. The Turks are obviously already in Azerbaijan, but they keep it on the hush-hush
www.defenseworld.net
* A Canadian supplier of drone component has stopped delivering. Immediate a Ukrainian company has offered to fill up the void
* The Iranians have started to move their forces to the border region. There is chatter that they are getting worried about
1. The conflict spurring Pan-Turkic (and anti Iranian government) sentiments/ Turkey wanting to start projecting influence into Iran's Northern part
2. Jihadists establishing bases on Iran's Northern border
Pan Turkism/Turanism has the potential to devestating. 25 percent of the Iranian population is Turkic. Same goes for Russia, where Turkic people inhabit regions from the polar circle to the deep south
+ Central Asia
* Iran's weapon embargo expired about a week ago. There are some rumours that the Iranians are willing to sell/donate Armenia military hardware. Especially drones
:quality(70)/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/mco/SCL5QDZUBNAIVAYMBFPNCTQPAA.jpg)
www.defensenews.com
An illegal fuel market in the Turkish held Syrian border regio got destroyed by a missile strike
* The Russians have taken up positions right on the Armenian - NK border
* Turkey's aggression against Russia continues, in several regions. Quick overview
1. The recent Turkish-Ukrainian deal on the purchasing of the Bayraktar TB2 attack drone is a hostile move
2. Erdogan has made statements about the Crimean Tatars
3. The Turks have withdrawn from several outposts in Syria and there seems to be movement in Idlib (note : that will be an operation against the SAA, not the PKK/YPG)
4. (unconfirmed) There is chatter that the Georgians are also interested in buying the Turkish attack drones
5. (unconfirmed) There are rumours the Turks want to open a military base in Azerbaijan. A Turkish military base will be a NATO base, which is unacceptable for Russia. The Turks are obviously already in Azerbaijan, but they keep it on the hush-hush
Ukraine Plans to Buy 50 Turkish Bayraktar Drones, Set up Assembly Line
Ukraine Plans to Buy 50 Turkish Bayraktar Drones, Set up Assembly Line
* A Canadian supplier of drone component has stopped delivering. Immediate a Ukrainian company has offered to fill up the void
* The Iranians have started to move their forces to the border region. There is chatter that they are getting worried about
1. The conflict spurring Pan-Turkic (and anti Iranian government) sentiments/ Turkey wanting to start projecting influence into Iran's Northern part
2. Jihadists establishing bases on Iran's Northern border
Pan Turkism/Turanism has the potential to devestating. 25 percent of the Iranian population is Turkic. Same goes for Russia, where Turkic people inhabit regions from the polar circle to the deep south
+ Central Asia
* Iran's weapon embargo expired about a week ago. There are some rumours that the Iranians are willing to sell/donate Armenia military hardware. Especially drones
UN arms embargo on Iran expires
While Iran says it plans no “buying spree,” it can now in theory purchase weapons to upgrade military armaments dating back to before its 1979 Islamic Revolution and sell its own locally produced gear abroad.
Two options.
1. These are military drones provided by a third party - most likely Russia, Iran, China
2. This is a DIY style drone. Buy a drone from ebay or let someone smart assemble one quickly
IS was already operating these DIY attack drones 5 years ago. Usually they just attach a shell or a 5kg/ 10kg bomb to it
* Third ceasefire was agreed upon earlier today. Pompeo was the mediator (with Russia's approval.
Ceasefire doesn't seem to be holding
Daily reminder that the Armenian military has still not engaged the Azeris
And some here expect Russia to come in and save the day, at huge geopolitical expenses. It is just not realistic
* Azeri drones have knocked out S300 air defenses in Armenia proper. These S300 did not engage the incoming drones
The President of Armenia, Soros' lapdog Pasinyan, is sabotaging the Armenian defenses from within. Armenian forces are not engaging the Azeris even when attacked within Armenian territory.
There are other rumours about the President of Artsakh being in direct contact with Putin thereby cutting Pasinyan out
* Several high ranking Armenian officials have been kicked out. Hopefully it's a sign that there is some sort of purge or Pasinyan related traitors going on, but it could also be vice versa
The Armenian President Armen Sarkissian has also dismissed a high ranking commander named Vaginak Sargsian
* There are rumours that the drones/ ballistic missiles that were downed near Yerevan about 10 days ago were not shot down by Armenian air defenses, but by Russian air defenses
* The (third) ceasefire, brokered by the USA, was breached within minutes (by Azerbaijan+Turkey)
A couple of hours later Russia bombed one of Turkey's favorite militia's HQ(Faylaq al Sham) in Syria. At least 78 killed
Those are columns of men
This airstrike is indicative of Russia's position. It is not willing to get dragged into a bloody conflict because the Armenian people let themselves be played by a clown.
The Syrian jihadists are a problem and this is a way of letting Turkey know they are serious about it. But as long as Pasinyan is sitting on his throne enacting policies that harm Russia, Putin isn't going to act
Russia right now doesn't have good options. Maybe they are banking on the Armenians chasing Pasinyan out
* Some Pan-Turkic propaganda. This is not a joke, both Aliyev and Erdo have mentioned the '1 people, 2 nations' phrase. NK might as well be the first step in their grand plan. Linking up Azerbaijan and Turkey (through Armenia) would be next
And some here expect Russia to come in and save the day, at huge geopolitical expenses. It is just not realistic
* Azeri drones have knocked out S300 air defenses in Armenia proper. These S300 did not engage the incoming drones
The President of Armenia, Soros' lapdog Pasinyan, is sabotaging the Armenian defenses from within. Armenian forces are not engaging the Azeris even when attacked within Armenian territory.
There are other rumours about the President of Artsakh being in direct contact with Putin thereby cutting Pasinyan out
* Several high ranking Armenian officials have been kicked out. Hopefully it's a sign that there is some sort of purge or Pasinyan related traitors going on, but it could also be vice versa
The Armenian President Armen Sarkissian has also dismissed a high ranking commander named Vaginak Sargsian
* There are rumours that the drones/ ballistic missiles that were downed near Yerevan about 10 days ago were not shot down by Armenian air defenses, but by Russian air defenses
* The (third) ceasefire, brokered by the USA, was breached within minutes (by Azerbaijan+Turkey)
A couple of hours later Russia bombed one of Turkey's favorite militia's HQ(Faylaq al Sham) in Syria. At least 78 killed
Those are columns of men
This airstrike is indicative of Russia's position. It is not willing to get dragged into a bloody conflict because the Armenian people let themselves be played by a clown.
The Syrian jihadists are a problem and this is a way of letting Turkey know they are serious about it. But as long as Pasinyan is sitting on his throne enacting policies that harm Russia, Putin isn't going to act
Russia right now doesn't have good options. Maybe they are banking on the Armenians chasing Pasinyan out
* Some Pan-Turkic propaganda. This is not a joke, both Aliyev and Erdo have mentioned the '1 people, 2 nations' phrase. NK might as well be the first step in their grand plan. Linking up Azerbaijan and Turkey (through Armenia) would be next
But wouldn't the soldiers manning the air defense fire anyways, regardless of their orders, rather than just sit and be killed? Or was the SAM site emptied and all personnel withdrawn?
I am currently in Turkey, not by desire, but because travel routes are very limited at the moment. I hope I have no problems getting out of here.
I've been here three times and the first time I was surprised how degenerate parts of it are. I was expecting to see hooded women and waddling men. But in one part in particular the place is over run by beatniks, girls with pink/blue hair and piercings etc. It looks like some lefty enclave in Colombia. The people look untrustworty, worldly and so greasy you could slide right of them. The worst area for that is the center of the capital Ankara. I'm somewhere different and it's the same, a bunch of strutting apes whose chief concerns are smoking, looking cool, thinking of themselves as gangsters and sex/porn.
The old Turkey is dying as like elsewhere millions move into the cities. For economic purposes people have been jammed into universities where courses are often in English. They are hot beds of liberalism where people become athiest, agnostic or diest. There are many women who wear hijabs who do not believe in Islam.
Like Western countries, Turkey (which is not really a country or people) is disintegrating. Sultan Erdoğan wants Turks to have 6 children and send 4 to Europe to turn it into a new Ottoman Empire. But it will never happen as the average Turkish man is more interrsted in fapping to porn and slutmaking. The arrogance of Turkish men is the perfect playground for Satan. Turkish women often hate their men and are becoming feminists in universities ... and of course these arrogant men will take it for the sex. The Turkish birth rate is falling and the Kurds are growing quicker. Turkey will hit its popilation peak in the 2050s and then start declining like all other half developed countries. But they will decline while being much poorer than say Germany. Turkey's economy has been shrinking for about 3 years in its own currency. I wouldnt expect too much growth in the future as they have hit cultural roadblocks to it.
The future of Turkey has many issues chief among them theit replacement by Kurds.
I've been here three times and the first time I was surprised how degenerate parts of it are. I was expecting to see hooded women and waddling men. But in one part in particular the place is over run by beatniks, girls with pink/blue hair and piercings etc. It looks like some lefty enclave in Colombia. The people look untrustworty, worldly and so greasy you could slide right of them. The worst area for that is the center of the capital Ankara. I'm somewhere different and it's the same, a bunch of strutting apes whose chief concerns are smoking, looking cool, thinking of themselves as gangsters and sex/porn.
The old Turkey is dying as like elsewhere millions move into the cities. For economic purposes people have been jammed into universities where courses are often in English. They are hot beds of liberalism where people become athiest, agnostic or diest. There are many women who wear hijabs who do not believe in Islam.
Like Western countries, Turkey (which is not really a country or people) is disintegrating. Sultan Erdoğan wants Turks to have 6 children and send 4 to Europe to turn it into a new Ottoman Empire. But it will never happen as the average Turkish man is more interrsted in fapping to porn and slutmaking. The arrogance of Turkish men is the perfect playground for Satan. Turkish women often hate their men and are becoming feminists in universities ... and of course these arrogant men will take it for the sex. The Turkish birth rate is falling and the Kurds are growing quicker. Turkey will hit its popilation peak in the 2050s and then start declining like all other half developed countries. But they will decline while being much poorer than say Germany. Turkey's economy has been shrinking for about 3 years in its own currency. I wouldnt expect too much growth in the future as they have hit cultural roadblocks to it.
The future of Turkey has many issues chief among them theit replacement by Kurds.
I respectfully disagree with most of what you said there. I always value personal anecdotes. However in this case it's kind of an imbalanced representation
There are also some perceived historical developments that are more based on expectation than on reality
1. "Turkey was an Islamic country that is turning into a liberal degenerate westernised one" (free, not literal translation)
This is wrong, and it was the opposite. Turkey before Erdogan was more leftist, atheist and secular than it is now. In the 60s and 70s Turkey was in danger of a communist takeover (of the already secular nationalist/ socialist Kemalists). There was a time when leftist terror attacks and partisan warfare cost the lives of people on a daily basis. Read up on Operation Gladio and the many military coups (protecting Turkey from leftism)
Erdo has enabled tons of Islamist laws, ranging from headscarves to the closure of liquor stores
Also, on the civil war like situation of the 70s
/)
en.m.wikipedia.org
The communists in Turkey have been stamped out and hold no power. Not in universities either, as the curriculum is heavily guided by the Turkish MoE (became even more strict after the failed Gulen 2016 coup).There are a couple of nearly extinct ethnic Turkish guerrillas in the Kurdish areas but they amount to nothing
2. On Turkish women. 58 percent of the Turkish women wear the headscarves, which is an enormous increase from even the early 90s.
www.google.com
3. "Turkish women flock to higher education to escape their surroundings" (free translation)
Actually the rate of higher education in Turkey is rather low.
From the OECD Website.
"Tertiary attainment is still low in Turkey. About one-third (33%) of Turkey's young adults (25-34 year-olds) had attained tertiary education by 2018, 11 percentage points below the OECD average of 44%."
On top of that, many of those following Tertiary Education, do so through Online Universities (ie. No in-class attendance). So it's not unrealistic to lower the 33 percent number to 25 percent or even lower.
Turkey is a matriarchy, but only within the households. Men are in charge out in the open, women rule the households
3. "Turkish women are not interested in marriage anymore"
This is again not true and probably comes forth from limited exposure
Turkey has one of the highest annual marriage rates (per 1000 people) in Europe, and comes close to the Middle East. They also have a very low divorce rate
en.m.wikipedia.org
Turkish women marry young (traditional value). This statistic is from a Feb 2020 study
"The mean age at first marriage rose for both women and men, reaching 25 and 27.9, respectively, up from 24.8 for women and 27.8 for men."
The average Turkish woman marries at 25.
4. "Turkish women are not having babies anymore, Kurds are overtaking them"
This is again a comment coming from observing your surroundings. *Leftist* Turkish women are not having many babies, conservative Turkish areas are majority above replacement levels.
To prove my point, go to any leftist Turkey sub-plebbit. It's non stop whining from sidelined Kemalists and communists about backward Anatolians out breeding the secular minded urbanite ubermensch. There is zero belief in returning to power
You are right about the Kurdish population boom though. Erdo has mentioned it frequently. In fact, during his early 2013 Kurdish rapprochement he mentioned it as a necessity because of the changing demographics of the country
Even so, there will never be a Kurdish takeover of Turkey. Take a close look at Turkey's history regarding the Kurds. As recent as the 1980s they were orchestrating ethnic cleansing campaigns as a form of collective retribution against the PKK uprising. More than 4000 villages got burned down.
en.m.wikipedia.org
This still happens. From a couple of years ago (the Kurdish cities of Cizre, Nusaybin, and Sirnak got completely destroyed after the local population let the PKK infiltrate)
Nusaybin, completely destroyed by the Mighty Turk.
Obviously what's going on in Afrin and Ras Al Ayn/Serekaniye (Syria) right now is widespread destruction of Kurdish culture, ethnic cleansing and cultural genocide
Turkish doesn't play games
5. Some additional info. 78 percent of the Turkish population is against same sex marriage
73 percent of the Young Turks are willing to defend their homeland (reminder that every war waged by Erdo is framed as defensive war)
Compare that to pozzed Western Europe
6. "Like Western countries, Turkey (which is not really a country or people) is disintegrating."
This one takes the cake for me. Couldn't be further from the truth. Turkey has everything, a strong sense of nationalism, reemerging religious fervour, a young population, geopolitical importance (Bosporus, between East and West), a strong and dedicated military, a functioning political system, a popular leader, a manufacturing economic base, raw materials etc.
They are lacking fossil fuels though. But they are working on that through the oil/gas pipeline from the Caspian Sea. Through NK Aliyev has sold himself out to Erdo, although I don't think he realizes it yet
Reality is that we are at best 15 years away from seeing Turkish boots in the Balkan/Greece
7. "Turkey's economy has been shrinking for about 3 years in its own currency. I wouldnt expect too much growth in the future as they have hit cultural roadblocks to it."
The Turkish GDP is growing steadily. The inflation is a problem but has more to do with Erdo's horrible policies/ meta economical tendencies than with Turkey lacking potential.
tradingeconomics.com
.
Moreover the Turkish economy is expected to grow by 4.5 percent in 2021.
8. "But it will never happen as the average Turkish man is more interrsted in fapping to porn and slutmaking. The arrogance of Turkish men is the perfect playground for Satan."
You should have read the 'bang reports' from Turkey on RVF 1.0. There basically were no bang reports, and many posters went home blueballed. Something along the lines off 'Half the girls wear hijabs, the other half is beautiful and feminine. Had two dates in three weeks, one flaked and the other one kept me on a leash for 3 hours at an ice cream store.'
Turkish girls are notoriously difficult
In this light you should see the greasyness and desperation from Turkish men (and Spanish+Italian+Arab men for that manner). They don't get any play so they resort to porn and harassing Western female tourists using cheesy pickup lines and banking on their 'Mediterrenean' looks
I really don't understand why everything on RVF is framed into the doomer mindset. Saying that Turkey is done is like saying that China does not have a bright future because there are degenerate career women that boss their husbands around (if they have one) in Shanghai/ Beijing/ Guangzhou, the birthrates are low/ non Han are growing faster in number and colored folks are starting to appear.
There are also some perceived historical developments that are more based on expectation than on reality
1. "Turkey was an Islamic country that is turning into a liberal degenerate westernised one" (free, not literal translation)
This is wrong, and it was the opposite. Turkey before Erdogan was more leftist, atheist and secular than it is now. In the 60s and 70s Turkey was in danger of a communist takeover (of the already secular nationalist/ socialist Kemalists). There was a time when leftist terror attacks and partisan warfare cost the lives of people on a daily basis. Read up on Operation Gladio and the many military coups (protecting Turkey from leftism)
Erdo has enabled tons of Islamist laws, ranging from headscarves to the closure of liquor stores
Also, on the civil war like situation of the 70s
Political violence in Turkey (1976–1980) - Wikipedia
The communists in Turkey have been stamped out and hold no power. Not in universities either, as the curriculum is heavily guided by the Turkish MoE (became even more strict after the failed Gulen 2016 coup).There are a couple of nearly extinct ethnic Turkish guerrillas in the Kurdish areas but they amount to nothing
2. On Turkish women. 58 percent of the Turkish women wear the headscarves, which is an enormous increase from even the early 90s.
Almost 60 percent of Turkish women cover their heads | Ahval
3. "Turkish women flock to higher education to escape their surroundings" (free translation)
Actually the rate of higher education in Turkey is rather low.
From the OECD Website.
"Tertiary attainment is still low in Turkey. About one-third (33%) of Turkey's young adults (25-34 year-olds) had attained tertiary education by 2018, 11 percentage points below the OECD average of 44%."
On top of that, many of those following Tertiary Education, do so through Online Universities (ie. No in-class attendance). So it's not unrealistic to lower the 33 percent number to 25 percent or even lower.
Turkey is a matriarchy, but only within the households. Men are in charge out in the open, women rule the households
3. "Turkish women are not interested in marriage anymore"
This is again not true and probably comes forth from limited exposure
Turkey has one of the highest annual marriage rates (per 1000 people) in Europe, and comes close to the Middle East. They also have a very low divorce rate
Divorce demography - Wikipedia
Turkish women marry young (traditional value). This statistic is from a Feb 2020 study
"The mean age at first marriage rose for both women and men, reaching 25 and 27.9, respectively, up from 24.8 for women and 27.8 for men."
The average Turkish woman marries at 25.
4. "Turkish women are not having babies anymore, Kurds are overtaking them"
This is again a comment coming from observing your surroundings. *Leftist* Turkish women are not having many babies, conservative Turkish areas are majority above replacement levels.
To prove my point, go to any leftist Turkey sub-plebbit. It's non stop whining from sidelined Kemalists and communists about backward Anatolians out breeding the secular minded urbanite ubermensch. There is zero belief in returning to power
You are right about the Kurdish population boom though. Erdo has mentioned it frequently. In fact, during his early 2013 Kurdish rapprochement he mentioned it as a necessity because of the changing demographics of the country
Even so, there will never be a Kurdish takeover of Turkey. Take a close look at Turkey's history regarding the Kurds. As recent as the 1980s they were orchestrating ethnic cleansing campaigns as a form of collective retribution against the PKK uprising. More than 4000 villages got burned down.
Kurdish villages depopulated by Turkey - Wikipedia
This still happens. From a couple of years ago (the Kurdish cities of Cizre, Nusaybin, and Sirnak got completely destroyed after the local population let the PKK infiltrate)
Redirect Notice
www.google.com
Nusaybin, completely destroyed by the Mighty Turk.
Obviously what's going on in Afrin and Ras Al Ayn/Serekaniye (Syria) right now is widespread destruction of Kurdish culture, ethnic cleansing and cultural genocide
Turkish doesn't play games
5. Some additional info. 78 percent of the Turkish population is against same sex marriage
73 percent of the Young Turks are willing to defend their homeland (reminder that every war waged by Erdo is framed as defensive war)
Compare that to pozzed Western Europe
6. "Like Western countries, Turkey (which is not really a country or people) is disintegrating."
This one takes the cake for me. Couldn't be further from the truth. Turkey has everything, a strong sense of nationalism, reemerging religious fervour, a young population, geopolitical importance (Bosporus, between East and West), a strong and dedicated military, a functioning political system, a popular leader, a manufacturing economic base, raw materials etc.
They are lacking fossil fuels though. But they are working on that through the oil/gas pipeline from the Caspian Sea. Through NK Aliyev has sold himself out to Erdo, although I don't think he realizes it yet
Reality is that we are at best 15 years away from seeing Turkish boots in the Balkan/Greece
7. "Turkey's economy has been shrinking for about 3 years in its own currency. I wouldnt expect too much growth in the future as they have hit cultural roadblocks to it."
The Turkish GDP is growing steadily. The inflation is a problem but has more to do with Erdo's horrible policies/ meta economical tendencies than with Turkey lacking potential.
Turkey GDP Growth Rate | 1998-2020 Data | 2021-2022 Forecast | Calendar | Historical
Turkey's economy shrank 11 percent quarter-on-quarter in the three months to June 2020, following a downwardly revised 0.1 percent drop in the previous period. It was the sharpest contraction on record, as the coronavirus pandemic hit the economy. GDP Growth Rate in Turkey averaged 0.95 percent...
Moreover the Turkish economy is expected to grow by 4.5 percent in 2021.
8. "But it will never happen as the average Turkish man is more interrsted in fapping to porn and slutmaking. The arrogance of Turkish men is the perfect playground for Satan."
You should have read the 'bang reports' from Turkey on RVF 1.0. There basically were no bang reports, and many posters went home blueballed. Something along the lines off 'Half the girls wear hijabs, the other half is beautiful and feminine. Had two dates in three weeks, one flaked and the other one kept me on a leash for 3 hours at an ice cream store.'
Turkish girls are notoriously difficult
In this light you should see the greasyness and desperation from Turkish men (and Spanish+Italian+Arab men for that manner). They don't get any play so they resort to porn and harassing Western female tourists using cheesy pickup lines and banking on their 'Mediterrenean' looks
I really don't understand why everything on RVF is framed into the doomer mindset. Saying that Turkey is done is like saying that China does not have a bright future because there are degenerate career women that boss their husbands around (if they have one) in Shanghai/ Beijing/ Guangzhou, the birthrates are low/ non Han are growing faster in number and colored folks are starting to appear.
Attachments
* Turks hunting Armenians in France. Actually quite surprised it took more than a month for this to happen
* First successful Armenian counter attack during the conflict
* Meanwhile the Azeris are already near the Lachin corridor
Cutting NK off from Armenia would be a major strategic victory
* First successful Armenian counter attack during the conflict
* Meanwhile the Azeris are already near the Lachin corridor
Cutting NK off from Armenia would be a major strategic victory
Here is a good analysis
Everybody Loses
BTW
Guess who "started it"?
STALIN. Those leftist reach beyond the grave
Everybody Loses
BTW
Guess who "started it"?
STALIN. Those leftist reach beyond the grave
The launching tubes are not even in position
In theory older systems like the S300 should be able to down incoming drones easily. Even obsolete 9k33 OSA anti aircraft weapon systems have been downing drones in NK. MANPADS are another effective counter-drone measure
The most efficient way of combating drones is through Electronic Warfare. The Russians have state of the art EW technology (Krasukha 4), as do they Turks and basically any other serious military.
Attack drones can operate in two modes 1. GPS based attack drones (against fixed targets) or 2. manual laser guided drones (mobile targets). GPS based attacks are preferable
By jamming the GPS signal the drone will lose its course and eventually crash. The drone operator can switch to manually guiding the drone by switching to the ELINT/ radio link but this means that the drone will have to lower altitude therefore making it more prone to being shot down. In addition these radio/ ELINT systems can be jammed as well
The Russians have been engaging in defensive drone warfare / Electronic Warfare in Syria and Ukraine for years now. Their airbase in Hmmeimim is targeted nearly weekly by drones. Up until now there are no indicators that they are willing to share this know how and weapon system with the Armenians
Russian Electronic Warfare System Brings Down Hostile Drones in Syria
Russian Electronic Warfare System Brings Down Hostile Drones in Syria
Not related to drones, but still a succinct and visual explanation of how EW works
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* The Defense Treaty has been activated by the Armenian president
Whether this will involve NK has to be seen
EDIT: Guess it was to be expected..
* For the lulz
The Turkish spin. These people are so predictable. Coming to a demonstration with hammers and at least one axe, getting your head dented in and then playing victim
* Fighting is reported near Shushi/Stepanakert. This is strange as the front line is supposed to be tens of kms away
Despite the Armenian bravado this can only mean one thing : Azeris have progressed much further than many thought
* Putin has invited Erdo to the peacetalks. Probably related to his objectives of breaking NATO up by massaging Turkey away from it
Turkey is a nuissance but NATO/ The US are the real enemy
Unless NATO is quietly on board with Turkey's antics but Macron's belligerent attitude makes that unlikely
www.reuters.com
* Pro-Russia opposition leaders, amongst them former President Levon Ter-Petrosyan, want to go to Moscow to negotiate. Something could be up
Part of the tweet says that they are currently still in Armenia as their passports have been taken as a result of the ongoing corruption investigation (political trial)
Whether this will involve NK has to be seen
EDIT: Guess it was to be expected..
* For the lulz
The Turkish spin. These people are so predictable. Coming to a demonstration with hammers and at least one axe, getting your head dented in and then playing victim
* Fighting is reported near Shushi/Stepanakert. This is strange as the front line is supposed to be tens of kms away
Despite the Armenian bravado this can only mean one thing : Azeris have progressed much further than many thought
* Putin has invited Erdo to the peacetalks. Probably related to his objectives of breaking NATO up by massaging Turkey away from it
Turkey is a nuissance but NATO/ The US are the real enemy
Unless NATO is quietly on board with Turkey's antics but Macron's belligerent attitude makes that unlikely
Putin calls for Turkish involvement in Nagorno-Karabakh talks
Russian President Vladimir Putin said Turkey should be among countries involved in talks to end fighting in Nagorno-Karabakh, as Azerbaijan and Armenia again accused each other on Thursday of shelling civilians in and around the mountain enclave.
* Pro-Russia opposition leaders, amongst them former President Levon Ter-Petrosyan, want to go to Moscow to negotiate. Something could be up
Part of the tweet says that they are currently still in Armenia as their passports have been taken as a result of the ongoing corruption investigation (political trial)
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Russian peacekeepers are on their way to Artsakh, and Armenia and Azerbaijan are signing an agreement to end the conflict:
www.rt.com
Putin announces that Russian peacekeepers are headed for Nagorno-Karabakh as Azerbaijan & Armenia sign suprise midnight armistice
Russian President Vladimir Putin has confirmed that Azerbaijan and Armenia have struck a deal to end the current conflict over Nagorno-Karabakh, and that Russian peacekeepers will be deployed along the line of contact.
Major happenings in Artsakh
* Russian Mi 24 helicopter shot down over Armenian territory. The Azeris immediately started shitting their pants and kept on asking for forgiveness
Yesterday an Iskander missile was fired on Baku. Rumours are that it was a Russian retaliation, not an Armenian
* Ceasefire/ Surrender of the Armenian forces
* Russian peacekeepers will stay in the region for 5 years (+possibly Turkish peacekeepers)
* Everything has to be seen in the light of the Turkish/NATO-Russian powerstruggle
Also keep in mind that this is half a ceasefire, and half a surrender
Read the thread below. From a staunchly Pro-Armenian source. The painful facts are that the Armenian forces were in a very bad state. Suffering from high attrition rates, lack of sleep and food, lack of materiel, constant drone attacks
Erdo got his way again. The Armenians were thoroughly defeated. Where this conflict will go in the future is unsure. It could return to a frozen status or become a flashpoint
* Meanwhile furious Armenians have stormed the parliament in Yerevan. Major protests elsewhere too. Pasinyan is rumoured to be in Sochi, Russia. Others say that he is still in Armenia
* Pasinyan's residence was stormed as well. This how the spineless rat reacted
Of course the blame game has started. Rightfully so.
Protestors trashing the Radio Europe Station
* Russian Mi 24 helicopter shot down over Armenian territory. The Azeris immediately started shitting their pants and kept on asking for forgiveness
Yesterday an Iskander missile was fired on Baku. Rumours are that it was a Russian retaliation, not an Armenian
* Ceasefire/ Surrender of the Armenian forces
* Russian peacekeepers will stay in the region for 5 years (+possibly Turkish peacekeepers)
* Everything has to be seen in the light of the Turkish/NATO-Russian powerstruggle
Also keep in mind that this is half a ceasefire, and half a surrender
Read the thread below. From a staunchly Pro-Armenian source. The painful facts are that the Armenian forces were in a very bad state. Suffering from high attrition rates, lack of sleep and food, lack of materiel, constant drone attacks
Erdo got his way again. The Armenians were thoroughly defeated. Where this conflict will go in the future is unsure. It could return to a frozen status or become a flashpoint
* Meanwhile furious Armenians have stormed the parliament in Yerevan. Major protests elsewhere too. Pasinyan is rumoured to be in Sochi, Russia. Others say that he is still in Armenia
* Pasinyan's residence was stormed as well. This how the spineless rat reacted
Of course the blame game has started. Rightfully so.
Protestors trashing the Radio Europe Station
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