The new cold war with China

US Navy plans to raise new fleet in Indo Pacific, says top US official

nmnimitz1811.jpg

The U.S. Navy gets very serious about containing China...

“We have to look to our other allies and partners like Singapore, like India, and actually put a numbered fleet where it would be extremely relevant if, God forbid, we were to ever get in any kind of a dust-up,” Mr Braithwaite said.

“More importantly, it can provide a much more formidable deterrence,” he added.

“So we’re going to create the First Fleet,” he said. “And we’re going to put it, if not Singapore right out of the chocks, we’re going to look to make it more expeditionary-oriented and move it across the Pacific until it is where our allies and partners see that it could best assist them as well as to assist us.”

Nations around the Pacific and around the globe need to assist in pushing back Beijing militarily and economically for deterrence to work, he stressed."


 

El Chinito loco

Crow
Gold Member
When it comes to Mainland China I have a sort of visceral hate towards the CCP that a lot of you guys may not understand. I have a lot of relatives who fought in that 50's revolutionary war before the nationalist KMT had to leave. However, I have to point out that very little of the issues in the U.S. now is due to either China or Russia it is another people colonizing the west. I think it's pretty obvious to based people on here.

It was a good historical example of globalism and how globalist powers would "limp dick" at the last moment for what they perceived as the greater good... which in the end just delivers the world to complete Jewish control. Subvert imperialism and nationalism but install globalism post WW2. Weimar republic for all.

There is a propaganda campaign being waged to pit the U.S. political left and right along these terms. It takes on the shape as being the left aligned with (China) and the right aligned with (Russia) both convenient enemies of the deep state as well as international Jews. The whole point of this left/right dichotomy is to squeeze you right into compliance in the middle. If you don't understand this, I feel a bit sorry for you. I don't know which side they are going to war with first by proxy but when it comes to actual blood sacrifice it is you and not the people in charge (the tribe) or their family members who will be paying it.

People itching to go to war with China over covid or Russia for whatever reason are just going along with the program. It is meant to decimate the white population and weaken the west for further takeover.
 
Seems like a somewhat plausible scenario. Basically it comes down to 1) whether China is a paper tiger or can fully mobilize its industrial base and perform competently on the battlefield and 2) U.S. can depend on Western Europe, Turkey, India, and Japan to fully commit and 3) Role of technology


I don't see a WWII style all major powers involved military conflict happening in the near future, which is what the video showed. I envision Russia hanging back, very curious to see what happens between America and China, and hoping to come out ahead by either or both great powers being greatly weakened by the war. I could see Xi wanting Putin to commit his formidable submarine force, but I just don't see Putin doing it, because of the various risks involved. I also don't see China wanting to tangle with India, while they are taking on the United States. Yes, the key thing for America is to get our allies, Australia, Japan, India, South Korea, and even NATO members, to actively commit their naval forces to fight beside us. I don't see the war lasting more than a few months. The key thing for China is to successfully land a huge force on Taiwan, and entrench themselves enough to resist a multi-national force from digging them out and sending them packing.

There is a theory that right around 2027/2028, China will be more or less ready to invade Taiwan (though not at the level if they waited till 2040 or later), and the U.S. may still have not fully upgraded their warships (second generation lasers, rail guns, next gen anti-ship and anti-aircraft missiles, one or two nuclear reactors in every large surface ship to power both propulsion and also the energy weapons) and have a mature and large drone force (undersea, surface, air) ready to augment their force projection. And so to the CCP, that may be the window of opportunity to try to conquer Taiwan, while the U.S. Navy still feels potentially very vulnerable to China's heavily fortified "front yard."

The U.S. Navy and Pentagon have certainly woken up to the threat and are now trying to shift into high gear to counter it. But at the rate weapons development, manufacturing and deployment take for our military industrial complex, I worry that when China decides to go on the attack, that we won't be near as ready as we could have been and so many more of our sailors and marines will pay with their lives, whether we win or lose.
 

Dr Mantis Toboggan

Kingfisher
Gold Member
I don't see a WWII style all major powers involved military conflict happening in the near future, which is what the video showed. I envision Russia hanging back, very curious to see what happens between America and China, and hoping to come out ahead by either or both great powers being greatly weakened by the war. I could see Xi wanting Putin to commit his formidable submarine force, but I just don't see Putin doing it, because of the various risks involved. I also don't see China wanting to tangle with India, while they are taking on the United States. Yes, the key thing for America is to get our allies, Australia, Japan, India, South Korea, and even NATO members, to actively commit their naval forces to fight beside us. I don't see the war lasting more than a few months. The key thing for China is to successfully land a huge force on Taiwan, and entrench themselves enough to resist a multi-national force from digging them out and sending them packing.

There is a theory that right around 2027/2028, China will be more or less ready to invade Taiwan (though not at the level if they waited till 2040 or later), and the U.S. may still have not fully upgraded their warships (second generation lasers, rail guns, next gen anti-ship and anti-aircraft missiles, one or two nuclear reactors in every large surface ship to power both propulsion and also the energy weapons) and have a mature and large drone force (undersea, surface, air) ready to augment their force projection. And so to the CCP, that may be the window of opportunity to try to conquer Taiwan, while the U.S. Navy still feels potentially very vulnerable to China's heavily fortified "front yard."

The U.S. Navy and Pentagon have certainly woken up to the threat and are now trying to shift into high gear to counter it. But at the rate weapons development, manufacturing and deployment take for our military industrial complex, I worry that when China decides to go on the attack, that we won't be near as ready as we could have been and so many more of our sailors and marines will pay with their lives, whether we win or lose.

As I've mentioned a few times in this or the other China thread, the CCP institutionally wants to retake Taiwan by the 100th anniversary of the PRC in 2049. They, again as an institution, don't care that much if this happens tomorrow or in 2048, as long as it happens in time for the centennial (obviously all else being equal they'd prefer it to happen sooner rather than later, but they wouldn't jeopardize its happening at all in order to force it earlier than necessary). Xi, on the other hand, clearly wants it to happen during his lifetime--he is 67 right now so figure he will want it to happen in the next 15 years or so (he may well live longer than that but past early 80s is pushing it in terms of mental decline). The big power struggle to watch re Taiwan over the next 10-15 years will be between Xi and his loyalists, who will want to accelerate the timeline to move on Taiwan, vs those who align more with the party institutionally than with Xi personally, who will not want to do so unless they can be convinced that doing so does not risk the long-term goal of taking Taiwan by 2049. In order to be able to move on Taiwan by say 2035, Xi will need to either convince the party loyalists (who still represent a good deal of power within the CCP) that doing so will not jeopardize the long-term aims, or simply purge them entirely.

Russia's potential role in a hot US-China conflict is an interesting question too. They are aligned with China for now, but they have to know that if China does successfully take Taiwan they will ultimately stab Russia in the back and invade Siberia for space and resources.
 

Arado

Pelican
Gold Member
When it comes to Mainland China I have a sort of visceral hate towards the CCP that a lot of you guys may not understand. I have a lot of relatives who fought in that 50's revolutionary war before the nationalist KMT had to leave. However, I have to point out that very little of the issues in the U.S. now is due to either China or Russia it is another people colonizing the west. I think it's pretty obvious to based people on here.

It was a good historical example of globalism and how globalist powers would "limp dick" at the last moment for what they perceived as the greater good... which in the end just delivers the world to complete Jewish control. Subvert imperialism and nationalism but install globalism post WW2. Weimar republic for all.

There is a propaganda campaign being waged to pit the U.S. political left and right along these terms. It takes on the shape as being the left aligned with (China) and the right aligned with (Russia) both convenient enemies of the deep state as well as international Jews. The whole point of this left/right dichotomy is to squeeze you right into compliance in the middle. If you don't understand this, I feel a bit sorry for you. I don't know which side they are going to war with first by proxy but when it comes to actual blood sacrifice it is you and not the people in charge (the tribe) or their family members who will be paying it.

People itching to go to war with China over covid or Russia for whatever reason are just going along with the program. It is meant to decimate the white population and weaken the west for further takeover.

Would be curious to see if you have a point by point refutation of my previous posts - there is a clear conflict of interest between the long term goals of China achieving its goals of world superpower status and regaining the central role of the Han in the world, vs. the economic and security interests of the world's white Christian population. It's far from as simple as "the globalist elites are behind the anti-China push". China's rise represents a shift in world power that we haven't seen since the discovery of the new world and everyone is still thinking about it using their anti-elite/anti-corporate/anti-globalist frame that they analyze domestic issues.

I can understand that you may have anti-CCP feelings based on what your relatives went through, but as discussed ad-nauseum on this thread, many (not all though as I admit) of the policies they are implementing now are just simply advancing the broader interests of the Han, and taking advantage of the West's weaknesses when possible.
 
As I've mentioned a few times in this or the other China thread, the CCP institutionally wants to retake Taiwan by the 100th anniversary of the PRC in 2049. They, again as an institution, don't care that much if this happens tomorrow or in 2048, as long as it happens in time for the centennial (obviously all else being equal they'd prefer it to happen sooner rather than later, but they wouldn't jeopardize its happening at all in order to force it earlier than necessary). Xi, on the other hand, clearly wants it to happen during his lifetime--he is 67 right now so figure he will want it to happen in the next 15 years or so (he may well live longer than that but past early 80s is pushing it in terms of mental decline). The big power struggle to watch re Taiwan over the next 10-15 years will be between Xi and his loyalists, who will want to accelerate the timeline to move on Taiwan, vs those who align more with the party institutionally than with Xi personally, who will not want to do so unless they can be convinced that doing so does not risk the long-term goal of taking Taiwan by 2049. In order to be able to move on Taiwan by say 2035, Xi will need to either convince the party loyalists (who still represent a good deal of power within the CCP) that doing so will not jeopardize the long-term aims, or simply purge them entirely.

Russia's potential role in a hot US-China conflict is an interesting question too. They are aligned with China for now, but they have to know that if China does successfully take Taiwan they will ultimately stab Russia in the back and invade Siberia for space and resources.

Yes, I fully agree with your survey of things. I find it quite ironic that Xi, supposedly the classic ideal of a CCP member, may actually bring about China's humiliating military defeat by forcing it into a premature war with the West, so that he can try to get the ego satisfaction of seeing China conquer Taiwan while he is still healthy and ruling the nation. If China's leadership could just be as patient as the Chinese are stereotyped as being, within thirty to fifty years, Taiwan might fall into their hands like a ripe fruit. But I just don't see Xi being patient. And also, I think he actually wants a major war so his military can get truly blooded and gain the confidence and experience which comes from going through a nasty extended war. Even if they do lose, they will have learned a great deal. The world economy will be shot to hell of course, but 20-30 years after a defeat, China would be ready again for another attempt at conquering Taiwan. Well, as long as the regime is not overthrown, and I just don't see that happening, even after a shameful loss to America and her allies. But Xi would certainly lose his "great leader for life" position for rolling the dice and not winning.

Russia and China are definitely a marriage made in hell, if you look at things long-term, as you did. China already is complaining about how they want Vladisvostok, despite it being a key Russian naval station. This will only be the beginning. But some think China will be peacefully devious with Russia, and over time quietly migrate millions of Chinese into Siberia as peaceful workers who put down roots. It will all be a matter of demographics. Lol But at a certain point Russia will probably stop the immigration, and start sending Chinese immigrants home. And then the ugly stuff will start.
 

El Chinito loco

Crow
Gold Member
Would be curious to see if you have a point by point refutation of my previous posts - there is a clear conflict of interest between the long term goals of China achieving its goals of world superpower status and regaining the central role of the Han in the world, vs. the economic and security interests of the world's white Christian population.
I'll be more than happy to address any points you want to put forth directly in this thread as an original post.

I absolutely will not comb through your history and address each post you've ever made about this topic just because you ask me to.


It's far from as simple as "the globalist elites are behind the anti-China push". China's rise represents a shift in world power that we haven't seen since the discovery of the new world and everyone is still thinking about it using their anti-elite/anti-corporate/anti-globalist frame that they analyze domestic issues.
I'm not going to mince words.. the western world is colonized by Jews, straight up. I'll say it outright. Everything from media, social media, finance, etc.. all controlled. Everything you see now and its repressive policies is directed at controlling and conditioning the goyim cattle.


I can understand that you may have anti-CCP feelings based on what your relatives went through, but as discussed ad-nauseum on this thread, many (not all though as I admit) of the policies they are implementing now are just simply advancing the broader interests of the Han, and taking advantage of the West's weaknesses when possible.

So your central thesis is Han supremacy is going to take over the world? That is a very boomer take and also straddles both kosher certified political aisles in the U.S.'s talking points.. I would like to hear more though.

What specific points do you want to talk about..I am open to it. If you intend to wax poetic about the struggles of the muslim uighers (wiggers) or rohingya it's going to be a an entertaining thread for sure.
 
El Chinito Loco wrote:
"So your central thesis is Han supremacy is going to take over the world? That is a very boomer take and also straddles both kosher certified political aisles in the U.S.'s talking points.. I would like to hear more though."

And if you are young enough you will unfortunately live to see it. But this will not be the classic gun and bayonet version of taking over the world. Instead it will be an economic, technological and political hegemony, backed up by a very powerful military. In a sense it will be a return to when China had emperors, were the wealthiest and largest state in the world, and many nations would send ambassadors with expensive gifts, to show fealty.
 
Five Eyes allies call on China to reverse ban on Hong Kong pro-democracy legislators

hk leg.jpeg

The days of real democracy in Hong Kong are sadly numbered...

"The Five Eyes intelligence sharing group has said China’s imposition of new rules to disqualify elected legislators in Hong Kong appeared to be part of a campaign to silence critics and called on Beijing to reverse course.

“We urge the Chinese central authorities to re-consider their actions against Hong Kong’s elected legislature and immediately reinstate the Legislative Council members,” foreign ministers from Australia, Britain, Canada, New Zealand and the United States said in a joint statement.

Hong Kong expelled four opposition members from its legislature last week after Beijing gave city authorities new powers to curb dissent. The move triggered mass resignations by Hong Kong’s pro-democracy opposition lawmakers."


 

Hong Kong’s national security law: 10 things you need to know

indextyu.jpg


Such a massive betrayal of their own people... And keep in mind that foreigners can get tangled in this web of tyrannical laws, without even living there...

"On 30 June, China’s top legislature unanimously passed a new national security law for Hong Kong that entered into force in the territory the same day, just before midnight. The law is dangerously vague and broad: virtually anything could be deemed a threat to “national security" under its provisions, and it can apply to anyone on the planet.

The Chinese authorities forced the law through without any accountability or transparency: it was passed just weeks after it was first announced, bypassing Hong Kong’s local legislature, and the text was kept secret from the public and allegedly even the Hong Kong government until after it was enacted.

Here are 10 reasons why everyone should be worried about this new law......"


 

ralfy

Sparrow
I think countries like the U.S. and Canada emit more per capita than China.

Also, Hong Kong belongs to China.

Finally, the likely reason why the U.S. is putting pressure on China is not because of "freedom" and "democracy" (i.e., given the long history of U.S. support for various regimes worldwide) but because it sees China as an economic threat, and there's no way to justify high military spending except to engage in war.

That's why every U.S. President across several admins has been promoting a combination of neo-conservatism (the use of the military, foreign policies, and dirty tricks to attack competing military powers indirectly through control of weaker countries) and neo-liberalism (deregulation to favor the rich and to force the same weaker countries to open up their economies for U.S. advantages). This explains why even an outsider like Trump had to work with the swamp, and why Biden is no different from Bush and Obama, who were warmongers and bailed out the rich.
 

911

Peacock
Gold Member

Hong Kong’s national security law: 10 things you need to know

View attachment 27101


Such a massive betrayal of their own people... And keep in mind that foreigners can get tangled in this web of tyrannical laws, without even living there...

"On 30 June, China’s top legislature unanimously passed a new national security law for Hong Kong that entered into force in the territory the same day, just before midnight. The law is dangerously vague and broad: virtually anything could be deemed a threat to “national security" under its provisions, and it can apply to anyone on the planet.

The Chinese authorities forced the law through without any accountability or transparency: it was passed just weeks after it was first announced, bypassing Hong Kong’s local legislature, and the text was kept secret from the public and allegedly even the Hong Kong government until after it was enacted.

Here are 10 reasons why everyone should be worried about this new law......"



You know what? Fuck Amnesty International and the POS neoliberal horse they rode on. Freedoms are getting trampled left and right across the West like never before in history, millions of small businesses crushed, crippling debts, Klaus Schwab Bond villain "reset" plans halfway passed, MASSIVE election fraud, freakish GMO altering vaccines to be forced upon hundreds of millions of families, and all they're worried about is "tyranical laws" in Hong Kong???

This is Hong Kong, a bunch of Cantonese larping as British:


and this is your country, and the "values" and "progress" our governments want to uphold:
 
Last edited:

Handsome Creepy Eel

Owl
Gold Member
I think countries like the U.S. and Canada emit more per capita than China.
They do, but since emissions are a global, combined business, the fact that China is the world's biggest CO2 emitter is the only thing that matters. USA could drop its emissions to Chinese levels, but all that China would need to offset it would to increase its own by just a few percent and it would all be for nothing.

If you want to measure this by per capita emissions, I guess we should be putting sanctions on Trinidad and Tobago:

 
You know what? Fuck Amnesty International and the POS neoliberal horse they rode on. Freedoms are getting trampled left and right across the West like never before in history, millions of small businesses crushed, crippling debts, Klaus Schwab Bond villain "reset" plans halfway passed, MASSIVE election fraud, freakish GMO altering vaccines to be forced upon hundreds of millions of families, and all they're worried about is "tyranical laws" in Hong Kong???

This is Hong Kong, a bunch of Cantonese larping as British:


and this is your country, and the "values" and "progress" our governments want to uphold:

Yes, America is facing some huge problems and challenges, but that does not mean what Hong Kongers are going through does not matter. The tyrannical CCP has broken its agreement with Britain, and years ahead of schedule, has overturned the one country, two systems agreement. The people there are mourning the loss of their civil liberties and trying to fight it, despite the odds. You should see them as brothers in arms. As for Amnesty International, they often do good work. And they stand up to Israel, in regard to their oppression of Palestinians.
 
Rampant Corruption in the PLA...

I had no idea just how massive the corruption was in the PLA! You can actually buy rank, as if this was some 18th century military... I wonder to what extent Xi's purges have truly curtailed the corruption in his armed forces? One of the reasons PLA equipment is not very reliable, is because senior ranking generals scooped off the top so much money that was allocated for their design and construction.

 

911

Peacock
Gold Member
Yes, America is facing some huge problems and challenges, but that does not mean what Hong Kongers are going through does not matter. The tyrannical CCP has broken its agreement with Britain, and years ahead of schedule, has overturned the one country, two systems agreement. The people there are mourning the loss of their civil liberties and trying to fight it, despite the odds. You should see them as brothers in arms. As for Amnesty International, they often do good work. And they stand up to Israel, in regard to their oppression of Palestinians.

MF2050 - Amnesty International did do some good work a decade or two ago, but lately, like most other left wing outfits, they've gone full on neoliberal and are tacitly pro-war and pro-tyrany. Looking for Amnesty International to be fair in those matters is kind of like expecting the ACLU to step forward and protect innocent victims like Kyle Rittenhouse or Nick Sandmann, not gonna happen...

A lot of the stuff posted in this thread was mostly relevant one or two years ago, right now the subject of "human rights" in Hong Kong as some kind of rallying point for patriots rings pretty hollow. I don't think you understand where we are headed in 2021. The freedom gap between us and China is closing, very fast. While we will have similar restrictions on A1 freedoms next year, on and off line, after the next rounds of "anti-hate" laws, China might actually end up looking like a better and freer place to raise a family for these three reasons alone:

- No aggressive coercive universal vaccination program. They seem to care more about the health of their people than the people running the show in nearly every western nation. When is the last time you've heard a top health official express concerns about the side effects of vaccines as a reason for limiting their use, like what China's top CDC guy said?

- Believing that there are only two genders, and that subjecting children to drastic hormonal treatments is an insidious form of physical and psychological torture - those beliefs are held as true and normal in China, but will turn you into a dissident in the West.

- Being able to run your small business and to go about your life without tyranical plandemic lockdowns, and down the line, not having Greta and AOC run your energy policy with disastrous economic consequences for the middle class.

For those and other reasons, we're going to overshoot China in terms of lack of basic human rights and liberties in the coming Dark Winter era.
 
Last edited:
Top