TRT Is Like Botox For Men

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
Yeah, keep your guns and your HRT and your lifts and your bitcoins.
All your preparations will come to naught. You are in for a harsh awakening.
Jer 17:5
“Cursed is the one who trusts in man, who draws strength from mere flesh and whose heart turns away from the Lord.

It also shrinks ones testicles and reduces sperm count.
If your manhood is dependent on external intake of T, the problem is deeper.
Depening on his age, that can be preventable. No one, and I mean no one is going to get testosterone because his manhood depends on it. SMH. It is simply a matter of improving health. Some of us think that matters to God. Virtually every prayer request I have heard at church is about a health related matter. I think that is everywhere. People's health and the health of their loved ones matters to them. They will do anything they can to prolong their lives that is within the will of God.
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
It’s the god honest truth, you can read/watch all the Internet talking head stuff you want one way or the other but I’ve seen it first hand. I’m a proponent of test use if it’s absolutely needed and serves a purpose, lots of boxes need to be checked, but if you think the oil in a syringe barrel is going to make you a man from a soy boy you are very sorely mistaken. You have to choose to be a strong man, that’s all there is to it, a weak man will always be a weak man unless he himself chooses not to be.
And I agree with you. But there are people here who automatically dismiss bioidentical testosterone as if it is from Satan himself.
Since when did raising T into the high normal but not surpraphysiological level, become such a dastardly thing to do?
Some of us have wives who are perfectly fine with getting prescribed testosterone because they want him healthy.
But when your levels are in the tank, you are severely limited in what you can achieve.
 

FrancisK

Kingfisher
Gold Member
And I agree with you. But there are people here who automatically dismiss bioidentical testosterone as if it is from Satan himself.
Since when did raising T into the high normal but not surpraphysiological level, become such a dastardly thing to do?
Some of us have wives who are perfectly fine with getting prescribed testosterone because they want him healthy.
But when your levels are in the tank, you are severely limited in what you can achieve.

There is nothing wrong with using a tool at your disposal to improve your life. The issue here is the “steroids” boogeyman and guys thinking it gives another guy a leg up on them so they have to compensate by admonishing it. It’s a lot deeper than the surface here.

If I made a thread about moisturizer, zinc and sunscreen I wonder if it would get the same reaction. Actually we have one which is pages and pages long. What it’s not the same thing because it’s not a needle? That’s the reasoning I see here….
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
Synthetic testosterone is a type of anabolic steroid, or a anabolic-androgenic steroids. As a medicine, testosterone is used for both its anabolic and androgenic functions. If you are low in testosterone, the treatment is for androgenic reason, not anabolic reasons. Testosterone can also be prescribed for anabolic reasons, most notably for people that had cancer or chronic wasting conditions.

Studies have shown the VAST majority of testosterone users are (around 74%-78%) men with a median age of about 25 and are noncompetitive bodybuilders and non-athletes using it for cosmetic purposes. This is who Roosh was talking about in his article. He wasn't talking about the small amount of people that use it to recover from cancer treatment, or even the small amount of people that suffering from hypogonadism. We don't even need to include the 60+ crowd of men who take testosterone to return to a "normal" level of testosterone.

I'll repeat: the VAST majority of men that use testosterone use it for cosmetic purposes. They use it to look better at the club and at the beach.

Please stop clouding the issue by lumping in people with legitimate medical concerns with the overwhelming majority of people that use synthetic testosterone as a designer drug for cosmetic purposes.

I think it's important to do things that improve your testosterone production. There's certain supplements and lifestyle changes you can take to improve your testosterone production. Supplements includes vitamin C, zinc, DHEA, magnesium, coleus forskohlii, boron, and DAA. If you combine a regime of these supplements with proper sleep, nutrition, and exercise, the VAST majority of men (95%) will be fine. I'll repeat it: synthetic testosterone is not required for the VAST of majority of men to have healthy levels of testosterone.
But who determines that even those vitamins and minerals you listed are not for the purpose of vanity? DHEA is a hormone just like T and that's supposed to be OK? I sure don't want any human being telling me what is best for me or my family.
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
You sound like my redneck friend who refuses to do anything to get himself out of his mom's house. He does the bare minimum in life.

My friend wanted him to get on TRT because he's a walking skeleton with no masculinity. I recommended against it because he's got many other issues that are more foundational. Regardless, the redneck's response was "well, then I would have to keep doing it and become dependent?"

I responded, are you going to stop brushing your teeth? They're going to just get dirty again tomorrow? His response was, he would just use pine needles. Still cleaning his teeth, don't think he understood. He also snorts pains pills, which he is literally dependent on.

If SHTF, I would adapt and overcome. You don't die when you run out of exogenous testosterone. It restores overtime and faster with certain compounds. Also, most disasters two weeks is all that's needed before order is restored.

Nothing about doing more than the bare minimum in life is correlated with a feminist. That would be like me saying you sound like a nigger because you disagree with me.
"You don't die when you run out of exogenous testosterone. It restores overtime and faster with certain compounds. Also, most disasters two weeks is all that's needed before order is restored." No, it doesn't always do that. Where are you getting this? 20-year olds who abuse might be able to get back to normal if they don't abuse it for long but they can also be screwed for life.
Don't need it, then don't use it.
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
There is nothing wrong with using a tool at your disposal to improve your life. The issue here is the “steroids” boogeyman and guys thinking it gives another guy a leg up on them so they have to compensate by admonishing it. It’s a lot deeper than the surface here.

If I made a thread about moisturizer, zinc and sunscreen I wonder if it would get the same reaction. Actually we have one which is pages and pages long. What it’s not the same thing because it’s not a needle? That’s the reasoning I see here….
Yes, and what about DHEA? An unregulated hormone supplement available OTC. I use it. I try to stay about 2/3 (uh oh, 0.666) of the top of the range. Just in case. You can get pregnenolone as a skin cream too. What if my wife wants estrogen later in life? We will do what is best for her.
 

FrancisK

Kingfisher
Gold Member
Yes, and what about DHEA? An unregulated hormone supplement available OTC. I use it. I try to stay about 2/3 (uh oh, 0.666) of the top of the range. Just in case. You can get pregnenolone as a skin cream too. What if my wife wants estrogen later in life? We will do what is best for her.

What about vitamins? I know everyone here loves their zinc.

Mosturizer?

Sunscreen?

Ever had any dental work done?

Ever done anything for acne?

How about getting a mole removed?

How about soap?

Shampoo?


Toothpaste?!

Do you shave?!

How far do you want to take this? What else needs to be admonished because it’s synthetic or not essential?

Is it the fact that it’s in a syringe that makes it a bad thing, so if it’s not an injection is that okay? So do you have a problem with diabetics using insulin?


I would dissuade anyone as much as I could if they asked me about testosterone, they would need to check a lot of boxes before I told them to go for it or even talked with them about it but the idea to just completely dismiss it as doing something wrong is indicative of something deeper. There is a root cause of that and it has nothing to do with the will of god or someone’s personal beliefs….thats an excuse to feel the way you do about it without admitting what it truly is.

To say it’s something that shouldn’t be toyed with or done casually then yes I 100% agree but to say it’s something “wrong” is hypocritical willful ignorance.

And I’ll say it again, that oil in the barrel is not going to turn a weak man into a strong man. That’s something you have to do yourself, it’s just an aid like everything else I listed up there.
 
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Unfortunatelty these days with all the stuff they put in our food, and with all the horrible pharmaceuticals they prescribe to boys that haven't even hit puberty yet, TRT is necessary for many men. Plus, there are genetic medical conditions like Klinefelter's that actually do make TRT necessary as well as various injuries that can cause low T. Even diabetes can lower T levels. Maybe if they made organic food affordable for everyone and not just millionaires and maybe if they made it illegal to prescribe 99% of medications to minors there would be less of a need for TRT but for many men it truly is necessary unfortunately. Also men born to older mothers tend to have lower testosterone and higher estrogen levels than men born to younger mothers so maybe encouraging women to marry and begin having children younger and making it illegal for married women and women under 35 to work outside the home would also reduce the need for TRT. But as a survivor of pharmaceutical malpractice I have to take a daily estrogen inhibitor to prevent my testosterone from converting to estrogen though I pray every day that God cures me and have been praying for a cure every day for the last 5 years but so far God has refused to cure me though I still have hope that someday he'll have enough compassion to say yes to my prayers. Compassion was more common in Nazi Germany than it is anywhere on planet earth at this time. And I was a minor when these "medications" were prescribed and was never informed of the risks until the "medications" had already ruined my life and my family threw me away like a piece of trash and left me to die before I was finally warned of the risks. And it was my family who wanted me on these medications, not me, and they ruthlessly punished me growing up when I even questioned them about whether I needed the "medications". So in a perfect world TRT would be unneccessary but in the clown world we live where evil men and even worse evil women, control everything and almost no good man has any power or authority over anything whatsoever, TRT will be necessary until God decides to intervene and cure the many men whose bodies have been ruined by a laundry list of factors they have little to no control over in addition to removing any authority wicked people have over good men
 

Carolus

Pigeon
You sound like my redneck friend who refuses to do anything to get himself out of his mom's house. He does the bare minimum in life.

My friend wanted him to get on TRT because he's a walking skeleton with no masculinity. I recommended against it because he's got many other issues that are more foundational. Regardless, the redneck's response was "well, then I would have to keep doing it and become dependent?"

I responded, are you going to stop brushing your teeth? They're going to just get dirty again tomorrow? His response was, he would just use pine needles. Still cleaning his teeth, don't think he understood. He also snorts pains pills, which he is literally dependent on.

If SHTF, I would adapt and overcome. You don't die when you run out of exogenous testosterone. It restores overtime and faster with certain compounds. Also, most disasters two weeks is all that's needed before order is restored.

Nothing about doing more than the bare minimum in life is correlated with a feminist. That would be like me saying you sound like a nigger because you disagree with me.

Advocating people not take TRT when nothing is wrong with them = advocating leading a bare minimum life.

This is comical hyperbole.
 

FrancisK

Kingfisher
Gold Member
And you wonder where the "little dick syndrome" saying comes from.

Sorry guys, Roosh is right.

Are you actually ignorant enough to believe that testosterone makes your penis smaller? Or did you just really want to use the term “little dick syndrome”?
 
Is any of you has been taking Clomid for longer period of time? (I haveeb looking into this. I am only two years younger than Roosh)
Anecdotal evidence, I know...but I am curious about experiences with log-term use of Clomil to improve testosterone levels.
1. how long have you been taking it?
2. What sortof improvement have you experienced?
3. Side effects, if you have experienced any.
4. For how long do you want to take Clomid?
 
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NickK

Woodpecker
Orthodox
What about vitamins? I know everyone here loves their zinc.

Mosturizer?

Sunscreen?

Ever had any dental work done?

Ever done anything for acne?

How about getting a mole removed?

How about soap?

Shampoo?


Toothpaste?!

Do you shave?!

How far do you want to take this? What else needs to be admonished because it’s synthetic or not essential?
All of these things, mate. Sorry. We are fallen people. The fact that all of us here use some or all these things does not make them good.
We have to admit that we are victims of the culture. We shouldn't propagandizing them as good.

Modern culture will add something to that list every 5 years. The least we can do is not accept the new thing in our lives and limit our damages.
 

DanielH

Pelican
Orthodox
What about vitamins? I know everyone here loves their zinc.
Grow your own food or just eat healthy and its not necessary
Mosturizer?
Not necessary. In extreme cases olive oil can be used, add some beeswax to make a balm.
Sunscreen?
Get a tan or use olive oil/avocado oil/coconut oil, etc. They work. Most sunscreens are carcinogenic, the most problematic chemical is usually hexanes.
Ever had any dental work done?
There's a difference between braces for cosmetic reasons and removing a rotten tooth
Ever done anything for acne?
Acne is a new thing, I'm not sure the exact cause (mix of hormones, sugar in diet, and bacterial/fungal imbalances I assume), but people before the 20th century didn't seem to ever have acne. I had really bad acne and I just powered through it for years and years.
How about getting a mole removed?
?
How about soap?

Shampoo?
Not actually necessary. Scrub with a washcloth. If you shower every day or every other day and scrub with a washcloth, you're in the top first percentile of hygiene for all humans historically. Your scalp produces oils in the appropriate amounts when it is given time to regulate itself.
Toothpaste?!
There's diets which make this unnecessary and a lot of toothpastes are mildly toxic. Can be replaced with activated charcoal or baking soda.
Do you shave?!
?
How far do you want to take this? What else needs to be admonished because it’s synthetic or not essential?
Nothing you've listed fundamentally alters your body and your mind to the tune that TRT does, and removing some of those things from your list and using the replacements I mentioned largely removes the need for TRT.
Is it the fact that it’s in a syringe that makes it a bad thing, so if it’s not an injection is that okay? So do you have a problem with diabetics using insulin?
Non sequitur. Lifesaving medicine vs. (in most cases) a drug for unnecessary purposes.
I would dissuade anyone as much as I could if they asked me about testosterone, they would need to check a lot of boxes before I told them to go for it or even talked with them about it but the idea to just completely dismiss it as doing something wrong is indicative of something deeper. There is a root cause of that and it has nothing to do with the will of god or someone’s personal beliefs….thats an excuse to feel the way you do about it without admitting what it truly is.

To say it’s something that shouldn’t be toyed with or done casually then yes I 100% agree but to say it’s something “wrong” is hypocritical willful ignorance.
In the vast majority of cases it is wrong.
And I’ll say it again, that oil in the barrel is not going to turn a weak man into a strong man. That’s something you have to do yourself, it’s just an aid like everything else I listed up there.
A woman cannot become strong like a man, just like someone with natural levels of testosterone cannot become strong like someone with extremely elevated levels. Most of us here (I assume) have plateau'ed at the gym and know our body's maximum natural potential. I know what I can lift without drugs from spending 5 days a week in a gym focusing on strength training, and I could probably only get a small percentage higher without spending my entire non-working life in the gym.

I'm not trying to say this to be a jerk and my response isn't even targeted to you per se, it's more directed towards people who think the only way to live is with cosmetics, chemicals, and supplements that were unknown to most of humanity throughout the millennia we've been around. I don't have anything against anyone using those things/services listed, and I use some of those things you listed. Each thing by itself is only a minor issue, but the cumulative effect of all of them is part of why men are rapidly becoming infertile and weak. We can fix the cause of this without resorting to intentionally altering our body.
 
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FrancisK

Kingfisher
Gold Member
Grow your own food or just eat healthy and its not necessary

Not necessary. In extreme cases olive oil can be used, add some beeswax to make a balm.

Get a tan or use olive oil/avocado oil/coconut oil, etc. They work. Most sunscreens are carcinogenic, the most problematic chemical is usually hexanes.

There's a difference between braces for cosmetic reasons and removing a rotten tooth

Acne is a new thing, I'm not sure the exact cause (mix of hormones, sugar in diet, and bacterial/fungal imbalances I assume), but people before the 20th century didn't seem to ever have acne. I had really bad acne and I just powered through it for years and years.

?

Not actually necessary. Scrub with a washcloth. If you shower every day or every other day and scrub with a washcloth, you're in the top first percentile of hygiene for all humans historically. Your scalp produces oils in the appropriate amounts when it is given time to regulate itself.

There's diets which make this unnecessary and a lot of toothpastes are mildly toxic. Can be replaced with activated charcoal or baking soda.

?

Nothing you've listed fundamentally alters your body and your mind to the tune that TRT does, and removing some of those things from your list and using the replacements I mentioned largely removes the need for TRT.

Non sequitur. Lifesaving medicine vs. (in most cases) a drug for unnecessary purposes.

In the vast majority of cases it is wrong.

A woman cannot become strong like a man, just like someone with natural levels of testosterone cannot become strong like someone with extremely elevated levels. Most of us here (I assume) have plateau'ed at the gym and know our body's maximum natural potential. I know what I can lift without drugs from spending 5 days a week in a gym focusing on strength training, and I could probably only get a small percentage higher without spending my entire non-working life in the gym.

I'm not trying to say this to be a jerk and my response isn't even targeted to you per se, it's more directed towards people who think the only way to live is with cosmetics, chemicals, and supplements that were unknown to most of humanity throughout the millennia we've been around. I don't have anything against anyone using those things/services listed, and I use some of those things you listed. Each thing by itself is only a minor issue, but the cumulative effect of all of them is part of why men are rapidly becoming infertile and weak. We can fix the cause of this without resorting to intentionally altering our body.

So Daniel are you saying you don’t use or do any of those things and you would judge someone who does?
 

FrancisK

Kingfisher
Gold Member
Is any of you has been taking Clomid for longer period of time? (I haveeb looking into this. I am only two years younger than Roosh)
Anecdotal evidence, I know...but I am curious about experiences with log-term use of Clomil to improve testosterone levels.
1. how long have you been taking it?
2. What sortof improvement have you experienced?
3. Side effects, if you have experienced any.
4. For how long do you want to take Clomid?

There is a whole thread specifically about that, do a search.
 
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