TRT Is Like Botox For Men

Maximizing testosterone is not going to achieve a state of perpetual pleasure. Anyone on TRT can vouch for that. It isn't about pleasure, it is about health and wellbeing.

Self control is the command regardless of testosterone level or sexual deprivation. It's just better to be married and have sex. 1 Corinthians 7.

I like your post. Just know that TRT will more than likely drop your sperm count to zero by dropping your FSH (Follicle Stimulating Hormone) to zero as well. Yes, you can add HCG (Human Chorionic Gonadotropin) to help with intratesticular testosterone production but at 39, unlike somone in their 20s, there is a better than not chance you will become infertile.

You could just take fertility doses of HCG which will increase your testosterone significantly, but you'll have to take an aromotase inhibitor most likely.

You could also take the very inexpensive Clomid which will boost your T even more than HCG. When I was trying to give my wife a baby, (Clomid is a fertility med too), it got my testosterone level to 1000 ng/dl and I was in my 50s, so that works. Be warned here that it could cause extremely high levels of SHBG (Sex Hormone Binding Globulin) and make your free T levels at the bottom of the range.
Thanks for your reply. In true , honesty , taking Clomid is far as I would be willing to go. (I am glad to hear than worked for you.) Obviously , we still have to weight up the potential risks and benefits.
 

Hannibal

Ostrich
Gold Member
Smaller meals, five times a day. Lean meat (mostly chicken, sometimes beef) , plenty of fresh fruit and vegetables. I cannot consume diary. Try to minimize unnecessary amounts of carbohydrates (especially sugar.) I also drink plenty of water.
No alcohol or coffee.

I see few issues. The only things I would change, would be to fast once a week for 24 hours permanently, and to see what happens when you eat more fatty meats and less fruits and vegetables, maybe for a month. Looks quite healthy other than that.
 

Vigilant

Kingfisher
Woman
Yes 100%. And this basically agrees with Tibetan medicine and other ancient techniques. Also Stress, mainly ignored unawares underlying emotional stress, severely affects stomach acid and the liver, damaging the digestive process. Stress also wrecks the endocrine system, hormones and such. As Roosh was saying modern life is a process of anaesthetising this stress in Modern Life is a Managed Terror. But if ignored, it comes to get you eventually, usually way before your natural time.
The only healthy stress is to fear God.

Health means salvation, so physical health is a manifestation of salvation in Christ.

It also means that the more consistent our working out our salvation in fear and trembling is, the more consistent our physical health will be.

12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
Phil 2:12


The broad road of too little stress or too much stress can be unhealthy, but the narrow road of God fearing stress is optimal.
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
Thanks for your reply. In true , honesty , taking Clomid is far as I would be willing to go. (I am glad to hear than worked for you.) Obviously , we still have to weight up the potential risks and benefits.
It did raise me T level a ton on 25 mg a day, I don't think it got me fertile but I only tried it for maybe 4 months or so. My free T was way too low due to the Clomid skyrocketing the SHBG.
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
You are being dishonest and you know it. Everything sentence in the first paragraph is false and you know it. You know there are doctors in every city and modestly sized town in America who will give out prescriptions for TRT, adderall, antidepressants, and sleeping pills to almost anyone who asks for them. If you don't know this is true, wake up.

I personally know men in their early 30s on TRT prescribed by a doctor who had healthy T levels and are taking it to boost their performance in the gym.

There is a difference between something being true in principle and something being true in fact. The principle does not matter if it is not practiced and the slippery slope is the undefeated champion.
Testosterone is not of the devil like some here suppose. Low testosterone is not a healthy condition to be in. If a man would rather be unhealthy and sickly, and his wife is okay that, knock yourself out, but first ask God what is best for you.


Abstract
Epidemiological studies have found that men with low or low normal endogenous testosterone are at an increased risk of mortality than those with higher levels. Cardiovascular disease accounts for the greater proportion of deaths in those with low testosterone. Cancer and respiratory deaths in some of the studies are also significantly more prevalent. Disease-specific studies have identified that there are higher mortality rates in men with cardiovascular, respiratory and renal diseases, type 2 diabetes and cancer with low testosterone. Obesity, metabolic syndrome, type 2 diabetes, cardiovascular disease and inflammatory disorders are all associated with an increased prevalence of testosterone deficiency. Two major questions that arise from these findings are (1) is testosterone deficiency directly involved in the pathogenesis of these conditions and/or a contributory factor impairing the body's natural defences or is it merely a biomarker of ill health and the severity of underlying disease process? (2) Does testosterone replacement therapy retard disease progression and ultimately enhance the clinical prognosis and survival? This review will discuss the current state of knowledge and discuss whether or not there are any answers to either of these questions. There is convincing evidence that low testosterone is a biomarker for disease severity and mortality. Testosterone deficiency is associated with adverse effects on certain cardiovascular risk factors that when combined could potentially promote atherosclerosis. The issue of whether or not testosterone replacement therapy improves outcomes is controversial. Two retrospective studies in men with diagnosed hypogonadism with or without type 2 diabetes have reported significantly improved survival.
 

FactusIRX

Kingfisher
Jokes aside, I did my first cycle of TRT when I got sick and my T level dropped by 40% in two years. For reference, it's supposed to drop about 1% a year at my age. You better believe I felt that 40% difference and getting on even a relatively low dose, just to bring myself back to what I'd been at before, felt like the difference between my proper age and being 80. If there's a "plus side" to that experience, I know what it's like to feel old - at least in certain respects - and it's honestly not that bad, or wouldn't be if I was actually old. So when I am actually old, if it's God will for me to make it that long, it won't be too much of a surprise to feel that "gentle." It's actually very peaceful, I'm just too young to want to feel that way all day.
I was thinking of you when I made my first post that I didn't completely agree with Roosh. Where there's a serious medical issue like this, then TRT is useful. Hypogonadism is a real illness and testosterone can help with that illness. However, the vast majority of men don't use it for this reason. I would hazard to guess that other than you and I believe, the user BMW, no one uses it treat hypogonadism. It's not different that than the fact that the vast majority of opiate addicts don't shoot heroin because they are having surgery.

The vast majority of young men and, now, women use it for vanity. They use it to have bigger muscles. They use it to make their lifts heavier. They use it because it gives them energy and pleasure. I know this is true because I fell in the same trap. I was insecure about my physique or how I don't have enough energy, and despite being in the "normal range" for testosterone, I purchased testosterone on the black market. I used it once, and immediately noticed an increase in energy, concentration, strength, and virility. I felt alive. That's a drug. I pray to God that he provides me the strength not to use it again because it has a stronger pull than alcohol, weed, drugs, or porn.

Many of these young men that use testosterone eventually use other steroids because, like all drugs, your body builds a dependence to it. There was a good post on this very forum of a user that explained how guys that start with testosterone rarely end with it. Once you feel the increase in vitality and strength, you want more, so you up your dosage, and when that doesn't give you the same "high", you use other steroids.

It's also the case that if you supplement with testosterone as a young men and you try and come off, your body will go through withdrawals, not unlike opiate withdrawal. If you do it long enough, it will permanently damage your body and alter your ability to produce your own testosterone. Again, not that different from heroin, which will permanently change your brain's serotonin receptors.

Older men use testosterone because they are afraid of aging. They are afraid of death and decay. They don't "like" that they don't have the same energy and vitality that they had as a young men. That's not fair, they say. That's no different than a woman using plastic surgery. It's quite interesting to watch these men mock women that panic when they hit the "wall," but they themselves cannot deal with the same existential panic of aging..

On a final note, I was at the gym today. The amount of men in their twenties that are ravaged by steroids is incredible. They are very easy to spot. They are generally very fat. They are all balding, with some of them trying to hide it with ballcaps. They look 15 years older than they are because steroids are great at aging you (in an ironic, Faustian bargain). Without God, they must find meaning in their physical bodies.
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
I was thinking of you when I made my first post that I didn't completely agree with Roosh. Where there's a serious medical issue like this, then TRT is useful. Hypogonadism is a real illness and testosterone can help with that illness. However, the vast majority of men don't use it for this reason. I would hazard to guess that other than you and I believe, the user BMW, no one uses it treat hypogonadism. It's not different that than the fact that the vast majority of opiate addicts don't shoot heroin because they are having surgery.

The vast majority of young men and, now, women use it for vanity. They use it to have bigger muscles. They use it to make their lifts heavier. They use it because it gives them energy and pleasure. I know this is true because I fell in the same trap. I was insecure about my physique or how I don't have enough energy, and despite being in the "normal range" for testosterone, I purchased testosterone on the black market. I used it once, and immediately noticed an increase in energy, concentration, strength, and virility. I felt alive. That's a drug. I pray to God that he provides me the strength not to use it again because it has a stronger pull than alcohol, weed, drugs, or porn.

Many of these young men that use testosterone eventually use other steroids because, like all drugs, your body builds a dependence to it. There was a good post on this very forum of a user that explained how guys that start with testosterone rarely end with it. Once you feel the increase in vitality and strength, you want more, so you up your dosage, and when that doesn't give you the same "high", you use other steroids.

It's also the case that if you supplement with testosterone as a young men and you try and come off, your body will go through withdrawals, not unlike opiate withdrawal. If you do it long enough, it will permanently damage your body and alter your ability to produce your own testosterone. Again, not that different from heroin, which will permanently change your brain's serotonin receptors.

Older men use testosterone because they are afraid of aging. They are afraid of death and decay. They don't "like" that they don't have the same energy and vitality that they had as a young men. That's not fair, they say. That's no different than a woman using plastic surgery. It's quite interesting to watch these men mock women that panic when they hit the "wall," but they themselves cannot deal with the same existential panic of aging..

On a final note, I was at the gym today. The amount of men in their twenties that are ravaged by steroids is incredible. They are very easy to spot. They are generally very fat. They are all balding, with some of them trying to hide it with ballcaps. They look 15 years older than they are because steroids are great at aging you (in an ironic, Faustian bargain). Without God, they must find meaning in their physical bodies.
"Older men use testosterone because they are afraid of aging. They are afraid of death and decay. They don't "like" that they don't have the same energy and vitality that they had as a young men." Is there something wrong with that? Do you have a Bible verse that condemns the use of testosterone? I'll just say it, this is legalistic.
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
I was thinking of you when I made my first post that I didn't completely agree with Roosh. Where there's a serious medical issue like this, then TRT is useful. Hypogonadism is a real illness and testosterone can help with that illness. However, the vast majority of men don't use it for this reason. I would hazard to guess that other than you and I believe, the user BMW, no one uses it treat hypogonadism. It's not different that than the fact that the vast majority of opiate addicts don't shoot heroin because they are having surgery.

The vast majority of young men and, now, women use it for vanity. They use it to have bigger muscles. They use it to make their lifts heavier. They use it because it gives them energy and pleasure. I know this is true because I fell in the same trap. I was insecure about my physique or how I don't have enough energy, and despite being in the "normal range" for testosterone, I purchased testosterone on the black market. I used it once, and immediately noticed an increase in energy, concentration, strength, and virility. I felt alive. That's a drug. I pray to God that he provides me the strength not to use it again because it has a stronger pull than alcohol, weed, drugs, or porn.

Many of these young men that use testosterone eventually use other steroids because, like all drugs, your body builds a dependence to it. There was a good post on this very forum of a user that explained how guys that start with testosterone rarely end with it. Once you feel the increase in vitality and strength, you want more, so you up your dosage, and when that doesn't give you the same "high", you use other steroids.

It's also the case that if you supplement with testosterone as a young men and you try and come off, your body will go through withdrawals, not unlike opiate withdrawal. If you do it long enough, it will permanently damage your body and alter your ability to produce your own testosterone. Again, not that different from heroin, which will permanently change your brain's serotonin receptors.

Older men use testosterone because they are afraid of aging. They are afraid of death and decay. They don't "like" that they don't have the same energy and vitality that they had as a young men. That's not fair, they say. That's no different than a woman using plastic surgery. It's quite interesting to watch these men mock women that panic when they hit the "wall," but they themselves cannot deal with the same existential panic of aging..

On a final note, I was at the gym today. The amount of men in their twenties that are ravaged by steroids is incredible. They are very easy to spot. They are generally very fat. They are all balding, with some of them trying to hide it with ballcaps. They look 15 years older than they are because steroids are great at aging you (in an ironic, Faustian bargain). Without God, they must find meaning in their physical bodies.
The Bible tells us to glorify God in our bodies and in our spirit, which are God's. Where does the Bible say someone is not allowed to use testosterone which is naturally occuring in men and women (not sure I would call it a drug anymore than your own blood), in order to improve their health?

Doctor-I have bad news for you. You have cancer, Can I start you on chemotherapy?
Patient (chuckles and grins) hehehehe no doc, no problem, when it's time it's time, I will just try to enjoy my inevitable decline and be thankful.
Doctor-You don't want me to help you live longer?
Patient-Of course not. I have had a good 30 years.
 

get2choppaaa

Pelican
On a final note, I was at the gym today. The amount of men in their twenties that are ravaged by steroids is incredible. They are very easy to spot. They are generally very fat. They are all balding, with some of them trying to hide it with ballcaps. They look 15 years older than they are because steroids are great at aging you (in an ironic, Faustian bargain). Without God, they must find meaning in their physical bodies.
I am a little confused... "ravaged by steroids" yet generally very fat? Do you mean they abused them when they were young and are older now?

Back before I got my home gym and focused on powerlifting I saw a lot of folks abusing roids for sure who were in their 20's/30's... but I usually see red skin/jaundiced looking eyes as symptoms of chronic use due to the hepatoxicity and high hematocrit... not so much being fat. Also the bald thing is not necessarily a sign of steroid use. Being bald is a product of DHT conversion and genetic predisposition. If you're gonna go bald, testosterone and steroids just hasten the effect, but you're still gonna go bald regardless.

Your point about starting with T and adding more than that is no doubt true... this happens a lot with people who go from seeking a health/medical benefit to becoming focused on appearance/not having the ability to exercise logic/self control and it is a valid criticism. It can easily be a vanity gateway drug to more, and you can absolutely find doctors via TRT clinics that with help you throw the kitchen sink into your body for the money they make off of it.

edited to add the following article specifically addressing the higher doses of "TRT" that some folks are doing.

 
Last edited:

Carolus

Pigeon
Testosterone is not of the devil like some here suppose. Low testosterone is not a healthy condition to be in. If a man would rather be unhealthy and sickly, and his wife is okay that, knock yourself out, but first ask God what is best for you.

The dishonesty and self-deception here is palpable. Hyperbole, straw men, conflations, and nonsense – and in just 3 sentences. The objection is to taking TRT to counteract natural aging despite healthy T levels, yet you pretend the objection is to taking TRT in someone like Witcoff's case. No one said testosterone is the devil except you. Most men in their 40s, 50s, and 60s who are unhealthy are unhealthy for reasons that has nothing to do with T levels but due to poor diet and lack of exercise. Most men in those ages who eat well and get regular exercise are perfectly healthy and energetic.

I hope those reading who are considering TRT just because they are 40 see the weakness, twisted logic, and hamstering going on here and take heed.

"Older men use testosterone because they are afraid of aging..." Is there something wrong with that? Do you have a Bible verse that condemns the use of testosterone? I'll just say it, this is legalistic.
Read the title of Roosh's article and reread what you wrote.

If you and choppaaa want to be dependent on pharmaceutical companies for the rest of your lives, go ahead. But don't try to get other men to become dependent on them to make yourselves feel better. Even if you get everyone else to do it too, that doesn't make it okay. You're both acting like women. Seems like all that extra T hasn't helped as much as you think.
 

GWYW2015

Woodpecker
Orthodox
The dishonesty and self-deception here is palpable. Hyperbole, straw men, conflations, and nonsense – and in just 3 sentences. The objection is to taking TRT to counteract natural aging despite healthy T levels, yet you pretend the objection is to taking TRT in someone like Witcoff's case. No one said testosterone is the devil except you. Most men in their 40s, 50s, and 60s who are unhealthy are unhealthy for reasons that has nothing to do with T levels but due to poor diet and lack of exercise. Most men in those ages who eat well and get regular exercise are perfectly healthy and energetic.

I hope those reading who are considering TRT just because they are 40 see the weakness, twisted logic, and hamstering going on here and take heed.


Read the title of Roosh's article and reread what you wrote.

If you and choppaaa want to be dependent on pharmaceutical companies for the rest of your lives, go ahead. But don't try to get other men to become dependent on them to make yourselves feel better. Even if you get everyone else to do it too, that doesn't make it okay. You're both acting like women. Seems like all that extra T hasn't helped as much as you think.
"TRT is like Botox for Men". That is the title. Botox for cosmetic purposes is not condemned in the Bible either. Do you think that actors aren't going to use it, people that make a living on screen? So what if they do. It's none of my business why anyone would use botox for their appearance. No reason for me to judge their motives.

TRT is not necessarily always for vanity, I know you aren't going to get a prescription from a trustworthy doctor because you have vanity and he can't legally give it to you for that either. TRT can extend your life and make it better. Botox, I don't know, you tell me.

Some Christian men have a mature conscience and can go on testosterone if they choose to, while others are forbidden by their conscience.

What is your deal against testosterone? If you take a deeper look, TRT is nothing at all like Botox.
 

get2choppaaa

Pelican
The dishonesty and self-deception here is palpable. Hyperbole, straw men, conflations, and nonsense – and in just 3 sentences. The objection is to taking TRT to counteract natural aging despite healthy T levels, yet you pretend the objection is to taking TRT in someone like Witcoff's case. No one said testosterone is the devil except you. Most men in their 40s, 50s, and 60s who are unhealthy are unhealthy for reasons that has nothing to do with T levels but due to poor diet and lack of exercise. Most men in those ages who eat well and get regular exercise are perfectly healthy and energetic.

I hope those reading who are considering TRT just because they are 40 see the weakness, twisted logic, and hamstering going on here and take heed.


Read the title of Roosh's article and reread what you wrote.

If you and choppaaa want to be dependent on pharmaceutical companies for the rest of your lives, go ahead. But don't try to get other men to become dependent on them to make yourselves feel better. Even if you get everyone else to do it too, that doesn't make it okay. You're both acting like women. Seems like all that extra T hasn't helped as much as you think.
Bro... I hear you...I dont really care if others do it or not. I think most dudes who are in their 40s or later would have health benefits by getting a supervised and motored testosterone therapy program provided their T is dropping (which after 35 is where this occurs for most* men for some men, maybe that age is younger, for others later ) Ultimately it is a choice you make that should be well informed and not based off some idea that taking T is going to alter your life and your way of thinking if you're 20 years old ect... T isn't some panacea to fix a weak mind/weak body, it will help with some things in your mental state, but in the end taking T isnt going to turn you into some sort of Chad in and of itself.

It really comes down to people's motives as far as I see. I read the whole article's point is this : "Are your actions and choices oriented toward vanity or toward promoting God?" I think that is a very valid question that is particular to many aspects of behavior beyond purely drug use.

If you're going to do this for purely vanity... I think it isn't a good idea and I strongly recommend against it. But IF you're motives are based off of a legitimate reasoning for mental/physical health/longevity ect... and you have maturity and restraint to not abuse this medicine then I am failing to see where the rub lies. This seems to be being made into a false dichotomy of "IF you do this THEN you're wrong" instead of "IF you do this for XXX bad reasoning THEN you're motivations are not pure and you're in the wrong."

I am less of a direct proponent and more of a realist about it, who is operating under the assumption that men who are going to go down that road understand the benfit/cost ratio, are educated, and mature. I understand that is not many people also. For them, I would say stay away.
 
I don't see where I've been emotional. I'm not convincing myself here, I'm just presenting the other side of the coin.

I do genuinely appreciate the comment about discussing with my priest.

But my point across all the posts is that we should not disregard positive health benefits of something that many many men would benefit from and stated that there needed to be a medical need. When i said all folks in their 40s.... I'm assuming that the previous condition of medical necessity being true. If that wasn't enumerated then I'll clarify that.

I'm gonna bow out on this now as I've made the point.
There are ways for you to bounce back if you get off of it without suffering the withdrawal effects. Certain temporary pharmaceuticals have shown (since you like those studies) proven transitional smoothness from getting off TRT to eventually managing higher T-levels nominally without any exogenous drugs, but your adrenal system and your body's hormonal alacrity may suffer initially depending on how long you were on the dosages. I won't be referencing drugs here in the public, but I can share with you through DM a long-term dosage program I considered before deciding not to go on TRT and go my naturopathic route instead.

It really isn't a good idea to give your balls to a doctor too, they could jack up the price and put you in testicular slavery lest you wither and weaken. Always so many control mechanisms to keep high-energy alpha men down... got to think long term beyond system control.
 

MichaelWitcoff

Ostrich
Orthodox
I'm at a 0% risk of going from TRT to anabolic steroids given that my tolerance for exogenous T caps out at around 100mg/week. Any more than that and I start to turn back into my old self, the self that got into constant fights with people and couldn't hold down a job. In fact when I started my second "cycle" if you will, I asked to be on a dose 40mg/week lower than I had ended the previous one. The guy who gives me the shots is on 200mg himself and I have no idea how he can handle that much without bouncing off the walls, but maybe I'm just hypersensitive to the effects of testosterone. In either case I don't want to be at a level above 800 ng/dl or so, which steroids would certainly put me well past.
 

Carolus

Pigeon
blah blah blah. Botox for cosmetic purposes is not condemned in the Bible either. blah blah blah. It's none of my business why anyone would use botox for their appearance. No reason for me to judge their motives.

blah blah blah

Yep, let's all just live and let live, man. As long as it's not hurting other people, man. It's none of my business what two consenting adults do in their own bedroom, man. Why can't two people who love each other get married, man? Don't be judgemental, man. The age of consent is that low in some countries anyway, man. No reason to judge their motives, man. Sarah said the antidepressants helped her and her experience is valid, man.

And that's why it's called the slippery slope.

What is your deal against testosterone? If you take a deeper look, TRT is nothing at all like Botox.
I haven't said anything against testosterone. It's just that you apparently can't separate testosterone from unnecessary TRT.

I dont really care if others do it or not.
Then don't promote it on a men's forum. I sin all the time, but I don't try to get others involved or promote it.
 

get2choppaaa

Pelican
Then don't promote it on a men's forum. I sin all the time, but I don't try to get others involved or promote it.
Thanks guy. Noted on your 5th post. It is understood that we all sin all the time. Also, it is not really a purely men's forum anymore, as you will note there are women involved to include in this thread..

You've been a bit over the top in your selective characterization of mine and other's comments. Its quite frankly disingenuous to take one sentence of my post and imply that I am doing anything other than stating my experience and perception. This is reminiscent of the types of posters from about 3-4 years ago who love gotcha type moments no matter the context. I think I've been more than contextually appropriate in the full explanation here.
 

Carolus

Pigeon
Thanks guy. Noted on your 5th post. It is understood that we all sin all the time.
Cheap attack to try to undermine credibility.
Also, it is not really a purely men's forum anymore, as you will note there are women involved to include in this thread..
Cheap 'gotcha' attempt.
You've been a bit over the top in your selective characterization of mine and other's comments.
I haven't been selectively characterizing anything and I haven't been over the top. You are over the top and making huge claims. I've pointed out that your position is an extreme one and leads to extreme problems. Stating that every man in his 40s should be on TRT is an extreme position. It is no different than all the quack doctors saying that every man over 35 should take statins and every young woman should be on birth control. But you can try to pretend you're just making a modest proposal all you want. I hope others reading this see through it.

I've also pointed out that the logic that you use to defend taking TRT to counteract natural aging is the same as has been used for decades to promote other harmful practices and drugs. But mostly I've not been talking to you at all, but the other hamstering guy.

Its quite frankly disingenuous to take one sentence of my post and imply that I am doing anything other than stating my experience and perception.
You just use words and sound like a woman arguing. I'm not 'implying' anything, I'm explicitly stating. You are hamstering. You are trying to convince yourself that you are doing the right thing by encouraging others to do it. Think of an ideal life. Does it include being dependent on the corrupt modern medical establishment from the age of 40 until you die? If you're doing it, should others do it too?

The reality is that TRT has become a fad and lots of men are getting it unnecessarily. That is bad for obvious reasons. The question becomes, why is it a fad and how did this occur? The answer is people like Joe Rogan promoting it. The answer is people like you promoting it. Now look back and see how antidepressants for women became a fad. Look back and see what happened to boys in school and ritalin.

Also,"I'm just stating my experience. My experience is valid!" Are you a girl?

contextually appropriate in the full explanation here.
What... What does this mean? What would be contextually inappropriate? Are you sure there isn't estrogen in those shots you're getting?

This is my last reply to you. I think I've demonstrated to a rational observer that your positions lead to corruption and weakness. The other guy just admitted that he can't object to women injecting botox if he's defending TRT. I know I can't convince you. Because you take the stuff you are very unlikely to be capable of anything other than rationalizing why it's great. Which is, in fact, one of the main reasons why globohomo wants you to take it.
 

get2choppaaa

Pelican
Cheap attack to try to undermine credibility.

Cheap 'gotcha' attempt.

I haven't been selectively characterizing anything and I haven't been over the top. You are over the top and making huge claims. I've pointed out that your position is an extreme one and leads to extreme problems. Stating that every man in his 40s should be on TRT is an extreme position. It is no different than all the quack doctors saying that every man over 35 should take statins and every young woman should be on birth control. But you can try to pretend you're just making a modest proposal all you want. I hope others reading this see through it.

I've also pointed out that the logic that you use to defend taking TRT to counteract natural aging is the same as has been used for decades to promote other harmful practices and drugs. But mostly I've not been talking to you at all, but the other hamstering guy.


You just use words and sound like a woman arguing. I'm not 'implying' anything, I'm explicitly stating. You are hamstering. You are trying to convince yourself that you are doing the right thing by encouraging others to do it. Think of an ideal life. Does it include being dependent on the corrupt modern medical establishment from the age of 40 until you die? If you're doing it, should others do it too?

The reality is that TRT has become a fad and lots of men are getting it unnecessarily. That is bad for obvious reasons. The question becomes, why is it a fad and how did this occur? The answer is people like Joe Rogan promoting it. The answer is people like you promoting it. Now look back and see how antidepressants for women became a fad. Look back and see what happened to boys in school and ritalin.

Also,"I'm just stating my experience. My experience is valid!" Are you a girl?


What... What does this mean? What would be contextually inappropriate? Are you sure there isn't estrogen in those shots you're getting?

This is my last reply to you. I think I've demonstrated to a rational observer that your positions lead to corruption and weakness. The other guy just admitted that he can't object to women injecting botox if he's defending TRT. I know I can't convince you. Because you take the stuff you are very unlikely to be capable of anything other than rationalizing why it's great. Which is, in fact, one of the main reasons why globohomo wants you to take it.
Big Dog... I did nothing to apply any "gotcha's" .....The forum may have started on a men's forum basis 10 years ago, but I would not consider it a men's forum now considering the prevalence of women threads and posts and the focus on being Christian in nature as the superseding element in the nature of the forum (The Christian focus of which I highly approve of and appreciate)

Calling someone a woman for disagreeing for you point is not a tactic someone who is intellectually sound needs to rely on, especially considering that there are multiple women on the thread, there might be umbrage to be had here sir..... I think the appropriate clarification has been made, and the reasons for those statements/conditions were presented to clarify my position.

You kind of lose me on the Joe Rogan comment. I personally detest Joe Rogan (though his Louie Simmons interview is excellent) Joe might be on T i guess... I don't really know nor do I pay attention to him except for the occasional Alex Jones interview or Elon Musk ect.... To be honest... I was unaware that TRT had become a fad.

Bringing it back to Botox again... there are many women who use Botox for migraines, it is a commonly effective treatment, along with daith piercing's. I'm waiting on your condemnation here also?
 

Carolus

Pigeon
Bringing it back to Botox again... there are many women who use Botox for migraines, it is a commonly effective treatment
Botox for cosmetic purposes is not condemned in the Bible either. Do you think that actors aren't going to use it, people that make a living on screen? So what if they do. It's none of my business why anyone would use botox for their appearance. No reason for me to judge their motives.


And, shockingly, neither of them actually object to botox. Why? Because they're taking it and know it. And how can someone object to something that they themselves do?

And this is why globohomo wants men on TRT. Because a man on TRT has no moral authority to object to mass birth control, botox, antidepressants, adderall, ritalin for 6 year olds, or globohomo in general. After all, he's doing it too.

It looks like everyone who disagrees with my article is either on T or has tried it (and liked it). Is there anyone who disagrees with the article but has never taken it or does not plan on taking it?

Turns out the those 'disagreeing' with your article agree with it, they just think it's a good thing.
 
Last edited:
Top