What responsibility do men bear for current dating market?

[Graft]

I'll add one more thing: I definitely do my part.

Anytime a woman that I'm courting shows blatant disrespect, I send them a snapchat of my asshole to signify what they are.

I've gotten some great reactions and it definitely makes them think twice before they try it on another guy.

 

[LoveBug]

^^ Hilarious Graft. If you literally do that

 

[Tikimalore]

The problem is the thirst of the men. They throw their thirst/attention at women so all women think they are super attratictive. That leads to a downward spiral of womens attractiveness. Men are responsible in that way. Stop giving women who dont deserve it your thirst.

Plus, in western countries there are more available men than women because of immigration. When I go to club in my hometown, there are german man, german woman and foreign man.

 

[The Stronger Sex]

I am not forcing a false dichotomy. I do not claim that homely and obese women are somehow made of superior moral fiber. They are not.

There is the matter, however, that they haven't been showered in as much attention their whole lives, and so may be less entitled.

It can go both ways. They can also be bitter, and their appearance can also partially be a consequence of her personality, e.g. obesity, unkemptness, tattoos, short hair...

Some of the sweetest girls I've met were gorgeous. Some of the biggest harpies are physically hideous (see feminists).

 

[The Stronger Sex]

If I’m going to be in a relationship, I’m going to be with the prettiest, most pleasant girl I can find.

I hope you're doing this in a third world village. This works in the provincial Philippines, Vietnam, rural Peru, parts of Africa, etc. If you're going this route in the modern west, you're asking for trouble.

That's self-pitying black pill talk. "If you want a good girl you better go to the remotest village in deep Amazonia".

 

[questor70]

True, but there's a kernel of truth to it. I am still waiting for the first real success story from anyone on this forum to prove that happily ever after is achievable.

 

[Oscar Henri]

 

[aeroektar]

True, but there's a kernel of truth to it. I am still waiting for the first real success story from anyone on this forum to prove that happily ever after is achievable.

There's been multiple accounts of happily married men here, recently even. Did you honestly not know that or are you choosing to ignore it for some reason?

Also, why would you wait to hear it from the internet? Most men here are here to get advice to achieve what they want, or increasingly refuse to do anything actionable and instead bitch and moan. Few happy people go on the internet to tell the world, they're busy living life.

 

[questor70]

There's been multiple accounts of happily married men here, recently even.

Link? And what is the age of these marriages? Recent? In this dating market?

Few happy people go on the internet to tell the world, they're busy living life.

You pay attention to advice when it seems like the people giving advice have put it into action and it worked for them.

In the OLD forum, people gained rep points because their notch counts seemed credible. This was true starting with Roosh himself who injected his books full of personal anecdotes. He wasn't just handing down dogma. It was field-tested.

This is no longer the case. Threads like this exist because it's totally reasonable to ask whether having ideals actually works in a debased cultural environment.

So I ask, who out there has put these new ideals into action and it worked? I'm not talking about people who have been married for decades. I'm talking about people who are now in LTRs and heading towards or recently tied the knot.

Roosh can't claim this. He's effectively starting over with a blank slate. And unless I've missed something, nobody else here can either.

I'm not saying it can't be done, but it would make sense to have a realistic view of the sexual marketplace rather than pretending things are better than they are. Nobody here is in a position to lecture other members unless they can, as Donovan Sharpe says "show the receipts".

Until then, everyone here is acting on little more than faith, which would, before the forum switch, be construed as "blue pill".

 

[Realbor]

Pay attention to what happened around 2008 when social media became popular.

 

[WombRaider]

There's been multiple accounts of happily married men here, recently even.

Link? And what is the age of these marriages? Recent? In this dating market?

Few happy people go on the internet to tell the world, they're busy living life.

You pay attention to advice when it seems like the people giving advice have put it into action and it worked for them.

In the OLD forum, people gained rep points because their notch counts seemed credible. This was true starting with Roosh himself who injected his books full of personal anecdotes. He wasn't just handing down dogma. It was field-tested.

This is no longer the case. Threads like this exist because it's totally reasonable to ask whether having ideals actually works in a debased cultural environment.

So I ask, who out there has put these new ideals into action and it worked? I'm not talking about people who have been married for decades. I'm talking about people who are now in LTRs and heading towards or recently tied the knot.

Roosh can't claim this. He's effectively starting over with a blank slate. And unless I've missed something, nobody else here can either.

I'm not saying it can't be done, but it would make sense to have a realistic view of the sexual marketplace rather than pretending things are better than they are. Nobody here is in a position to lecture other members unless they can, as Donovan Sharpe says "show the receipts".

Until then, everyone here is acting on little more than faith, which would, before the forum switch, be construed as "blue pill".

^Facts

 

[Leonard D Neubache]

True, but there's a kernel of truth to it. I am still waiting for the first real success story from anyone on this forum to prove that happily ever after is achievable.

Unfortunately the internet is the internet. I'll explain how replying to LTR advice on the internet works (no hate).

What do you know you're not even in an LTR!
>
What do you know!? You're not even married!
>
What do you know!? Your marriage hasn't even survived kids yet!
>
LOL. You have three kids!? The dating market is completely different now, gramps! You have no meaningful advice to offer in the current context!

Happily ever after is only proven once you get to the ever after bit, at which point someone is simply going to say "times have changed and your advice is no longer relevant."

Besides, you can't really quantify the full extent of the positives in text form anyway. It's like trying to explain to a six year old why good wine is actually really nice to drink. To them, quality or garbage, it all just tastes like vinegar.

p.s. You can apply that system above for virtually all advice. For guys giving advice on making money it goes "LOL but you're broke!, LOL you went from broke to 50k a year and you think that's impressive?, LOL you banked 100K over 5 years big deal!, LOL you think it's as easy to become a millionaire now as it was when you started 10 years ago?!"

 

[strange times]

Just two words: stop simpin'.

 

[BlastbeatCasanova]

It's pretty obvious that when men collaborate and collude, we can accomplish amazing things: pioneering new land, building incredible empires, inventing products and services that change the world. Men are vastly superior to women when working on a team in this regard.

However, men are piss poor at creating any sort of collaborative brotherhood when it comes to social dating situations, especially compared to women. I've never experienced a strange man helping me in any sort of dating situation. Women seem to go out of their way to help strangers in dating situations by cockblocking, spreading rumors, letting each other know which man is a "Creep." It's like a covert, underground sisterhood meant to protect each other. I've even tried reaching out to women's jilted ex boyfriends in order to gain intel on a situation, no response.

Unfortunately men will never be on parity with women in the dating market. Men are too individualistic to create a nationwide brotherhood.

If men decided to work together, we could create an app within weeks that provides anonymous reviews on women, estimated notch count, potential for ghost/flake/cheat, etc. We all know that if this app was created, it would be torn down in seconds-by other men, not women.

Every man for himself.

Men can collaborate on a project or a higher goal but we have always competed for women, and most men aren't willing to share. It's simply nature. I'd be down to give a guy game/improvement tips but if we were at a venue and there's one beautiful girl...Game on my friend.

I actually posited a thought experiment to a few of my bros not too long ago, it is somewhat relevant to the quoted post. You can answer it or let me know if it's just dumb:

There has been a cataclysmic event and the world population has been reduced to six people: you, five random men, and the most beautiful woman on the planet. For the sake of this thought experiment you are confined to a small island, Hunger Games style. When you see this women you feel the absolute biological pull to mate with her, and the other men feel the same. The fate and future of the human race depends on breeding with her. No one is willing to share her. Are you willing to fight and kill the other men so that your genes will live on and save the human race?

What if these men were five of your closest friends?

I say...En garde!

 

[ScannerLIV]

Why not each mate yearly? The order in which one goes first is determined by rock-paper-scissor.

One or two nerdy out of shape simps who'd have no realistic chance with her in the real world should be excluded from RPS and go last, to wait four or five years.

Woman should have no say for obvious reasons; it'd result in violence to determine the most alpha one worthy of mating. Her primitive biological being will clap with glee at six men killing one another for access to her.

Beside life would be awfully harder and boring if there were no other men to build up a new society. You'd essentially be alone with no one to communicate and facilitate ideas with. You'd have to wait at least 12 years before you get a useful member. And that's just assuming your first two born children are male.

 

[Elmore]

To be perfectly honest i would lay 95% of the blame of the situation on technology alone.

In 2010 a solid 7 who was single & wanted to meet guys would go to bars with her friends. Most men would be awkward & thirsty around her, or drunk & horrendous, & she was in a relative scarcity of suitors. Cant say how many times girls would say to me 'its great to actually have a cool conversation with a new guy in a bar'. You could get numbers and meet up to a week or so later on the back of 10 mins chat, if you played your cards right.

Now that exact same girl would not go to bars to meet guys, instead use her phone, or the orbiters in her social circle. Even if she rarely meets these guys (on tinder) she has a constant pipeline, that she can indulge on a whim. The same interaction before, IF it yielded a phone number today (which being in surplus, is significantly less likely) would have far less chance of getting answered or turning into a date.

People sperg about the political changes, but again i see them as facilitated by the modern tech & the now utterly entitled, surrounded by choice, 7 and above. Remove all that, & they would self correct.

Tl;dr
it's the technologys, stupid.

 

[griffinmill]

It's temping to fault women for the way the dating marketplace has evolved (or devolved) in the last ten years, but I'm sorry to say that men bare ultimate responsibility.

Men have always been thirsty hornballs, but now with the anonymity or perceived anonymity of the internet, the total abasement and supplication men are willingly to exhibit is nothing short of horrific, and that's to girls who aren't even that hot. The abasement and supplication reaches heights seen from space for the 8s and 9s.

Texting some random chick on Instagram to tell her you'd love to come on her feet, then texting fifteen times after enquiring about a lack of response (u not talkin 2 me babe lol xxx) is not cool and it has completely ruined things for everybody.

Men have thus created a marketplace wherein women have zero need to show any kind of loyalty or decency when they're having their ass kissed simply for existing and not having any major deformities.

 

[Castillo]

A girl no longer needs to have a conversation with a guy in a bar / anywhere else in order to get her dopamine hit, when she gets the same dopamine hit by just looking at her screen and reading the 200 messages she gets every day from guys called Chad. She doesn’t even need to get out of bed to meet a guy anymore.

 

[ScannerLIV]

Imagine how over the moon a girl would often be in the pre-internet era when a random guy, using the right game tools, charmed her, made her laughed one or two times, and had to actually make a phone calls.

She'd be curled up on bed for hours, waiting for her charismatic guy to call her, mournfully looking at her phone box. A guy she might have met in high school, cafe, college campus, anywhere.

Because back then, there was no internet and thus no red pill/game forums. So you had very few guys in the know slaying innocent lambs left and right. It is this group that made up the 10-20/90 percent rule.

That is the trade-off with technology.

Still, I think we would have been happier without internet/superficial technology today. Internet, with all of the corresponding websites/apps, alone deformed the sexual market by at least sixty percent. Add smartphone and that's another twenty percent. The rest-feminism.

BUT.....then the media knowledge would be 100 percent controlled by the corporation/ruling class and we'd have no way to verify anything. The hundreds of authors/books we'd never hear/read were it not for the internet.

At the same time....do they really improve our lives in the grand scheme of things? Does the knowledge actually enhances or hinders our own happiness? After all, relatively very people are informed or have the actual desire to be informed on anything, so being the educated few is rather moot.

We don't see people on the street anymore do we? If you get the chance, grab Los Angeles Decades Photography book at the book store/library. You're guaranteed to see swarming masses of people on the streets and at the corners of cinema, book stores, cafes, etc pre 90's. You won't find that anywhere in Los Angeles nor in US..except for Boston and New York today. Drive all day. No people. None, nada. Just a bunch on the main streets, where they also have driven to and from. It depresses me greatly and what I miss about Europe. This is because of endless entertainment and distractions provided by television (hundreds of channels), YouTube (million plus videos?), Facebook, video games, porn, and so on. Dick on Tap, otherwise known as Tinder, delivered directly to the ladies at absolutely zero cost. Even shipping is free!

So....it's hard to say......I think, overall, keeping the last two sections in mind, we'd have been better off without internet and its corresponding technologies.

 

[WombRaider]

Texting some random chick on Instagram to tell her you'd love to come on her feet, then texting fifteen times after enquiring about a lack of response (u not talkin 2 me babe lol xxx) is not cool and it has completely ruined things for everybody.

Why are you hating on my game?