Where to escape coronavirus lockdowns/tyranny?

El Draque

 
Banned
Orthodox
To use UK as an example, i know there's enough obstinate backbone there, and that demographic will not got quitely into the night. I'd just stay in UK and form contacts with other likeminded people, and brace yourself for what comes.

I think the govt are actually playing a bit of a blinder by the way they're engineering the place with such kid gloves, compared to others. This makes people falsely comfortable, and ultimately it's still going in the same direction, but in a much more sophisticated, politically savvy way.

But to jack in all your rights, and go (presumably) solo to the third world, with no contacts and serious plan right now, just seems nuts to me.
 

ginsu

Kingfisher
Other Christian
A significant component of escaping lockdowns and tyranny is money. Either you go the wilderness survival route or you try to buy your way out of things. In the best case scenario we have until 2030 before the opportunities in the west to make any kind of wealth close.

Financial literacy and which types of work ( how to ) should be discussed more. Most of things that make it hard for people trying to move to other countries could be eased with enough money thrown at it.

The process of trying to become more wealthy gives you something productive to do with your time. Which gives you less time to worry about the news. It also forces you to evolve as a person. You build valuable skills which lead to making connections with people who also have skills a network and experience moving around the world.

Either invest in living outside society, like the Amish and learn how to survive off the land or try to become more wealthy. We will all have to look our children in the eye someday to tell them how we spent our time.

You don't want to be the guy who neither learned how to survive nor made any kind of wealth when your children have 0 job opportunities and are stuck in a social credit system that doesn't allow them to progress in life.

We have been discussing where to go for nearly two years now, the perfect place doesn't exist. The list is more or less settled the only thing remaining is for us to pull the trigger.

Worry less about where to go and more about how you can become the best version of yourself.

The people that will do the best will be those who have the most to offer in service to others
 
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iop890

Peacock
Orthodox
Gold Member
Still loving Georgia personally, but I'd only really recommend it if you're Orthodox. It's probably not the best choice for a non-Orthodox covid refugee, though I'm living normally despite these new coof-passes that I still haven't been asked for, but when I factor in Orthodoxy I can't think of anywhere else I'd rather be. The Churches never closed here, and masks are not worn in church(at least at my parish) aside from one or two women.

Georgia is probably the closest you can get to a truly Orthodox country these days. Even in the capital I feel it around me constantly in subtle ways, from little traffic jams on the sidewalks in front of churches as pedestrians stop to cross themselves, to fasting menus at restaurants. This is not comparable to red-state America.

Obviously the entire country isn't devout, but I pass three or four churches on the walk to mine, and they're all packed. Not just with old women either, Liturgy today was full of young people. We have supra together after Liturgy every Sunday(Georgian Liturgy) and every other Friday/Saturday(English Vespers/Liturgy) and I'm surrounded by like-minded people, both Georgians and expats. I've never shown up in a country and had this kind of community around me this quickly, I didn't even have this kind of community around me in the US actually.
 

El Draque

 
Banned
Orthodox
Going anywhere without a) significant funds, and a way of at very least ticking over online, or b) genuine marketable skills (eg electrician, construction, established teaching skills / resume etc) is crazy, especially the way the world's going.

If you think you can turn up in BongoBongo Land and live like the white man on even 500 USD pcm i think you'll be in for a shock.

And the idea of 'living like a local' is retarded as it is dangerous. Greedy eyes will follow you, because just the lack of melonin in your skin alone will represent $$$'s, even if there are none.

The 'hey man, where you from? England!Who you like Arsenal Liverpool Manchester united?!! I love Manchester united! Where you going, you need anything, i help you! Maybe you have one dollar?!", hassle you get will continually do your head in, whilst constantly reminding you that you stick out like the proverbial, and are viewed everywhere as some sort of mark.

Maybe I'm a jaded old bigot, but that's the impression i get.
 

Pointy Elbows

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Curious about mexico myself.
Irish guy
I know a Mexican American man that is pretty based on CV and has lots of family ties in MX. He says that CV rules there can be heavy handed, but like everything in Mexico, enforcement is spotty.

He also believes there are many suitable, relatively safe places for white expats to live in MX. Some of these communities are so large that US Doctors will fly down for a week or two, then fly home. Basically, they set up a practice in the US and Mexico alike and go nomadic.

If you can do digital work, all the better. Mexico does not like foreigners taking up local good paying jobs. If you plan to enter the normie work-force, you will need an employer sponsor and gov't approval.

I'm sure with a little research you can find these places.

I still prefer Red State US any day, but Mexico is a good option, so long as you are thoughtful and keep a low profile.
 

canuckj

Woodpecker
Other Christian
A significant component of escaping lockdowns and tyranny is money. Either you go the wilderness survival route or you try to buy your way out of things. In the best case scenario we have until 2030 before the opportunities in the west to make any kind of wealth close.

Financial literacy and which types of work ( how to ) should be discussed more. Most of things that make it hard for people trying to move to other countries could be eased with enough money thrown at it.

The process of trying to become more wealthy gives you something productive to do with your time. Which gives you less time to worry about the news. It also forces you to evolve as a person. You build valuable skills which lead to making connections with people who also have skills a network and experience moving around the world.

Either invest in living outside society, like the Amish and learn how to survive off the land or try to become more wealthy. We will all have to look our children in the eye someday to tell them how we spent our time.

You don't want to be the guy who neither learned how to survive nor made any kind of wealth when your children have 0 job opportunities and are stuck in a social credit system that doesn't allow them to progress in life.

We have been discussing where to go for nearly two years now, the perfect place doesn't exist. The list is more or less settled the only thing remaining is for us to pull the trigger.

Worry less about where to go and more about how you can become the best version of yourself.

The people that will do the best will be those who have the most to offer in service to others
I think you make some good points here. For example, I hear a lot about online income but have no idea what actually works. Do you think we should start a new thread on income generating ideas, whether online or real world? I have read many books like $100 Startup and others but lack any real ideas.
 

Grow Bag

Pelican
Catholic
I think the govt are actually playing a bit of a blinder by the way they're engineering the place with such kid gloves, compared to others. This makes people falsely comfortable, and ultimately it's still going in the same direction, but in a much more sophisticated, politically savvy way.

But to jack in all your rights, and go (presumably) solo to the third world, with no contacts and serious plan right now, just seems nuts to me.
Couldn't agree more, but this is to be expected. This is Perfidious Albion, with centuries of experience in handling the great unwashed, after all. But I'm glad to be given a bit of wriggle room and the time to observe the response of those under the iron fist, so I can better prepare myself for what's coming.
 

fortyfive

Kingfisher
Other Christian
Recently, I have spoken with a friend living in one of the Baltic states, a member of the EU. He said that as unvaxxed without QR code in the phone, you can't enter more than 90% of venues here. He got a jab in the summer because Gov promised him freedom forever, (just get 2 jabs), and he wanted to travel and live normally. Like a first-class citizen with rights.

Now, during this winter to his big surprise, he found that Gov lied, and rules changed. No more freedom forever. His vaxxed status in the phone will expire at the end of January. Prolonging requires taking the third jab. And then every couple of months. Instead, he will become a second-class citizen overnight.

Is such a life worth staying there? Wouldn't be better to wash dishes somewhere in Kansas for a couple of bucks with Latinos or even pounding sand in Africa?
I don't know. Everyone needs to find his own answer to that.

Would be evil masters in the future satisfied with only jabbing slaves every 6 months and that will be all? I don't know either, but I doubt it.

In Poland and Belarus during General Government (1939-45) at some point, being a second-class citizen meant (if you wanted just survive) hiding in the woods. When found by searching squads, or ratted out by good citizens, you were shot on the spot.

And if you think, that such things couldn't be possible today, well, I know personally people who survived the same fate in former Yugoslavia in the 90s.
 

El Draque

 
Banned
Orthodox
Couldn't agree more, but this is to be expected. This is Perfidious Albion, with centuries of experience in handling the great unwashed, after all. But I'm glad to be given a bit of wriggle room and the time to observe the response of those under the iron fist, so I can better prepare myself for what's coming.

I really dont think it's in the British character at all this stuff. A lot of non Brits i think have a false assumption about the place as ultra-cucked, but in some regards it really isn't.

EG Brits absolutely do not react well to Jobsworthery, or petty officialdom. They can get chippy very quickly to the sort of things that Germanics will accept. There's a kind of ingrained individualism to the place, people want to be left alone, and have always seen them distinct to the nations that needed standing armies, and armed police forces to govern them. (ok times have changed re the latter, but i'm talking of the actual British here).

Kipling had it right in "when the Saxon began to hate". Basically people will take a lot of crap, but then when they decide on their mind, they aren't for budging. They dont flare up like the French do, it's very distinct, and i dont think i am expressing it well. But ultimately, i think people won't stand for the sort of stuff that the Aussies and NZ's are seeing. I think there's a strong non-conformist gene in the English, that is to an extent lacking its neighbouring nations in Europe. Even the so called Celtic nations of Britain.

Maybe the Irish presence in the Aussie genepool has rendered them a bit more malleable. Or maybe i'm talking out of my rear-end. But i will stand by the fact that the English won't roll over as easy as many seem to think.
 

fortyfive

Kingfisher
Other Christian
I really dont think it's in the British character at all this stuff. A lot of non Brits i think have a false assumption about the place as ultra-cucked, but in some regards it really isn't.
I don't know Brits, but they seem to be historically somewhat more rebellious than Germans, that's true. But how do you explain their high vaxx rate? Currently, more than 76%
 

El Draque

 
Banned
Orthodox
I don't know Brits, but they seem to be historically somewhat more rebellious than Germans, that's true. But how do you explain their high vaxx rate? Currently, more than 76%

People are ultra comfortable and trusting. They were gaslit / fooled into thinking it would just be a harmless vax to "get back to normal"

That remaining unvaxd 25% will be as stubborn as a mule. I think theyll struggle to get much beyond 80% at this stage.

Also that rate is for uk, not england, i know the Scots at least are higher.
 

Stadtaffe

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Gold Member
I really dont think it's in the British character at all this stuff. A lot of non Brits i think have a false assumption about the place as ultra-cucked, but in some regards it really isn't.
I was in London and it was "you must where a mask" signs on the tubes, and announcements and nobody was wearing one, police didn't care, pubs were packed, a club was so packed the windows were steamed up, no QR codes, no checks, everyone relatively normal. Get to Germany and well, people will just about murder each other on the train if someone takes off a mask. Well, if it's a quiet train in Germany and you can tuck yourself into a corner you can get away with it, but need to be ready to be approached aggressively.
 

Grow Bag

Pelican
Catholic
I really dont think it's in the British character at all this stuff. A lot of non Brits i think have a false assumption about the place as ultra-cucked, but in some regards it really isn't.
I could've used triple parentheses I suppose or specifically mentioned the symbiotic relationship of money merchants and the aristocracy, but Perfidious Albion pretty much sums up that unholy alliance. The British people and their character should never be conflated with our duplicitous ruling class.
 

presidentcarter

Ostrich
Protestant
Gold Member
What do you mean "just a matter of legality visa"? It's like saying "why not go to the moon? It's just a matter of a big rocket"

Here are the options available to me, a Canadian who's a native English speaker and professional engineer to work legally. Unless you're from a crappy country where you can claim refugee status access to the special green card lottery, other 1st world countries like the UK or Sweden have even fewer options.

-Independently, the only option is a $500k-$2m investment visa, thousands in fees, and better part of a year of waiting. Contrast this with say Australia, which uses points. I pay my fees, take some tests, still takes several months, but it's entirely in my hands.

-Being Canadian, (or Mexican) the option exists for a TN visa, but that requires a job offer in advance, and it's a temporary visa, essentially a travel visa with the right to work for a specific employer temporarily, after which you're expected to return to Canada. Having tried extensively, as soon as employers find out you aren't already legal, you're done.

-L1 company transfer. I worked on one of these, required me to be a specialized knowledge worker or upper management, a year working in your home country, and requires your company to have int'l offices, be on board with the transfer, and be willing to involved in getting lawyers, paperwork, thousands in lawyer/application fees, and several months of processing.

-H1B. The typical "immigration" visa. Capped numbers, lottery system as demand vastly exceeds supply, usually gets filled up day the visas are released by companies looking to bring Indians over on the cheap. Requires a job in advance, a company on board to pay even more fees, a once a year access point, and a fair amount of luck.

-J/F visa. Student visas. Requires you to be a student, and pay international student fees on top of already extortionist tuition. Requires acceptance, then fees and interviews and lots of waiting, and only allows for casual work. Primary purpose is study.

While it's been years since I've looked at it (so it's possible some info may be out of date) I eventually threw up my hands in frustration and decided to not be such a nomad, but as far as I can tell, that's it. Absent a million dollar investment, they all require sponsorship from a school/company, thousands in fees, lots of waiting, luck, and once you are there highly restrictive terms which companies can take advantage of since you have few options if a company screws you, save going back home.

Much like this CV19 thing, the vast, vast majority of people are simply too lazy and ignorant to actually look into the real details of a situation before forming opinions carved in stone which are wholly influenced by what they see on TV. The siren song of "well they should do it the right way like everyone else" echos a time when the rules were far more sensible. I've yet to see a society grow weak at having lots of native language speaking engineers and doctors, so I really can't fathom why the US gov't puts far more road blocks up to them coming over vs the relative of some Honduran with grade 9 who can't speak english via family reunification visas.
Yeah I wasn't intending it as 'just' as in a small feat - but as in an absolute reason.

Anyway, I do know several illegal immigrants and they have ITIN #s, pay taxes, and even have driver's licenses. Came in through southern border.

Like you mentioned I see the rules continuing to lose relevance and I think increasingly an argument can indeed be made for refugee status - now whether the powers that be here accept that or not is another issue.

It's just hard as a native born 'Merican to not notice the two tiers of acceptable entry here. We have/had anchor babies left and right entire industry (I knew some Russian women who were employed in the anchor baby industry) as well as very...porous borders. Oh and no stab required for them. Then on the other end of the spectrum we have all the folks getting in line and filing their paperwork, paying their fees like good global citizens who by the way must be stabbed.
 

Pointy Elbows

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Recently, I have spoken with a friend living in one of the Baltic states, a member of the EU. He said that as unvaxxed without QR code in the phone, you can't enter more than 90% of venues here. He got a jab in the summer because Gov promised him freedom forever, (just get 2 jabs), and he wanted to travel and live normally. Like a first-class citizen with rights.

Now, during this winter to his big surprise, he found that Gov lied, and rules changed. No more freedom forever. His vaxxed status in the phone will expire at the end of January. Prolonging requires taking the third jab. And then every couple of months. Instead, he will become a second-class citizen overnight.

Is such a life worth staying there? Wouldn't be better to wash dishes somewhere in Kansas for a couple of bucks with Latinos or even pounding sand in Africa?
I don't know. Everyone needs to find his own answer to that.

Would be evil masters in the future satisfied with only jabbing slaves every 6 months and that will be all? I don't know either, but I doubt it.

In Poland and Belarus during General Government (1939-45) at some point, being a second-class citizen meant (if you wanted just survive) hiding in the woods. When found by searching squads, or ratted out by good citizens, you were shot on the spot.

And if you think, that such things couldn't be possible today, well, I know personally people who survived the same fate in former Yugoslavia in the 90s.
fortyfive, your Baltic friend would be completely justified in a radical, high risk move under such circumstances. And, yes, washing dishes in Kansas as an illegal immigrant is better life to what he has now.

I know a Brit that came to the US on a tourist visa almost 30 years ago. He's never been back to England. I don't ask his status, and he doesn't offer. He has been a one-man contractor for about 20 years. Before that, he worked construction and odd-jobs around the US. He's been a cowboy on big western ranches, hung drywall in NYC for a couple years (often living in the construction site as night "security"), worked as a painter, etc. He has hitchhiked through as much of the US as I have been, maybe more. Always landed odd jobs along the way. He doesn't own a home, but he owns a really nice truck and has a cash landlord. His driver's license is from one of the many states that offer licenses to illegals.

He loves the US, but he is still a stranger in the land. Sometime he admits to terrible loneliness and homesickness. He does well with women (American women go crazy for euro accents and he's in great shape and has good game), but he is lonely as he has some very strong personality traits that block LT relations.

Illegals here joke about "Mexicare," where they just go to the emergency room and declare they are indigent and get full care for free. They make cash and often live a simple, un-harassed life. Still, they are somewhat outcasts (until they get married and gain "status").

After what you said about the Baltics, it sure sounds better to be an illegal dishwasher/cowboy in the US than all that.
 

fortyfive

Kingfisher
Other Christian
fortyfive, your Baltic friend would be completely justified in a radical, high risk move under such circumstances. And, yes, washing dishes in Kansas as an illegal immigrant is better life to what he has now.
Thanks, Pointy Elbows. Actually, it's me who is considering leaving the EU, not that my friend. He is just currently living in a worse place, than the rest of the EU, but we are heading in the same direction rapidly too.
 

Tradcatholic

Robin
Catholic
Where have you heard that? First time those two countries are crossing my radar, is there a German expat community or what?
I have a friend who spends a lot of time Ghana, she tells me that there is a big (pre-Covid) German expat community there, many of them are normies, but many are anti-vaxx too (not just Christians, also e.g. hippies and new agey or natural living types who are skeptical of government decrees and Big Pharma and adamantly refuse to have these new experimental vaxxes injected into them), and after the Covid pass this summer, then Austria announcing vaccine mandates and Germany signalling that they would follow, many of the anti-vaxxers are relocating permanently to Ghana, and some of their anti-vaxx friends who don't live in Ghana are following them.

As for Namibia, I read an article by Linh Dinh which suggested there are quite a few Covid refugees there.
 
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canuckj

Woodpecker
Other Christian
Where have you heard that? First time those two countries are crossing my radar, is there a German expat community or what?
Namibia has a large white population in the south and Germans have been there since the late 1800s. If you look at the map you will see the names of the towns they settled. As far as Africa goes Namibia is hardly a bad place. German also has some sort of legal status as a language.
 
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