Wife problems weighing VERY heavily on me

Pointy Elbows

Woodpecker
Orthodox
Sounds like she has "buyer's regret," even though she hasn't really "bought in" yet, as you are not married.

Is she considering leaving you? As Elicola implied she is surrounded by men that will soon be rich. In my professional life, I've seen many marriages that dissolve as soon as the wife makes as much or more than the husband, especially if she can land more beta bucks.

Usually, the man is the LAST person to know she is about to leave him. I don't know that this is the case, but please consider it.

I mean no disrespect to you, brother. It sounds like you've worked for and gained a great deal. Like you, I was always a good wage earner, but my ex had a hidden alpha (or two) memories in the closet. I was competing against these memories and the college "good" times.

For some women, unfortunately, the drudgery of child-rearing is a major let-down after having lived even one day on the carousel.

I had many similarities in my 20+ year marriage. I hid my head in the sand, but the sad truth was that my ex had considered divorcing me as early as our first little argument, two months into the marriage. I did many wrong things - but I was "all in." She never was. Not once. She did try, faked it some, but was never "all in." In a way, I wish she had rejected me up front. She knew she could not give herself fully to me (later admission in marriage). Yet she married me anyway, and we all suffered for it.

By way of your kids, you will forever be tied to her. These ties should only increase if you are to marry her. But will they? That is an important question to ask both yourself and her.

You are around to be a good father and useful helper to her. But before you marry her, maybe offer the "get out of jail" pass. "Honey, it sure seems you are not happy here. I love you, our kid/s, and would like to have a great future together. If you have reservations, then now is the time to end this. If you want to be in, then get 'all in' with me. I'm not pleading, begging, or demanding anything else, just get in or get out."

I lived trapped, unwittingly for many years, in a relation with a regretful spouse. I don't wish that on you.
 

gent

Sparrow
Catholic
I'm praying for you man. Good on you for opening up. I think other people gave a lot of good advice. It's going to be hard to hear but you should not be having sex with her until you're married.

Me and my wife were not practicing Christians when we got married in a civil ceremony. This past year as I've returned to Christ one of the first things my priest told me is that I should not have any relations with my wife until our marriage was convalidated by the Church. I wanted to be faithful, but I was scared to tell my wife that. I also thought there was no way I could manage to do that. Me and wife had engaged in fornication since the very beginning of our relationship, which seemed so normal to me at the time but now I look back with sorrow on.

Anyways I prayed to God for help, and he proved his love for me and gave me the strength to not only stand strong and tell my wife we couldn't have sex until we got our marriage blessed (which we did, a few months later, and now she attends church regularly with me and our kids), but to keep my own lustful impulses at bay. That ended up being my longest period of celibacy since I was 12 years old. It seemed impossible, but our marriage has exceedingly blessed since then.

I am also working from home while my wife stays at home. To be honest, sometimes you are gonna have to deal with your kids while you're "working". My wife is usually up at night breastfeeding so I tend to wake up at 5/6am and sit with the kids while I work to try to let her sleep a bit more.

God bless you. May you and your wife find harmony with one another and may you be freed from your resentment and anger. I struggle with it too sometimes so I know how it is.
 

Kadikoy

 
Banned
Orthodox
Become Orthodox.
Read the book No More Mr. Nice Guy and begin implementing, immediately.
Stop all payments for her schooling, and demand marriage and/or counseling or her jobless ass can take a hike.
Watch her run for the hills, but at least not after you've wasted another few years and more $$ just so she can trade up more easily and have you play babysitter twice a week while she does the romance/slut thing with another guy.

Another possibility is just getting her pregnant again and keeping her in the home.

Basically you screwed the pooch, in a thousand ways. Especially with the whole thing about her being a horrible, absentee mother while she took classes you were paying for, whilst not even married. But, hindsight is 20/20.

Regardless, you need to become Orthodox. It likely won't fix any of these problems, not on this side of eternity, but if you stay at it, earnestly, you'll find peace with it all. That I can testify to from my own experience with crap life experiences and horrible choices with painful consequences. Jesus Christ promises an other-worldly peace to those who follow The Way, and the Narrow Path is only found in the Holy Orthodox Church.
 

thelordofthewest

Chicken
Agnostic
I don't have permission to post. I came here to ask if any man has divorced his wife because she doesn't want kids.

When I read your story it is maybe how things would turn out with my wife if somehow we had a kid. She just doesn't seem interested and I don't see myself living a zero kid life.

Being miserable and full of regret doesn't seem like a good choice for anyone.
 

Mercury

Pigeon
Catholic
Hey guys, I come before you humbly because I am near the end of my rope as to what to do with my wife in our situation. Our story didnt have good beginnings which is likely why the problems exist today. It started fine enough, she was much younger (early 20s when I was early 30s), submissive, sexy, passionate, great cook. We dated for almost a year, and she stuck out from all the previous trash I dated. An accidentally condom break (and 9 months) later we had a kid, which was a huge stress on her and partly something she never seemed to recover out of. Years since (we are going on 5) our relationship never really recovered. It always seemed like one thing after another would come up and be a big deal, sexual trauma from her past, abuse in the family, this and that, all 'real' issues, but things she never processed or even let go. I understand the whole honeymoon, but I'd say it often rarely gets above tepid. Sexually, she is near frozen, and has long been a constant complaint of mine - though now I realize its merely a marker of other issues. She has crippling depression and self esteem issues; this along with a bad origin family (her mom wore the pants) she sees any advice I try to give her as controlling/hostile.

I feel like I can mostly give up on the passion, and settle for a 'dead bed' type relationship if it was not for how useless of a mother she generally is. This is a hard thing to write. She breast fed our kid the first year to her credit, but is so unbelievably hands off, I have had to step (awkwardly) into the role of being the nurturer. This last year especially, is it not a joke to say I did 90% of the parent duties. She had been going to school these last 4 years for medical, and likely could get a pretty decent job, but there has been a lot of latent resentment in me towards her for how much I have footed the entire bill and the general lack of gratitude towards me. (Beta bux evidently). The last year, I had a fair amount of money saved up from my STEM job, and needed to career change to something that actually might make more then 40-50k a year into perpetuity. So I watch our kid 90% of the time (shes too 'tired'/'sick'/studying to do it) and somehow study myself for career change, specifically IT certs. It was an incredibly long and hard road to hoe.

Earlier this year I drug her into counseling (ironic its usually the other way around) and it seemed like we were making some progress and coming together. We had a lot of good times and I think maybe we have turned a corner. We both always wanted a big family, she hops off birth control, and of course ends up pregnant within a month. It doesnt take long for old patterns to re-emerge and our relationship trajectory angles down once again.

In my life I have been trying to be the best I can. I lift weights 5x a week, recently hit a great PR on bench press, desirable by women when we head out and all that. All my studying paid off and I lucked (by the grace of God) my way into an incredible remote IT job with great pay. I am happy, but my women is very 'meh' about the whole thing. The thing that really makes me worried, is again, remember I am the primary care taker due to her laziness, that means I am up at 630 or 7am feeding/playing with our kid. My job starts soon and I have told her 'You need to be ready for this' and she just says she plans on sleeping in or using the tv to babysit.

Needless to say, I have a lot of anger towards her. Without a kid (and another coming) together I would have left this behavior a long time ago, yet now I feel 'duty-bound' to my kids. I feel trapped in short. I used to be desperate for sex or attention from her, but I just feel so much resentment towards her now it scares me. I honestly feel like she is near completely dead weight. She is almost done with her school, but I want her to just stay home and raise kid 1 and 2 on the way, but there is little evidence she can do that effectively.

I love my kid, but in dark truth the pregnancy really put my life on a trajectory that I have not been happy with for a long time,, largely due to what I perceive her massive shortcomings to be. I have tried to improve it, and really tried my best, but now feels like things are going to get even worse. The irony is so bad, because with a great remote job, and me offering to just let her stay home with the kids it should be perfect - yet its not. Here I am a week away from my job wondering if she will actually wake up and take care of our kid, and what do I do if my kid is saying 'daddy im hungry!" when I am 'at work'.

Thanks guys if you read this and can offer me anything.

I hate to be the black pilled guy but I have 3 close friends going through similar situations. These are guys are extremely high value guys (well over 6 foot, one a surgeon and the other a program manager). Both married the girls in their 20s and we are all now in our 40s.

A couple of things - how much time does she spend on social media or the internet? If she is seeing girls out traveling, clubbing and having fun she's liable to believe that she is missing out on the best years of her life. What are her friends like? Are they all single and out having the time of their lives (or so they claim)? I am going to go out on a limb - she is probably bitching at you on the smallest things too?

I hate to be a doomer, but I suspect when her schooling is done and she gets a stable job this may likely be the end of your marriage. If there is any silver lining look at this as an opportunity to grow closer to God...at least 1 of the guys is now a regular churchgoer.
 

Kadikoy

 
Banned
Orthodox
but I have 3 close friends going through similar situations. These are guys are extremely high value guys (well over 6 foot, one a surgeon and the other a program manager). Both married the girls in their 20s and we are all now in our 40s.

And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery. -- Mark 10.12
 

Mercury

Pigeon
Catholic
And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery. -- Mark 10.12
I'm not sure they aim to be married, but the short term plan is to just engage in fornication as part of "finding themselves".

None of these women(or men) are religious, and the overwhelming reference groups of these women are secular. There is almost no blowback as they put away their husbands. The lone pushback is from the older generation of their family who while still secular, are closer to their Christian roots.
 

Padouk

Kingfisher
Non-Christian
I usually do not like to interfere with people's lives but your story sounds almost the same as mine. You (and I) made wrong choices. Fools. It could end badly as it did for me. I can't advise you what to do specifically apart from analyse it where it went wrong and work on it. Remember it takes two to tango.

From what I gather your second is on the way. That means she won't leave you before the child is at least 4-5 years old. It's an instinct for women to not trust a stranger male with the life of an infant. If she gets financially independent sooner she might consider leaving sooner. So you've got some time to straight this relationship out but don't delay it because years fly.

p.s. sex hormones cloud your judgments
 

Jive Turkey

Woodpecker
Other Christian
It always seemed like one thing after another would come up and be a big deal, sexual trauma from her past, abuse in the family, this and that, all 'real' issues, but things she never processed or even let go.

This stood out to me more than anything else in the OP. You kinda mention it like "Oh and by the way she was raped/molested, but anyway that's neither here nor there"

Not that being abused is an excuse to be a bad person or partner, but you also don't seem to be genuinely empathizing with her trauma. This kind of thing messes with people in a very deep way. Victims of sexual abuse are usually good at "functioning" for superficial encounters, but then find real and sustained intimacy very challenging and intimidating, because they are so alienated from their true sexuality. Many, maybe most or even all girls, I have come to learn, who do the hook up thing, do it as a form of self-harm.

They hate themselves and that is why they are always asking men to do degrading and harmful things to themselves. There is a line between being submissive and being a masochist. A submissive wants to be lead and please someone, a masochist desires punishment and pain because they see themselves as deserving of it. It was hard for me to understand this aspect of female psychology for a long time, because they almost always refuse to talk about it, because they think it makes them seem weak and crazy. This clashes with their feminist paradigm, but also on a human level these are people who have just been hurt and are afraid of being vulnerable.

I would pray deeply and every day that God may grant you a heart of empathy so that you can understand where she is coming from and let go of some of your resentment. It is easy for me to say this because I am a single guy, but I have been in a similar relationship in the past.

Moving on from the above, like @MichaelWitcoff et al said, you are living in a perpetual sin. You are leading her in praying one moment and fornicating with her the next. Suppose she does begin giving her heart to Christ. Isn't this just going to add to her feelings of guilt and depression?

Ultimately you have a deep and complicated issue. I don't think anyone on this forum is going to advocate you abandoning this child, so I think marriage should be on the table for you if you want to make things work in a spiritually correct way.

It also sounds like you guys need to find a good mentor couple in church, or a Christian relationship counselor. I have come to learn that most good relationship advice really depends on the situation and the temperament of the people involved, and only people who know you well and personally can give such nuanced advice.

This is a big and messy situation, and I think it really goes way beyond the capabilities of anyone to just help you solve your problems with a couple of forum posts.

There is also the whole "lead a horse to water" thing. It sounds like you are doing a lot of things right. For a while as a reprieve to yourself I think you should stop worrying on what she is doing right or wrong and just go into a period of self-reflection and see where you could be a better partner to her. Since she is already uninterested in sex now would be a good time to stop asking her to commit that sin with you.

Maybe after six months you will become a better person and it will inspire her to do the same. Or maybe after six months you will be back at square one.

Also, what is her support network like? If she just has you and the kids that isn't enough. Ideally she would have extended family, but that isn't an option for everyone, so maybe bring her to church and go to couples events where she can meet other Godly women and confide in them. Good women can be powerful allies in making relationships work, because they know how to steer each other much better than men do. A man needs a woman's consent to truly lead her, but women seem to know how to work each other naturally.


I know I through a bunch of stuff out there, and keep in mind I am no relationship expert, but self-reflection and empathy have never done me wrong. I would strongly, strongly recommend finding help IRL and just try to be as non-judgmental as possible. You are in a tough situation so I don't want to come as preaching or like I would do any better, these are just my thoughts.
 

Pointy Elbows

Woodpecker
Orthodox
These occasional threads weigh heavily on me, and during a long drive yesterday, I remembered an old Axiom of RVF:

- Attraction cannot be negotiated.

She is either sufficiently attracted to her man to behave appropriately, or she is not. That's really it. Are you the best man you can be (always a struggle), presently leading a righteous life, penitent for your wrong, presenting yourself in a respectable lovable way, bringing honor to your people, leading well? If you are, and if she is not coming around, then you won't be able to talk, coax or negotiate your way in.

With God's help, all can be done. But you, as a man alone, cannot change this attraction rule. This leads to another old Axiom:

- You must be outcome independent.

Do your part, leave the rest to God, and deal with the results in an honorable way. Don't despair if it goes south. Don't hang all your joy in life on her if she comes around.

Best wishes to you, Sword.
 

get2choppaaa

Ostrich
Orthodox
Forgive me for the following.... and I am sure this is not going to be well received by a lot on here.

First you need to figure out, if you're doing your job. Are you setting the example? She is depressed... why? No offense, but she sounds like she needs a lot of help and sounds like you are enabling her. Remember you are the man. EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENS IS YOUR FAULT. Thats how it is. You lead or abdicate leadership.

I think you need to be ready to tell her you are a heartbeat from leaving. This sounds like a case of a one-way relationship and she sounds like a terrible mother. I was married to a woman like that once.

Its been my experience, that once it is over it is over, its only a matter of time before she gets out and drags you down into the mud in the process. Sounds like my ex-wife who was miserable. (though we never had issues with intimacy)

If your'e doing all that, and there's no effort by your wife to do her part and you're miserable to the point where you hate your life... I would get a divorce. NOT SAYING YOU SHOULD but that's what I would do.

I went through a really terrible one, as I have written about here and stayed in the relationship until she left because of the kids. If I had known the other side of the coin, I would have had no qualms about getting out of that marriage but I stuck around for the kids and the sex.

I don't think the "stay together for the kids" argument is a winning one. Stay together because you can work toward each other's salvation and bring your children together.

When it comes to sex and attraction... for women its either something they are really really excited about OR its a chore. If she doesnt find you attractive for whatever reason, its a chore... and you're going to hate yourself for not feeling appreciated and satisified.

The above might not sit well with some folks on the forum and come off as secular to a degree and not the advice of many on here.... but its the honest truth as best I can give it. Thats what I would do. Make an attempt at reconciliation, but if it isnt there, then move on. This relationship is holding you back from what you want, from your career goals, and from your own success. Why keep the gal around?

Probably gonna get some hate for it... but I can say, after re-marrying, finding a woman who shares the same faith goals, family goals, and life goals compared to my exwife, I can 100% say getting divorce (though not my choice at the time) was the best thing that ever happened to me.

I had to be free from it all in order to be where I am now.
 

Viktor Zeegelaar

Hummingbird
Orthodox Inquirer
So in other words, this entire thread is “living in mortal sin isn’t working out and granting me the peace and joy I long for. What can I do differently?”

You already know the answer. Be chaste until you’re married, and live a God-pleasing life to the best of your ability and circumstances. If you “lead nightly prayers” and then lead her into sin moments later, all you’re communicating is that God and your faith are not important or worth taking seriously. Every time you do that, it chips away at your leadership and her perception that you’re worth following.
I'd second this take of Michael. In Dutch we say you're mopping with an open tap. You're not addressing the cause of the problems this way. Instead you're fiddling around with the effects. But if the (spiritual) cause doesn't get fixed you'll not solve the situation and in our dense, anti human society it will actually deteriorate over time.

What I think is a very good point is that you're not taking the leadership now towards a situation where the problem is solved. It seems like you're building on quicksand. I'd say take a weekend off to reconsider your whole life, find the causes for your problems (the real causes!) And make a plan to address those and then execute.
 

Revolting Truth

 
Banned
Orthodox
Hey guys, I come before you humbly because I am near the end of my rope as to what to do with my wife in our situation. Our story didnt have good beginnings which is likely why the problems exist today. It started fine enough, she was much younger (early 20s when I was early 30s), submissive, sexy, passionate, great cook. We dated for almost a year, and she stuck out from all the previous trash I dated. An accidentally condom break (and 9 months) later we had a kid, which was a huge stress on her and partly something she never seemed to recover out of. Years since (we are going on 5) our relationship never really recovered. It always seemed like one thing after another would come up and be a big deal, sexual trauma from her past, abuse in the family, this and that, all 'real' issues, but things she never processed or even let go. I understand the whole honeymoon, but I'd say it often rarely gets above tepid. Sexually, she is near frozen, and has long been a constant complaint of mine - though now I realize its merely a marker of other issues. She has crippling depression and self esteem issues; this along with a bad origin family (her mom wore the pants) she sees any advice I try to give her as controlling/hostile.

I feel like I can mostly give up on the passion, and settle for a 'dead bed' type relationship if it was not for how useless of a mother she generally is. This is a hard thing to write. She breast fed our kid the first year to her credit, but is so unbelievably hands off, I have had to step (awkwardly) into the role of being the nurturer. This last year especially, is it not a joke to say I did 90% of the parent duties. She had been going to school these last 4 years for medical, and likely could get a pretty decent job, but there has been a lot of latent resentment in me towards her for how much I have footed the entire bill and the general lack of gratitude towards me. (Beta bux evidently). The last year, I had a fair amount of money saved up from my STEM job, and needed to career change to something that actually might make more then 40-50k a year into perpetuity. So I watch our kid 90% of the time (shes too 'tired'/'sick'/studying to do it) and somehow study myself for career change, specifically IT certs. It was an incredibly long and hard road to hoe.

Earlier this year I drug her into counseling (ironic its usually the other way around) and it seemed like we were making some progress and coming together. We had a lot of good times and I think maybe we have turned a corner. We both always wanted a big family, she hops off birth control, and of course ends up pregnant within a month. It doesnt take long for old patterns to re-emerge and our relationship trajectory angles down once again.

In my life I have been trying to be the best I can. I lift weights 5x a week, recently hit a great PR on bench press, desirable by women when we head out and all that. All my studying paid off and I lucked (by the grace of God) my way into an incredible remote IT job with great pay. I am happy, but my women is very 'meh' about the whole thing. The thing that really makes me worried, is again, remember I am the primary care taker due to her laziness, that means I am up at 630 or 7am feeding/playing with our kid. My job starts soon and I have told her 'You need to be ready for this' and she just says she plans on sleeping in or using the tv to babysit.

Needless to say, I have a lot of anger towards her. Without a kid (and another coming) together I would have left this behavior a long time ago, yet now I feel 'duty-bound' to my kids. I feel trapped in short. I used to be desperate for sex or attention from her, but I just feel so much resentment towards her now it scares me. I honestly feel like she is near completely dead weight. She is almost done with her school, but I want her to just stay home and raise kid 1 and 2 on the way, but there is little evidence she can do that effectively.

I love my kid, but in dark truth the pregnancy really put my life on a trajectory that I have not been happy with for a long time,, largely due to what I perceive her massive shortcomings to be. I have tried to improve it, and really tried my best, but now feels like things are going to get even worse. The irony is so bad, because with a great remote job, and me offering to just let her stay home with the kids it should be perfect - yet its not. Here I am a week away from my job wondering if she will actually wake up and take care of our kid, and what do I do if my kid is saying 'daddy im hungry!" when I am 'at work'.

Thanks guys if you read this and can offer me anything.
A simple but probably useful advice: put your children first. You'll always be their father, regardless of your wife's behavior.
 

SaintPiusX

Pigeon
Trad Catholic
no, not technically married. We have been engaged for a while and she wanted to finish school first before she wanted to get married. We are set to be officially sometime early next year since she finishes soon. Yes I realize its a problem, its been an ongoing issue. Its another issue I am fully aware of.
When you think you have a complicated problem, it's often the case it's very simple. Your profile says your Catholic, yet you are not living a Catholic life. Fornicating outside of a marriage is a mortal sin. If you died right now, according to your faith, you would be given a 1 way ticket to Hell. Your girlfriend would also be going to hell. Your poor children are not being raised in a Catholic household. I'll provide you with the solution to your problems, and it's up to you on whether you actually want to solve them.

Step 1) Go to confession. Receive absolution from your Father, and do the appropriate penance.
Step 2) Stop committing mortal sins. Work with your Father at your Parish to prepare for a Catholic marriage. You cannot engage in fornication until the marriage is complete. If you do engage in fornication before the marriage, confess your sins.
Step 3) Start living a Catholic life.

You are mocking God. You have no Sanctifying Grace, and thus, are cut off from His help. If you don't follow these above steps, I will tell you exactly what will happen:

1) As soon as your girlfriend finishes school and finds a job, she will leave you.
2) You will be required to pay child support, spousal support, and fight for custody of your children.
 

Saxonia

Pigeon
Protestant
She is almost done with her school, but I want her to just stay home and raise kid 1 and 2 on the way, but there is little evidence she can do that effectively.
Just my two cents and the observations I've made.
I know many unhappy relationships/divorces with stay at home moms. Marriages in which the woman has other tasks in life in addition to bringing up the children, e.g. a fulfilling (maybe parttime) job, usually seem happier and more successful to me.
Of course, this does not apply to every case and every culture.
 

Spro23

Pigeon
Catholic
If you died right now, according to your faith, you would be given a 1 way ticket to Hell. Your girlfriend would also be going to hell.

Step 1) Go to confession. Receive absolution from your Father, and do the appropriate penance.
Step 2) Stop committing mortal sins. Work with your Father at your Parish to prepare for a Catholic marriage. You cannot engage in fornication until the marriage is complete. If you do engage in fornication before the marriage, confess your sins.

This is a sincere question, I'm not meaning to troll.
How is a forced apology even valid? He clearly doesn't feel he's done anything wrong. He'd be going largely because you told him (or reminded him of) he's going into an oven for eternity.

In Catholic school they taught us missing a holy day of obligation was also a mortal sin. I got suspicious when I knew kids from different denominations who didn't have those obligations. I was like welp guess they're getting a Mexican cartel-style torture for eternity.

I also don't think dressing up and having a pretty ceremony first would've changed this woman's behavior, he simply chose poorly.
 

2 Right Hands

Woodpecker
Catholic
It's not about being forced or not but about being sincere. If he goes to confession and sincerely apologises for his sins then it's a valid sacrament, otherwise it's just an empty gesture and he would still be in a state of mortal sin.
If you're Catholic, it's not about how you feel about certain activities but what the Church teaches. Fornication is a mortal sin, always has been so it doesn't matter what his personal opinion about it is. Bear in mind, sinning must be a conscious act.
 

Viktor Zeegelaar

Hummingbird
Orthodox Inquirer
I hate to be the black pilled guy but I have 3 close friends going through similar situations. These are guys are extremely high value guys (well over 6 foot, one a surgeon and the other a program manager). Both married the girls in their 20s and we are all now in our 40s.

A couple of things - how much time does she spend on social media or the internet? If she is seeing girls out traveling, clubbing and having fun she's liable to believe that she is missing out on the best years of her life. What are her friends like? Are they all single and out having the time of their lives (or so they claim)? I am going to go out on a limb - she is probably bitching at you on the smallest things too?

I hate to be a doomer, but I suspect when her schooling is done and she gets a stable job this may likely be the end of your marriage. If there is any silver lining look at this as an opportunity to grow closer to God...at least 1 of the guys is now a regular churchgoer.
Her seeing other dudes and living the single lifestyle is a good point. In the past it would've been unacceptable for a woman to have a bunch of dudes around them as supposed friends. That's a setup for disaster. You lock your Lambo too when you park it.

Nowadays as men are boys and we have no conception of what masculinity is, a lot of the whirlwind of disaster hits us when we're not combat ready. So instead of avoiding problems as the men of old were noticed of by their patriarchal father, grandfather and brothers we have to experience every single stupid thing that has been known since the dawn of humanity and burn our hand trying it. In any relationship where failure sets in, the man has made a mistake down the line. Usually that is accepting nonsense from the woman which makes her lose respect and when she's not kept in check and respect is lost, the relationship will deteriorate from then. Restoring respect comes with order, boundaries and consequences for misbehavior.
 
Top