MichaelWitcoff
Ostrich
kel said:
Mostly a high-drama girlfriend and some issues with the job I had after the one I loved.
Would you quit your job if you had 200k savings in 2020?
- Thread starter NapoleonDynamighty
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Mostly a high-drama girlfriend and some issues with the job I had after the one I loved.
Simeon_Strangelight
Eagle
You want a risk-free 18% ROI and live off that? This is not going to happen - it won't be risk-free or you won't make that kind of return. On top of it - you are young with a growing family. Something unforeseen will happen that necessitate more income for sure. In our economic model the safety of landed gentry income disappeared centuries ago. Change is the only constant. You have to keep on pimping unless you have truly massive assets and can hire people who will do the work for you. But 200k isn't it.
I can think of low-risk ways to make 1-1.5k/month, but that's about it.
I can think of low-risk ways to make 1-1.5k/month, but that's about it.
If your looking at higher risk yo could look at lending money on Crypto.com for fixed rates.
I have no idea how secure this is, but for stable coins (USD backed) you can get about 14% interest per year, including compound interest.
You can get lower rates on crypto. For example you can get about 8% yearly on BTC (not including compound). So if you think BTC is going up it's a way to multiply gains.
So with $200,000, you could take around $28,000 from lending out USD stable coins. I've made much more than that on another lending platform when rate were better.
I saw crypto bottom around 5 Jan, when the 1W candle MACD turned over and RSI went low enough. When that's happened it's always been the bottom of the crypto bear market. So I would be looking at a decent crypto allocation though.
I have no idea how secure this is, but for stable coins (USD backed) you can get about 14% interest per year, including compound interest.
You can get lower rates on crypto. For example you can get about 8% yearly on BTC (not including compound). So if you think BTC is going up it's a way to multiply gains.
So with $200,000, you could take around $28,000 from lending out USD stable coins. I've made much more than that on another lending platform when rate were better.
I saw crypto bottom around 5 Jan, when the 1W candle MACD turned over and RSI went low enough. When that's happened it's always been the bottom of the crypto bear market. So I would be looking at a decent crypto allocation though.
joseph15
Sparrow
200K is nothing. A 'great' ROI these days is 10% and usually these carry on great risk. Are you willing to risk your 200K life savings for a measly 20K per year; not even minimum wage? If you want to make money with less than 500K realistically, you're going to have to bring something to the table, in terms of skills and business acumen. Don't fall for the trap of investing in crypto, stocks, forex, etc. Invest small bits of that money into making yourself a smarter individual who will know what to do with that money.
One thing I can relate to hervens about on this post: everybody who has never seen 6 figures at once thinks its a magical number and that if you can just achieve that, you can read a book or two about investing and retire for life. When you get there, you realize how small of an amount it is.
Realistically speaking, the only people who can truly retire off of passive investments of 4%-10% are multi-millionaires, at least in first world countries. A few hundred thousand is unfortunately nothing when it comes to things like stocks and real estate.
One thing I can relate to hervens about on this post: everybody who has never seen 6 figures at once thinks its a magical number and that if you can just achieve that, you can read a book or two about investing and retire for life. When you get there, you realize how small of an amount it is.
Realistically speaking, the only people who can truly retire off of passive investments of 4%-10% are multi-millionaires, at least in first world countries. A few hundred thousand is unfortunately nothing when it comes to things like stocks and real estate.
SlickyBoy
Hummingbird
There's a guy with a youtube channel who "retired" in his late 30s after getting divorced, paying down his debts, quitting his job, selling everything and moving to the Philippines with only $10K in his pocket. He teaches English over there while traveling around and has a steady gf. Lives frugally, but seems happy.
Granted, he already had experience teaching English in the US so that skill set helped, and who knows where he will be when he's older and has pretty much zero retirement and minimal social security income, but he's still better off than most of the people over there. Plenty of old expats and military guys raise small families over there with small budgets - can be done. All depends what you want.
Granted, he already had experience teaching English in the US so that skill set helped, and who knows where he will be when he's older and has pretty much zero retirement and minimal social security income, but he's still better off than most of the people over there. Plenty of old expats and military guys raise small families over there with small budgets - can be done. All depends what you want.
Sankt Michael
Sparrow
I inherited about 300.000 Euro from my Grandpa about 2 years ago and can agree with the other posters it isn't very much. I can not even buy a nice house in my home town (population of ~42.000), let alone a house or an apartment in the big city where I currently live (Munich).
I hope the real estate prices will drop in the future through the aging population dying off, but at the moment the housing situation in most of Germany is tense with all the refugees and stuff.
I can imagine the next recession will hit hard and there is potential for good deals, if not I will most likely settle in some small and dying village.
Furthermore I can not imagine how the huge proportions of the populace with little to no savings are supposed to get financial stability in this country with the enormous tax burden. For me it becomes more and more clear that I live in a second Weimar Republic and the populace is even more subverted than 100 years ago. We will see how it ends this time.
I hope the real estate prices will drop in the future through the aging population dying off, but at the moment the housing situation in most of Germany is tense with all the refugees and stuff.
I can imagine the next recession will hit hard and there is potential for good deals, if not I will most likely settle in some small and dying village.
Furthermore I can not imagine how the huge proportions of the populace with little to no savings are supposed to get financial stability in this country with the enormous tax burden. For me it becomes more and more clear that I live in a second Weimar Republic and the populace is even more subverted than 100 years ago. We will see how it ends this time.
Simeon_Strangelight
Eagle
kel said:
Cheap rental real-estate will get you those returns - possibly a bit higher than 1.5k - even 3k/month with a 200k investment. But it all depends on the country and region. In the US the easiest is welfare-financed rental income, somethin similar in the West. In other countries it's cheap affordable rentals. It's a relatively easy field of investment where you only have to learn the basics and never risk much. But since 200k is enough to buy multiple properties, then it's not much of a risk. There are even simple courses to do and books written on the topic.
And due to those real estate prices unlikely to get lower, then even a modest asset increase is likely. There are even companies which administer the properties for you for a 20%-25% fee.
PUA_Rachacha
Woodpecker
SlickyBoy said:
Can you link his channel?
I think if you can net $3k/month USD you would be in a position to retire in a developing country or semi-retire in a low cost of living state in USA. The margin of comfortability is unique to each individual.
The key is to get housing costs below $700/mo. The best combination of cost of living and quality of life I have seen in USA is Wisconsin. Green Bay in particular. The people are nice and hardworking and you can get a decent house for under $150k. Cold as hell, though.
To achieve $3k/mo. consistently and relatively safely I think you’ll need >$500k in investable assets. I have yet to hear any discussion about closed-end bond funds on this forum. It’s a great way to achieve a decent yield in the form of dividends, which can be used to live on. Have to be careful with the leveraged ones, however.
The key is to get housing costs below $700/mo. The best combination of cost of living and quality of life I have seen in USA is Wisconsin. Green Bay in particular. The people are nice and hardworking and you can get a decent house for under $150k. Cold as hell, though.
To achieve $3k/mo. consistently and relatively safely I think you’ll need >$500k in investable assets. I have yet to hear any discussion about closed-end bond funds on this forum. It’s a great way to achieve a decent yield in the form of dividends, which can be used to live on. Have to be careful with the leveraged ones, however.
In the country im in of about 11 million people theres probably less than 50 people with an income above 200k. That type of income has 0 relevance in most of the world.
I walked away from my business once I was comfortable I could generate about 3k usd / month without working.
Ill probably still do work here and there but my baseline allows me to live very well in the countries that interest me. In the city I live 3k usd / month would be about the equivalent of a guy with 100+ million in terms of rarity.
When I was young and naive I imagined Id need 100s of thousands a year anywhere. As Ive aged and am now early 30s I couldnt care less. The life Im able to live is far better than my friends making low to mid 6 figures in the west.
I think 200k would provide a baseline but youd want to supplement that by continuing to work in some capacity. Once you have mid 6 figures is when you start to have more freedom assuming the goal isnt to live in a developed country. At 7 figures you probably can forget about working completely.
Always makes me chuckle a bit when the big baller guys who constantly reference high incomes huge networth etc.. clearly dont have either.
Personally after a bit over a year of retirement im itching to start a project or work in some capacity. A lot of you guys who eventually pull the plug will probably find the same happens to you.
I walked away from my business once I was comfortable I could generate about 3k usd / month without working.
Ill probably still do work here and there but my baseline allows me to live very well in the countries that interest me. In the city I live 3k usd / month would be about the equivalent of a guy with 100+ million in terms of rarity.
When I was young and naive I imagined Id need 100s of thousands a year anywhere. As Ive aged and am now early 30s I couldnt care less. The life Im able to live is far better than my friends making low to mid 6 figures in the west.
I think 200k would provide a baseline but youd want to supplement that by continuing to work in some capacity. Once you have mid 6 figures is when you start to have more freedom assuming the goal isnt to live in a developed country. At 7 figures you probably can forget about working completely.
Always makes me chuckle a bit when the big baller guys who constantly reference high incomes huge networth etc.. clearly dont have either.
Personally after a bit over a year of retirement im itching to start a project or work in some capacity. A lot of you guys who eventually pull the plug will probably find the same happens to you.
@Deepdiver
In Cuba. (Not in Havana or Varadero) - Those two places have some reasonable earners.
Top restaurant in the city im in for two with a few coctels each is under $30. Whisky Bottle Service is around $20 for Jameson / Ballantines and Chivas 12 $30-$40. (More or less cost of the bottle in store) A more typical restaurant sells steaks for $2 or less and beer for $1) Pasta / Pizza is typically also in the 20 cent - $1.50 range for a full personal sized meal)
Normal income for service at decent restaurants for example is $1-$2 per day.
Workers in government jobs typically make $10-$25 a month (legally) - No point in explaining siphoning of government resources to expand ones income buts its not as if a worker doing that is able to siphon off huge amounts when there base pay is so low.
Incomes are very low here. Large limitations on what types of business you can start.(You can't for example start a manufacturing business, an infrastructure business, a car dealership etc. All of those are government businesses only) I'd say about 90% of businesses are (Gold, Mobile / Computer repairs, Restaurants (limitations on size), Beauty, Watch Repairs) A gym membership is usually $2 or less and they don't by any means have 1000 monthly sign ups that dont actually use the gym. More like 100ish in decent gyms.
To make 200k a year you'd have to be one of a select few Restaurant owners who are wildly successful in Havana or in some sort of position of power. (There are surely lots of diplomats (all which would be located in Havana not where I am) but I don't think Diplomats make that sum) I was of the impression they depending on country are more in the 70-150k range) Nice benefits as well obviously.
I pay masons with 20+ years experience about $4 / day while they build my house. Lawyers make like $30 a month though in specific areas you could potentially make more due to under the table incomes. Doctors can make a bit more even with tips maybe make $100+ a month in select fields.
Theres the odd guy who makes $500+ a month and even the very odd guy who might make $1000. But because of extremely low costs of everything, tiny margins and restrictions regarding what you can do there simply isn't really a legitimate way to make a lot of money. (Exception being in Havana due to the American tourism where lots of restaurant owners, taxi's and people in the tourism industry were able to take advantage for several years) All of that is being curbed pretty good now though with all the new restrictions. But even then netting $500 / day is a huge stretch aside from the most successful restaurants and many of those are frankly foreign owned due to the fact that they usually are in historic mansions and would cost 6 figures to start up.
Theres a lot of taxi's in Havana who really hose tourists good but at the same time even if you hose tourists 3 times a day for $20 you are only looking at around $1200 a month and aside from that the upkeep and gas / diesel on vehicles from the 1950s is costly as well.
Now Americans can only fly into Havana, not to any other part of the island. I live on the other side of the island.
In Cuba. (Not in Havana or Varadero) - Those two places have some reasonable earners.
Top restaurant in the city im in for two with a few coctels each is under $30. Whisky Bottle Service is around $20 for Jameson / Ballantines and Chivas 12 $30-$40. (More or less cost of the bottle in store) A more typical restaurant sells steaks for $2 or less and beer for $1) Pasta / Pizza is typically also in the 20 cent - $1.50 range for a full personal sized meal)
Normal income for service at decent restaurants for example is $1-$2 per day.
Workers in government jobs typically make $10-$25 a month (legally) - No point in explaining siphoning of government resources to expand ones income buts its not as if a worker doing that is able to siphon off huge amounts when there base pay is so low.
Incomes are very low here. Large limitations on what types of business you can start.(You can't for example start a manufacturing business, an infrastructure business, a car dealership etc. All of those are government businesses only) I'd say about 90% of businesses are (Gold, Mobile / Computer repairs, Restaurants (limitations on size), Beauty, Watch Repairs) A gym membership is usually $2 or less and they don't by any means have 1000 monthly sign ups that dont actually use the gym. More like 100ish in decent gyms.
To make 200k a year you'd have to be one of a select few Restaurant owners who are wildly successful in Havana or in some sort of position of power. (There are surely lots of diplomats (all which would be located in Havana not where I am) but I don't think Diplomats make that sum) I was of the impression they depending on country are more in the 70-150k range) Nice benefits as well obviously.
I pay masons with 20+ years experience about $4 / day while they build my house. Lawyers make like $30 a month though in specific areas you could potentially make more due to under the table incomes. Doctors can make a bit more even with tips maybe make $100+ a month in select fields.
Theres the odd guy who makes $500+ a month and even the very odd guy who might make $1000. But because of extremely low costs of everything, tiny margins and restrictions regarding what you can do there simply isn't really a legitimate way to make a lot of money. (Exception being in Havana due to the American tourism where lots of restaurant owners, taxi's and people in the tourism industry were able to take advantage for several years) All of that is being curbed pretty good now though with all the new restrictions. But even then netting $500 / day is a huge stretch aside from the most successful restaurants and many of those are frankly foreign owned due to the fact that they usually are in historic mansions and would cost 6 figures to start up.
Theres a lot of taxi's in Havana who really hose tourists good but at the same time even if you hose tourists 3 times a day for $20 you are only looking at around $1200 a month and aside from that the upkeep and gas / diesel on vehicles from the 1950s is costly as well.
Now Americans can only fly into Havana, not to any other part of the island. I live on the other side of the island.
[email protected]
Pelican
Like anyone here will tell you 200k isn't enough to retire on in the West. You can live off that in a developing country if you are extremely careful but eventually it will run out.
The only person I know of that pulled it off is my dad. He had around 200k from the house he sold in 2009 and used half as a deposit for a 440k duplex (which was actually a triplex). He lived in one side of the duplex/triplex and rented out the other 2 sides of the house and collected rent for the next 10+ years while collecting monthly pension payments. The renters paid his mortgage and bills to this day with disposable income to spend on travels to Ukraine. The duplex/triplex is now worth over 1.2m and climbing in the bubbling Toronto market. The only thing I help him on is the land tax of 3k each year which he could manage if he didn't piss his money on buying used German cars and traveling. It's still amazing considering he managed to do this in the West. If he went off-grid that money would be gone.
The only person I know of that pulled it off is my dad. He had around 200k from the house he sold in 2009 and used half as a deposit for a 440k duplex (which was actually a triplex). He lived in one side of the duplex/triplex and rented out the other 2 sides of the house and collected rent for the next 10+ years while collecting monthly pension payments. The renters paid his mortgage and bills to this day with disposable income to spend on travels to Ukraine. The duplex/triplex is now worth over 1.2m and climbing in the bubbling Toronto market. The only thing I help him on is the land tax of 3k each year which he could manage if he didn't piss his money on buying used German cars and traveling. It's still amazing considering he managed to do this in the West. If he went off-grid that money would be gone.
Dilated said:
Its one of the few places that people are neighborly any more. Just last week I helped push a stranger's car out of a ditch and helped another person back a large truck out of a small parking lot.
Housing is inexpensive, but so is rent here. I don't know how the rent is so cheap considering the very high property taxes. You would be paying about $3500/year in tax on your $150k house so just beware of that.
Its not easy to get rich in WI, but its a great place to live peacefully.
SlickyBoy
Hummingbird
PUA_Rachacha said:
Sure. Here you go.
Simeon_Strangelight said:
Not much of a risk? Real estate prices can indeed fall - ask anyone who was around in 1986, or again in 2008. The sky-high valuations of the past decade are an anomaly. Just wait till interest rates go up - prices will fall, precipitously. And 20-25% fees for property management are not only profit killers, they don't even include maintenance costs or carrying costs when your units are vacant between tenants, as they are during cleanups or renovations. Don't buy the Kiyosaki-inspired nonsense. Real estate isn't a passive income gimme, but an active endeavor that requires your full attention.
Cor, a lot of people saying 200 grand isn't much money. That's crazy. I think 200 grand is a shit load of money.
One needs to look at their own lifestyle before deciding how much money is a lot I think. It's very easy to get desensitised these days to large amounts of cash because lots of people talk about lots of money all the time.
It's all relative.
Assuming 200 grand, I could live my current lifestyle in my house for 10 years without bringing in any money.
My bills are about 1 grand a month including my mortgage. Then that's 1 grand to spend each month as I like.
Sure, 200 grand isn't a lot compared to someone with 2 million. But imagine living a life on your own terms for 5-10 years. That's way healthier imo and plenty of time to work out how to invest some or grow some. I'd put 50k straight into Bitcoin as a start.
One needs to look at their own lifestyle before deciding how much money is a lot I think. It's very easy to get desensitised these days to large amounts of cash because lots of people talk about lots of money all the time.
It's all relative.
Assuming 200 grand, I could live my current lifestyle in my house for 10 years without bringing in any money.
My bills are about 1 grand a month including my mortgage. Then that's 1 grand to spend each month as I like.
Sure, 200 grand isn't a lot compared to someone with 2 million. But imagine living a life on your own terms for 5-10 years. That's way healthier imo and plenty of time to work out how to invest some or grow some. I'd put 50k straight into Bitcoin as a start.